The Roe Effect

[Annie]

Just heading off to bed and had to read one more thing, thought this interesting, links at site:

http://www.opinionjournal.com/best/

Babies Having (Fewer) Babies
The Washington Post reports on an interesting new analysis by the National Campaign to Prevent Teen Pregnancy. The campaign, noting that U.S. teen birthrates fell 30% between 1991 and 2002, calculates that if those rates had instead remained constant, there would be some 406,000 additional children living below the federally defined poverty line and some 428,000 living in households with single mothers.

Since 1991 was exactly 18 years after Roe v. Wade, we got to wondering if the Roe effect might have something to do with all this. The Roe effect would predict that the effect of a reduction in birthrates would be greatest in liberal states, where pregnant teenagers would be more likely to exercise their "right to privacy" and thus less likely to carry their babies to term. The campaign's numbers seem to bear this out.

Here, in order, are the 10 states with the biggest percentage decline in teen birthrates (links for tables in PDF): California, Maine, Michigan, Alaska, New Hampshire, Washington, Vermont, Massachusetts, Connecticut, Hawaii.

These are the 10 states where the campaign attributes the greatest percentage improvement in child poverty rates to a reduction in teen birthrates: Connecticut, Vermont, Maryland, Michigan, Maine, Rhode Island, Pennsylvania, Ohio, California, Massachusetts.

And here's the same list for the improvement in the number of children living with single mothers: Michigan, Missouri, New Hampshire, Vermont, California, Massachusetts, Delaware, Illinois, Pennsylvania, Maine.

John Kerry carried nine of the top 10 states in each category, which is remarkable considering he won only 19 states overall. (The District of Columbia, if it were a state, would place 10th on the first list and first on the other two lists.) Thus it would appear that there is a correlation between the encouraging social trends the campaign notes and relatively slow population growth in Democratic-leaning states.

One other thing strikes us as odd about the whole effort: Isn't the focus on teen pregnancy slightly misplaced? After all, lots of 18- and 19-year-old women are mature enough to marry and start families, and there's no reason to stigmatize them for doing so. A national campaign against unwed teen pregnancy would make more sense.

 

[Avatar4321]

How about we just have a campaign to get married and stay married?

 

[dilloduck]

How about we just have a campaign to get married and stay married?

Cmon dude !!---that takes effort !!!

 

[Falk]

I read the initial post over and over again, trying to find out what was so interesting about it. I mean, using statistic this way don't impress me a whole lot. But, my eyes kept falling on the line about how many additional childeren would have been born below the poverty line. And that is really interesting, beacause i have only heard that kind of statistics beeing published regarding countries in the third world.

In the final statement a opinion is stated:
"A national campaign against unwed teen pregnancy would make more sense."

I guess "unwed" is the key word here? Fascinating how one can use the word poverty line and conclude that more weddings would make more sense.

I'm slowly starting to open my eyes. And I don't like what I see.
/Falk

 

[KarlMarx]

How about we just have a campaign to get married and stay married?

agreed..... but that would require that people change their attitudes

 

[musicman]

I read the initial post over and over again, trying to find out what was so interesting about it. I mean, using statistic this way don't impress me a whole lot. But, my eyes kept falling on the line about how many additional childeren would have been born below the poverty line. And that is really interesting, beacause i have only heard that kind of statistics beeing published regarding countries in the third world.

In the final statement a opinion is stated:
"A national campaign against unwed teen pregnancy would make more sense."

I guess "unwed" is the key word here? Fascinating how one can use the word poverty line and conclude that more weddings would make more sense.

I'm slowly starting to open my eyes. And I don't like what I see.
/Falk

Try opening them a little faster and a lot wider, there, Falk. Did you read the first two paragraphs at all? Maybe you did, but just didn't like them.

The point of the piece is that the study smells funny - kind of like a lot of flowery language being used to mask some rather malodorous truths about Roe vs. Wade, blue states, and birth rates. "See how we're IMPROVING?" Never mind the deadly path to those rosy new numbers.

Fewer babies are being born into poverty - almost certainly because they're being killed off. That's a good thing?

Fewer unwed teen pregnancies would be an indication that America is trying to pull itself out of the moral sewer in which it has wallowed for the last thirty years. That's a bad thing?

 

[Gem]

Falk Wrote:

Fascinating how one can use the word poverty line and conclude that more weddings would make more sense.

