Sinking Christianity

[Annie]

I don't think it will be that easy:

http://time-blog.com/middle_east/2007/02/jesus_tales_from_the_crypt.html?iid=chix-digg

Jesus: Tales from the Crypt


Brace yourself. James Cameron, the man who brought you 'The Titanic' is back with another blockbuster. This time, the ship he's sinking is Christianity.

In a new documentary, Producer Cameron and his director, Simcha Jacobovici, make the starting claim that Jesus wasn't resurrected --the cornerstone of Christian faith-- and that his burial cave was discovered near Jerusalem. And, get this, Jesus sired a son with Mary Magdelene.

No, it's not a re-make of "The Da Vinci Codes'. It's supposed to be true.

Let's go back 27 years, when Israeli construction workers were gouging out the foundations for a new building in the industrial park in the Talpiyot, a Jerusalem suburb. of Jerusalem. The earth gave way, revealing a 2,000 year old cave with 10 stone caskets. Archologists were summoned, and the stone caskets carted away for examination. It took 20 years for experts to decipher the names on the ten tombs. They were: Jesua, son of Joseph, Mary, Mary, Mathew, Jofa and Judah, son of Jesua.
Israel's prominent archeologist Professor Amos Kloner didn't associate the crypt with the New Testament Jesus. His father, after all, was a humble carpenter who couldn't afford a luxury crypt for his family. And all were common Jewish names...

 

[Bullypulpit]

Christianity is already sinking under the accumulated weight of its modern-day Pharisees, sectarian strife and just plain hypocrisy. The same can be said of the Islam and Judaism as well.

 

[mattskramer]

I hope that the Christians don’t threaten the director with violence.

 

[Annie]

I hope that the Christians don’t threaten the director with violence.

But, but it makes it so much easier for your ilk, a few whackjobs do so and you can equate them with suicide bombers. Where would your arguments be without the idiot abortion bombers and such?

 

[mattskramer]

But, but it makes it so much easier for your ilk, a few whackjobs do so and you can equate them with suicide bombers. Where would your arguments be without the idiot abortion bombers and such?

I just marvel at how Christians say that their religion is different from other religions as exemplified in their people and practices. They say that to compare their religions to other religions is to compare apples and oranges. Yet, the comparisons are similar. The only difference is a matter of degrees.

When people make a comic depiction of Mohamed or write books satirical of Islam, Muslims become outraged, call for apology, retraction or execution. When someone makes a movie about Christ that does not coincide with traditional conservative views of Christ, there is outrage, picketing, and even death threats.

Advised and instructed by their “Bible” or not, Muslims have a history or conversion by the sword. They tortured and killed non-Muslims. Advised and instructed by their “Bible” or not, Christians have a history of conversion by the sword.

There is good and bad in practically everything.

 

[Annie]

I just marvel at how Christians say that their religion is different from other religions as exemplified in their people and practices. They say that to compare their religions to other religions is to compare apples and oranges. Yet, the comparisons are similar. The only difference is a matter of degrees.

When people make a comic depiction of Mohamed or write books satirical of Islam, Muslims become outraged, call for apology, retraction or execution. When someone makes a movie about Christ that does not coincide with traditional conservative views of Christ, there is outrage, picketing, and even death threats.

Advised and instructed by their “Bible” or not, Muslims have a history or conversion by the sword. They tortured and killed non-Muslims. Advised and instructed by their “Bible” or not, Christians have a history of conversion by the sword.

There is good and bad in practically everything.

and degree is everything, when it comes to violence. There are the deviations, which are condemned and the accepted, if not practiced by the majority. Again, it's about teaching-today.

 

[Black Lance]

I just marvel at how Christians say that their religion is different from other religions as exemplified in their people and practices. They say that to compare their religions to other religions is to compare apples and oranges. Yet, the comparisons are similar. The only difference is a matter of degrees.

When people make a comic depiction of Mohamed or write books satirical of Islam, Muslims become outraged, call for apology, retraction or execution. When someone makes a movie about Christ that does not coincide with traditional conservative views of Christ, there is outrage, picketing, and even death threats.

Advised and instructed by their “Bible” or not, Muslims have a history or conversion by the sword. They tortured and killed non-Muslims. Advised and instructed by their “Bible” or not, Christians have a history of conversion by the sword.

