San Francisco Chronicle Exclusive: Captain of aircraft carrier with growing coronavirus outbreak pleads for help from Navy

[Desperado]

i blame Trump! there's no social distancing on an aircraft carrier, my friends!

Exclusive: Captain of aircraft carrier with growing coronavirus outbreak pleads for help from Navy

The captain of a nuclear aircraft carrier docked in Guam with more than 100...

www.sfchronicle.com

Of course you blame Trump, you are a democrat and that is your mission in life. I would prefer to blame the person that allowed the ship to have a 5 day shore leave in Vietnam in early March

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Joe Biden slams firing of Navy captain over leak of letter requesting his ship’s crew be taken off the ship to contain COVID-19 spread. "The poor judgment here belongs to the Trump Administration, not a courageous officer trying to protect his sailors.”

WTF cares...........I don't .............he broke the chain of command.........bye............You want Biden then elect him .............until then he isn't in charge of a damned thing.

That ship was sent to Guam........to deal with the situation the best they could do............Same as other ships.

OTHER SHIPS...........have had cases..........I haven't seen them going to the SAN FRAN CHRONICLE..........you have got to be kidding me............

If he felt this way so strongly..........you go to your ELECTED OFFICIALS from your state. Even then.........you have violated the Chain of Command.

He did use the chain of command and if they did something it would have been resolved at that time. But they didn't as this was something most military leaders are not able to deal with.

So he leaked a letter asking for help from his superiors , will I would suspect that this got their attention and they will help those guy serving their country. Yes he will probably be assigned a desk job but I bet he will sleep better at night that he went the extra mile and saved lives. I wonder what his crew thinks of him.

First. No one has confirmed that the Captain sent the letter to the media. Their complaint is that he sent it via an unsecure server.

Second. This is how his Sailors feel about him.



Third. Anyone want to place bets on who they will be voting against?

Uh, they won't be voting? Very few active duty personnel bother to vote.

 

[Mushroom]

Still you seem to expect that being in the middle of the ocean XXX miles away from home and confronted with a disease that is very contagious could be easily solved by the captain of the ship.

But he was not "in the middle of the ocean" when he wrote that letter.

He had already been tied up alongside the dock in Guam for over 3 days. So that entire claim is moot.

And no, I accept nothing at all, and kindly stop projecting onto me. If there is one thing I absolutely detest, it is the dishonesty of people who try to tell others what they think. Especially since 90% of the time when people do that they are absolutely wrong.

Want to know my biggest problem with what he did? It is that he sent a rambling 4 page memo full of complaints and gripes, and not a single suggestion on how things could have been improved. That there is the single biggest issue I have. I read that, and I nod and go "Yea, if that was all he had to say those above him should have ignored him". They were worrying about trying to actually solve the issue about finding housing for his people off of the ship. They did not need to be distracted by listening to his whining complaints without a single bit of suggestion to improve things.

After that in a distant second, was his sending information that was obviously classified in an unsecure manner. Then after that to a list that certainly caused it to be leaked.

I do not really know the "official Navy statement", and I do not care. He offered absolutely nothing to help the issue, and likely made it worse. And I have yet to find a single person who can actually give a single suggestion that could have made things better.

All I see is people trying to turn this into a political thing. I do not give a damn about politics, I simply see somebody whining and not helping the problem. And if that is all he is good for, then get him outta there and put in somebody that prefers actions to complaining.

 

[Kilroy2]

a mother of one Roosevelt sailor telling Navy Times she was “devastated” by the captain’s dismissal, adding that Crozier “risked his own livelihood. That is so hard to do. Not a lot of men, not a lot of women, not a lot of people out there who would do that for others.”

Does history repeat itself. Teddy Roosevelt faced a similar situation with Malaria and yellow fever threatening to wipe out his men.

He wrote a letter "The Round Robin Letter

it was meant for the command structure but a copy found its way to a newspaper.

