The First Black Republican Presidential Nominee Will Be.....

[Correll]

And Goldwater's position on it. YOur statement implies that he did those things, when you know he did not.


You are trying to be misleading, while giving yourself cover, by using vague pro-nouns.


You are a dishonest assshole.


Goldwater never supported Jim Crow and neither did the Republican Party. You are a lying asshole.

Goldwater voted AGAINST the Civil Rights Act

Make of it what you want

Except you leapt from that, to talking about supporting the use of government power to enforce Jim Crow.


YOU did that, not me. So, drop your pretense that you did not.


His stated reason was not opposition to Civil Rights but concern about how that particular bill addressed the issue.


Considering his life long support of Civil Rights AND smaller government, that position is highly credible.


Thus his position and his presidential run was not the beginning of the debunked conspiracy theory of "The Southern Strategy".

Umm...you were the one jumping to a conclusion
I merely corrected you on it

Bullshit. YOu are a dishonest coward.


Barry Goldwater was not pandering to southern racists as you claimed. His opposition to that specific bill was not based on opposition to Civil Rights but to how that bill attempted to achieve them.


HIs campaign did not reflect the GOP "flipping" on Civil Rights, nor pandering to southern racists, as you claimed.


That you claimed those things and now when called on your shit, are trying to weasel out of them, instead of defending them, or admitting you were wrong,


is you being a race baiting asshole.

It's a endless cycle of horseshit.

I deal with others who are not as extreme

Correll, you really need to shut your fucking white mouth up trying to tell blacks who saw why blacks left the republican party anything. If things were as you say, Goldwaters sincere racism was an insult to the humanity of black people. And that's just the way it is. It's not debatable and your opinion on the matter is irrelevant. Sometimes it's good for whites like yourself to know when to be seen and not heard.

Goldwater claimed he was not racist but was merely standing up for conservative “principles”. States have the right to set their own rules on how their citizens are treated.

But this was 1964. I don’t see how anyone could maintain those “principles” as they saw the state turn firehoses on peaceful protestors, use attack dogs, imprison people who only wanted to vote.

Goldwater sang the same song these conservatives sing today. He was a racist.

And it led to Goldwater winning the states of S Carolina, Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi, Louisiana .....outside of his home state, the only states he won

Two sentences....tsk tsk.

1. This was not the only factor in the election.
2. Johnson was touting his costly "Great Society" program which appealed to more than just blacks.
3. Goldwater was severely undercut by the moderates in the party who, after they lost the primary, refused to campaign for him (and actively worked against him). These were the moderates who thought America would swim in money forever.
4. Rarely mentioned is that Johnson also fought Goldwater on the issue of being an anti-communist.

Wow....learned something doing a little research.

Democratic primary included GEORGE WALLACE

Republican primary included Margaret Chase Smith. Imagine those sexist bastards letting a woman in the program.

Jesus, that's interesting. A women elected to the House, in 1940!


Margaret Chase Smith - Wikipedia



Whoa!


"During the administration of President John F. Kennedy, Smith argued that the United States should use nuclear weapons against the Soviet Union.[14] This led Soviet leader Nikita Khrushchev to call Smith "the devil in disguise of a woman" whose position exceeded "all records of savagery."[14] Smith later replied, "Mr. Khrushchev isn't really mad at me. I am not that important. He is angry because American officials have grown more firm since my speech." "

 

[Correll]

Goldwater voted AGAINST the Civil Rights Act

Make of it what you want

Except you leapt from that, to talking about supporting the use of government power to enforce Jim Crow.


YOU did that, not me. So, drop your pretense that you did not.


His stated reason was not opposition to Civil Rights but concern about how that particular bill addressed the issue.


Considering his life long support of Civil Rights AND smaller government, that position is highly credible.


Thus his position and his presidential run was not the beginning of the debunked conspiracy theory of "The Southern Strategy".

Umm...you were the one jumping to a conclusion
I merely corrected you on it

Bullshit. YOu are a dishonest coward.


Barry Goldwater was not pandering to southern racists as you claimed. His opposition to that specific bill was not based on opposition to Civil Rights but to how that bill attempted to achieve them.


HIs campaign did not reflect the GOP "flipping" on Civil Rights, nor pandering to southern racists, as you claimed.


That you claimed those things and now when called on your shit, are trying to weasel out of them, instead of defending them, or admitting you were wrong,


is you being a race baiting asshole.

It's a endless cycle of horseshit.

I deal with others who are not as extreme

Correll, you really need to shut your fucking white mouth up trying to tell blacks who saw why blacks left the republican party anything. If things were as you say, Goldwaters sincere racism was an insult to the humanity of black people. And that's just the way it is. It's not debatable and your opinion on the matter is irrelevant. Sometimes it's good for whites like yourself to know when to be seen and not heard.

Goldwater claimed he was not racist but was merely standing up for conservative “principles”. States have the right to set their own rules on how their citizens are treated.

But this was 1964. I don’t see how anyone could maintain those “principles” as they saw the state turn firehoses on peaceful protestors, use attack dogs, imprison people who only wanted to vote.

Goldwater sang the same song these conservatives sing today. He was a racist.

And it led to Goldwater winning the states of S Carolina, Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi, Louisiana .....outside of his home state, the only states he won

Two sentences....tsk tsk.

1. This was not the only factor in the election.
2. Johnson was touting his costly "Great Society" program which appealed to more than just blacks.
3. Goldwater was severely undercut by the moderates in the party who, after they lost the primary, refused to campaign for him (and actively worked against him). These were the moderates who thought America would swim in money forever.
4. Rarely mentioned is that Johnson also fought Goldwater on the issue of being an anti-communist.

Wow....learned something doing a little research.

Democratic primary included GEORGE WALLACE

Republican primary included Margaret Chase Smith. Imagine those sexist bastards letting a woman in the program.

Has nothing to do with Goldwater sweeping the Jim Crow south.
Over a southern Democrat no less.

How do you know that? Social Security wasn't an issue the South? Johnson dissing Wallace, wasn't an issue in the South?

 

[Correll]

Except you leapt from that, to talking about supporting the use of government power to enforce Jim Crow.


YOU did that, not me. So, drop your pretense that you did not.


His stated reason was not opposition to Civil Rights but concern about how that particular bill addressed the issue.


Considering his life long support of Civil Rights AND smaller government, that position is highly credible.


Thus his position and his presidential run was not the beginning of the debunked conspiracy theory of "The Southern Strategy".

Umm...you were the one jumping to a conclusion
I merely corrected you on it

Bullshit. YOu are a dishonest coward.


Barry Goldwater was not pandering to southern racists as you claimed. His opposition to that specific bill was not based on opposition to Civil Rights but to how that bill attempted to achieve them.


HIs campaign did not reflect the GOP "flipping" on Civil Rights, nor pandering to southern racists, as you claimed.


