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Russian invasion of Ukraine showed all the problems of the democratic countries’ “unity”

zaangalewa

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:) Do you think, World War wouldn't be at your territory?

I think you are a Russian who likes to waste Russia - so why not to help you with German thoroughness to tear yourselve into pieces, Rumpelstiltskin?

 
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para bellum

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How do you recognize it by this photo? ;-\
The pic is a frame from a longer video- I've seen the video.

The rounded turret front and the cutouts on the sides are M109, not PzH2000. You can also see the outlines of the headlights which poke out on each side and are unique on the M109.

In the video there is also a clear shot of the rear, which further identifies it to be an M109. Specifically, it is an M109A3GN from Norway.

This is 3 months old, the PzH2000 claim was debunked a long time ago.

It was struck and disabled by a ZALA Lancet loitering munition. At least one crew member was seen climbing out, then the video cut off.
 

Ringo

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Sbiker

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The pic is a frame from a longer video- I've seen the video.

The rounded turret front and the cutouts on the sides are M109, not PzH2000. You can also see the outlines of the headlights which poke out on each side and are unique on the M109.

In the video there is also a clear shot of the rear, which further identifies it to be an M109. Specifically, it is an M109A3GN from Norway.

This is 3 months old, the PzH2000 claim was debunked a long time ago.

It was struck and disabled by a ZALA Lancet loitering munition. At least one crew member was seen climbing out, then the video cut off.

Ok. I've seen photo of transported PzH2000, but I'm not a specialist to recognize it from any record :)
 

para bellum

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Sbiker

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I think you are a Russian who likes to waste Russia - so why not to help you with German thoroughness to tear yourselve into pieces, Rumpelstiltskin?

Cet animal est très méchant
Quand on l'attaque, il se défend...
I think, it would be better to learn some experience from your neighbors, than flowing in your own phantasies... :)
 

zaangalewa

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Cet animal est très méchant
Quand on l'attaque, il se défend...
I think, it would be better to learn some experience from your neighbors, than flowing in your own phantasies... :)

Russia is an animal who defended herselve by starting to do a war agaist the Ukraine without any reason to do so, by annexing illegaly Ukrainian territory and by doing masses of war crimes - for example in the moment the war crime to destroy the energy and water infrastructure of the civil Ukrainian population wíth Iranian Kamikaze-drones?

Be happy that the NATO is not an "animal" - in your weird view of this what could be an animal for you - otherwise Russia would be dead now.
 
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zaangalewa

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... sondern es ist ein hybrider Krieg, auch mit viel Propaganda, mit Fakle-News; man kann auch Lügen dazu sagen. Und jetzt kommt dieses weitere Element dazu inde er ANgst schürt in der Hoffnung, dass dann die Unterstützung der Ukraine abnimmt. Das haben wir ja schon im Hinblick auf die Energie gesehen. Auch da war das Ziel: Spaltung unserer Gesellschaft. Verunsicherung. Un das Wichtige ist in solchen Momenten nicht der Angst zu folgen, sondern einen kühlen Kopf zu bewahren. Dass man sich allen Risikien bewußt sein muss aber zugleich sich auch bewusst machen muss dass diese Erpressungsversuche nicht aufgehen. Weil wenn man sich vorstellt mit was er jetzt droht wenn das dann russische Territorien sind - das hat er zwischendurch auch schon getan, dass er gesagt hat das sind dann aber Angriffe auf uns - glaube ich dass es auch wichitg ist sich zu vergegenwärtigen dass auch umgekehrt ein Schuh daraus wird. Wenn wir das jetzt akzeptieren würden, dass man mit vorgehaltener Waffe am Kopf der Menschen - so ist es ja bei den Referenden - die werden erschosssen, sie werden vergewaltigt und dann sollen sie innerhalb von drei Tagen Kreuze machen während neben einem ein Soldat steht, im Zweifel mit Kalaschnikow on der Hand. Wenn man das jetzt akzeptieren und durchgehen lassen würde, dann wäre doch klar dass das in anderen Gebieten genauso der Fall sein würde, es wäre eine Einladung zu weiterem Völkerrechtsbruch. Und deswegen ist es so wichtig dass wir geschlossen dagegen stehen. Ich bin morgen auch im Sicherheitsrat da werden wir diese Thema zentral erörteren ...