The troops were eventually withdrew. Previously they were told that there was no ships to withdraw them but that quickly changed when the letter was reported in the newspaper. Suddenly the troops were withdrawn.

They had followed the chain of command but the they were unwilling to withdrawn them for more pressing political objectives.

Teddy Roosevelt eventually became the president of the US

This is the 2nd leader of the NAVY to resign under Trump after he got involved with internal navy matters.

 

[Mushroom]

He wrote a letter "The Round Robin Letter

He did not write it. And he was 1 of 10 people who signed it, and he was the lowest ranking person to sign it.

It was also a vastly different situation. The war with Spain was over, and a great many who were overseas had completed their terms of service and wanted to return home to be mustered out. But because so many had contracted tropical diseases, the decision was made to keep them there in quarantine until they had run their course because nobody wanted them to break out in the US.

A week and a half later units started to return to a new camp that had been built in New York to be mustered out. So they were moved to the new camp and lived in tents for the next 3-5 months until they had passed quarantine.

All told, around 30,000 men arrived to the new Camp Wikoff, around 10% were infected with tropical diseases (primarily Yellow Fever). 10% of those infected died.

 

[Kilroy2]

MAJOR-GENERAL SHAFTER. SIR: In a meeting of the general and medical officers called by you at the Palace this morning we were all, as you know, unanimous in our views of what should be done with the army. To keep us here, in the opinion of every officer commanding a division or a brigade, will simply involve the destruction of thousands.

There is no possible reason for not shipping practically the entire command North at once. Yellow-fever cases are very few in the cavalry division, where I command one of the two brigades, and not one true case of yellow fever has occurred in this division, except among the men sent to the hospital at Siboney, where they have, I believe, contracted it. But in this division there have been 1,500 cases of malarial fever. Hardly a man has yet died from it, but the whole command is so weakened and shattered as to be ripe for dying like rotten sheep, when a real yellow-fever epidemic instead of a fake epidemic, like the present one, strikes us, as it is bound to do if we stay here at the height of the sickness season, August and the beginning of September.

Quarantine against malarial fever is much like quarantining against the toothache. All of us are certain that as soon as the authorities at Washington fully appreciate the condition of the army, we shall be sent home. If we are kept here it will in all human possibility mean an appalling disaster, for the surgeons here estimate that over half the army, if kept here during the sickly season, will die.


This is not only terrible from the standpoint of the individual lives lost, but it means ruin from the standpoint of military efficiency of the flower of the American army, for the great bulk of the regulars are here with you. The sick list, large though it is, exceeding four thousand, affords but a faint index of the debilitation of the army. Not ten per cent are fit for active work.

Six weeks on the North Maine coast, for instance, or elsewhere where the yellow-fever germ cannot possibly propagate, would make us all as fit as fighting-cocks, as able as we are eager to take a leading part in the great campaign against Havana in the fall, even if we are not allowed to try Porto Rico. We can be moved North, if moved at once, with absolute safety to the country, although, of course, it would have been infinitely better if we had been moved North or to Puerto Rico two weeks ago. If there were any object in keeping us here, we would face yellow fever with as much indifference as we faced bullets. But there is no object.

The four immune regiments ordered here are sufficient to garrison the city and surrounding towns, and there is absolutely nothing for us to do here, and there has not been since the city surrendered. It is impossible to move into the interior. Every shifting of camp doubles the sick rate in our present weakened condition, and, anyhow, the interior is rather worse than the coast, as I have found by actual reconnoissance.

Our present camps are as healthy as any camps at this end of the island can be. I write only because I cannot see our men, who have fought so bravely and who have endured extreme hardship and danger so uncomplainingly, go to destruction without striving so far as lies in me to avert a doom as fearful as it is unnecessary and undeserved.


Yours respectfully, THEODORE ROOSEVELT, Colonel Commanding Second Cavalry Brigade.

Signed by all the officers, the letter was delivered to Shafter and meant for delivery to the Army Headquarters in Washington.