That you claimed those things and now when called on your shit, are trying to weasel out of them, instead of defending them, or admitting you were wrong,


is you being a race baiting asshole.

It's a endless cycle of horseshit.

I deal with others who are not as extreme

Goldwater claimed he was not racist but was merely standing up for conservative “principles”. States have the right to set their own rules on how their citizens are treated.

But this was 1964. I don’t see how anyone could maintain those “principles” as they saw the state turn firehoses on peaceful protestors, use attack dogs, imprison people who only wanted to vote.

Goldwater sang the same song these conservatives sing today. He was a racist.

And it led to Goldwater winning the states of S Carolina, Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi, Louisiana .....outside of his home state, the only states he won

Two sentences....tsk tsk.

1. This was not the only factor in the election.
2. Johnson was touting his costly "Great Society" program which appealed to more than just blacks.
3. Goldwater was severely undercut by the moderates in the party who, after they lost the primary, refused to campaign for him (and actively worked against him). These were the moderates who thought America would swim in money forever.
4. Rarely mentioned is that Johnson also fought Goldwater on the issue of being an anti-communist.

Wow....learned something doing a little research.

Democratic primary included GEORGE WALLACE

Republican primary included Margaret Chase Smith. Imagine those sexist bastards letting a woman in the program.

Has nothing to do with Goldwater sweeping the Jim Crow south.
Over a southern Democrat no less.

Really ?

Prove it.

The south has traditionally be a supporter of a strong, edgy, military. Johnson painting Goldwater as being weak on communism helped in the south.

It will be interesting to see which RW answers. The human, or the troll boy, who just does two sentence hit and run snark.

 

[Correll]

That thought is not even logical. Obviously he put staying within the confines of "government limits" over ensuring equal rights for ALL Americans.

Which was a conflict with what blacks wanted. But it was not an insult to their intelligence. It would only have been an insult to their intelligence if he has been lying about why he was doing it. That was my point. It is pathetic that you cannot admit that.

Why should any American have to "wait" for equal treatment in what is supposed be the so called
"land of the free"?

Because the cure had the potential to be another additional problem for the country.

As tax paying citizens, black people were entitled to the same rights as every other citizen, and he apparantly believed that it was ACCEPTABLE for them to be selectively discriminated against at the whim of any state at any time, while he and his fellow oppressors "decided how to make the bill more palatable to the majority". That was nothing but the same ideology that the Confederacy supported prior to the start of the civil war.

No, it is not. Stating that he believed that the way the bill went about it was wrong, is not the same as being against the goal.

It was a moral issue to black citizens during that era, and was definately an INSULT.

Bullshit. It was a practical matter of self interest to blacks. And Goldwater disagreeing with them on how to get there, was NOT an insult to them. It was a political disagreement.


It was only an insult to their intelligence, if he was LYING about his reasons. Which is why you denying that you said that, is stupid.

Unlike you, I am old enough to recall the outrage over it, and black voters responded as they should have.....at the polls.

That is a no brainer, and it will be a well deserved footnote in Goldwaters legacy for eternity.

It is understandable that blacks, suffering under Jim Crow, and facing real racism and discrimination, were not patient with any discussion of METHODS, of fighting racism and discrimination.


IMO, that blame for the lie, lies with the dem liberals, who told and still tell them.

Simply put, YOU were not a black voter in 1964, nor were you even born. I was, and I heard them voice their disdain for Goldwaters draconian "states rights, government overreach" INSULT, first hand.

You, did not.

My parents and grandparents were involved in the civil rights movement, and on foot they went out and knocked on doors to convince registered black voters in our community to leave the Republican party.


Because they were OUTRAGED and INSULTED.

Black voters WERE insulted by it. PERIOD.

Your post is nothing but speculation and a thinly veiled defense of an ideology that the civil war should have buried FOREVER.

Consequently, his position further drove black voters out of the Republican party, as it should have.

And it also left a PERMANENT stain on his legacy. As it SHOULD HAVE.

Putting the rights of citizens on hold due to what an outdated politician calls "government overreach," WAS AN INSULT.

PERIOD.

You claimed it was an "insult to their intelligence".


That statement only makes sense, if you were assuming his stated position was a lie.


I have no doubt that the blacks of the time disagreed with him on that issue. If they choose to take offense at his position, that was their choice. I have no doubt that that was not Barry Goldwater's intent.


"Stain"? Time will tell. IMO, the government has certainly gone into "overreach" and the results have not been good.


IN the future, historians, white and black, might look back at him and his defeat as a very bad turning point for the US.

You are free to think as you wish. But the black voters of that generation DID take his position as an INSULT to their intelligence and they took it as an assault upon their value as tax paying citizens.

And I seriously doubt that anyone who believes in equality of the most basic rights for all citizens will view his defeat in the future as a "bad turning point.

If they have even a shred of moral decency.

Correll, your opinion of what blacks thought about Goldwater doesn't matter. Blacks left the party for the reasons I and Stave have stated. As we are black and were there to see it, you are simply talking out of your white racist ass. Whites do not speak for, or think for us. It is that paternalism which is a continuing part of a number of white americans that keeps racism alive. Things are as we said it was, not as you think it was.

It is not paternalism to point out that disagreeing on how to reach a goal, is not an insult to someone's intelligence.



That you need it to be, is because you lefties are terrified that conservative blacks might someday realize that they have more in common with conservative whites, then they do with you, and that you leftards, if you get your way, will ruin this nation.


And you fear having to defend your position and ideas based on their actual merits.

 

[Correll]

That thought is not even logical. Obviously he put staying within the confines of "government limits" over ensuring equal rights for ALL Americans.

Which was a conflict with what blacks wanted. But it was not an insult to their intelligence. It would only have been an insult to their intelligence if he has been lying about why he was doing it. That was my point. It is pathetic that you cannot admit that.

Why should any American have to "wait" for equal treatment in what is supposed be the so called
"land of the free"?

Because the cure had the potential to be another additional problem for the country.

As tax paying citizens, black people were entitled to the same rights as every other citizen, and he apparantly believed that it was ACCEPTABLE for them to be selectively discriminated against at the whim of any state at any time, while he and his fellow oppressors "decided how to make the bill more palatable to the majority". That was nothing but the same ideology that the Confederacy supported prior to the start of the civil war.

No, it is not. Stating that he believed that the way the bill went about it was wrong, is not the same as being against the goal.

It was a moral issue to black citizens during that era, and was definately an INSULT.

Bullshit. It was a practical matter of self interest to blacks. And Goldwater disagreeing with them on how to get there, was NOT an insult to them. It was a political disagreement.


It was only an insult to their intelligence, if he was LYING about his reasons. Which is why you denying that you said that, is stupid.

Unlike you, I am old enough to recall the outrage over it, and black voters responded as they should have.....at the polls.

That is a no brainer, and it will be a well deserved footnote in Goldwaters legacy for eternity.

