Understanding The Book of Revelation from a Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saint perspective


The expected Messiah was supposed to be an anointed warrior king who would vanquish the enemies of the Jews. Jesus doesn't fit that description in any way.

There isn't a single reference to Jesus in the old testament unless you fiddle with scripture which Christians do.
The Old Testament doesn't mention Jesus of Nazareth by name, but certain prophecies were fulfilled only by Jesus. Daniel 9, for example, mentions some:

Seventy weeks are decreed about your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to put an end to sin, and to atone for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal both vision and prophet, and to anoint a most holy place.

This passage lists six prophecies for Israel’s Messiah to fulfill: to finish the transgression, conquer sin, atone for iniquity, bring everlasting righteousness, seal all future visions, and bless and anoint a majestic new most holy place. These things happened with Jesus.

And the kingdom came with Jesus, Daniel's rock built by no human hand that would fill the earth (2:34-35). As it turned out, no one fulfilled these prophecies except Jesus the Nazarene.


Yes, the holy people pined for a warrior king to deliver them from their foreign overlords. This idolatrous people were prone to blaming others for their own iniquity, but Jesus put the blame on them and ended their reign without drawing any blood except his own. He was not the messiah they expected, so they had him killed.

Except Daniel was NOT a prophet, but a historian writing about Antiochus IV..

Jesus Christ believed that Daniel was certainly a prophet:

Mark 13:14

14 ¶ But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judæa flee to the mountains:

Matthew 24:15

15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

Daniel wrote about Antiochus IV as the first Abomination of Desolation. Jesus and Matthew are referencing Daniel.

Mark 13:14
14 ¶ But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judæa flee to the mountains:
Matthew 24:15
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

This time when you see the Abominton of Desolation as spoken of in Daniel, flee Jerusalem to the mountains (and avoid the tribulation)

They were two seperate events..

So Jesus was a liar?

Jesus is referencng the earlier Abominationn of Desolation during the rule of Antiochus IV.

You keep running from my question because it's not religion you detest, it's Christianity. As a Hindu you believe in shiva and all the rest.

You're a moron. I'm Episcopalian.

Horse hockey. You don't believe in Jesus at all.

So much so that I don't think we should tamper with scripture.

Revelation 1:9
“I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.”

King James Version (KJV)

You "tamper" with Scripture with nearly every post, He is the Word, ALL of the Word, both Old and New Testament. When you twist scripture to fit what you want it to say that is tampering. You may believe in "a" jesus, but not THE Jesus.

John 1:1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2 The same was in the beginning with God.

I didn't write or rewrite any scripture.

Revelation 1:9
“I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.”

King James Version (KJV)

Of course you. Tell me, is Jesus coming again?

2 Timothy 3:5-7​

King James Version​

5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.​


You mean within 40 years? A generation?

LOL, sorry son. My Jesus will return during the future Tribulation and I will meet Him in the clouds and although I WISH it would happen Pre Trib it won't. I will most likely die for my faith. People like you will cheer it on.
 
In the Book of Revelation, the Apostle John is shown a vision of a book that is sealed on its backside with seven seals. Nobody but the Lamb of God, Jesus Christ, was able to open the book and loose the seven seals. Chapter six tells of what is contained in the book as each seal is opened. In these latter-days the Prophet Joseph Smith received revelation telling us what the book and its seven seals represent:

Doctrine and Covenants 77:6-7
6 Q. What are we to understand by the book which John saw, which was sealed on the back with seven seals? A. We are to understand that it contains the revealed will, mysteries, and the works of God; the hidden things of his economy concerning this earth during the seven thousand years of its continuance, or its temporal existence.

7 Q. What are we to understand by the seven seals with which it was sealed? A. We are to understand that the first seal contains the things of the first thousand years, and the second also of the second thousand years, and so on until the seventh.

From the above verses, members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints believe that the temporal existence of the earth will last 7000 years. This means that from the fall of Adam and Eve until the end of the millennial reign of Jesus Christ, will be 7000 years. We believe that this patterns the temporal existence of the earth similar to the seven periods of creation. We believe that each of the seven seals on the backside of the book represent each of the consecutive 1000 year periods of the earth's temporal existence. The seventh seal represents the seventh thousand year period of the earth's temporal existence or the millennial reign of Jesus Christ. It is like a sabbath of the earth's temporal existence. Thus the opening of the book in Revelation 6-7 gives us a summation of the earth during its first, second, third, fourth, fifth, and sixth thousand year periods. The following chapters of the Book of Revelation, excepting chapter 12, tells us of the events of the seventh thousand year period of this earth's temporal existence and of the earth being changed to a celestial sphere

To Joseph Smith, it was also revealed that the events of chapter 7 were to occur in the sixth seal or the sixth thousand year period of the earth's temporal existence:

Doctrine and Covenants 77:9-11
9 Q. What are we to understand by the angel ascending from the east, Revelation 7th chapter and 2nd verse? A. We are to understand that the angel ascending from the east is he to whom is given the seal of the living God over the twelve tribes of Israel; wherefore, he crieth unto the four angels having the everlasting gospel, saying: Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads. And, if you will receive it, this is Elias which was to come to gather together the tribes of Israel and restore all things.

10 Q. What time are the things spoken of in this chapter to be accomplished? A. They are to be accomplished in the sixth thousand years, or the opening of the sixth seal.

11 Q. What are we to understand by sealing the one hundred and forty-four thousand, out of all the tribes of Israel—twelve thousand out of every tribe? A. We are to understand that those who are sealed are high priests, ordained unto the holy order of God, to administer the everlasting gospel; for they are they who are ordained out of every nation, kindred, tongue, and people, by the angels to whom is given power over the nations of the earth, to bring as many as will come to the church of the Firstborn.

It is my personal belief that we are currently living in the last days of the sixth seal or six thousand year period of the earth's temporal existence. The Lord Jesus is to come again on the earth after the opening of the seventh seal. It is my personal belief that the sixth seal will end around 2033 or 2034. More on this in a subsequent post.
more demonic dogshit from the darknesss of the mortal mind
 

The expected Messiah was supposed to be an anointed warrior king who would vanquish the enemies of the Jews. Jesus doesn't fit that description in any way.

There isn't a single reference to Jesus in the old testament unless you fiddle with scripture which Christians do.
The Old Testament doesn't mention Jesus of Nazareth by name, but certain prophecies were fulfilled only by Jesus. Daniel 9, for example, mentions some:

Seventy weeks are decreed about your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to put an end to sin, and to atone for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal both vision and prophet, and to anoint a most holy place.

This passage lists six prophecies for Israel’s Messiah to fulfill: to finish the transgression, conquer sin, atone for iniquity, bring everlasting righteousness, seal all future visions, and bless and anoint a majestic new most holy place. These things happened with Jesus.

And the kingdom came with Jesus, Daniel's rock built by no human hand that would fill the earth (2:34-35). As it turned out, no one fulfilled these prophecies except Jesus the Nazarene.