 

[Mushroom]

Signed by all the officers, the letter was delivered to Shafter and meant for delivery to the Army Headquarters in Washington.

It was a "Round Robin" letter, like a modern chain letter. TR did not author it, and he was one of 10 Officers that signed it. Others who signed it were Major General Kent, Major General Bates, Major General Chaffee, Brigadier General Sumner, Brigadier General Ludlow, Brigadier General Ames, and Brigadier General Wood. He never once claimed credit for the idea or authoring it, only that he had at most "made corrections" (page 168, "The Works of Teddy Roosevelt" volume 13). And TR was never one to shy from claiming credit if he did or originated something.

In fact, on the same page he stated he was going to give General Shafter his own revised copy when he found there was already a copy prepared for him to sign so he signed it.

The Works of Theodore Roosevelt

books.google.com

And no, not signed by "all the Officers" signed it. Specifically, Major General Shafter (Corps commander) did not sign it. And also unlike the recent letter, it listed a great many things to take into consideration, such as where to quarantine those being returned, and steps to be taken to ensure disease did not spread among the civilian population.

In fact, Major General Shafter refused to even deliver the letter to higher authority.

And this letter mentioned a lot of things that Captain Crozier did not even mention at all. Including precautions to take, and that those returned be isolated in a remote location.

No, there is nothing at all similar between the two letters, other than both were leaked to the press.

 

[Kilroy2]

Signed by all the officers, the letter was delivered to Shafter and meant for delivery to the Army Headquarters in Washington.

It was a "Round Robin" letter, like a modern chain letter. TR did not author it, and he was one of 10 Officers that signed it. Others who signed it were Major General Kent, Major General Bates, Major General Chaffee, Brigadier General Sumner, Brigadier General Ludlow, Brigadier General Ames, and Brigadier General Wood. He never once claimed credit for the idea or authoring it, only that he had at most "made corrections" (page 168, "The Works of Teddy Roosevelt" volume 13). And TR was never one to shy from claiming credit if he did or originated something.

In fact, on the same page he stated he was going to give General Shafter his own revised copy when he found there was already a copy prepared for him to sign so he signed it.

The Works of Theodore Roosevelt

books.google.com

And no, not signed by "all the Officers" signed it. Specifically, Major General Shafter (Corps commander) did not sign it. And also unlike the recent letter, it listed a great many things to take into consideration, such as where to quarantine those being returned, and steps to be taken to ensure disease did not spread among the civilian population.

In fact, Major General Shafter refused to even deliver the letter to higher authority.

And this letter mentioned a lot of things that Captain Crozier did not even mention at all. Including precautions to take, and that those returned be isolated in a remote location.

No, there is nothing at all similar between the two letters, other than both were leaked to the press.

You are only referring to the first letter that was sent. and is not the round robin. Roosevelt sent the second one which is the round robin and was leaked to the press.

The letter I posted above shows that it was signed by Roosevelt. yet you cannot even accept that.