It is understandable that blacks, suffering under Jim Crow, and facing real racism and discrimination, were not patient with any discussion of METHODS, of fighting racism and discrimination.


IMO, that blame for the lie, lies with the dem liberals, who told and still tell them.

Simply put, YOU were not a black voter in 1964, nor were you even born. I was, and I heard them voice their disdain for Goldwaters draconian "states rights, government overreach" INSULT, first hand.

You, did not.

My parents and grandparents were involved in the civil rights movement, and on foot they went out and knocked on doors to convince registered black voters in our community to leave the Republican party.


Because they were OUTRAGED and INSULTED.

Black voters WERE insulted by it. PERIOD.

Your post is nothing but speculation and a thinly veiled defense of an ideology that the civil war should have buried FOREVER.

Consequently, his position further drove black voters out of the Republican party, as it should have.

And it also left a PERMANENT stain on his legacy. As it SHOULD HAVE.

Putting the rights of citizens on hold due to what an outdated politician calls "government overreach," WAS AN INSULT.

PERIOD.

Sadly, that was only the start for the Republican Party as they embraced the deplorables and sold out minorities, immigrants and Muslims.

Except it wasn't, as I've shown. And like the rest, the whole lie of the Southern Strategy, is all just libs spewing shit from their face anuses.

Southern Strategy worked.
The South is still voting Republican

If you really believed that, you would not have just made an unsupported empty assertion.


You are doing NOTHING, but playing the Logical Fallacy of Proof by Assertion.


A disagreement on how to reach a goal, is not opposition to reaching a goal.


ALL you claims of "Southern Strategy" is just you lefties lying like that.


Why do you want to divide America against itself like this?

 

[rightwinger]

Which was a conflict with what blacks wanted. But it was not an insult to their intelligence. It would only have been an insult to their intelligence if he has been lying about why he was doing it. That was my point. It is pathetic that you cannot admit that.


Because the cure had the potential to be another additional problem for the country.


No, it is not. Stating that he believed that the way the bill went about it was wrong, is not the same as being against the goal.




Bullshit. It was a practical matter of self interest to blacks. And Goldwater disagreeing with them on how to get there, was NOT an insult to them. It was a political disagreement.


It was only an insult to their intelligence, if he was LYING about his reasons. Which is why you denying that you said that, is stupid.




It is understandable that blacks, suffering under Jim Crow, and facing real racism and discrimination, were not patient with any discussion of METHODS, of fighting racism and discrimination.


IMO, that blame for the lie, lies with the dem liberals, who told and still tell them.

Simply put, YOU were not a black voter in 1964, nor were you even born. I was, and I heard them voice their disdain for Goldwaters draconian "states rights, government overreach" INSULT, first hand.

You, did not.

My parents and grandparents were involved in the civil rights movement, and on foot they went out and knocked on doors to convince registered black voters in our community to leave the Republican party.


Because they were OUTRAGED and INSULTED.

Black voters WERE insulted by it. PERIOD.

Your post is nothing but speculation and a thinly veiled defense of an ideology that the civil war should have buried FOREVER.

Consequently, his position further drove black voters out of the Republican party, as it should have.

And it also left a PERMANENT stain on his legacy. As it SHOULD HAVE.

Putting the rights of citizens on hold due to what an outdated politician calls "government overreach," WAS AN INSULT.

PERIOD.

Sadly, that was only the start for the Republican Party as they embraced the deplorables and sold out minorities, immigrants and Muslims.

You are such a piece of shit. You say stupid ass vague general shit like this, with no specifics, and when I call you on it, you pretend that I am putting words in your mouth.


You are a dishonest, cowardly race baiting piece of shit.

What I said was quite specific.

Today’s Republican Party is a rehash of the Know Nothings who exploited hatred of Irish immigrants and Catholics to rise to political power.

If that was true, you would not spend so much time lying. If that was true, you would admit that Barry Goldwater was not opposed to civil rights, but just HOW that particular bill went about getting there.



You lie, because you know that you have to lie, to get people to vote for the agenda you want, that you know is bad for them.

That’s the way it works

I AM NOT A RACIST
But I support the rights of states to enforce racism

 

[katsteve2012]

That thought is not even logical. Obviously he put staying within the confines of "government limits" over ensuring equal rights for ALL Americans.

Which was a conflict with what blacks wanted. But it was not an insult to their intelligence. It would only have been an insult to their intelligence if he has been lying about why he was doing it. That was my point. It is pathetic that you cannot admit that.

Why should any American have to "wait" for equal treatment in what is supposed be the so called
"land of the free"?

Because the cure had the potential to be another additional problem for the country.

As tax paying citizens, black people were entitled to the same rights as every other citizen, and he apparantly believed that it was ACCEPTABLE for them to be selectively discriminated against at the whim of any state at any time, while he and his fellow oppressors "decided how to make the bill more palatable to the majority". That was nothing but the same ideology that the Confederacy supported prior to the start of the civil war.

No, it is not. Stating that he believed that the way the bill went about it was wrong, is not the same as being against the goal.

It was a moral issue to black citizens during that era, and was definately an INSULT.

Bullshit. It was a practical matter of self interest to blacks. And Goldwater disagreeing with them on how to get there, was NOT an insult to them. It was a political disagreement.


It was only an insult to their intelligence, if he was LYING about his reasons. Which is why you denying that you said that, is stupid.

Unlike you, I am old enough to recall the outrage over it, and black voters responded as they should have.....at the polls.

That is a no brainer, and it will be a well deserved footnote in Goldwaters legacy for eternity.

It is understandable that blacks, suffering under Jim Crow, and facing real racism and discrimination, were not patient with any discussion of METHODS, of fighting racism and discrimination.


IMO, that blame for the lie, lies with the dem liberals, who told and still tell them.

Simply put, YOU were not a black voter in 1964, nor were you even born. I was, and I heard them voice their disdain for Goldwaters draconian "states rights, government overreach" INSULT, first hand.

You, did not.

My parents and grandparents were involved in the civil rights movement, and on foot they went out and knocked on doors to convince registered black voters in our community to leave the Republican party.


Because they were OUTRAGED and INSULTED.

Black voters WERE insulted by it. PERIOD.

Your post is nothing but speculation and a thinly veiled defense of an ideology that the civil war should have buried FOREVER.

Consequently, his position further drove black voters out of the Republican party, as it should have.

And it also left a PERMANENT stain on his legacy. As it SHOULD HAVE.

Putting the rights of citizens on hold due to what an outdated politician calls "government overreach," WAS AN INSULT.

PERIOD.

You claimed it was an "insult to their intelligence".


That statement only makes sense, if you were assuming his stated position was a lie.


I have no doubt that the blacks of the time disagreed with him on that issue. If they choose to take offense at his position, that was their choice. I have no doubt that that was not Barry Goldwater's intent.


"Stain"? Time will tell. IMO, the government has certainly gone into "overreach" and the results have not been good.