There is good and bad in practically everything.

Comparing Islamic Jihads to Christian Crusades or the Spanish Inquisition is simplistic, at best. These were very different situations rooted in very different doctrines, even if the outcome was often similar or the same.

Regardless, the "Christians-R-evil" crowd among the secular leftists can only compare Pat Robertson to Osama Bin Laden at their own expense, because even a common sense examination reveals the difference.

 

[maineman]

cameron is free to make any movie he likes..... it will not damage the foundations of my faith.

a tempest in a teapot, if you ask me.

 

[jasendorf]

It will be easy.

 

[mattskramer]

Comparing Islamic Jihads to Christian Crusades or the Spanish Inquisition is simplistic, at best. These were very different situations rooted in very different doctrines, even if the outcome was often similar or the same.

Regardless, the "Christians-R-evil" crowd among the secular leftists can only compare Pat Robertson to Osama Bin Laden at their own expense, because even a common sense examination reveals the difference.

There was the Spanish Inquisition, Salem Witch Trials, harassments and threats against those who would criticize Christian beliefs. The killings by Muslims might outnumber the killings by Christians, and the times and methods might be different. Yet, the agendas were similar and for all practical purposes, the difference is only in degrees.

I doubt that Pat Robertson advocated violence, but I might be wrong. A more appropriate comparison would be between Osama Bin Laden and Jim Jones, David Koresh, Michael Griffin, and Eric Rudolph.

 

[5stringJeff]

There was the Spanish Inquisition, Salem Witch Trials, harassments and threats against those who would criticize Christian beliefs. The killings by Muslims might outnumber the killings by Christians, and the times and methods might be different. Yet, the agendas were similar and for all practical purposes, the difference is only in degrees.

Except that killing of non-believers is not sanctioned by the Bible; it is sanctioned by the Koran. Therefore, it was inconsistent and wrong for Christians to participate in the Spanish Inquisition, Salem Witch Trials, etc.; it is consistent with Muslim beliefs to participate in jihad and to kill infidels.

 

[mattskramer]

Except that killing of non-believers is not sanctioned by the Bible; it is sanctioned by the Koran. Therefore, it was inconsistent and wrong for Christians to participate in the Spanish Inquisition, Salem Witch Trials, etc.; it is consistent with Muslim beliefs to participate in jihad and to kill infidels.

See http://www.religioustolerance.org/intol_bibl2.htm#non

It provides ways used by people to interpret the Bible in ways to condone violence, if not murder, against non-Christians.

See http://islam.about.com/od/terrorism/f/terrorism_verse.htm and http://www.islamdenouncesterrorism.com/the_pacifism_of_islam.html

They provide ways used my people to interpret the Koran to oppose violence, if not murder, against non-Muslims.

Again, it is a legitimate comparison (apples to apples or oranges to oranges). You can discuss which interpretations or translations are more accurate. Christian apologetics and research has written books about it. Likewise, Islamic sympathizers have done a lifetime of research and reasoning on what Mohamed really meant and how Islamic scripture is to be applied today. The debate will probably go on forever. I don’t care to go on into the “we versus them” fight. There is good and bad in practically everything. As one famous/infamous person once said “Can’t we all just get along”?

 

[5stringJeff]

See http://www.religioustolerance.org/intol_bibl2.htm#non

It provides ways used by people to interpret the Bible in ways to condone violence, if not murder, against non-Christians.

Not one of those interpretations is even close to being either orthodox or common-sense. It would be as if I interpreted your post as saying that I should use less cumin in my taco seasoning.

 

[Eightball]

Except that killing of non-believers is not sanctioned by the Bible; it is sanctioned by the Koran. Therefore, it was inconsistent and wrong for Christians to participate in the Spanish Inquisition, Salem Witch Trials, etc.; it is consistent with Muslim beliefs to participate in jihad and to kill infidels.

Jeff: Christians are defined by what Jesus says they are, and not any other definition.

So those who claimed to be Christians doing their thing in Salem, during the Inquisition, the Crusades, by definition were not Christians if we were to go to the source.....namely the bible........and Jesus the Founder.