Yes, the holy people pined for a warrior king to deliver them from their foreign overlords. This idolatrous people were prone to blaming others for their own iniquity, but Jesus put the blame on them and ended their reign without drawing any blood except his own. He was not the messiah they expected, so they had him killed.

Except Daniel was NOT a prophet, but a historian writing about Antiochus IV..

Jesus Christ believed that Daniel was certainly a prophet:

Mark 13:14

14 ¶ But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judæa flee to the mountains:

Matthew 24:15

15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

Daniel wrote about Antiochus IV as the first Abomination of Desolation. Jesus and Matthew are referencing Daniel.

Mark 13:14
14 ¶ But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judæa flee to the mountains:
Matthew 24:15
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

This time when you see the Abominton of Desolation as spoken of in Daniel, flee Jerusalem to the mountains (and avoid the tribulation)

They were two seperate events..

So Jesus was a liar?

Jesus is referencng the earlier Abominationn of Desolation during the rule of Antiochus IV.

You keep running from my question because it's not religion you detest, it's Christianity. As a Hindu you believe in shiva and all the rest.

You're a moron. I'm Episcopalian.

Horse hockey. You don't believe in Jesus at all.

So much so that I don't think we should tamper with scripture.

Revelation 1:9
“I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.”

King James Version (KJV)

You "tamper" with Scripture with nearly every post, He is the Word, ALL of the Word, both Old and New Testament. When you twist scripture to fit what you want it to say that is tampering. You may believe in "a" jesus, but not THE Jesus.

John 1:1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2 The same was in the beginning with God.

I didn't write or rewrite any scripture.

Revelation 1:9
“I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.”

King James Version (KJV)

Of course you. Tell me, is Jesus coming again?

2 Timothy 3:5-7​

King James Version​

5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.​


You mean within 40 years? A generation?

LOL, sorry son. My Jesus will return during the future Tribulation and I will meet Him in the clouds and although I WISH it would happen Pre Trib it won't. I will most likely die for my faith. People like you will cheer it on.
Along with the masses in darkness, you believe those who Jesus said NOT to believe -
"They shall say lo here and lo there, believe them not nor follow them" - Luke 17:23
 

The expected Messiah was supposed to be an anointed warrior king who would vanquish the enemies of the Jews. Jesus doesn't fit that description in any way.

There isn't a single reference to Jesus in the old testament unless you fiddle with scripture which Christians do.
The Old Testament doesn't mention Jesus of Nazareth by name, but certain prophecies were fulfilled only by Jesus. Daniel 9, for example, mentions some:

Seventy weeks are decreed about your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to put an end to sin, and to atone for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal both vision and prophet, and to anoint a most holy place.

This passage lists six prophecies for Israel’s Messiah to fulfill: to finish the transgression, conquer sin, atone for iniquity, bring everlasting righteousness, seal all future visions, and bless and anoint a majestic new most holy place. These things happened with Jesus.

And the kingdom came with Jesus, Daniel's rock built by no human hand that would fill the earth (2:34-35). As it turned out, no one fulfilled these prophecies except Jesus the Nazarene.


Yes, the holy people pined for a warrior king to deliver them from their foreign overlords. This idolatrous people were prone to blaming others for their own iniquity, but Jesus put the blame on them and ended their reign without drawing any blood except his own. He was not the messiah they expected, so they had him killed.

Except Daniel was NOT a prophet, but a historian writing about Antiochus IV..

Jesus Christ believed that Daniel was certainly a prophet:

Mark 13:14

14 ¶ But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judæa flee to the mountains:

Matthew 24:15

15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

Daniel wrote about Antiochus IV as the first Abomination of Desolation. Jesus and Matthew are referencing Daniel.

Mark 13:14
14 ¶ But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judæa flee to the mountains:
Matthew 24:15
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

This time when you see the Abominton of Desolation as spoken of in Daniel, flee Jerusalem to the mountains (and avoid the tribulation)

They were two seperate events..

So Jesus was a liar?

Jesus is referencng the earlier Abominationn of Desolation during the rule of Antiochus IV.

You keep running from my question because it's not religion you detest, it's Christianity. As a Hindu you believe in shiva and all the rest.

You're a moron. I'm Episcopalian.

Horse hockey. You don't believe in Jesus at all.

So much so that I don't think we should tamper with scripture.

Revelation 1:9
“I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.”

King James Version (KJV)

You "tamper" with Scripture with nearly every post, He is the Word, ALL of the Word, both Old and New Testament. When you twist scripture to fit what you want it to say that is tampering. You may believe in "a" jesus, but not THE Jesus.

John 1:1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2 The same was in the beginning with God.

I didn't write or rewrite any scripture.

Revelation 1:9
“I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.”

King James Version (KJV)

Of course you. Tell me, is Jesus coming again?

2 Timothy 3:5-7​

King James Version​

5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.​


You mean within 40 years? A generation?

LOL, sorry son. My Jesus will return during the future Tribulation and I will meet Him in the clouds and although I WISH it would happen Pre Trib it won't. I will most likely die for my faith. People like you will cheer it on.

Perhaps you should read the Bible before you die for your faith. Who, BTW, is out to get you?
 

The expected Messiah was supposed to be an anointed warrior king who would vanquish the enemies of the Jews. Jesus doesn't fit that description in any way.

There isn't a single reference to Jesus in the old testament unless you fiddle with scripture which Christians do.
The Old Testament doesn't mention Jesus of Nazareth by name, but certain prophecies were fulfilled only by Jesus. Daniel 9, for example, mentions some:

Seventy weeks are decreed about your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to put an end to sin, and to atone for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal both vision and prophet, and to anoint a most holy place.

This passage lists six prophecies for Israel’s Messiah to fulfill: to finish the transgression, conquer sin, atone for iniquity, bring everlasting righteousness, seal all future visions, and bless and anoint a majestic new most holy place. These things happened with Jesus.

And the kingdom came with Jesus, Daniel's rock built by no human hand that would fill the earth (2:34-35). As it turned out, no one fulfilled these prophecies except Jesus the Nazarene.


Yes, the holy people pined for a warrior king to deliver them from their foreign overlords. This idolatrous people were prone to blaming others for their own iniquity, but Jesus put the blame on them and ended their reign without drawing any blood except his own. He was not the messiah they expected, so they had him killed.

Except Daniel was NOT a prophet, but a historian writing about Antiochus IV..

Jesus Christ believed that Daniel was certainly a prophet:

Mark 13:14

14 ¶ But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judæa flee to the mountains:

Matthew 24:15

15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

Daniel wrote about Antiochus IV as the first Abomination of Desolation. Jesus and Matthew are referencing Daniel.

Mark 13:14
14 ¶ But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judæa flee to the mountains:
Matthew 24:15
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

This time when you see the Abominton of Desolation as spoken of in Daniel, flee Jerusalem to the mountains (and avoid the tribulation)

They were two seperate events..