IN the future, historians, white and black, might look back at him and his defeat as a very bad turning point for the US.

You are free to think as you wish. But the black voters of that generation DID take his position as an INSULT to their intelligence and they took it as an assault upon their value as tax paying citizens.

And I seriously doubt that anyone who believes in equality of the most basic rights for all citizens will view his defeat in the future as a "bad turning point.

If they have even a shred of moral decency.

And that is what this is about. You lefties NEED to define any political disagreements as emotionally and personally as possible,


because you use that for demagoguery, to turn various groups of voters, against your enemies, to prevent them from listening to the other side, on other issues.


It is how you are dividing America.


Right now, issues such as Abortion could be a bridge between black conservatives and the Republican Party, which represents the majority of whites.


BUT, people like you, lie about valid political disagreements and turn them into poison.


Barry Goldwater, disagreeing on how to achieve equality, was not an insult to blacks. It was a valid political disagreement.

But you people need to lie about it, to keep your lock on black votes.

You are purposefully dividing this nation, for partisan gain.

As you were told before, and are being told for the final time, I SAW the outrage in registered black voters over Goldwaters position on passing the civil rights bill. It was a condescending INSULT and an ASSAULT on the rights of black citizens, and there is no rhetoric that you can spew to justify it as being "OK".

You were not even a blip on the radar during that era, and for YOU to climb on a soapbox and make a feeble attempt to lecture someone that saw it first hand is an an asinine joke that I am not even going to dignify with an argument.

Who in the hell do you think you are to categorize someone that you know nothing about as a so called "lefty, trying to divide the country", simply because I lived in an era where I actually saw where an outdated politician used peoples rights as a bargaining chip to take a position on a moral issue that should have been a no brainer based on human decency?

You nor anyone that you know was ever forced to ride in the back of a bus, accept substandard public services, be denied service based on race, or had urine and feces thrown on them for peacefully protesting just for the right to vote.

I saw those things happen, before you were even spit out.

You could not even imagine what that actually looks like. And if you actually experienced it first hand you would probably committ suicide or turn into a mass shooter.

The way that you constantly bellyache and piss and moan about "discrimination against white people", but seem to think it was ok to put BASIC rights for all on hold because of "government overreach" is a glaring example of the REAL HYPOCRISY that actually divides this country.

Your double standards for justice, make you a hypocrite who talks out of both sides of your mouth.

Barry Goldwater disagreeing with implementing equal rights for all for the sake of what he thought was proper "government protocol" was wrong, which is exactly why he he lost the election and contributed to driving numerous black voters out of YOUR party.

And for you to even attempt to wage a weak argument in a laughable effort to defend his poor decision nearly 60 years ago, just for the purpose of justifying your blind political loyalty in the face of utter stupidity speaks volumes about you as a person.

Everytime that I make the mistake of wasting time engaging you in a conversation of any kind, you manage to sink to the same level of absurdity, outright bald faced lies, and personal politics over country.

But at least you are a great reminder of the fact that the times which I recall so well, from many decades ago, could return very quickly because of people like YOU.

 

[Ghost of a Rider]

How many times do we have to tell this racist idiot that before he drops this lie? Correll, white men died to save the union and if we use your rationale, white men died to correct their own mistake. They didn't have to die for slavery, because they never should have had slaves.

Most of the free world voluntarily gave up slavery without having to kill 600,000 men.

So does this mean those 600,000 deaths are meaningless? Does it mean that the nearly 300,000 who died on the Union side died for nothing?

The war should never have come to pass. But since the South pushed the issue, the North had no choice but to fight them. So to dismiss the Union deaths because other countries abolished slavery without bloodshed is, quite frankly, insulting to those who died and their families.

It means it was unnecessary like many wars.

Of course it was unnecessary. But the fact remains that thousands fought and died to prevent the spread of slavery and to maintain the Union.

The thing is the south panicked and overplayed a weak hand. Lincoln did not have the political power to end slavery. Best he could have done is stop the spread to new states.

Instead of a gradual loss of slavery and compensation, the south lost them all in four years.

True enough. I just don't think we should so easily dismiss those deaths.

 

[rightwinger]

Most of the free world voluntarily gave up slavery without having to kill 600,000 men.

So does this mean those 600,000 deaths are meaningless? Does it mean that the nearly 300,000 who died on the Union side died for nothing?

The war should never have come to pass. But since the South pushed the issue, the North had no choice but to fight them. So to dismiss the Union deaths because other countries abolished slavery without bloodshed is, quite frankly, insulting to those who died and their families.

It means it was unnecessary like many wars.

Of course it was unnecessary. But the fact remains that thousands fought and died to prevent the spread of slavery and to maintain the Union.

The thing is the south panicked and overplayed a weak hand. Lincoln did not have the political power to end slavery. Best he could have done is stop the spread to new states.

Instead of a gradual loss of slavery and compensation, the south lost them all in four years.

True enough. I just don't think we should so easily dismiss those deaths.

Other than they were unnecessary

 

[Ghost of a Rider]

So does this mean those 600,000 deaths are meaningless? Does it mean that the nearly 300,000 who died on the Union side died for nothing?

The war should never have come to pass. But since the South pushed the issue, the North had no choice but to fight them. So to dismiss the Union deaths because other countries abolished slavery without bloodshed is, quite frankly, insulting to those who died and their families.

It means it was unnecessary like many wars.

Of course it was unnecessary. But the fact remains that thousands fought and died to prevent the spread of slavery and to maintain the Union.

The thing is the south panicked and overplayed a weak hand. Lincoln did not have the political power to end slavery. Best he could have done is stop the spread to new states.

Instead of a gradual loss of slavery and compensation, the south lost them all in four years.

True enough. I just don't think we should so easily dismiss those deaths.

Other than they were unnecessary

In that case, so were the deaths in WWII.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

Goldwater voted AGAINST the Civil Rights Act

Make of it what you want

Except you leapt from that, to talking about supporting the use of government power to enforce Jim Crow.


YOU did that, not me. So, drop your pretense that you did not.


His stated reason was not opposition to Civil Rights but concern about how that particular bill addressed the issue.


Considering his life long support of Civil Rights AND smaller government, that position is highly credible.


Thus his position and his presidential run was not the beginning of the debunked conspiracy theory of "The Southern Strategy".

Umm...you were the one jumping to a conclusion
I merely corrected you on it

Bullshit. YOu are a dishonest coward.


Barry Goldwater was not pandering to southern racists as you claimed. His opposition to that specific bill was not based on opposition to Civil Rights but to how that bill attempted to achieve them.


HIs campaign did not reflect the GOP "flipping" on Civil Rights, nor pandering to southern racists, as you claimed.


That you claimed those things and now when called on your shit, are trying to weasel out of them, instead of defending them, or admitting you were wrong,


is you being a race baiting asshole.