=

.. but it is a hybrid war, also with a lot of propaganda, with fakle news; you can also call it lies. And now there is this additional element of stoking fear in the hope that Ukraine's support will then decrease. We have already seen this with regard to energy. There, too, the goal was to divide our society. Uncertainty. And the important thing in such moments is not to follow fear, but to keep a cool head. That you have to be aware of all the risks, but at the same time you have to be aware that these blackmail attempts will not work. Because if you imagine what he is threatening now, if these are Russian territories - which he has already done in the meantime, saying that these are attacks on us - I think it is also important to realise that the reverse is also true. If we were to accept that people are shot at gunpoint - that's what happened with the referendums - they are raped and then they are supposed to make crosses within three days while a soldier is standing next to them, in case of doubt with a Kalashnikov in his hand. If one were to accept this now and let it pass, then it would be clear that this would also be the case in other areas, it would be an invitation to further violations of international law. And that is why it is so important that we stand united against this. Tomorrow I will also be at the Security Council where we will discuss this issue centrally ...

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)
 

Ringo

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Russia is an animal who defended herselve by starting to do a war agaist the Ukraine without any reason to do so, by annexing illegaly Ukrainian territory
You seem to have declared the existence of the USA illegal... After all, Lincoln forcibly seized the southern states that chose independence. However, a hypocrite will always explain anything.
 

zaangalewa

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You seem to have declared the existence of the USA illegal..

What about to drink less Vodka, Russian?

After all, Lincoln

Czar Lincoln?

forcibly seized the southern states that chose independence.

Totally unimportant for me.

However, a hypocrite will always explain anything.

Russian - if you do not like to think about anything what a German says to you then do whatever your Putin likes you to do, slave. But in this case don't be astonished to awake in a black hole one day without to know what had happened. „Sa sdorowje“.

 

Ringo

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Russian - if you do not like to think about anything what a German says to you then do whatever your Putin likes you to do, slave.
In my opinion, you should call a russian not only a slave, but also an untermensch, isn't that the german tradition? But you first pay off debts to Poland (Greece is also already demanding), and only then open your aryan mouth to say something to Russia. But I doubt I'll hear anything reasonable from the likes of you.

The Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Poland has prepared a list of demands to Germany for damage from World War II. The document is published on the website of the Polish Foreign Ministry.

In particular, Poland demands compensation from Germany for material and non-material losses in the amount of 6 trillion 220 billion 609 million zlotys (approximately 1.3 trillion dollars), compensation to victims of German aggression to their family members, the return of stolen cultural property.

Among other things, the published list of requirements indicates the return of assets and liabilities of Polish banks and repayment of debts formed as a result of "predatory activities of credit bureaus financing criminal military actions of the Third Reich."

Warsaw also insists on the rehabilitation of the murdered activists of the pre-war Polish minority and, in general, demands that the German authorities convey to society the real picture of the war and its consequences.@
 

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Berlin will mature to the decision to supply Kiev with tanks, according to the new ambassador of Ukraine to Germany Alexey Makeev, his words are reported by RIA Novosti. According to Makeev, Ukraine will be able to convince Germany, as it happened with air defense systems (air defense) and anti-aircraft self-propelled guns (ZSU).
"I am sure that Germany will be ready for a political decision on the supply of armored vehicles and tanks, as we were able to convince Germany to change its position on multiple launch rocket systems, artillery, portable anti-aircraft missile systems, as well as air defense systems. Since in addition to IRIS-T, it is worth remembering 30 "cheetahs" that protect our sky," Makeev said.
Earlier, German Chancellor Olaf Scholz explained the country's refusal to supply tanks to Ukraine. According to him, the transfer of these combat vehicles could be a dangerous step in the development of the conflict.
---
Soon this whole little bastard bunch will leave Germany without panties and in flip-flops.
To Ukraine - tanks, to Poland - trillions, to Greece - billions, to the USA - the whole industry...
 

zaangalewa

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In my opinion, you should call a russian not only a slave, but also an untermensch, isn't that the german tradition?