So Jesus was a liar?

Jesus is referencng the earlier Abominationn of Desolation during the rule of Antiochus IV.

According to Jesus, Daniel was not referring to anything that occurred during the rule of Antiochus IV. In Matthew 24, Jesus states:

Matthew 24:15
5 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

Here Jesus refers to a future event as the abomination of desolation. Antiochus IV was in the past at the time Jesus gave this prophesy. Therefore it could not be what Jesus and Daniel were referring to. I believe what Jesus and Daniel were referring to is the invasion and destruction of the temple in 70 AD and also the same event that will occur before the second coming of Jesus Christ on the earth. Latter-day scripture has revealed the following unto us:

JOSEPH SMITH—MATTHEW​

An extract from the translation of the Bible as revealed to Joseph Smith the Prophet in 1831: Matthew 23:39 and chapter 24.

CHAPTER 1

Jesus foretells the impending destruction of Jerusalem—He also discourses on the Second Coming of the Son of Man, and the destruction of the wicked.

1 For I say unto you, that ye shall not see me henceforth and know that I am he of whom it is written by the prophets, until ye shall say: Blessed is he who cometh in the name of the Lord, in the clouds of heaven, and all the holy angels with him. Then understood his disciples that he should come again on the earth, after that he was glorified and crowned on the right hand of God.
2 And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple; and his disciples came to him, for to hear him, saying: Master, show us concerning the buildings of the temple, as thou hast said—They shall be thrown down, and left unto you desolate.
3 And Jesus said unto them: See ye not all these things, and do ye not understand them? Verily I say unto you, there shall not be left here, upon this temple, one stone upon another that shall not be thrown down.
4 And Jesus left them, and went upon the Mount of Olives. And as he sat upon the Mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying: Tell us when shall these things be which thou hast said concerning the destruction of the temple, and the Jews; and what is the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world, or the destruction of the wicked, which is the end of the world?
5 And Jesus answered, and said unto them: Take heed that no man deceive you;
6 For many shall come in my name, saying—I am Christ—and shall deceive many;
7 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you, and ye shall be hated of all nations, for my name’s sake;
8 And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another;
9 And many false prophets shall arise, and shall deceive many;
10 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold;
11 But he that remaineth steadfast and is not overcome, the same shall be saved.
12 When you, therefore, shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, concerning the destruction of Jerusalem, then you shall stand in the holy place; whoso readeth let him understand.
13 Then let them who are in Judea flee into the mountains;
14 Let him who is on the housetop flee, and not return to take anything out of his house;
15 Neither let him who is in the field return back to take his clothes;
16 And wo unto them that are with child, and unto them that give suck in those days;
17 Therefore, pray ye the Lord that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the Sabbath day;
18 For then, in those days, shall be great tribulation on the Jews, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, such as was not before sent upon Israel, of God, since the beginning of their kingdom until this time; no, nor ever shall be sent again upon Israel.
19 All things which have befallen them are only the beginning of the sorrows which shall come upon them.
20 And except those days should be shortened, there should none of their flesh be saved; but for the elect’s sake, according to the covenant, those days shall be shortened.
21 Behold, these things I have spoken unto you concerning the Jews; and again, after the tribulation of those days which shall come upon Jerusalem, if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there, believe him not;
22 For in those days there shall also arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall show great signs and wonders, insomuch, that, if possible, they shall deceive the very elect, who are the elect according to the covenant.
23 Behold, I speak these things unto you for the elect’s sake; and you also shall hear of wars, and rumors of wars; see that ye be not troubled, for all I have told you must come to pass; but the end is not yet.
24 Behold, I have told you before;
25 Wherefore, if they shall say unto you: Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: Behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not;
26 For as the light of the morning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west, and covereth the whole earth, so shall also the coming of the Son of Man be.
27 And now I show unto you a parable. Behold, wheresoever the carcass is, there will the eagles be gathered together; so likewise shall mine elect be gathered from the four quarters of the earth.
28 And they shall hear of wars, and rumors of wars.
29 Behold I speak for mine elect’s sake; for nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom; there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
30 And again, because iniquity shall abound, the love of men shall wax cold; but he that shall not be overcome, the same shall be saved.
31 And again, this Gospel of the Kingdom shall be preached in all the world, for a witness unto all nations, and then shall the end come, or the destruction of the wicked;
32 And again shall the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, be fulfilled.
33 And immediately after the tribulation of those days, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of heaven shall be shaken.
34 Verily, I say unto you, this generation, in which these things shall be shown forth, shall not pass away until all I have told you shall be fulfilled.
35 Although, the days will come, that heaven and earth shall pass away; yet my words shall not pass away, but all shall be fulfilled.
36 And, as I said before, after the tribulation of those days, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken, then shall appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven, and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn; and they shall see the Son of Man coming in the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory;
37 And whoso treasureth up my word, shall not be deceived, for the Son of Man shall come, and he shall send his angels before him with the great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together the remainder of his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
38 Now learn a parable of the fig tree—When its branches are yet tender, and it begins to put forth leaves, you know that summer is nigh at hand;
39 So likewise, mine elect, when they shall see all these things, they shall know that he is near, even at the doors;
40 But of that day, and hour, no one knoweth; no, not the angels of God in heaven, but my Father only.
41 But as it was in the days of Noah, so it shall be also at the coming of the Son of Man;
42 For it shall be with them, as it was in the days which were before the flood; for until the day that Noah entered into the ark they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage;
43 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of Man be.
44 Then shall be fulfilled that which is written, that in the last days, two shall be in the field, the one shall be taken, and the other left;
45 Two shall be grinding at the mill, the one shall be taken, and the other left;
46 And what I say unto one, I say unto all men; watch, therefore, for you know not at what hour your Lord doth come.
47 But know this, if the good man of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to have been broken up, but would have been ready.
48 Therefore be ye also ready, for in such an hour as ye think not, the Son of Man cometh.
49 Who, then, is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season?
50 Blessed is that servant whom his lord, when he cometh, shall find so doing; and verily I say unto you, he shall make him ruler over all his goods.
51 But if that evil servant shall say in his heart: My lord delayeth his coming,
52 And shall begin to smite his fellow-servants, and to eat and drink with the drunken,
53 The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,
54 And shall cut him asunder, and shall appoint him his portion with the hypocrites; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
55 And thus cometh the end of the wicked, according to the prophecy of Moses, saying: They shall be cut off from among the people; but the end of the earth is not yet, but by and by.
 

The expected Messiah was supposed to be an anointed warrior king who would vanquish the enemies of the Jews. Jesus doesn't fit that description in any way.

There isn't a single reference to Jesus in the old testament unless you fiddle with scripture which Christians do.
The Old Testament doesn't mention Jesus of Nazareth by name, but certain prophecies were fulfilled only by Jesus. Daniel 9, for example, mentions some:

Seventy weeks are decreed about your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to put an end to sin, and to atone for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal both vision and prophet, and to anoint a most holy place.