It's a endless cycle of horseshit.

I deal with others who are not as extreme

Correll, you really need to shut your fucking white mouth up trying to tell blacks who saw why blacks left the republican party anything. If things were as you say, Goldwaters sincere racism was an insult to the humanity of black people. And that's just the way it is. It's not debatable and your opinion on the matter is irrelevant. Sometimes it's good for whites like yourself to know when to be seen and not heard.

Goldwater claimed he was not racist but was merely standing up for conservative “principles”. States have the right to set their own rules on how their citizens are treated.

But this was 1964. I don’t see how anyone could maintain those “principles” as they saw the state turn firehoses on peaceful protestors, use attack dogs, imprison people who only wanted to vote.

Goldwater sang the same song these conservatives sing today. He was a racist.

And it led to Goldwater winning the states of S Carolina, Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi, Louisiana .....outside of his home state, the only states he won

Two sentences....tsk tsk.

1. This was not the only factor in the election.
2. Johnson was touting his costly "Great Society" program which appealed to more than just blacks.
3. Goldwater was severely undercut by the moderates in the party who, after they lost the primary, refused to campaign for him (and actively worked against him). These were the moderates who thought America would swim in money forever.
4. Rarely mentioned is that Johnson also fought Goldwater on the issue of being an anti-communist.

Wow....learned something doing a little research.

Democratic primary included GEORGE WALLACE

Republican primary included Margaret Chase Smith. Imagine those sexist bastards letting a woman in the program.

Jesus, that's interesting. A women elected to the House, in 1940!


Margaret Chase Smith - Wikipedia



Whoa!


"During the administration of President John F. Kennedy, Smith argued that the United States should use nuclear weapons against the Soviet Union.[14] This led Soviet leader Nikita Khrushchev to call Smith "the devil in disguise of a woman" whose position exceeded "all records of savagery."[14] Smith later replied, "Mr. Khrushchev isn't really mad at me. I am not that important. He is angry because American officials have grown more firm since my speech." "

A republican woman no less.

She must have been a brainless, sell-out, pol-whore, zombie (at least according to the left).

Learn something new every day.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

Simply put, YOU were not a black voter in 1964, nor were you even born. I was, and I heard them voice their disdain for Goldwaters draconian "states rights, government overreach" INSULT, first hand.

You, did not.

My parents and grandparents were involved in the civil rights movement, and on foot they went out and knocked on doors to convince registered black voters in our community to leave the Republican party.


Because they were OUTRAGED and INSULTED.

Black voters WERE insulted by it. PERIOD.

Your post is nothing but speculation and a thinly veiled defense of an ideology that the civil war should have buried FOREVER.

Consequently, his position further drove black voters out of the Republican party, as it should have.

And it also left a PERMANENT stain on his legacy. As it SHOULD HAVE.

Putting the rights of citizens on hold due to what an outdated politician calls "government overreach," WAS AN INSULT.

PERIOD.

Sadly, that was only the start for the Republican Party as they embraced the deplorables and sold out minorities, immigrants and Muslims.

You are such a piece of shit. You say stupid ass vague general shit like this, with no specifics, and when I call you on it, you pretend that I am putting words in your mouth.


You are a dishonest, cowardly race baiting piece of shit.

What I said was quite specific.

Today’s Republican Party is a rehash of the Know Nothings who exploited hatred of Irish immigrants and Catholics to rise to political power.

If that was true, you would not spend so much time lying. If that was true, you would admit that Barry Goldwater was not opposed to civil rights, but just HOW that particular bill went about getting there.



You lie, because you know that you have to lie, to get people to vote for the agenda you want, that you know is bad for them.

That’s the way it works

I AM NOT A RACIST
But I support the rights of states to enforce racism

3 SENTENCES !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

AMAZING !

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Which was a conflict with what blacks wanted. But it was not an insult to their intelligence. It would only have been an insult to their intelligence if he has been lying about why he was doing it. That was my point. It is pathetic that you cannot admit that.


Because the cure had the potential to be another additional problem for the country.


No, it is not. Stating that he believed that the way the bill went about it was wrong, is not the same as being against the goal.




Bullshit. It was a practical matter of self interest to blacks. And Goldwater disagreeing with them on how to get there, was NOT an insult to them. It was a political disagreement.


It was only an insult to their intelligence, if he was LYING about his reasons. Which is why you denying that you said that, is stupid.




It is understandable that blacks, suffering under Jim Crow, and facing real racism and discrimination, were not patient with any discussion of METHODS, of fighting racism and discrimination.


IMO, that blame for the lie, lies with the dem liberals, who told and still tell them.

Simply put, YOU were not a black voter in 1964, nor were you even born. I was, and I heard them voice their disdain for Goldwaters draconian "states rights, government overreach" INSULT, first hand.

You, did not.

My parents and grandparents were involved in the civil rights movement, and on foot they went out and knocked on doors to convince registered black voters in our community to leave the Republican party.


Because they were OUTRAGED and INSULTED.

Black voters WERE insulted by it. PERIOD.

Your post is nothing but speculation and a thinly veiled defense of an ideology that the civil war should have buried FOREVER.

Consequently, his position further drove black voters out of the Republican party, as it should have.

And it also left a PERMANENT stain on his legacy. As it SHOULD HAVE.

Putting the rights of citizens on hold due to what an outdated politician calls "government overreach," WAS AN INSULT.

PERIOD.

You claimed it was an "insult to their intelligence".


That statement only makes sense, if you were assuming his stated position was a lie.


I have no doubt that the blacks of the time disagreed with him on that issue. If they choose to take offense at his position, that was their choice. I have no doubt that that was not Barry Goldwater's intent.


"Stain"? Time will tell. IMO, the government has certainly gone into "overreach" and the results have not been good.


IN the future, historians, white and black, might look back at him and his defeat as a very bad turning point for the US.

You are free to think as you wish. But the black voters of that generation DID take his position as an INSULT to their intelligence and they took it as an assault upon their value as tax paying citizens.

And I seriously doubt that anyone who believes in equality of the most basic rights for all citizens will view his defeat in the future as a "bad turning point.

If they have even a shred of moral decency.

And that is what this is about. You lefties NEED to define any political disagreements as emotionally and personally as possible,


because you use that for demagoguery, to turn various groups of voters, against your enemies, to prevent them from listening to the other side, on other issues.


It is how you are dividing America.


Right now, issues such as Abortion could be a bridge between black conservatives and the Republican Party, which represents the majority of whites.


BUT, people like you, lie about valid political disagreements and turn them into poison.


Barry Goldwater, disagreeing on how to achieve equality, was not an insult to blacks. It was a valid political disagreement.

But you people need to lie about it, to keep your lock on black votes.

You are purposefully dividing this nation, for partisan gain.

As you were told before, and are being told for the final time, I SAW the outrage in registered black voters over Goldwaters position on passing the civil rights bill. It was a condescending INSULT and an ASSAULT on the rights of black citizens, and there is no rhetoric that you can spew to justify it as being "OK".

