Singapore's Health Care System - Seemed Pretty Good

[Sun Devil 92]

And this is where I think you're misguided.

Be careful what you wish for.

I am all ears as to how this might not be the case.

I didn't start this thread to argue a point. I started it to raise these questions.

I can't say it is a bad thing. What I need to know is where we spend our dollars.

A very touch subject is end of life care. As I understand it, we spend about 30% of our total health care dollars on people in the last year of life.

I quickly looked and found this:

Medicare, the health insurance program for the elderly, spends nearly 30 percent of its budget on beneficiaries in their final year of life. Slightly more than half of Medicare dollars are spent on patients who die within two months.

30% or a small variation, one has to ask what we are getting for that.

Now, I'd like to see what Singapore does with regards to EOL issues.

If a family wants to blow their life savings to keep grandpa alive for an extra year, or if insurance companies can sell expensive insurance that covers such extremes, it's not a bad thing. It's people spending their money how
they want. You and I might think it's a waste, but others disagree. They obviously find some value in it.

EOL care is no longer a "personal decision" in the USA -- largely.. It's the Medicare reimbursements and highly controlled MediCare supplemental markets that we all are FORCED to share. In fact ---- it's ILLEGAL to "blow a wad" on Gramps in almost all cases. I know -- my Dad died (partly) because I was not able to fund a simple variation on a procedure that Medicare would not allow..

You'll need to explain.

You are saying that had you paid for a procedure on your own, you would have been in violation of the law ?

If the patient is admitted for a particular reason that is covered under Medicare - you cannot ALTER the treatments or services rendered in ANY WAY by private funding or subsidizing deviations from Medicare standards. The doctors will then not be reimbursed for a DIME of the total cost.

In this case, there were recurrent serious UTInfections due to an enlarged prostate and the solution was radio heating of prostrate which is approved for local anesthesia. The Urologist refused to put him on the table because it's painful and requires a lot a cooperation and was afraid he wouldn't comply.

I wanted them to put him under general anesth. which the doctor said was possible, but Medicare would reject his entire claim if I paid for it..

That sounds terrible.

I am sorry for you and your father.

 

[dblack]

Again, I have to ask. Why does it matter how much of our GDP we spend on health care? I'm certainly sympathetic to the concern that health care prices are inflated - I think it's obvious they are. But how much we choose to invest our treasure in health care is a different concern. Why do we assume it's a bad thing?

We're not assuming it's a bad thing. We KNOW it's a bad thing. Because we share a lot of those costs thru insurance pools.. Not the elective stuff -- but the other stuff that SunDevil mentioned. Or including the Govt mandated coverage for stuff I --- YOU don't want or need..

And this is where I think you're misguided.

Be careful what you wish for.

I am all ears as to how this might not be the case.

I didn't start this thread to argue a point. I started it to raise these questions.

I can't say it is a bad thing. What I need to know is where we spend our dollars.

A very touch subject is end of life care. As I understand it, we spend about 30% of our total health care dollars on people in the last year of life.

I quickly looked and found this:

Medicare, the health insurance program for the elderly, spends nearly 30 percent of its budget on beneficiaries in their final year of life. Slightly more than half of Medicare dollars are spent on patients who die within two months.

30% or a small variation, one has to ask what we are getting for that.

Now, I'd like to see what Singapore does with regards to EOL issues.

If a family wants to blow their life savings to keep grandpa alive for an extra year, or if insurance companies can sell expensive insurance that covers such extremes, it's not a bad thing. It's people spending their money how they want. You and I might think it's a waste, but others disagree. They obviously find some value in it.

EOL care is no longer a "personal decision" in the USA -- largely..

And that, to the extent that it is the case, is the problem. It leads to insane scenarios like what you describe with your father.

 

[flacaltenn]

We're not assuming it's a bad thing. We KNOW it's a bad thing. Because we share a lot of those costs thru insurance pools.. Not the elective stuff -- but the other stuff that SunDevil mentioned. Or including the Govt mandated coverage for stuff I --- YOU don't want or need..