This passage lists six prophecies for Israel’s Messiah to fulfill: to finish the transgression, conquer sin, atone for iniquity, bring everlasting righteousness, seal all future visions, and bless and anoint a majestic new most holy place. These things happened with Jesus.

And the kingdom came with Jesus, Daniel's rock built by no human hand that would fill the earth (2:34-35). As it turned out, no one fulfilled these prophecies except Jesus the Nazarene.


Yes, the holy people pined for a warrior king to deliver them from their foreign overlords. This idolatrous people were prone to blaming others for their own iniquity, but Jesus put the blame on them and ended their reign without drawing any blood except his own. He was not the messiah they expected, so they had him killed.

Except Daniel was NOT a prophet, but a historian writing about Antiochus IV..

Jesus Christ believed that Daniel was certainly a prophet:

Mark 13:14

14 ¶ But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judæa flee to the mountains:

Matthew 24:15

15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

Daniel wrote about Antiochus IV as the first Abomination of Desolation. Jesus and Matthew are referencing Daniel.

Mark 13:14
14 ¶ But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judæa flee to the mountains:
Matthew 24:15
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

This time when you see the Abominton of Desolation as spoken of in Daniel, flee Jerusalem to the mountains (and avoid the tribulation)

They were two seperate events..

So Jesus was a liar?

Jesus is referencng the earlier Abominationn of Desolation during the rule of Antiochus IV.

According to Jesus, Daniel was not referring to anything that occurred during the rule of Antiochus IV. In Matthew 24, Jesus states:

Matthew 24:15
5 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

Here Jesus refers to a future event as the abomination of desolation. Antiochus IV was in the past at the time Jesus gave this prophesy. Therefore it could not be what Jesus and Daniel were referring to. I believe what Jesus and Daniel were referring to is the invasion and destruction of the temple in 70 AD and also the same event that will occur before the second coming of Jesus Christ on the earth. Latter-day scripture has revealed the following unto us:

JOSEPH SMITH—MATTHEW​

An extract from the translation of the Bible as revealed to Joseph Smith the Prophet in 1831: Matthew 23:39 and chapter 24.

CHAPTER 1

Jesus foretells the impending destruction of Jerusalem—He also discourses on the Second Coming of the Son of Man, and the destruction of the wicked.

1 For I say unto you, that ye shall not see me henceforth and know that I am he of whom it is written by the prophets, until ye shall say: Blessed is he who cometh in the name of the Lord, in the clouds of heaven, and all the holy angels with him. Then understood his disciples that he should come again on the earth, after that he was glorified and crowned on the right hand of God.
2 And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple; and his disciples came to him, for to hear him, saying: Master, show us concerning the buildings of the temple, as thou hast said—They shall be thrown down, and left unto you desolate.
3 And Jesus said unto them: See ye not all these things, and do ye not understand them? Verily I say unto you, there shall not be left here, upon this temple, one stone upon another that shall not be thrown down.
4 And Jesus left them, and went upon the Mount of Olives. And as he sat upon the Mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying: Tell us when shall these things be which thou hast said concerning the destruction of the temple, and the Jews; and what is the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world, or the destruction of the wicked, which is the end of the world?
5 And Jesus answered, and said unto them: Take heed that no man deceive you;
6 For many shall come in my name, saying—I am Christ—and shall deceive many;
7 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you, and ye shall be hated of all nations, for my name’s sake;
8 And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another;
9 And many false prophets shall arise, and shall deceive many;
10 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold;
11 But he that remaineth steadfast and is not overcome, the same shall be saved.
12 When you, therefore, shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, concerning the destruction of Jerusalem, then you shall stand in the holy place; whoso readeth let him understand.
13 Then let them who are in Judea flee into the mountains;
14 Let him who is on the housetop flee, and not return to take anything out of his house;
15 Neither let him who is in the field return back to take his clothes;
16 And wo unto them that are with child, and unto them that give suck in those days;
17 Therefore, pray ye the Lord that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the Sabbath day;
18 For then, in those days, shall be great tribulation on the Jews, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, such as was not before sent upon Israel, of God, since the beginning of their kingdom until this time; no, nor ever shall be sent again upon Israel.
19 All things which have befallen them are only the beginning of the sorrows which shall come upon them.
20 And except those days should be shortened, there should none of their flesh be saved; but for the elect’s sake, according to the covenant, those days shall be shortened.
21 Behold, these things I have spoken unto you concerning the Jews; and again, after the tribulation of those days which shall come upon Jerusalem, if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there, believe him not;
22 For in those days there shall also arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall show great signs and wonders, insomuch, that, if possible, they shall deceive the very elect, who are the elect according to the covenant.
23 Behold, I speak these things unto you for the elect’s sake; and you also shall hear of wars, and rumors of wars; see that ye be not troubled, for all I have told you must come to pass; but the end is not yet.
24 Behold, I have told you before;
25 Wherefore, if they shall say unto you: Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: Behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not;
26 For as the light of the morning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west, and covereth the whole earth, so shall also the coming of the Son of Man be.
27 And now I show unto you a parable. Behold, wheresoever the carcass is, there will the eagles be gathered together; so likewise shall mine elect be gathered from the four quarters of the earth.
28 And they shall hear of wars, and rumors of wars.
29 Behold I speak for mine elect’s sake; for nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom; there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
30 And again, because iniquity shall abound, the love of men shall wax cold; but he that shall not be overcome, the same shall be saved.
31 And again, this Gospel of the Kingdom shall be preached in all the world, for a witness unto all nations, and then shall the end come, or the destruction of the wicked;
32 And again shall the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, be fulfilled.
33 And immediately after the tribulation of those days, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of heaven shall be shaken.
34 Verily, I say unto you, this generation, in which these things shall be shown forth, shall not pass away until all I have told you shall be fulfilled.
35 Although, the days will come, that heaven and earth shall pass away; yet my words shall not pass away, but all shall be fulfilled.
36 And, as I said before, after the tribulation of those days, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken, then shall appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven, and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn; and they shall see the Son of Man coming in the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory;
37 And whoso treasureth up my word, shall not be deceived, for the Son of Man shall come, and he shall send his angels before him with the great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together the remainder of his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
38 Now learn a parable of the fig tree—When its branches are yet tender, and it begins to put forth leaves, you know that summer is nigh at hand;
39 So likewise, mine elect, when they shall see all these things, they shall know that he is near, even at the doors;
40 But of that day, and hour, no one knoweth; no, not the angels of God in heaven, but my Father only.
41 But as it was in the days of Noah, so it shall be also at the coming of the Son of Man;
42 For it shall be with them, as it was in the days which were before the flood; for until the day that Noah entered into the ark they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage;
43 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of Man be.
44 Then shall be fulfilled that which is written, that in the last days, two shall be in the field, the one shall be taken, and the other left;
45 Two shall be grinding at the mill, the one shall be taken, and the other left;
46 And what I say unto one, I say unto all men; watch, therefore, for you know not at what hour your Lord doth come.
47 But know this, if the good man of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to have been broken up, but would have been ready.
48 Therefore be ye also ready, for in such an hour as ye think not, the Son of Man cometh.
49 Who, then, is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season?
50 Blessed is that servant whom his lord, when he cometh, shall find so doing; and verily I say unto you, he shall make him ruler over all his goods.
51 But if that evil servant shall say in his heart: My lord delayeth his coming,
52 And shall begin to smite his fellow-servants, and to eat and drink with the drunken,
53 The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,
54 And shall cut him asunder, and shall appoint him his portion with the hypocrites; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
55 And thus cometh the end of the wicked, according to the prophecy of Moses, saying: They shall be cut off from among the people; but the end of the earth is not yet, but by and by.