​

SANTIAGO DE CUBA, August 3d (delayed in transmission).—Summoned by Major-General Shafter, a meeting was held here this morning at head-quarters, and in the presence of every commanding and medical officer of the Fifth Army Corps, General Shafter read a cable message from Secretary Alger, ordering him, on the recommendation of Surgeon-General Sternberg, to move the army into the interior, to San Luis, where it is healthier.	2​
As a result of the conference General Shafter will insist upon the immediate withdrawal of the army North.	3​
As an explanation of the situation the following letter from Colonel Theodore Roosevelt, commanding the First Cavalry, to General Shafter, was handed by the latter to the correspondent of the Associated Press for publication: MAJOR-GENERAL SHAFTER. SIR: In a meeting of the general and medical officers called by you at the Palace this morning we were all, as you know, unanimous in our views of what should be done with the army. To keep us here, in the opinion of every officer commanding a division or a brigade, will simply involve the destruction of thousands. There is no possible reason for not shipping practically the entire command North at once. Yellow-fever cases are very few in the cavalry division, where I command one of the two brigades, and not one true case of yellow fever has occurred in this division, except among the men sent to the hospital at Siboney, where they have, I believe, contracted it. But in this division there have been 1,500 cases of malarial fever. Hardly a man has yet died from it, but the whole command is so weakened and shattered as to be ripe for dying like rotten sheep, when a real yellow-fever epidemic instead of a fake epidemic, like the present one, strikes us, as it is bound to do if we stay here at the height of the sickness season, August and the beginning of September. Quarantine against malarial fever is much like quarantining against the toothache. All of us are certain that as soon as the authorities at Washington fully appreciate the condition of the army, we shall be sent home. If we are kept here it will in all human possibility mean an appalling disaster, for the surgeons here estimate that over half the army, if kept here during the sickly season, will die. This is not only terrible from the stand-point of the individual lives lost, but it means ruin from the stand-point of military efficiency of the flower of the American army, for the great bulk of the regulars are here with you. The sick list, large though it is, exceeding four thousand, affords but a faint index of the debilitation of the army. Not twenty per cent. are fit for active work. Six weeks on the North Maine coast, for instance, or elsewhere where the yellow-fever germ cannot possibly propagate, would make us all as fit as fighting-cocks, as able as we are eager to take a leading part in the great campaign against Havana in the fall, even if we are not allowed to try Porto Rico. We can be moved North, if moved at once, with absolute safety to the country, although, of course, it would have been infinitely better if we had been moved North or to Porto Rico two weeks ago. If there were any object in keeping us here, we would face yellow fever with as much indifference as we faced bullets. But there is no object. The four immune regiments ordered here are sufficient to garrison the city and surrounding towns, and there is absolutely nothing for us to do here, and there has not been since the city surrendered. It is impossible to move into the interior. Every shifting of camp doubles the sick-rate in our present weakened condition, and, anyhow, the interior is rather worse than the coast, as I have found by actual reconnoissance. Our present camps are as healthy as any camps at this end of the island can be. I write only because I cannot see our men, who have fought so bravely and who have endured extreme hardship and danger so uncomplainingly, go to destruction without striving so far as lies in me to avert a doom as fearful as it is unnecessary and undeserved. Yours respectfully, THEODORE ROOSEVELT, Colonel Commanding Second Cavalry Brigade.​	4​
After Colonel Roosevelt had taken the initiative, all the American general officers united in a "round robin" addressed to General Shafter. It reads: We, the undersigned officers commanding the various brigades, divisions, etc., of the Army of Occupation in Cuba, are of the unanimous opinion that this army should be at once taken out of the island of Cuba and sent to some point on the Northern sea-coast of the United States; that can be done without danger to the people of the United States; that yellow fever in the army at present is not epidemic; that there are only a few sporadic cases; but that the army is disabled by malarial fever to the extent that its efficiency is destroyed, and that it is in a condition to be practically entirely destroyed by an epidemic of yellow fever, which is sure to come in the near future. We know from the reports of competent officers and from personal observations that the army is unable to move into the interior, and that there are no facilities for such a move if attempted, and that it could not be attempted until too late. Moreover, the best medical authorities of the island say that with our present equipment we could not live in the interior during the rainy season without losses from malarial fever, which is almost as deadly as yellow fever. This army must be moved at once, or perish. As the army can be safely moved now, the persons responsible for preventing such a move will be responsible for the unnecessary loss of many thousands of lives. Our opinions are the result of careful personal observation, and they are also based on the unanimous opinion of our medical officers with the army, who understand the situation absolutely. J. FORD KENT, Major-General Volunteers Commanding First Division, Fifth Corps. J. C. BATES, Major-General Volunteers Commanding Provisional Division. ADNAH R. CHAFFEE, Major-General Commanding Third Brigade, Second Division. SAMUEL S. SUMNER, Brigadier-General Volunteers Commanding First Brigade, Cavalry. WILL LUDLOW, Brigadier-General Volunteers Commanding First Brigade, Second Division. ADELBERT AMES, Brigadier-General Volunteers Commanding Third Brigade, First Division. LEONARD WOOD, Brigadier-General Volunteers Commanding the City of Santiago. THEODORE ROOSEVELT, Colonel Commanding Second Cavalry Brigade.​