Not quite sure what you find so fascinating about it. A large number of the single people living below the poverty level, i.e. single mothers, would be lifted out of that status by marrying someone who has a full-time job and sharing assets with them.

 

[Annie]

I read the initial post over and over again, trying to find out what was so interesting about it. I mean, using statistic this way don't impress me a whole lot. But, my eyes kept falling on the line about how many additional childeren would have been born below the poverty line. And that is really interesting, beacause i have only heard that kind of statistics beeing published regarding countries in the third world.

In the final statement a opinion is stated:
"A national campaign against unwed teen pregnancy would make more sense."

I guess "unwed" is the key word here? Fascinating how one can use the word poverty line and conclude that more weddings would make more sense.

I'm slowly starting to open my eyes. And I don't like what I see.
/Falk

I kind of think of the Roe effect as the liberal equivalent of group suicide. For the poor, it's sanctioned genocide, heck it's easier to kill than to educate.

I don't much like what I see either.

 

[Falk]

Not quite sure what you find so fascinating about it. A large number of the single people living below the poverty level, i.e. single mothers, would be lifted out of that status by marrying someone who has a full-time job and sharing assets with them.

NO!
Well, poverty is the lack of sharing resources - I agree, but you marry someone you love. Society as a whole can "share assets".

Thinking of it, I don't even understand what you mean. Should everyone with a full-time job just get to marry an unemployed?

 

[musicman]

NO!
Society as a whole can "share assets".

Ah, yes - to each according to his need; from each according to his ability. That sounds so nice!

 

[dilloduck]

NO!
Well, poverty is the lack of sharing resources - I agree, but you marry someone you love. Society as a whole can "share assets".

Thinking of it, I don't even understand what you mean. Should everyone with a full-time job just get to marry an unemployed?

BY the way--what IS your income--It just might be that you owe me !

 

[musicman]

BY the way--what IS your income--It just might be that you owe me !

:rotflmao:

You're KILLING me, man!

 

[Falk]

Ah, yes - to each according to his need; from each according to his ability. That sounds so nice!

Allright, i get it. What I meant to say (wich you probably understand) is that people should get married with someone they love, not someone with a full-time job. The struggle against poverty has to be taken somewhere else.
In some countries women are still forced to get married over economics.

BY the way--what IS your income--It just might be that you owe me !

Yeah, maybe we should get married? The best way to defeat poverty, right?

 

[dilloduck]

Allright, i get it. What I meant to say (wich you probably understand) is that people should get married with someone they love, not someone with a full-time job. The struggle against poverty has to be taken somewhere else.
In some countries women are still forced to get married over economics.



Yeah, maybe we should get married? The best way to defeat poverty, right?

I think encouraging abstinance until marriage would go a long way !

 

[Nienna]

I think encouraging abstinance until marriage would go a long way !

Yes! And a campaign to help people understand that relationships are about hard work, not ALL about warmfuzzy feelings. Not busting up families because you "fall out of love."

 

[dilloduck]

Yes! And a campaign to help people understand that relationships are about hard work, not ALL about warmfuzzy feelings. Not busting up families because you "fall out of love."

If nothing else you can keep form going into poverty by not having to pay a divorce attorney :

 

[musicman]

Allright, i get it. What I meant to say (wich you probably understand) is that people should get married with someone they love, not someone with a full-time job.

On the contrary, I was responding to the part of your post where you said, "Society as a whole can share assets." I don't hear love and marriage in that statement - I hear the socialist ideal. I can only understand what you type.

 

[Falk]

On the contrary, I was responding to the part of your post where you said, "Society as a whole can share assets." I don't hear love and marriage in that statement - I hear the socialist ideal. I can only understand what you type.

Yeah... whatever. You pick one line and totaly miss the point. That is your problem. And... If you (as you said) only understand what I type, then... I guess I have alot of typing to do.

/Falk

 

[manu1959]

Yeah... whatever. You pick one line and totaly miss the point. That is your problem. And... If you (as you said) only understand what I type, then... I guess I have alot of typing to do.

/Falk

you started this argument by picking one line out of an article....then get all pissy that it was done to you....i oughta neg rep rep you....but damn if i am sharing my assests

 

[Nienna]

If nothing else you can keep form going into poverty by not having to pay a divorce attorney :

:tng: