Washington Split on the Ukraine's Nato Bid.

[Donald H]

Perhaps. I watched the head of Nato Jens someone talking about Nato and then asking if there was any questions. He took four questions. One was on Ukraine joining Nato to which as has been reported he did not really say yes or no. The other three were on whether the US would consider softening its view given what Putin has said re Nukes. Each time he replied that he would continue to encourage Ukraine to take back the territory. Regardless the next question asked the same as did the one after that. There seems to be no concept in the west of communication of toning down the rhetoric which is what they were talking about. I think they were mainly European but not sure. It was clear they all were taking the possibility of nukes far more seriously than the head of Nato. It has been so strange watching people finding the belief that anyone would use nukes as amusing and apparently wanting to humiliate Putin and Russia which if anything will bring nukes on.

Thanks for your wise comments. They're helpful to the continuing of this forum.

I think that nothing new can be learned from Stoltenberg. He's paid to say what he has to say.

More valuable hints will come from lesser players, possibly on both sides, who become what is known as loose cannons.
The title of this discussion is my shot at suggesting that America has blinked.

If anything, the US congress must be either silenced or it has to come together on support of America's war with Russia.

Coming together isn't a possible option!

Hope is in Biden's war losing the support it desperately needs!

 

[gipper]

It would be a very smart tactical move by Russia, if then it's followed up with denial.

No. That’s absurd.

 

[Sunni Man]

It would be a very smart tactical move by Russia, if then it's followed up with denial.

Russia has zero reason to destroy their own pipeline, which will cost a billion dollars to repair.
When all they needed to do is close a valve to stop the flow of gas.

 

[alexa]

Are Nato's European members suggesting that it's time for America to blink?

I didn't realise you had used that word. I do not think that is what is needed. I think what is needed is for everyone to start realising what they are playing with. Then possibly something done undercover to make an agreement between them all possible but when you have one side who have just told the other than any attack on areas will be taken as an attack on Russia and responded to with Nukes, which is all at the moment that Russia has to threaten with and then this is responded to the very next day by such an attack. It seems that neither the US/NATO or Ukraine know how to communicate, and they are bringing us to the edge of the precipice. Everyone knows the NATO/Ukraine military are beating Russia but the belief that they should humiliate Purin if they do want to avoid nuclear war is crazy and I was hearing yesterday for anyone still hoping someone kills Putin that if that were to happen his replacement is likely to be far worse.

 

[gipper]

Russia has zero reason to destroy their own pipeline, which will cost a billion dollars to repair.
When all they needed to do is close a valve to stop the flow of gas.

It’s amazing how easily some Americans are duped by their corrupt lying government and media.

 

[Sunni Man]

The U.S. is most likely the country that sabotaged the pipeline.
With the cold winter temperatures arriving in a couple of months.
The leaders of the EU countries are growing fearful their citizens will start protesting and rioting on the streets demand that all the sanctions against Russia be lifted so that gas will flow to heat their homes and they won't freeze to death.
By blowing up the pipeline the U.S. was making sure the leaders of the EU countries didn't have a reason to cave in and lift the sanctions against Russia to obtain gas.

 

[Donald H]

I didn't realise you had used that word. I do not think that is what is needed. I think what is needed is for everyone to start realising what they are playing with. Then possibly something done undercover to make an agreement between them all possible but when you have one side who have just told the other than any attack on areas will be taken as an attack on Russia and responded to with Nukes, which is all at the moment that Russia has to threaten with and then this is responded to the very next day by such an attack. It seems that neither the US/NATO or Ukraine know how to communicate, and they are bringing us to the edge of the precipice. Everyone knows the NATO/Ukraine military are beating Russia but the belief that they should humiliate Purin if they do want to avoid nuclear war is crazy and I was hearing yesterday for anyone still hoping someone kills Putin that if that were to happen his replacement is likely to be far worse.

I hear you but i'm going to be frank about it and to the point.

America must stop it's aggression and the continuous policy of uncontested world supremacy.

I think the situation has passed to point of pretending. Russia isn't going to accept defeat and neither is China.

 

[Donald H]

Russia has zero reason to destroy their own pipeline, which will cost a billion dollars to repair.
When all they needed to do is close a valve to stop the flow of gas.

You don't understand and that's the reason why hardly anybody is going to accept the idea. That makes the action by Russia a sure winning ploy.

Russia doesn't have to b seen as the evil empire that causes Europeans to freeze to death. America can be blamed for doing the job for Russia.

Just askk the US propagandists who wrecked the two pipelines and they will assure you that it was Russia!

 

[gipper]

The U.S. is most likely the country that sabotaged the pipeline.
With the cold winter temperatures arriving in a couple of months.
The leaders of the EU countries are growing fearful their citizens will start protesting and rioting on the streets demand that all the sanctions against Russia be lifted so that gas will flow to heat their homes and they won't freeze to death.
By blowing up the pipeline the U.S. was making sure the leaders of the EU countries didn't have a reason to cave in and lift the sanctions against Russia to obtain gas.

I tend to agree with you. The frightening aspect of this is the mindset of American leaders who ordered the destruction of the pipelines. These people are psychopaths and they’re in control of American foreign policy.

 

[Donald H]

No. That’s absurd.
View attachment 704094

You're an American who has started thinking and that's a good thing.

Save your colour cartoons for the kids.

This event is worthy being classed as one of the main events of the war, for it's effectiveness on the European audience!

 

[Sunni Man]

I tend to agree with you. The frightening aspect of this is the mindset of American leaders who ordered the destruction of the pipelines. These people are psychopaths and they’re in control of American foreign policy.

U.S. agencies like the CIA and others that use acronyms for their name.
Have been engaged in diabolical plots to overthrow foreign leaders and create chaos in countries all over the world for decades.
Anyone who thinks the U.S. government wouldn't blow up the Russian pipeline for its own geopolitical machinations is seriously deluded.

 

[gipper]

U.S. agencies like the CIA and others that use acronyms for their name.
Have been engaged in diabolical plots to overthrow foreign leaders and create chaos in countries all over the world for decades.
Anyone who thinks the U.S. government wouldn't blow up the Russian pipeline for its own geopolitical machinations is seriously deluded.

Absolutely. Yet somehow many Americans know nothing about this and when confronted with these facts, will dispute them and often call you a traitor.

 

[Concerned American]

It's bluster and false bravado to say that Russia's use of a nuclear weapon would start WW3.

Tell 'em to let one fly and you'll find out how much bluster and false bravado it is duck. You don't know shit about the US so STFU.

 

[Concerned American]

Trying to hide what side you're on?

He's a anti American communist that thinks NATO is the US all while quoting Jens Stoltenberg--A Norwegian. He is a moron with the common sense of a rock.

 

[georgephillip]

I notice Scott Ritter is saying on Consortium News 'We are literally on the eve of destruction'. He believes that Biden and Putin need to talk and see if there is a way out.

One of Ritter's recent interviews revealed how Russian airpower may bring this conflict to a close:

"Enter Andrey Gurulyov, a former Russian general officer and current member of the Russian Duma..."

"...(G)iven that the Russian government has labelled the government of Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky a Nazi regime, 'denazification' would require regime change in Kiev and Russian troops advancing up to the western reaches of Ukraine that border NATO itself.

"These objectives would be accomplished through a strategic air campaign that would destroy the totality of Ukraine’s critical infrastructure, severely impacting command and control and logistics of the Ukrainian military.

"According to Gurulyov, such a campaign could last up to three weeks, after which the Ukrainian military would be a sitting duck for the newly reinforced Russian military."

SCOTT RITTER: The Onus Is on Biden & Putin

 

[alexa]

One of Ritter's recent interviews revealed how Russian airpower may bring this conflict to a close:

"Enter Andrey Gurulyov, a former Russian general officer and current member of the Russian Duma..."

"...(G)iven that the Russian government has labelled the government of Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky a Nazi regime, 'denazification' would require regime change in Kiev and Russian troops advancing up to the western reaches of Ukraine that border NATO itself.

"These objectives would be accomplished through a strategic air campaign that would destroy the totality of Ukraine’s critical infrastructure, severely impacting command and control and logistics of the Ukrainian military.

"According to Gurulyov, such a campaign could last up to three weeks, after which the Ukrainian military would be a sitting duck for the newly reinforced Russian military."

SCOTT RITTER: The Onus Is on Biden & Putin

Interesting. I was reading an article yesterday which said that Russia had not used their planes and I wondered if that might make a difference. I've got a feeling it may have been that one, though possibly I only skimmed! I have also thought Russia will now be waiting to get its recruits well trained and then come back in massive numbers. It is the only possible way that they can get Ukraine to the negotiating table. Then hopefully everyone will be sane. No one is going to get everything they want.

 

[alexa]

One of Ritter's recent interviews revealed how Russian airpower may bring this conflict to a close:

"Enter Andrey Gurulyov, a former Russian general officer and current member of the Russian Duma..."

"...(G)iven that the Russian government has labelled the government of Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky a Nazi regime, 'denazification' would require regime change in Kiev and Russian troops advancing up to the western reaches of Ukraine that border NATO itself.

"These objectives would be accomplished through a strategic air campaign that would destroy the totality of Ukraine’s critical infrastructure, severely impacting command and control and logistics of the Ukrainian military.

"According to Gurulyov, such a campaign could last up to three weeks, after which the Ukrainian military would be a sitting duck for the newly reinforced Russian military."

SCOTT RITTER: The Onus Is on Biden & Putin

No I didn't read that article or certainly the second page, His belief is that Russia should do a Nato on Ukraine, that is drop bombs anywhere for three weeks until they can be pretty sure that everyone's morale is low and little is left and then come in with the 300,000 troops now properly trained and try and do a rout of those left while understanding that NATO might find this so upsetting that they feel the need to put their troops in and.........

 

[Litwin]

Nato

ivan who cares what your rt- urinal produce ?
the reality :

 

[Litwin]

Trying to hide what side you're on?

+1


Ivan is so funny , so pathetic

ps

 

[Donald H]

Unfortunately, the Ukrainian people have ended up as America's pawn to be sacrificed in the America/Russia game. It can't end well for them now.