Antiochus IV Epiphanes had defiled the Temple with pig sacrifices and a statue of Zeus. He was determinined to Helenize the Jews. He created the first Abomination of Desolation so that is what Jesus is referencing.
 
Jesus was referencing the future and not the past. His prophesy was to occur in the future.
 

The expected Messiah was supposed to be an anointed warrior king who would vanquish the enemies of the Jews. Jesus doesn't fit that description in any way.

There isn't a single reference to Jesus in the old testament unless you fiddle with scripture which Christians do.
The Old Testament doesn't mention Jesus of Nazareth by name, but certain prophecies were fulfilled only by Jesus. Daniel 9, for example, mentions some:

Seventy weeks are decreed about your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to put an end to sin, and to atone for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal both vision and prophet, and to anoint a most holy place.

This passage lists six prophecies for Israel’s Messiah to fulfill: to finish the transgression, conquer sin, atone for iniquity, bring everlasting righteousness, seal all future visions, and bless and anoint a majestic new most holy place. These things happened with Jesus.

And the kingdom came with Jesus, Daniel's rock built by no human hand that would fill the earth (2:34-35). As it turned out, no one fulfilled these prophecies except Jesus the Nazarene.


Yes, the holy people pined for a warrior king to deliver them from their foreign overlords. This idolatrous people were prone to blaming others for their own iniquity, but Jesus put the blame on them and ended their reign without drawing any blood except his own. He was not the messiah they expected, so they had him killed.

Except Daniel was NOT a prophet, but a historian writing about Antiochus IV..

Jesus Christ believed that Daniel was certainly a prophet:

Mark 13:14

14 ¶ But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judæa flee to the mountains:

Matthew 24:15

15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

Daniel wrote about Antiochus IV as the first Abomination of Desolation. Jesus and Matthew are referencing Daniel.

Mark 13:14
14 ¶ But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judæa flee to the mountains:
Matthew 24:15
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

This time when you see the Abominton of Desolation as spoken of in Daniel, flee Jerusalem to the mountains (and avoid the tribulation)

They were two seperate events..

So Jesus was a liar?

Jesus is referencng the earlier Abominationn of Desolation during the rule of Antiochus IV.

You keep running from my question because it's not religion you detest, it's Christianity. As a Hindu you believe in shiva and all the rest.

You're a moron. I'm Episcopalian.

Horse hockey. You don't believe in Jesus at all.

So much so that I don't think we should tamper with scripture.

Revelation 1:9
“I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.”

King James Version (KJV)

You "tamper" with Scripture with nearly every post, He is the Word, ALL of the Word, both Old and New Testament. When you twist scripture to fit what you want it to say that is tampering. You may believe in "a" jesus, but not THE Jesus.

John 1:1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2 The same was in the beginning with God.

I didn't write or rewrite any scripture.

Revelation 1:9
“I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.”

King James Version (KJV)

Of course you. Tell me, is Jesus coming again?

2 Timothy 3:5-7​

King James Version​

5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.​


You mean within 40 years? A generation?

LOL, sorry son. My Jesus will return during the future Tribulation and I will meet Him in the clouds and although I WISH it would happen Pre Trib it won't. I will most likely die for my faith. People like you will cheer it on.

That's Tim Lahaye and Hal Lindsey. Read it again.
 

The expected Messiah was supposed to be an anointed warrior king who would vanquish the enemies of the Jews. Jesus doesn't fit that description in any way.

There isn't a single reference to Jesus in the old testament unless you fiddle with scripture which Christians do.
The Old Testament doesn't mention Jesus of Nazareth by name, but certain prophecies were fulfilled only by Jesus. Daniel 9, for example, mentions some:

Seventy weeks are decreed about your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to put an end to sin, and to atone for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal both vision and prophet, and to anoint a most holy place.

This passage lists six prophecies for Israel’s Messiah to fulfill: to finish the transgression, conquer sin, atone for iniquity, bring everlasting righteousness, seal all future visions, and bless and anoint a majestic new most holy place. These things happened with Jesus.

And the kingdom came with Jesus, Daniel's rock built by no human hand that would fill the earth (2:34-35). As it turned out, no one fulfilled these prophecies except Jesus the Nazarene.


Yes, the holy people pined for a warrior king to deliver them from their foreign overlords. This idolatrous people were prone to blaming others for their own iniquity, but Jesus put the blame on them and ended their reign without drawing any blood except his own. He was not the messiah they expected, so they had him killed.

Except Daniel was NOT a prophet, but a historian writing about Antiochus IV..

Jesus Christ believed that Daniel was certainly a prophet:

Mark 13:14

14 ¶ But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judæa flee to the mountains:

Matthew 24:15

15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

Daniel wrote about Antiochus IV as the first Abomination of Desolation. Jesus and Matthew are referencing Daniel.

Mark 13:14
14 ¶ But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judæa flee to the mountains:
Matthew 24:15
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

This time when you see the Abominton of Desolation as spoken of in Daniel, flee Jerusalem to the mountains (and avoid the tribulation)

They were two seperate events..

So Jesus was a liar?

Jesus is referencng the earlier Abominationn of Desolation during the rule of Antiochus IV.

You keep running from my question because it's not religion you detest, it's Christianity. As a Hindu you believe in shiva and all the rest.

You're a moron. I'm Episcopalian.

Horse hockey. You don't believe in Jesus at all.

So much so that I don't think we should tamper with scripture.

Revelation 1:9
“I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.”

King James Version (KJV)

You "tamper" with Scripture with nearly every post, He is the Word, ALL of the Word, both Old and New Testament. When you twist scripture to fit what you want it to say that is tampering. You may believe in "a" jesus, but not THE Jesus.

John 1:1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2 The same was in the beginning with God.

I didn't write or rewrite any scripture.

Revelation 1:9
“I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.”

King James Version (KJV)

Of course you. Tell me, is Jesus coming again?

2 Timothy 3:5-7​

King James Version​

5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.​


You mean within 40 years? A generation?

LOL, sorry son. My Jesus will return during the future Tribulation and I will meet Him in the clouds and although I WISH it would happen Pre Trib it won't. I will most likely die for my faith. People like you will cheer it on.

