Sir Arthur Harris: Dutiful Soldier or War Criminal?

[rupol2000]

Khrushchev introduced to the USSR the technology of growing corn, which he brought from the United States. During Khrushchev's time, the economy of the USSR grew at a frantic pace, he freed collective farmers from slavery, supplied electricity to the countryside, he fought alcoholism, resettled people from barracks to normal housing, under Khrushchev there was complete freedom of speech in Russia, even more freedom than now in Europe
He built the rocket industry from scratch and sent the first man into space. It was an unprecedented rise, and he is Greatest leader of USSR

 

[rupol2000]

In the days of Khrushchev, the USSR was respected in the world almost as much as America. He dominated international politics, he destroyed British colonialism, opposed the Chinese Stalinists. He tested on Malaya Zemlya the world's largest hydrogen bomb, about 100 megatons. There was no such capacity in the United States. He bypassed the United States both in the arms race and in space.

The first man in space, Yuri Gagarin, was a triumph for the USSR. The whole world knew it.

 

[rupol2000]

Khrushchev can be compared to Reagan. Reagan also made America a great country after the crisis. When Reagan was in power, no one dared to wipe their feet on the American people, as is customary now.

 

[rupol2000]

I have no doubt that the Gorbachev government was loyal to the Reagan, or even was a puppet of Reagan government. But inside the USSR it all looked as if Khrushchev had returned. It was a pro-Khrushchev anti-left course.
They ended alcoholism, took up housing, liberalized trade, and introduced democratic institutions.

 

[rupol2000]

The bottom line is that during the times of Khrushchev and Reagan-Gorbachev, the USSR was an ally of the right-wing forces of the United States, and together they pursued international politics.

 

[rupol2000]

And if US realy want to become "Great Again", they must return to the Reagan's politics. Trump was a left freak in right clothes.

 

[rupol2000]

so guess which was right?

Unfortunately, those who argued that the United States will slide into communism are right. Under current leftist politics, this is a real scenario, and this is exactly what is happening. Even the insignificant Taliban fucked the United States.
Khrushchev was not a communist in the Stalinist and Marxist sense of the word. Even his economic policy was anti-left, he decentralized the economy and gave wide powers to local authorities. He even pursued an anti-Semitic policy. He opposed the return of Jews to Ukraine.

This was absolutely the right course. This terminology was needed only for the illiterate masses, to maintain stability.

 

[Mushroom]

his photographs were published in the Soviet press. Khrushchev was the leader of the right deviation, he hated Bolshevism.

Of course he did, he was a good Soviet.

The "Bolsheviks" may have won the Russian Revolution, but the White Army was barely in retreat when the various groups started fighting it out amongst each other. One eating the next, until what was left among the bloodied remnants was essentially a coalition government. Which would become a thing for many decades, with the different beliefs of these groups and individuals rising up over and over.

Nikita was much less of a hardliner, having come to the Party from his family being mine workers and Unionizers. But looking at his career, he seems to largely follow orders, and yet was also rather pragmatic. Prone to bombastic actions, then amazingly congenial.

 

[Mushroom]

There was no such capacity in the United States

Oh, the technology was there. The US simply never felt the need to create the biggest bombs they could. The US had long ago given up trying to hold their tests in secret. In fact, they were actually a tourist draw for neighboring cities. That one was so big, Washington knew about the massive bomb probably about the same time Moscow did.

And Yuri is only first, if you reject the Vladimir Ilyushin conspiracy theories.

​

 

[rupol2000]

And Yuri is only first, if you reject the Vladimir Ilyushin conspiracy theories.

I don't know about this theory, but I heard that there are documents about the space program in Germany during the 3rd Reich, there is a version that they flew into space. But in the mass consciousness, Yuri Gagarin is still the first, from the point of view of politics it was important.

 

[rupol2000]

But looking at his career, he seems to largely follow orders

He has been in opposition to Stalin and Kaganovich since the end of the war. This is a false feeling, he made very bold statements against the leadership, and for those times it was unthinkable. For example, he led an open public discussion in the press with Stalin about improving the situation of rural residents.

Perhaps he was supported by the American right. This was definitely the case with Gorbachev, he was influenced by Reagan. I think that Khrushchev too. He himself would not have been able to organize such a coup.