You were not even a blip on the radar during that era, and for YOU to climb on a soapbox and make a feeble attempt to lecture someone that saw it first hand is an an asinine joke that I am not even going to dignify with an argument.

Who in the hell do you think you are to categorize someone that you know nothing about as a so called "lefty, trying to divide the country", simply because I lived in an era where I actually saw where an outdated politician used peoples rights as a bargaining chip to take a position on a moral issue that should have been a no brainer based on human decency?

You nor anyone that you know was ever forced to ride in the back of a bus, accept substandard public services, be denied service based on race, or had urine and feces thrown on them for peacefully protesting just for the right to vote.

I saw those things happen, before you were even spit out.

You could not even imagine what that actually looks like. And if you actually experienced it first hand you would probably committ suicide or turn into a mass shooter.

The way that you constantly bellyache and piss and moan about "discrimination against white people", but seem to think it was ok to put BASIC rights for all on hold because of "government overreach" is a glaring example of the REAL HYPOCRISY that actually divides this country.

Your double standards for justice, make you a hypocrite who talks out of both sides of your mouth.

Barry Goldwater disagreeing with implementing equal rights for all for the sake of what he thought was proper "government protocol" was wrong, which is exactly why he he lost the election and contributed to driving numerous black voters out of YOUR party.

And for you to even attempt to wage a weak argument in a laughable effort to defend his poor decision nearly 60 years ago, just for the purpose of justifying your blind political loyalty in the face of utter stupidity speaks volumes about you as a person.

Everytime that I make the mistake of wasting time engaging you in a conversation of any kind, you manage to sink to the same level of absurdity, outright bald faced lies, and personal politics over country.

But at least you are a great reminder of the fact that the times which I recall so well, from many decades ago, could return very quickly because of people like YOU.

Let me get this right, blacks are SO IGNORANT that while the vast majority of Republicans and MORE then democrats I might add, voted for the bill, they were upset one guy didn't? So upset they joined the party that actually voted against it more then the Republicans? REALLY?

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

Simply put, YOU were not a black voter in 1964, nor were you even born. I was, and I heard them voice their disdain for Goldwaters draconian "states rights, government overreach" INSULT, first hand.

You, did not.

My parents and grandparents were involved in the civil rights movement, and on foot they went out and knocked on doors to convince registered black voters in our community to leave the Republican party.


Because they were OUTRAGED and INSULTED.

Black voters WERE insulted by it. PERIOD.

Your post is nothing but speculation and a thinly veiled defense of an ideology that the civil war should have buried FOREVER.

Consequently, his position further drove black voters out of the Republican party, as it should have.

And it also left a PERMANENT stain on his legacy. As it SHOULD HAVE.

Putting the rights of citizens on hold due to what an outdated politician calls "government overreach," WAS AN INSULT.

PERIOD.

You claimed it was an "insult to their intelligence".


That statement only makes sense, if you were assuming his stated position was a lie.


I have no doubt that the blacks of the time disagreed with him on that issue. If they choose to take offense at his position, that was their choice. I have no doubt that that was not Barry Goldwater's intent.


"Stain"? Time will tell. IMO, the government has certainly gone into "overreach" and the results have not been good.


IN the future, historians, white and black, might look back at him and his defeat as a very bad turning point for the US.

You are free to think as you wish. But the black voters of that generation DID take his position as an INSULT to their intelligence and they took it as an assault upon their value as tax paying citizens.

And I seriously doubt that anyone who believes in equality of the most basic rights for all citizens will view his defeat in the future as a "bad turning point.

If they have even a shred of moral decency.

And that is what this is about. You lefties NEED to define any political disagreements as emotionally and personally as possible,


because you use that for demagoguery, to turn various groups of voters, against your enemies, to prevent them from listening to the other side, on other issues.


It is how you are dividing America.


Right now, issues such as Abortion could be a bridge between black conservatives and the Republican Party, which represents the majority of whites.


BUT, people like you, lie about valid political disagreements and turn them into poison.


Barry Goldwater, disagreeing on how to achieve equality, was not an insult to blacks. It was a valid political disagreement.

But you people need to lie about it, to keep your lock on black votes.

You are purposefully dividing this nation, for partisan gain.

As you were told before, and are being told for the final time, I SAW the outrage in registered black voters over Goldwaters position on passing the civil rights bill. It was a condescending INSULT and an ASSAULT on the rights of black citizens, and there is no rhetoric that you can spew to justify it as being "OK".

You were not even a blip on the radar during that era, and for YOU to climb on a soapbox and make a feeble attempt to lecture someone that saw it first hand is an an asinine joke that I am not even going to dignify with an argument.

Who in the hell do you think you are to categorize someone that you know nothing about as a so called "lefty, trying to divide the country", simply because I lived in an era where I actually saw where an outdated politician used peoples rights as a bargaining chip to take a position on a moral issue that should have been a no brainer based on human decency?

You nor anyone that you know was ever forced to ride in the back of a bus, accept substandard public services, be denied service based on race, or had urine and feces thrown on them for peacefully protesting just for the right to vote.

I saw those things happen, before you were even spit out.

You could not even imagine what that actually looks like. And if you actually experienced it first hand you would probably committ suicide or turn into a mass shooter.

The way that you constantly bellyache and piss and moan about "discrimination against white people", but seem to think it was ok to put BASIC rights for all on hold because of "government overreach" is a glaring example of the REAL HYPOCRISY that actually divides this country.

Your double standards for justice, make you a hypocrite who talks out of both sides of your mouth.

Barry Goldwater disagreeing with implementing equal rights for all for the sake of what he thought was proper "government protocol" was wrong, which is exactly why he he lost the election and contributed to driving numerous black voters out of YOUR party.

And for you to even attempt to wage a weak argument in a laughable effort to defend his poor decision nearly 60 years ago, just for the purpose of justifying your blind political loyalty in the face of utter stupidity speaks volumes about you as a person.

Everytime that I make the mistake of wasting time engaging you in a conversation of any kind, you manage to sink to the same level of absurdity, outright bald faced lies, and personal politics over country.

But at least you are a great reminder of the fact that the times which I recall so well, from many decades ago, could return very quickly because of people like YOU.

Let me get this right, blacks are SO IGNORANT that while the vast majority of Republicans and MORE then democrats I might add, voted for the bill, they were upset one guy didn't? So upset they joined the party that actually voted against it more then the Republicans? REALLY?

The reason you dic suckers remain on the wrong side of history is because you really do believe this dumb shit you just said.....

 

[RetiredGySgt]

You claimed it was an "insult to their intelligence".


That statement only makes sense, if you were assuming his stated position was a lie.


I have no doubt that the blacks of the time disagreed with him on that issue. If they choose to take offense at his position, that was their choice. I have no doubt that that was not Barry Goldwater's intent.