In fact these folks were the antithesis of Christianity, and when the left, or the atheists use these examples as what Christianity or Christians are, they are totally out of their league of understanding scripturally what a Christian/Christianity is.

You and I know that Scripture is Spiritually understood, and means nothing, or is totally misunderstood, to those that have not been regenerated by God........namely non-Christians. That's scriptural, and all of Jesus's apostles taught that, in one form of another in the Epistles, as well as Jesus Himself.

I cannot apologize for Christianity when abortion clinics are blown up or abortionists murdered, or innocents hung because someone said they were demon possessed, as true Christians would find that behaviour abhorrant, and totally against their nature in Christ.

There are "wack jobs" out there that say, "thus sayeth the Lord Almighty" yet by their very actions and life reflect nothing of the nature of one who has a Spiritual relationship with God, as clearly explained by Jesus when He talked to Nicodemus about being "born again" or "born from above".

The ones posting here that bring up the atrocities done by someone or groups that claim to be Christian, are only using these examples to deflect any honest scrutiny of their own consciences. Human nature naturally in it's fallen state deflects personal accountability for wrongs by making others the scape goat for their flawed character and nature. Just as Adam tried to escape accountability by telling God that Eve gave him the fruit or encouraged him, this telling display of lacking personal culpability still continues in this fallen race, called human kind.

Why did folks attempt to stone Jesus? Because He spoke a piercing truth that challenged mankind to scrutinize his own heart, and really see that there was really nothing there that merited God's favor. Right on this forum, that very behaviour is exercised by many as they deflect the piercing truth of scripture by attacking Christianity from many unsubstantiated angles.

If Jeffrey Dalmer, the Zodiac, Stalin, Pol Pot, Idi Amin, had claimed to be a Christians, they would use them as well for their lame cannon fodder to attack the merits of the Christian faith and it's adherents.

True, pure, biblical Christianity has two major affects on mankind..........He/she either flees from it, or is attracted to it. It all depend on whether the person/s is willing to be honest/transparent about themselves at the deepest core of their being. Pride must go down the toilet, as it is the greatest stumbling block of man's possible entrance into God's kingdom and eternal, restored relationship through Jesus Christ, the only and en-total attoner for all mankind's sin, and sinful nature.

The cross is the field-leveler. It represents death and that's exactly where our lives must fall, face down, and it's at the cross where we see the light/truth as pride takes a back-row seat, and a contrite heart readies the soul to accept God's Lordship over one's self-centered, hopeless life of vacuous search for meaning, and identity.

The ressurrection is the work of God through His Son, displaying the victory over man's fallen nature, and his unrighteous, fallen, condition. The sinful nature stays dead/crucified, the new nature in Christ assumes the throne of the Christian's life (ressurrection).

As Galatians 2:20 clearly says, "I have been crucified with Christ, and it is no longer I(the old natured man) who lives, but Christ in me(The new natured man), and the life I(new natured man in Christ) now live, I(new natured man in Christ) live by faith in Jesus Christ, who delievered Himself(gave His life in my stead) up for me".

So by nature, a true Christian has the nature of Christ, or the Holy Spirit in him/her empowering/guiding/counseling, them 24 hours a day.

It is totally against the nature of a true Christian to commit attrocities to fellow human beings, without being totally devastated with remore, and shame.

Yes, Christians sin, but they also have a constant Counselor that reminds them in their conscience when they are or are not in God's will. That's the Holy Spirit.

Many will say "Lord Lord" and Jesus will say, "I don't know you!".

So as Christians, we are representing the King, and are considered Royal Ambassadors in reality. We can lead the unsaved away from God, or to God. We can be an instrument of stumbling or we can be an instrument of leading one to reconciliation with God, through their volitional faith in Jesus Christ.

Yet, to say that Christians killed Jews in Africa(Crusades) by the myriads in the name of Jesus is total nonsense,.

Those and the Inquisitioners will be yelling, "Lord Lord" and Jesus will anwer with a, "I don't know you!". You can bet on that!

 

[actsnoblemartin]

ironically, this movie would not have been made if it were about islam. In america, and around the world, you cannot even draw a picture of mohammed, let alone question of critcize islam, but if you wanna demean, degrade or villify all christians, based on a few. Go right ahead.

Sad world we live in, and im not even a christian.