That's Tim Lahaye and Hal Lindsey. Read it again.

Sorry, no but it's fine, your "faith" isn't in the "real" Gospel. You have a myopic view of the "truth", one that doesn't take into account the power the reality of a living and and active to this very dau Jesus.
By the way, Hal and Tim are pre-trib, read it again. Unfortunately I'll be going through the Tribulation(if I live that long)
 

The expected Messiah was supposed to be an anointed warrior king who would vanquish the enemies of the Jews. Jesus doesn't fit that description in any way.

There isn't a single reference to Jesus in the old testament unless you fiddle with scripture which Christians do.
The Old Testament doesn't mention Jesus of Nazareth by name, but certain prophecies were fulfilled only by Jesus. Daniel 9, for example, mentions some:

Seventy weeks are decreed about your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to put an end to sin, and to atone for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal both vision and prophet, and to anoint a most holy place.

This passage lists six prophecies for Israel’s Messiah to fulfill: to finish the transgression, conquer sin, atone for iniquity, bring everlasting righteousness, seal all future visions, and bless and anoint a majestic new most holy place. These things happened with Jesus.

And the kingdom came with Jesus, Daniel's rock built by no human hand that would fill the earth (2:34-35). As it turned out, no one fulfilled these prophecies except Jesus the Nazarene.


Yes, the holy people pined for a warrior king to deliver them from their foreign overlords. This idolatrous people were prone to blaming others for their own iniquity, but Jesus put the blame on them and ended their reign without drawing any blood except his own. He was not the messiah they expected, so they had him killed.

Except Daniel was NOT a prophet, but a historian writing about Antiochus IV..

Jesus Christ believed that Daniel was certainly a prophet:

Mark 13:14

14 ¶ But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judæa flee to the mountains:

Matthew 24:15

15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

Daniel wrote about Antiochus IV as the first Abomination of Desolation. Jesus and Matthew are referencing Daniel.

Mark 13:14
14 ¶ But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judæa flee to the mountains:
Matthew 24:15
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

This time when you see the Abominton of Desolation as spoken of in Daniel, flee Jerusalem to the mountains (and avoid the tribulation)

They were two seperate events..

So Jesus was a liar?

Jesus is referencng the earlier Abominationn of Desolation during the rule of Antiochus IV.

You keep running from my question because it's not religion you detest, it's Christianity. As a Hindu you believe in shiva and all the rest.

You're a moron. I'm Episcopalian.

Horse hockey. You don't believe in Jesus at all.

So much so that I don't think we should tamper with scripture.

Revelation 1:9
“I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.”

King James Version (KJV)

You "tamper" with Scripture with nearly every post, He is the Word, ALL of the Word, both Old and New Testament. When you twist scripture to fit what you want it to say that is tampering. You may believe in "a" jesus, but not THE Jesus.

John 1:1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2 The same was in the beginning with God.

I didn't write or rewrite any scripture.

Revelation 1:9
“I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.”

King James Version (KJV)

Of course you. Tell me, is Jesus coming again?

2 Timothy 3:5-7​

King James Version​

5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.​


You mean within 40 years? A generation?

LOL, sorry son. My Jesus will return during the future Tribulation and I will meet Him in the clouds and although I WISH it would happen Pre Trib it won't. I will most likely die for my faith. People like you will cheer it on.

That's Tim Lahaye and Hal Lindsey. Read it again.

Sorry, no but it's fine, your "faith" isn't in the "real" Gospel. You have a myopic view of the "truth", one that doesn't take into account the power the reality of a living and and active to this very dau Jesus.
By the way, Hal and Tim are pre-trib, read it again. Unfortunately I'll be going through the Tribulation(if I live that long)

LOLOL Futurists never read scripture.

The tribulation was over in 70 AD.
 

The expected Messiah was supposed to be an anointed warrior king who would vanquish the enemies of the Jews. Jesus doesn't fit that description in any way.

There isn't a single reference to Jesus in the old testament unless you fiddle with scripture which Christians do.
The Old Testament doesn't mention Jesus of Nazareth by name, but certain prophecies were fulfilled only by Jesus. Daniel 9, for example, mentions some:

Seventy weeks are decreed about your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to put an end to sin, and to atone for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal both vision and prophet, and to anoint a most holy place.

This passage lists six prophecies for Israel’s Messiah to fulfill: to finish the transgression, conquer sin, atone for iniquity, bring everlasting righteousness, seal all future visions, and bless and anoint a majestic new most holy place. These things happened with Jesus.

And the kingdom came with Jesus, Daniel's rock built by no human hand that would fill the earth (2:34-35). As it turned out, no one fulfilled these prophecies except Jesus the Nazarene.


Yes, the holy people pined for a warrior king to deliver them from their foreign overlords. This idolatrous people were prone to blaming others for their own iniquity, but Jesus put the blame on them and ended their reign without drawing any blood except his own. He was not the messiah they expected, so they had him killed.

Except Daniel was NOT a prophet, but a historian writing about Antiochus IV..

Jesus Christ believed that Daniel was certainly a prophet:

Mark 13:14

14 ¶ But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judæa flee to the mountains:

Matthew 24:15

15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

Daniel wrote about Antiochus IV as the first Abomination of Desolation. Jesus and Matthew are referencing Daniel.

Mark 13:14
14 ¶ But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judæa flee to the mountains:
Matthew 24:15
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

This time when you see the Abominton of Desolation as spoken of in Daniel, flee Jerusalem to the mountains (and avoid the tribulation)

They were two seperate events..

So Jesus was a liar?

Jesus is referencng the earlier Abominationn of Desolation during the rule of Antiochus IV.

You keep running from my question because it's not religion you detest, it's Christianity. As a Hindu you believe in shiva and all the rest.

You're a moron. I'm Episcopalian.

Horse hockey. You don't believe in Jesus at all.

So much so that I don't think we should tamper with scripture.

Revelation 1:9
“I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.”

King James Version (KJV)

You "tamper" with Scripture with nearly every post, He is the Word, ALL of the Word, both Old and New Testament. When you twist scripture to fit what you want it to say that is tampering. You may believe in "a" jesus, but not THE Jesus.

John 1:1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2 The same was in the beginning with God.

I didn't write or rewrite any scripture.

Revelation 1:9
“I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.”

King James Version (KJV)

Of course you. Tell me, is Jesus coming again?

2 Timothy 3:5-7​

King James Version​

5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.​


You mean within 40 years? A generation?

LOL, sorry son. My Jesus will return during the future Tribulation and I will meet Him in the clouds and although I WISH it would happen Pre Trib it won't. I will most likely die for my faith. People like you will cheer it on.

That's Tim Lahaye and Hal Lindsey. Read it again.

