Zone1 The Wayward Church

[norwegen]

Characteristics of the early church were spontaneity, freedom, and open participation in which every member participated.

The Protestant order of worship has roots in the Catholic Mass, which did not originate in the New Testament. The Mass didn’t begin until the fourth century, and Gregory the Great is the man largely responsible for shaping the medieval Mass in the late sixth century. It has changed little since then. The Eucharist, "to give thanks," remains the re-sacrificing of Jesus Christ.

Luther and the Protestants believed preaching, not the Eucharist, to be the heart of the gathering of worshipers. The pulpit rather than the altar-table ought to be the central element.

But Luther’s order of worship and Gregory’s liturgy are otherwise virtually the same, and neither has any biblical foundation. Both have borrowed traditions from paganism and, save for the priest or preacher, relegate the assembly to passive participation, but that is contrary to scripture. All believers are called to be priests and active members of the body.

A real, first-century assembly is one in which all are equals. Preachers need not apply for leadership position.

 

[Votto]

How's about focusing on giving people some hope in a world drowning in Left wing wokeness and misery instead?

Yea, the church needs help.

If you teach them right from wrong, an amazing thing happens. Next thing you know they will be able to tell you want a woman is.

 

[occupied]

That's kind of how it was with some primitive Pentecostals. Their services were mostly music and singing with rattlesnakes.

 

[Leviticus]

The main difference between Catholics and Lutherans is that Lutherans do bot believe that the clergy has the right to just change dogma. If it isn't spelled out in the bible, it's not part of the Lutheran faith.

 

[norwegen]

That's kind of how it was with some primitive Pentecostals. Their services were mostly music and singing with rattlesnakes.

Remove the emotion, and a Pentecostal service is similar to a Baptist one. Of course, the members are allowed more participation with dancing in the pews and with tongues and "prophetic" utterances (but only for a minute or two).

 

[norwegen]

The main difference between Catholics and Lutherans is that Lutherans do bot believe that the clergy has the right to just change dogma. If it isn't spelled out in the bible, it's not part of the Lutheran faith.

None of it is in the Bible, so changing anything doesn't violate the Bible.

 

[Leviticus]

None of it is in the Bible, so changing anything doesn't violate the Bible.

90% of catholic dogma was just made up by church leaders and has no basis in the bible.

Lutherans base their chrch laws on how the bible says.

 

[norwegen]

90% of catholic dogma was just made up by church leaders and has no basis in the bible.

Lutherans base their chrch laws on how the bible says.

Adherence to law is debatable, but back to order of worship, or the topic.

Does a Lutheran service look something like this?

Singing
Prayer
The Sermon
Admonition to the people
The Lord's Supper
Singing
Post-communion prayer
The Benediction

I trust it does. And it's really no different than in any other church.

The question: is it biblical?

 

[occupied]

Remove the emotion, and a Pentecostal service is similar to a Baptist one. Of course, the members are allowed more participation with dancing in the pews and with tongues and "prophetic" utterances (but only for a minute or two).

Not even sure the primitive Pentecostals are a thing anymore. They were a dying breed thirty years ago when I last had any contact.

 

[norwegen]

Not even sure the primitive Pentecostals are a thing anymore. They were a dying breed thirty years ago when I last had any contact.

They were the "spirit-filled" ones. Everyone else were the frozen chosen.

Apparently, this unique spirit-filled power they had didn't actually manifest.

 

[occupied]

They were the "spirit-filled" ones. Everyone else were the frozen chosen.

Apparently, this unique spirit-filled power they had didn't actually manifest.

Still it's the closest thing I've seen to a communal church gathering without a set program of worship or clearly defined leader.

 

[norwegen]

Still it's the closest thing I've seen to a communal church gathering without a set program of worship or clearly defined leader.

Like I said, Pentecostal (and Charismatic) churches allowed their members a little more participation, though still very limited.

And yes, they had a set program of worship, even if not a printed bulletin. You arrived every service with certain expectations of rote.

 

[occupied]

Like I said, Pentecostal (and Charismatic) churches allowed their members a little more participation, though still very limited.

And yes, they had a set program of worship, even if not a printed bulletin. You arrived every service with certain expectations of rote.

These people called themselves "primative Pentecostal". It was way out in the N Alabama hills. The "gathering house" didn't even have electricity and I never saw anyone that seemed to be leading the service.