And this is where I think you're misguided.

Be careful what you wish for.

I am all ears as to how this might not be the case.

I didn't start this thread to argue a point. I started it to raise these questions.

I can't say it is a bad thing. What I need to know is where we spend our dollars.

A very touch subject is end of life care. As I understand it, we spend about 30% of our total health care dollars on people in the last year of life.

I quickly looked and found this:

Medicare, the health insurance program for the elderly, spends nearly 30 percent of its budget on beneficiaries in their final year of life. Slightly more than half of Medicare dollars are spent on patients who die within two months.

30% or a small variation, one has to ask what we are getting for that.

Now, I'd like to see what Singapore does with regards to EOL issues.

If a family wants to blow their life savings to keep grandpa alive for an extra year, or if insurance companies can sell expensive insurance that covers such extremes, it's not a bad thing. It's people spending their money how they want. You and I might think it's a waste, but others disagree. They obviously find some value in it.

EOL care is no longer a "personal decision" in the USA -- largely..

And that, to the extent that it is the case, is the problem. It leads to insane scenarios like what you describe with your father.

It does.. You MIGHT "blow a wad" on Grandpa -- but not to actually achieve better medical outcomes, because they've made that virtually illegal. The money gets sunk to cover the caps that Medicare doesn't on Nursing Home care and Assisted Living.. Or God forbids, that he outlives the Hospice deadline and accidentally lives on.

Which to SunDevil's point is --- Is all the nursing home care/assisted living/inhome care that we DO "splurge" on INCLUDED in these summaries of Amer. Health Care costs?? It probably SHOULDN'T be for apples to apples.

Great questions raised here.. Someone should probably write an article about how much all these things affects comparisons with foreign h.care systems.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

And this is where I think you're misguided.

Be careful what you wish for.

I am all ears as to how this might not be the case.

I didn't start this thread to argue a point. I started it to raise these questions.

I can't say it is a bad thing. What I need to know is where we spend our dollars.

A very touch subject is end of life care. As I understand it, we spend about 30% of our total health care dollars on people in the last year of life.

I quickly looked and found this:

Medicare, the health insurance program for the elderly, spends nearly 30 percent of its budget on beneficiaries in their final year of life. Slightly more than half of Medicare dollars are spent on patients who die within two months.

30% or a small variation, one has to ask what we are getting for that.

Now, I'd like to see what Singapore does with regards to EOL issues.

If a family wants to blow their life savings to keep grandpa alive for an extra year, or if insurance companies can sell expensive insurance that covers such extremes, it's not a bad thing. It's people spending their money how they want. You and I might think it's a waste, but others disagree. They obviously find some value in it.

EOL care is no longer a "personal decision" in the USA -- largely..

And that, to the extent that it is the case, is the problem. It leads to insane scenarios like what you describe with your father.

It does.. You MIGHT "blow a wad" on Grandpa -- but not to actually achieve better medical outcomes, because they've made that virtually illegal. The money gets sunk to cover the caps that Medicare doesn't on Nursing Home care and Assisted Living.. Or God forbids, that he outlives the Hospice deadline and accidentally lives on.

Which to SunDevil's point is --- Is all the nursing home care/assisted living/inhome care that we DO "splurge" on INCLUDED in these summaries of Amer. Health Care costs?? It probably SHOULDN'T be for apples to apples.

Great questions raised here.. Someone should probably write an article about how much all these things affects comparisons with foreign h.care systems.

I keep thinking someone can show us the data so we can look at how it is broken down.

I don't like being handed conclusions without being able to see the basis for them.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

I guess I've come to realize that the left really does not care to discuss the issue in terms other than what satisfies their fantasies.

Here we have a system that seems to deliver good care and good cost (but not to much cost) with direct connection to funding by users.

Obamacare has provided insurance that is worthless in a high cost system they prop up (hospitals are now making lots of money) that is putting more stress on the lower income folks.......

All, so we can feed the beast.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

Hello healthmyths

You seem to post a great deal on the subject of healthcare.

I'd be curious to get your comments.