Appendix C: The Round Robin Letter - Collection at Bartleby.com

Appendix C: The Round Robin Letter SANTIAGO DE CUBA, August 3d (delayed in transmission).—Summoned by Major-General Shafter, a meeting was held here this morning at head-quarters, and

www.bartleby.com

USS Theodore Roosevelt Commanding Officer Followed the Example of Colonel Roosevelt

By Commander Ward Carroll, U.S. Navy (Retired)

USS Theodore Roosevelt Commanding Officer Followed the Example of Colonel Roosevelt

The leak of Captain Crozier's letter is remarkably similar to an event involving Colonel Theodore Roosevelt in 1898.

www.usni.org

This is history and it is simple and cannot be changed.

Now show me your proof.

 

[Mushroom]

Now show me your proof.

I already quoted from his own writings.

What you are quoting are 2 very different letters.

The first was one written directly to Major General Shafter. It is not the same letter you are trying to make it out to be. As you said yourself, it was not the "round robin" letter, so why you are even trying to bring it up as if it was I have no idea.

Here, in the middle of a discussion about dogs, let me inject a picture of a kitten. Now yes it has nothing to do with a dog, but it is an animal so that is close enough!

That is all you are really doing. If you can not stick to a single item without bouncing around between 2 or 3 others, this really is over. You yourself said it is a different letter, you have already proved my point for me. The letter is addressed to one person, you yourself admit it is not the "round robin" letter, so why even bring it up in the first place?

Other than you somehow think they are each the same thing, which obviously they are not.

 

[Kilroy2]

Now show me your proof.

Here what you say admitting there are 2 letters but then you try to point to the one Teddy R did not sign and say that is your point. Ignoring the other letter which was signed by him.

You - What you are quoting are 2 very different letters.

The first was one written directly to Major General Shafter. It is not the same letter you are trying to make it out to be. As you said yourself, it was not the "round robin" letter, so why you are even trying to bring it up as if it was I have no idea.

Here, in the middle of a discussion about dogs, let me inject a picture of a kitten. Now yes it has nothing to do with a dog, but it is an animal so that is close enough!

That is all you are really doing. If you can not stick to a single item without bouncing around between 2 or 3 others, this really is over. You yourself said it is a different letter, you have already proved my point for me. The letter is addressed to one person, you yourself admit it is not the "round robin" letter, so why even bring it up in the first place?

Other than you somehow think they are each the same thing, which obviously they are not.

Your the one who is bouncing around, You quote one letters and say Teddy R did not sign which is correct. But he sent his own letter that I posted but you ignore it and don't even address it because you release that you lose.


You
What you are quoting are 2 very different letters.

AJOR-GENERAL SHAFTER. SIR: In a meeting of the general and medical officers called by you at the Palace this morning we were all, as you know, unanimous in our views of what should be done with the army. To keep us here, in the opinion of every officer commanding a division or a brigade, will simply involve the destruction of thousands.

There is no possible reason for not shipping practically the entire command North at once. Yellow-fever cases are very few in the cavalry division, where I command one of the two brigades, and not one true case of yellow fever has occurred in this division, except among the men sent to the hospital at Siboney, where they have, I believe, contracted it. But in this division there have been 1,500 cases of malarial fever. Hardly a man has yet died from it, but the whole command is so weakened and shattered as to be ripe for dying like rotten sheep, when a real yellow-fever epidemic instead of a fake epidemic, like the present one, strikes us, as it is bound to do if we stay here at the height of the sickness season, August and the beginning of September.

Quarantine against malarial fever is much like quarantining against the toothache. All of us are certain that as soon as the authorities at Washington fully appreciate the condition of the army, we shall be sent home. If we are kept here it will in all human possibility mean an appalling disaster, for the surgeons here estimate that over half the army, if kept here during the sickly season, will die.