Sorry, no but it's fine, your "faith" isn't in the "real" Gospel. You have a myopic view of the "truth", one that doesn't take into account the power the reality of a living and and active to this very dau Jesus.
By the way, Hal and Tim are pre-trib, read it again. Unfortunately I'll be going through the Tribulation(if I live that long)

LOLOL Futurists never read scripture.

The tribulation was over in 70 AD.

LOL, you go with that son, I know you think you are the smartest little boy in the class but you aren't. I'm fine with you going to hell it is after all your choice.
 
Excellent - this is what I have been waiting for.
Now......what does the actual text of Revelation tell us as to "WHOM" the letter or Book of Revelations was addressed (Hint....its not Joseph Smith).

The source of the Book of Revelation is the Christ Himself. The words of revelation were given to an angel who in turn gave them to John. John simply recorded/drafted the things that were revealed to him (Rev. 1:1, 4, 9, 22:8).

Historical scholars have presented a couple of dates as to when the book was recorded, the 1st date is suggested to be between 64 and 68AD, during the reign of Nero. The 2nd date suggests the book was recorded between 91 and 96AD during the reign of Domitian. Both era's were times when Christians were greatly persecuted by Rome.

I am of the opinion that it was written during the time period when Christians were being burned and used as entertainment in the Roman arenas as the Book addressed the hostilities by the Roman Empire were becoming difficult. (Rev. 1:9, 2:10, 13).

Regardless of when the Book was written.......it was written during the life time of an Apostle and its most easy to understand why the Book was written.

Most people ignore the very opening context of this book, as several statements contained in the beginning verses are overlooked or simply ignored. The Book of Revelation reveals things to John through proxy of an angel of "Things that were to shortly take place......." Rev. 1:1, 3, 22:6,10.

Any viewpoint that does consider these events/symbolic in nature or (signified as recorded in the opening) are to take place in the 1st or 2nd century anything else contradicts the opening statements of this book.

1800 years is not considered "shortly" by any means as its not even close to the time period when John wrote this book down.

The only events not considered to come about shortly as SIGNIFIED are the passages addressing the 2nd coming of Jesus. Passages such as Rev. 20:11-22:5. But any view that states the majority of these signified events were to take place thousands of years later simply ignore the words of John that very clearly states that the events would come soon after he wrote them.

The purpose of Revelation was to give encouragement to the early Christians who were being victimized by the Roman Empire and even the Jewish leadership before Jerusalem fell. (Rev. 1:3) All throughout this book of symbolism there is a portrayal of great tribulation upon the church which are being overcome by God. The word "overcome" is used 17 times in the book of revelation. Examples would be Rev.12:11, and 21:7.

We see that God is always in control regardless of how it appears.....just as Paul stated in one of his records (1 Cor.15:54-17).

Just like all the other books of the New Testament the book of revelation was written for and addressed to the Christians who were alive and living through these early tribulations when the Church was being established.....but this does not prohibit any of the writings being taught from being valuable lessons to learn according to the principles being taught therein...during any future age. Just as Paul stated that we are to study from the Old Testament to learn from the many mistakes made by the early fathers of our religion. We are to constantly study and learn from the all the books of the New Testament.
 
Last edited:

The expected Messiah was supposed to be an anointed warrior king who would vanquish the enemies of the Jews. Jesus doesn't fit that description in any way.

There isn't a single reference to Jesus in the old testament unless you fiddle with scripture which Christians do.
The Old Testament doesn't mention Jesus of Nazareth by name, but certain prophecies were fulfilled only by Jesus. Daniel 9, for example, mentions some:

Seventy weeks are decreed about your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to put an end to sin, and to atone for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal both vision and prophet, and to anoint a most holy place.

This passage lists six prophecies for Israel’s Messiah to fulfill: to finish the transgression, conquer sin, atone for iniquity, bring everlasting righteousness, seal all future visions, and bless and anoint a majestic new most holy place. These things happened with Jesus.

And the kingdom came with Jesus, Daniel's rock built by no human hand that would fill the earth (2:34-35). As it turned out, no one fulfilled these prophecies except Jesus the Nazarene.


Yes, the holy people pined for a warrior king to deliver them from their foreign overlords. This idolatrous people were prone to blaming others for their own iniquity, but Jesus put the blame on them and ended their reign without drawing any blood except his own. He was not the messiah they expected, so they had him killed.

Except Daniel was NOT a prophet, but a historian writing about Antiochus IV..

Jesus Christ believed that Daniel was certainly a prophet:

Mark 13:14

14 ¶ But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judæa flee to the mountains:

Matthew 24:15

15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

Daniel wrote about Antiochus IV as the first Abomination of Desolation. Jesus and Matthew are referencing Daniel.

Mark 13:14
14 ¶ But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judæa flee to the mountains:
Matthew 24:15
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)

This time when you see the Abominton of Desolation as spoken of in Daniel, flee Jerusalem to the mountains (and avoid the tribulation)

They were two seperate events..

So Jesus was a liar?

Jesus is referencng the earlier Abominationn of Desolation during the rule of Antiochus IV.

You keep running from my question because it's not religion you detest, it's Christianity. As a Hindu you believe in shiva and all the rest.

You're a moron. I'm Episcopalian.

Horse hockey. You don't believe in Jesus at all.

So much so that I don't think we should tamper with scripture.

Revelation 1:9
“I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.”

King James Version (KJV)

You "tamper" with Scripture with nearly every post, He is the Word, ALL of the Word, both Old and New Testament. When you twist scripture to fit what you want it to say that is tampering. You may believe in "a" jesus, but not THE Jesus.

John 1:1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2 The same was in the beginning with God.

I didn't write or rewrite any scripture.

Revelation 1:9
“I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.”

King James Version (KJV)

Of course you. Tell me, is Jesus coming again?

2 Timothy 3:5-7​

King James Version​

5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.​


You mean within 40 years? A generation?

LOL, sorry son. My Jesus will return during the future Tribulation and I will meet Him in the clouds and although I WISH it would happen Pre Trib it won't. I will most likely die for my faith. People like you will cheer it on.

That's Tim Lahaye and Hal Lindsey. Read it again.

Sorry, no but it's fine, your "faith" isn't in the "real" Gospel. You have a myopic view of the "truth", one that doesn't take into account the power the reality of a living and and active to this very dau Jesus.
By the way, Hal and Tim are pre-trib, read it again. Unfortunately I'll be going through the Tribulation(if I live that long)

LOLOL Futurists never read scripture.

The tribulation was over in 70 AD.

LOL, you go with that son, I know you think you are the smartest little boy in the class but you aren't. I'm fine with you going to hell it is after all your choice.

I'm a grandmother.. The book of Revelation is addressed to the 7 churchs and happens within 40 years of the crucifixion.
 
Excellent - this is what I have been waiting for.
Now......what does the actual text of Revelation tell us as to "WHOM" the letter or Book of Revelations was addressed (Hint....its not Joseph Smith).

The source of the Book of Revelation is the Christ Himself. The words of revelation were given to an angel who in turn gave them to John. John simply recorded/drafted the things that were revealed to him (Rev. 1:1, 4, 9, 22:8).

