The "TRUE" problem with this whole health care issue...

[Oscar Wao]

It's not Obama.

It's not Pelosi, Reid, or anyone in Congress.

It's not the "compromisers."

It's not the lobbyists, whether they're lobbying for the "good" side or the "bad" side.

It's not any past President or Congress that tried to do this.

It's not the Obamanoids who think health care "reform" would be the greatest thing since the wheel was invented.

It's not even the mammoth bill that's being proposed.

The problem is the foundation for everything I mentioned...

Which is...

The view that health insurance is a "basic right." That you're entitled to it just as much as you're entitled to free speech, freedom of or from religion, self-defense, privacy, proper and fair legal treatment (ie no excessive fines, fair and speedy trial, no cruel/unusual punishment, etc.), or any of these things.

Yes, I said it.

I'm ready to be piled on like a football player.

Go on, give me your worst.

I don't care.

It's my opinion and I'm sticking with it.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

I'd have to say I agree. The problem with this line of thinking is that you can't have a right to something that somebody else has to provide.

 

[rightwinger]

Life, Liberty and the pursuit of happiness

Socialist nonsense!

 

[Oscar Wao]

Life, Liberty and the pursuit of happiness

Socialist nonsense!

That doesn't even implicitly allow for health care to be a "right."

I wouldn't go as far as to say it's a luxury, aka "Be damned grateful and lucky ya'll got somfin!"

But I don't recognize it as a human right either.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Life, Liberty and the pursuit of happiness

Socialist nonsense!

The only nonsense is if you think that line means the government should force people to provide a service for other people.

 

[elvis]

Life, Liberty and the pursuit of happiness

Socialist nonsense!

keyword: pursuit.

 

[Oscar Wao]

Life, Liberty and the pursuit of happiness

Socialist nonsense!

keyword: pursuit.

They actually argue more on the "life" point but you are right on this one though.

 

[Oscar Wao]

But then again everything is made into a "right" these days, so what's the point in arguing about it?

 

[rightwinger]

The key issue here is...

We are the wealthiest nation on the planet.
We are the only industrialized nation that does not ensure healthcare for all its citizens.
We rank 37th in the quality of healthcare
We allow people to go broke just because they get sick
We have 47 million uninsured

Other nations look at us and wonder

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

None of that changes the nature of what is or what is not a right, and healthcare insurance does not fall into that category. What we need are market reforms for insurance.

 

[DiamondDave]

Life, Liberty and the pursuit of happiness

Socialist nonsense!

Life... not the means for you to upkeep it at the expense of someone else's personal rights

Liberty... The right to act upon your will... not the right to have someone else act and give you stuff according to your will

The pursuit of happiness.. not to have it handed to you

 

[elvis]

The key issue here is...

We are the wealthiest nation on the planet.
We are the only industrialized nation that does not ensure healthcare for all its citizens.
We rank 37th in the quality of healthcare
We allow people to go broke just because they get sick
We have 47 million uninsured

Other nations look at us and wonder

let them wonder all they like. we can look at them with wonder about their horrendous tax rates and government inefficiencies. your 47 million figure includes illegal aliens, whom your ossiah is hell-bent on insuring no matter how many times he says otherwise. the "Goebbels trick", as a liberal friend of mine refers to it, doesn't work, no matter which party employs it.

 

[Oscar Wao]

The key issue here is...

We are the wealthiest nation on the planet.

I'd wonder how fast we're going to not be so anymore...

We are the only industrialized nation that does not ensure healthcare for all its citizens.

Because you aren't ENTITLED to health insurance or health care. If it's such a human right, why are there so many people that do NOT, of their own volition, go to the doctor or any "special" doctor that you usually "have" to see yearly (aka dentist, eye doctor, etc.)?

We rank 37th in the quality of healthcare

Is that according to the WHO, an anti-sovereignty (of any nation, not just America) and globalist part of the UN?

We allow people to go broke just because they get sick

I love simplistic glib statements...

We have 47 million uninsured

It's 47 million now? God, the numbers keep changing!

Other nations look at us and wonder

...why we aren't trying to stoop down to THEIR level.

 

[elvis]

Life, Liberty and the pursuit of happiness

Socialist nonsense!

Life... not the means for you to upkeep it at the expense of someone else's personal rights

Liberty... The right to act upon your will... not the right to have someone else act and give you stuff according to your will

The pursuit of happiness.. not to have it handed to you

and why do the liberals not embrace the "life" portion when abortion is discussed?

 

[rightwinger]

NCHC | Facts About Healthcare - Health Insurance Costs

The Impact of Rising Health Care Costs

Economists have found that rising health care costs correlate with significant drops in health insurance coverage, and national surveys also show that the primary reason people are uninsured is due to the high and escalating cost of health insurance coverage.8
A recent study found that 62 percent of all bankruptcies filed in 2007 were linked to medical expenses. Of those who filed for bankruptcy, nearly 80 percent had health insurance.9
According to another published article, about 1.5 million families lose their homes to foreclosure every year due to unaffordable medical costs.10
Without health care reform, small businesses will pay nearly $2.4 trillion dollars over the next ten years in health care costs for their workers, 178,000 small business jobs will be lost by 2018 as a result of health care costs, $834 billion in small business wages will be lost due to high health care costs over the next ten years, small businesses will lose $52.1 billion in profits to high health care costs and 1.6 million small business workers will suffer “job lock“— roughly one in 16 people currently insured by their employers.11

 

[Zander]

Life, Liberty and the pursuit of happiness

Socialist nonsense!

Strawman nonsense!

 

[AllieBaba]

The key issue here is...

We are the wealthiest nation on the planet.
We are the only industrialized nation that does not ensure healthcare for all its citizens.
We rank 37th in the quality of healthcare
We allow people to go broke just because they get sick
We have 47 million uninsured

Other nations look at us and wonder

We are the wealthiest nation for a reason. It's because we haven't prescribed to the notion that the government should have control over the masses. The government exists to protect them.

Why should we follow the example of failed countries, who only exist because WE protect them?

 

[Zander]

The key issue here is...

We are the wealthiest nation on the planet.
We are the only industrialized nation that does not ensure healthcare for all its citizens.
We rank 37th in the quality of healthcare
We allow people to go broke just because they get sick
We have 47 million uninsured

Other nations look at us and wonder

Why should we care what other nations "wonder" about when it comes to domestic policy?

 

[Oscar Wao]

The key issue here is...

We are the wealthiest nation on the planet.
We are the only industrialized nation that does not ensure healthcare for all its citizens.
We rank 37th in the quality of healthcare
We allow people to go broke just because they get sick
We have 47 million uninsured

Other nations look at us and wonder

Why should we care what other nations "wonder" about when it comes to domestic policy?

Yes, that's something I should have noted as well.

I'm sure France could care less about what we think of their domestic policy...

Why is it that we're the ones who have to worry about what "the world thinks" about how we handle OUR OWN MATTERS.

The John and Mary, and their sons Jim and Bill family losing insurance in America isn't going to have an effect on newlyweds Santiago and Laura's health care in Spain.

 

[WillowTree]

Five main problems are.

1. 500 billion dollar cut in Medicare!

2. Illegal immigration

3. demoncwats refusal to allow verification of American citizenship.

4. failure to fund it.

5. bad timing. it's all about jobs jobs jobs.


call me joe..