This is not only terrible from the standpoint of the individual lives lost, but it means ruin from the standpoint of military efficiency of the flower of the American army, for the great bulk of the regulars are here with you. The sick list, large though it is, exceeding four thousand, affords but a faint index of the debilitation of the army. Not ten per cent are fit for active work.

Six weeks on the North Maine coast, for instance, or elsewhere where the yellow-fever germ cannot possibly propagate, would make us all as fit as fighting-cocks, as able as we are eager to take a leading part in the great campaign against Havana in the fall, even if we are not allowed to try Porto Rico. We can be moved North, if moved at once, with absolute safety to the country, although, of course, it would have been infinitely better if we had been moved North or to Puerto Rico two weeks ago. If there were any object in keeping us here, we would face yellow fever with as much indifference as we faced bullets. But there is no object.

The four immune regiments ordered here are sufficient to garrison the city and surrounding towns, and there is absolutely nothing for us to do here, and there has not been since the city surrendered. It is impossible to move into the interior. Every shifting of camp doubles the sick rate in our present weakened condition, and, anyhow, the interior is rather worse than the coast, as I have found by actual reconnoissance.

Our present camps are as healthy as any camps at this end of the island can be. I write only because I cannot see our men, who have fought so bravely and who have endured extreme hardship and danger so uncomplainingly, go to destruction without striving so far as lies in me to avert a doom as fearful as it is unnecessary and undeserved.


Yours respectfully, THEODORE ROOSEVELT, Colonel Commanding Second Cavalry Brigade.
letter one by roosevelt

letter two

After Colonel Roosevelt had taken the initiative, all the American general officers united in a "round robin" addressed to General Shafter. It reads:

We, the undersigned officers commanding the various brigades, divisions, etc., of the Army of Occupation in Cuba, are of the unanimous opinion that this army should be at once taken out of the island of Cuba and sent to some point on the Northern sea-coast of the United States; that can be done without danger to the people of the United States; that yellow fever in the army at present is not epidemic; that there are only a few sporadic cases; but that the army is disabled by malarial fever to the extent that its efficiency is destroyed, and that it is in a condition to be practically entirely destroyed by an epidemic of yellow fever, which is sure to come in the near future. We know from the reports of competent officers and from personal observations that the army is unable to move into the interior, and that there are no facilities for such a move if attempted, and that it could not be attempted until too late. Moreover, the best medical authorities of the island say that with our present equipment we could not live in the interior during the rainy season without losses from malarial fever, which is almost as deadly as yellow fever. This army must be moved at once, or perish. As the army can be safely moved now, the persons responsible for preventing such a move will be responsible for the unnecessary loss of many thousands of lives. Our opinions are the result of careful personal observation, and they are also based on the unanimous opinion of our medical officers with the army, who understand the situation absolutely.
J. FORD KENT, Major-General Volunteers Commanding First Division, Fifth Corps. J. C. BATES, Major-General Volunteers Commanding Provisional Division. ADNAH R. CHAFFEE, Major-General Commanding Third Brigade, Second Division. SAMUEL S. SUMNER, Brigadier-General Volunteers Commanding First Brigade, Cavalry. WILL LUDLOW, Brigadier-General Volunteers Commanding First Brigade, Second Division. ADELBERT AMES, Brigadier-General Volunteers Commanding Third Brigade, First Division. LEONARD WOOD, Brigadier-General Volunteers Commanding the City of Santiago. THEODORE ROOSEVELT, Colonel Commanding Second Cavalry Brigade.

Letter two

Bottom line you are lying and you are well aware of it.

There are two letters Roosevelt sent the first one listed above

got it

Then the other guys sent the 2nd one with all their signatures,

I know you hate to lose but it not a matter of losing its a matter of telling the truth the first time around. If you claim to serve your country but you don't mind lying then good luck with that.

Case closed.