"Stain"? Time will tell. IMO, the government has certainly gone into "overreach" and the results have not been good.


IN the future, historians, white and black, might look back at him and his defeat as a very bad turning point for the US.

You are free to think as you wish. But the black voters of that generation DID take his position as an INSULT to their intelligence and they took it as an assault upon their value as tax paying citizens.

And I seriously doubt that anyone who believes in equality of the most basic rights for all citizens will view his defeat in the future as a "bad turning point.

If they have even a shred of moral decency.

And that is what this is about. You lefties NEED to define any political disagreements as emotionally and personally as possible,


because you use that for demagoguery, to turn various groups of voters, against your enemies, to prevent them from listening to the other side, on other issues.


It is how you are dividing America.


Right now, issues such as Abortion could be a bridge between black conservatives and the Republican Party, which represents the majority of whites.


BUT, people like you, lie about valid political disagreements and turn them into poison.


Barry Goldwater, disagreeing on how to achieve equality, was not an insult to blacks. It was a valid political disagreement.

But you people need to lie about it, to keep your lock on black votes.

You are purposefully dividing this nation, for partisan gain.

As you were told before, and are being told for the final time, I SAW the outrage in registered black voters over Goldwaters position on passing the civil rights bill. It was a condescending INSULT and an ASSAULT on the rights of black citizens, and there is no rhetoric that you can spew to justify it as being "OK".

You were not even a blip on the radar during that era, and for YOU to climb on a soapbox and make a feeble attempt to lecture someone that saw it first hand is an an asinine joke that I am not even going to dignify with an argument.

Who in the hell do you think you are to categorize someone that you know nothing about as a so called "lefty, trying to divide the country", simply because I lived in an era where I actually saw where an outdated politician used peoples rights as a bargaining chip to take a position on a moral issue that should have been a no brainer based on human decency?

You nor anyone that you know was ever forced to ride in the back of a bus, accept substandard public services, be denied service based on race, or had urine and feces thrown on them for peacefully protesting just for the right to vote.

I saw those things happen, before you were even spit out.

You could not even imagine what that actually looks like. And if you actually experienced it first hand you would probably committ suicide or turn into a mass shooter.

The way that you constantly bellyache and piss and moan about "discrimination against white people", but seem to think it was ok to put BASIC rights for all on hold because of "government overreach" is a glaring example of the REAL HYPOCRISY that actually divides this country.

Your double standards for justice, make you a hypocrite who talks out of both sides of your mouth.

Barry Goldwater disagreeing with implementing equal rights for all for the sake of what he thought was proper "government protocol" was wrong, which is exactly why he he lost the election and contributed to driving numerous black voters out of YOUR party.

And for you to even attempt to wage a weak argument in a laughable effort to defend his poor decision nearly 60 years ago, just for the purpose of justifying your blind political loyalty in the face of utter stupidity speaks volumes about you as a person.

Everytime that I make the mistake of wasting time engaging you in a conversation of any kind, you manage to sink to the same level of absurdity, outright bald faced lies, and personal politics over country.

But at least you are a great reminder of the fact that the times which I recall so well, from many decades ago, could return very quickly because of people like YOU.

Let me get this right, blacks are SO IGNORANT that while the vast majority of Republicans and MORE then democrats I might add, voted for the bill, they were upset one guy didn't? So upset they joined the party that actually voted against it more then the Republicans? REALLY?

The reason you dic suckers remain on the wrong side of history is because you really do believe this dumb shit you just said.....

HISTORICAL FACT RETARD,Higher percentage of Republicans voted for Civil Rights act then democrats, it is an HISTORICAL FACT.

 

[rightwinger]

Sadly, that was only the start for the Republican Party as they embraced the deplorables and sold out minorities, immigrants and Muslims.

You are such a piece of shit. You say stupid ass vague general shit like this, with no specifics, and when I call you on it, you pretend that I am putting words in your mouth.


You are a dishonest, cowardly race baiting piece of shit.

What I said was quite specific.

Today’s Republican Party is a rehash of the Know Nothings who exploited hatred of Irish immigrants and Catholics to rise to political power.

If that was true, you would not spend so much time lying. If that was true, you would admit that Barry Goldwater was not opposed to civil rights, but just HOW that particular bill went about getting there.



You lie, because you know that you have to lie, to get people to vote for the agenda you want, that you know is bad for them.

That’s the way it works

I AM NOT A RACIST
But I support the rights of states to enforce racism

3 SENTENCES !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

AMAZING !

I reserve two sentences for the crap you post

 

[rightwinger]

You are free to think as you wish. But the black voters of that generation DID take his position as an INSULT to their intelligence and they took it as an assault upon their value as tax paying citizens.

And I seriously doubt that anyone who believes in equality of the most basic rights for all citizens will view his defeat in the future as a "bad turning point.

If they have even a shred of moral decency.

And that is what this is about. You lefties NEED to define any political disagreements as emotionally and personally as possible,


because you use that for demagoguery, to turn various groups of voters, against your enemies, to prevent them from listening to the other side, on other issues.


It is how you are dividing America.


Right now, issues such as Abortion could be a bridge between black conservatives and the Republican Party, which represents the majority of whites.


BUT, people like you, lie about valid political disagreements and turn them into poison.


Barry Goldwater, disagreeing on how to achieve equality, was not an insult to blacks. It was a valid political disagreement.

But you people need to lie about it, to keep your lock on black votes.

You are purposefully dividing this nation, for partisan gain.

As you were told before, and are being told for the final time, I SAW the outrage in registered black voters over Goldwaters position on passing the civil rights bill. It was a condescending INSULT and an ASSAULT on the rights of black citizens, and there is no rhetoric that you can spew to justify it as being "OK".

You were not even a blip on the radar during that era, and for YOU to climb on a soapbox and make a feeble attempt to lecture someone that saw it first hand is an an asinine joke that I am not even going to dignify with an argument.

Who in the hell do you think you are to categorize someone that you know nothing about as a so called "lefty, trying to divide the country", simply because I lived in an era where I actually saw where an outdated politician used peoples rights as a bargaining chip to take a position on a moral issue that should have been a no brainer based on human decency?

You nor anyone that you know was ever forced to ride in the back of a bus, accept substandard public services, be denied service based on race, or had urine and feces thrown on them for peacefully protesting just for the right to vote.

I saw those things happen, before you were even spit out.

You could not even imagine what that actually looks like. And if you actually experienced it first hand you would probably committ suicide or turn into a mass shooter.

The way that you constantly bellyache and piss and moan about "discrimination against white people", but seem to think it was ok to put BASIC rights for all on hold because of "government overreach" is a glaring example of the REAL HYPOCRISY that actually divides this country.

Your double standards for justice, make you a hypocrite who talks out of both sides of your mouth.