Historical scholars have presented a couple of dates as to when the book was recorded, the 1st date is suggested to be between 64 and 68AD, during the reign of Nero. The 2nd date suggests the book was recorded between 91 and 96AD during the reign of Domitian. Both era's were times when Christians were greatly persecuted by Rome.

I am of the opinion that it was written during the time period when Christians were being burned and used as entertainment in the Roman arenas as the Book addressed the hostilities by the Roman Empire were becoming difficult. (Rev. 1:9, 2:10, 13).

Regardless of when the Book was written.......it was written during the life time of an Apostle and its most easy to understand why the Book was written.

Most people ignore the very opening context of this book, as several statements contained in the beginning verses are overlooked or simply ignored. The Book of Revelation reveals things to John through proxy of an angel of "Things that were to shortly take place......." Rev. 1:1, 3, 22:6,10.

Any viewpoint that does consider these events/symbolic in nature or (signified as recorded in the opening) are to take place in the 1st or 2nd century anything else contradicts the opening statements of this book.

1800 years is not considered "shortly" by any means as its not even close to the time period when John wrote this book down.

The only events not considered to come about shortly as SIGNIFIED are the passages addressing the 2nd coming of Jesus. Passages such as Rev. 20:11-22:5. But any view that states the majority of these signified events were to take place thousands of years later simply ignore the words of John that very clearly states that the events would come soon after he wrote them.

The purpose of Revelation was to give encouragement to the early Christians who were being victimized by the Roman Empire and even the Jewish leadership before Jerusalem fell. (Rev. 1:3) All throughout this book of symbolism there is a portrayal of great tribulation upon the church which are being overcome by God. The word "overcome" is used 17 times in the book of revelation. Examples would be Rev.12:11, and 21:7.

We see that God is always in control regardless of how it appears.....just as Paul stated in one of his records (1 Cor.15:54-17).

Just like all the other books of the New Testament the book of revelation was written for and addressed to the Christians who were alive and living through these early tribulations when the Church was being established.....but this does not prohibit any of the writings being taught from being valuable lessons to learn according to the principles being taught therein...during any future age. Just as Paul stated that we are to study from the Old Testament to learn from the many mistakes made by the early fathers of our religion. We are to constantly study and learn from the all the books of the New Testament.

REVELATION 1:9 KJV
I Iohn, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Iesus Christ, was in the Isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimonie of Iesus Christ. - King James Version (1611)
 
I am of the opinion that it was written during the time period when Christians were being burned and used as entertainment in the Roman arenas as the Book addressed the hostilities by the Roman Empire were becoming difficult. (Rev. 1:9, 2:10, 13).
Roman persecution of Christians may have occurred, as Revelation 2:10 alludes to, but not to the extent that many people - especially Christians - believe. Such occasions were really kind of rare, and not perpetrated by the Roman people; pagans were really quite tolerant. Only the authorities used force to enforce the peace, however reluctantly.

In the New Testament, the Romans were not the ones who persecuted the Christians; the Jews were. Jesus did not warn of the rage and retaliation of the Romans; he warned of the rage and retaliation of the Jews. He warned of the Roman forces descending on the rebellious and bloodthirsty Jews. The book of Hebrews, for example, elaborates on the Jews' attempts to Judaize the new converts. The Jews were the rebellious ones. The Jews were the ones whose time had come.

The tribulation of Revelation 1:9 did not involve the Christians in a bloody conflict. The Christians fled that conflict. They endured the tribulation in exile.

As to Revelation 2:13, the Jews (and Christians) regarded Pergamum a dwelling place for Satan because that was where the Great Altar of Zeus silhouetted the skyline. Satan was the adversary; essentially idolatry.

The only events not considered to come about shortly as SIGNIFIED are the passages addressing the 2nd coming of Jesus. Passages such as Rev. 20:11-22:5. But any view that states the majority of these signified events were to take place thousands of years later simply ignore the words of John that very clearly states that the events would come soon after he wrote them.
All prophesy was fulfilled before the apostles' generation ended, according to the Olivet Discourse. That would include the Parousia. In those days, Jesus was to come soon (Rv 22:7, 12). Or does "soon" mean something different than "shortly"?
 
Jesus was referencing the future and not the past. His prophesy was to occur in the future.
It did occur in the future. Nearly a generation after he uttered it.
Indeed...........most people do not comprehend the fact that for the 1st generation (about 10 yrs) after the ascension of the Christ the early church was populated expressly via those of Jewish heritage, the first gentile convert did not occur for over a decade later, after the sacrifice of the cross. God never lies, His prophecies never fail........if the Christ sent an angel to John to project "future" events that were to "Shortly take place"........that prophecy NEVER FAILED.

Revelation is a book of Comfort to the early church with God telling His people regardless of how things might appear......the church would overcome any and all tribulations as God had promised father Abraham to populate the earth with his descendants so they would number like the stars in the sky..................That promise is still alive today, as members are being added to the Lord's church everyday, Christianity has indeed become a GREAT NATION in a spiritual nature with the Lord Jesus Christ still sitting in reign at the right hand of the Father, as King of Kings.

Christianity is the world's largest Religion, populating almost a third of the human race around the globe. Major religious groups - Wikipedia
 
Last edited:
Jesus was referencing the future and not the past. His prophesy was to occur in the future.
It did occur in the future. Nearly a generation after he uttered it.
Indeed...........most people do not comprehend the fact that for the 1st generation (about 10 yrs) after the ascension of the Christ the early church was populated expressly via those of Jewish heritage, the first gentile convert did not occur for over a decade later, after the sacrifice of the cross. God never lies, His prophecies never fail........if the Christ sent an angel to John to project "future" events that were to "Shortly take place"........that prophecy NEVER FAILED.

Revelation is a book of Comfort to the early church with God telling His people regardless of how things might appear......the church would overcome any and all tribulations as God had promised father Abraham to populate the earth with his descendants so they would number like the stars in the sky..................That promise is still alive today, as members are being added to the Lord's church everyday, Christianity has indeed become a GREAT NATION in a spiritual nature with the Lord Jesus Christ still sitting in reign at the right hand of the Father, as King of Kings.

Christianity is the world's largest Religion, populating almost a third of the human race around the globe. Major religious groups - Wikipedia
One of the biggest mistakes that mainstream and dispensationalist Christians make in reading the Scriptures is to pluck them out of their historical contexts. Hence they have a giant cube descending from the sky that Jesus plans on marrying; they have Jesus "returning" (a term he himself does not use in describing his Parousia) in bodily form (which the Bible does not say); they keep waiting on a new brick-and-mortar temple that will never be built; etc.

The apostles wrote that they themselves were witnessing the last days, yet most modern Christians caricature the Scriptures with their ridiculous, cartoonish visions that lack context. No one makes a mockery of Christianity like evangelical and dispensationalist Christians do.
 

Forum List

Back
Top