 

[Mushroom]

I don't know about this theory, but I heard that there are documents about the space program in Germany during the 3rd Reich, there is a version that they flew into space. But in the mass consciousness, Yuri Gagarin is still the first, from the point of view of politics it was important.

Germany never even came close. They had no rocket capable of doing such.

But the Vladimir Ilyushin theory dates to when that all happened. That days before the Gagarin launch, Colonel Ilyushin was in an earlier pre-orbital flight that went disastrously wrong and almost killed him. And it does not help that over the decades, the Soviets would commonly doctor photographs, which made it even more believeable.

On the right is the original photographed as released. On the left, the doctored one with Cosmonaut Grigory Nelyubov removed, as he had been killed while drunk in 1966 after walking in front of a train. There were others, but I remember reading a book over 40 years ago that showed a lot of photographs like the above. Where a cosmonaut was in the oldest one, but had been removed from later releases of the same photo.

Of course, the Soviets did that a lot, especially during the Stalin era.

 

[rupol2000]

In fact, in Vietnam, Khrushchev and America had common interests. USSR broke off relations with China and stood up in opposition, there were even armed conflicts. There can be no question of the Soviet Union's support of that time for the Chinese side in the Vietnam conflict. And this opinion is now being imposed by the left.
I would not even be surprised if I found out that the USSR fought there together with the USA.

 

[rupol2000]

Germany never even came close. They had no rocket capable of doing such.

But the Vladimir Ilyushin theory dates to when that all happened. That days before the Gagarin launch, Colonel Ilyushin was in an earlier pre-orbital flight that went disastrously wrong and almost killed him. And it does not help that over the decades, the Soviets would commonly doctor photographs, which made it even more believeable.

It may be, but it is not critical, there were tests with animals before that. Emergency situations are not excluded. In any case, Yuri Gagarin is a symbol.

By the way, there is a possibility that the KGB killed him. He knew a lot and he was very loved by people, this might be problem for Brezhnev's regime.

Regarding the possibilities of Germany, I see no obstacles. If they could fly into space, then they could send people there, we are not talking about a space station here.

 

[Mushroom]

By the way, there is a possibility that the KGB killed him.

Naw. The erasure started even before, when he was kicked out of the program for his issues with drinking. They had already largely removed him from all records, back in 1963. It is just the Soviets tended to forget that some would remember and keep older copies of their releases, and notice their alterations. Hitler did it, Stalin did it, North Korea still does it today. The idea of many in the Far Left that by controlling images, they control reality.

But the KGB kill him? Why? He was a broken alcoholic, living on his pension in a bad area when he decided to kill himself. Not the first time something like that happened.

 

[Mushroom]

In fact, in Vietnam, Khrushchev and America had common interests. USSR broke off relations with China and stood up in opposition, there were even armed conflicts. There can be no question of the Soviet Union's support of that time for the Chinese side in the Vietnam conflict. And this opinion is now being imposed by the left.
I would not even be surprised if I found out that the USSR fought there together with the USA.

Well, not the USSR, but Russia.

I find it amazing how little remembered the mighty coalition that went on a crusade in China is today. And that three of the largest participants was the US, Russia, and Japan.

 

[rupol2000]

Naw. The erasure started even before, when he was kicked out of the program for his issues with drinking.

This is a semi-official version. But he doesn't look like a drunkard in photographs and film. Even if he drank, it doesn't mean that he couldn't fly planes. This does not bother many. Surely many pilots of that time drank, it was in the order of things, there was no control, and alcohol was always available, this did not mean that they all had accidents. It is not directly related at all.

 

[rupol2000]

Well, not the USSR, but Russia.

Was there a separate Russia at that time?

 

[rupol2000]

Yuri Gagarin was the main symbol of the Khrushchev era, its triumph. People still remembered this time as a wonderful time of the end of suffering, hunger, repression and war, a time of freedom. Villagers saw electric bulbs in their homes. People moved from barracks to individual apartments in five-story buildings.

Gagarin was not a politician, but his image of the Khrushchev era could be used in politics. It was enough for him to say and people belived and go with him: he was a Hero.

It was not profitable for the KGB.

 

[rupol2000]

Gagarin in the last years of his life was in good shape.

He is athletic, looks much stronger than the average man in the USSR, was actively involved in several sports, and jumped with a parachute. An alcohol addict cannot live like this. There are no people with real alcohol problems who live such a life. Even if he got drunk from time to time, he could not have a severe form of alcoholism.