Barry Goldwater disagreeing with implementing equal rights for all for the sake of what he thought was proper "government protocol" was wrong, which is exactly why he he lost the election and contributed to driving numerous black voters out of YOUR party.

And for you to even attempt to wage a weak argument in a laughable effort to defend his poor decision nearly 60 years ago, just for the purpose of justifying your blind political loyalty in the face of utter stupidity speaks volumes about you as a person.

Everytime that I make the mistake of wasting time engaging you in a conversation of any kind, you manage to sink to the same level of absurdity, outright bald faced lies, and personal politics over country.

But at least you are a great reminder of the fact that the times which I recall so well, from many decades ago, could return very quickly because of people like YOU.

Let me get this right, blacks are SO IGNORANT that while the vast majority of Republicans and MORE then democrats I might add, voted for the bill, they were upset one guy didn't? So upset they joined the party that actually voted against it more then the Republicans? REALLY?

The reason you dic suckers remain on the wrong side of history is because you really do believe this dumb shit you just said.....

HISTORICAL FACT RETARD,Higher percentage of Republicans voted for Civil Rights act then democrats, it is an HISTORICAL FACT.

Not in the south and not in the north

 

[Ethos Logos Pathos]

HISTORICAL FACT RETARD,Higher percentage of Republicans voted for Civil Rights act then democrats, it is an HISTORICAL FACT.

Add the correct context.

Even if you are correct here, which I doubt, it does not change the fact that the mid/late-60's saw the GOP turn against the Black Community ---after realizing the party could not loose negros from the grip of, Dem claws, which MLKSr. helped the Kennedy fam plunge into the Black Community.

Therefore from mid-1960s thru mid-2010's, yes, those 50yrs we have mainly seen disdain from our White GOP when it comes to negro citizens. Fortunately, President Trump is not a politician. So he uplifts negros unlike any White anti-Liberal President since LBJ ---who was borne from 1940s-50s Dems that hated negros.

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

You are free to think as you wish. But the black voters of that generation DID take his position as an INSULT to their intelligence and they took it as an assault upon their value as tax paying citizens.

And I seriously doubt that anyone who believes in equality of the most basic rights for all citizens will view his defeat in the future as a "bad turning point.

If they have even a shred of moral decency.

And that is what this is about. You lefties NEED to define any political disagreements as emotionally and personally as possible,


because you use that for demagoguery, to turn various groups of voters, against your enemies, to prevent them from listening to the other side, on other issues.


It is how you are dividing America.


Right now, issues such as Abortion could be a bridge between black conservatives and the Republican Party, which represents the majority of whites.


BUT, people like you, lie about valid political disagreements and turn them into poison.


Barry Goldwater, disagreeing on how to achieve equality, was not an insult to blacks. It was a valid political disagreement.

But you people need to lie about it, to keep your lock on black votes.

You are purposefully dividing this nation, for partisan gain.

As you were told before, and are being told for the final time, I SAW the outrage in registered black voters over Goldwaters position on passing the civil rights bill. It was a condescending INSULT and an ASSAULT on the rights of black citizens, and there is no rhetoric that you can spew to justify it as being "OK".

You were not even a blip on the radar during that era, and for YOU to climb on a soapbox and make a feeble attempt to lecture someone that saw it first hand is an an asinine joke that I am not even going to dignify with an argument.

Who in the hell do you think you are to categorize someone that you know nothing about as a so called "lefty, trying to divide the country", simply because I lived in an era where I actually saw where an outdated politician used peoples rights as a bargaining chip to take a position on a moral issue that should have been a no brainer based on human decency?

You nor anyone that you know was ever forced to ride in the back of a bus, accept substandard public services, be denied service based on race, or had urine and feces thrown on them for peacefully protesting just for the right to vote.

I saw those things happen, before you were even spit out.

You could not even imagine what that actually looks like. And if you actually experienced it first hand you would probably committ suicide or turn into a mass shooter.

The way that you constantly bellyache and piss and moan about "discrimination against white people", but seem to think it was ok to put BASIC rights for all on hold because of "government overreach" is a glaring example of the REAL HYPOCRISY that actually divides this country.

Your double standards for justice, make you a hypocrite who talks out of both sides of your mouth.

Barry Goldwater disagreeing with implementing equal rights for all for the sake of what he thought was proper "government protocol" was wrong, which is exactly why he he lost the election and contributed to driving numerous black voters out of YOUR party.

And for you to even attempt to wage a weak argument in a laughable effort to defend his poor decision nearly 60 years ago, just for the purpose of justifying your blind political loyalty in the face of utter stupidity speaks volumes about you as a person.

Everytime that I make the mistake of wasting time engaging you in a conversation of any kind, you manage to sink to the same level of absurdity, outright bald faced lies, and personal politics over country.

But at least you are a great reminder of the fact that the times which I recall so well, from many decades ago, could return very quickly because of people like YOU.

Let me get this right, blacks are SO IGNORANT that while the vast majority of Republicans and MORE then democrats I might add, voted for the bill, they were upset one guy didn't? So upset they joined the party that actually voted against it more then the Republicans? REALLY?

The reason you dic suckers remain on the wrong side of history is because you really do believe this dumb shit you just said.....

HISTORICAL FACT RETARD,Higher percentage of Republicans voted for Civil Rights act then democrats, it is an HISTORICAL FACT.

The fact you think black voters started to vote more for democrats than republicans was because of goldwater is the dumb shit I am referring to....

Fact of the matter is -- there is a reason why you dic suckers fixate on democrat/republican instead of liberal/conservative....and that is because conservatives have been AGAINST EVERY EMANCIPATION EFFORT OF EVERY HISTORICALLY OPPRESSED MINORITY GROUP -- be it women, blacks, gays, etc.....

Now is Barry Goldwater celebrated and praised by liberals or conservatives?? Is his opposition to the Civil Rights Act something that is constantly parroted and defended by liberals or conservatives?

 

[IM2]

600K white men died to end slavery!

They died to preserve the union. First and foremost. And to prevent slavery from encroaching on the white labor force nationwide.

And after the war ended, Jim Crow laws took the place of slavery in the north and the south.

There were 179k black soldiers who fought for the union but were paid lower wages and treated unequally and 40k died fighting for their own freedom.

But that fact is frequently overlooked or ignored altogether.

How many times do we have to tell this racist idiot that before he drops this lie? Correll, white men died to save the union and if we use your rationale, white men died to correct their own mistake. They didn't have to die for slavery, because they never should have had slaves.

Most of the free world voluntarily gave up slavery without having to kill 600,000 men.

So does this mean those 600,000 deaths are meaningless? Does it mean that the nearly 300,000 who died on the Union side died for nothing?

The war should never have come to pass. But since the South pushed the issue, the North had no choice but to fight them. So to dismiss the Union deaths because other countries abolished slavery without bloodshed is, quite frankly, insulting to those who died and their families.

It means it was unnecessary like many wars.

Exactly.