No.

But you first pay off debts to Poland (Greece is also already demanding), and only then open your aryan mouth to say something to Russia. But I doubt I'll hear anything reasonable from the likes of you.

In the absurde definitions of the Nazis also all Slaws had been Aryans. Indeed Aryans are only "Indo-Iranians".

... In particular, Poland demands compensation from Germany for material and non-material losses in the amount of 6 trillion 220 billion 609 million zlotys (approximately 1.3 trillion dollars) ...

What's also totally absurde.
 

zaangalewa

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Berlin will mature to the decision to supply Kiev with tanks, according to the new ambassador of Ukraine to Germany Alexey Makeev, his words are reported by RIA Novosti. According to Makeev, Ukraine will be able to convince Germany, as it happened with air defense systems (air defense) and anti-aircraft self-propelled guns (ZSU).
"I am sure that Germany will be ready for a political decision on the supply of armored vehicles and tanks, as we were able to convince Germany to change its position on multiple launch rocket systems, artillery, portable anti-aircraft missile systems, as well as air defense systems. Since in addition to IRIS-T, it is worth remembering 30 "cheetahs" that protect our sky," Makeev said.
Earlier, German Chancellor Olaf Scholz explained the country's refusal to supply tanks to Ukraine. According to him, the transfer of these combat vehicles could be a dangerous step in the development of the conflict.
---
Soon this whole little bastard bunch will leave Germany without panties and in flip-flops.
To Ukraine - tanks, to Poland - trillions, to Greece - billions, to the USA - the whole industry...

What for heavens sake are you babbling about?
 

LA RAM FAN

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Since the first days of March EU and NATO have begun execution of their plan of global isolating Russia. Putin’s invasion to Ukraine was used as an excellent reason. This plan contained several actions which should have destroyed Russian economic and technological sectors and included strong sanctions, ban of the Russian energy import, including natural gas, oil and coal, declining Russian cooperation with the biggest world companies, cutting off their main banks form SWIFT, etc.
Moreover, European countries began to intensify arms supply to Ukraine to withstand Russian aggression. At least 21 countries sent their weapon systems and supplies to the fighting zone, including tanks, helicopters, MLRS, UAVs and so on. NATO instructors were appointed to provide combat training to Ukrainian armed forces.
One of the main goals of European leaders was to support Ukrainian refugees. To achieve this aim several actions were taken – simplifying border policies, creating all possible conditions for accommodation.
It looked like Europe while being involved in escalating conflict would unite and follow one way together. But while European leaders are busy in dealing with foreign policy questions, Europe have begun to divide inside.

Natural gas & inflation
When the war began, democratic world responded with far-reaching sanctions against Moscow. In response to that Putin declared that “unfriendly” countries would pay for Russian natural gas in rubles, and if not import would be stopped for them. Of course this demand caused great indignation of European leaders, which unanimously rejected it on the G7 meeting saying that “all G-7 ministers agreed completely that this (would be) a one-sided and clear branch of the existing contracts”. That moment can be called the beginning of the European crisis.
It’s important to point out that the EU depends on Russia for about 40% of its natural gas. So, if Europe admired to stop using it they should be able to find something that could be an equal alternative. As for now they could not deal with it.
It’s undeniable that the gas prices had been already high before the war started. But when Europe refused to pay for natural gas in Russian national currency the “inflation bomb” finally exploded.

View attachment 675513
Inflation rate in EU countries and in Estonia particularly

As it’s presented in the graphics, inflation in Europe hits its celling for the first time in 40 years. Moreover, it’s not even a limit as experts make their predictions that CPI will be higher than nowadays. It’s not a secret that high inflation has an influence on a price of at least everything – from similar goods to high technologies and energy resources.
It’s interesting to note that European leaders’ attempts to make an excuse for this serious fail looked very humiliating. Moreover, all their actions which were taken to stabilize the situation make the crisis in Europe more and more visible. For example, Romanian Deputy Prime Minister Hunor Kelemen said: “First of all, we, the European Union, will have to pay for the sanctions against Russia… Truth be told, we will all pay the price this winter while, unfortunately, there are no signs that the end of war is near… It well be a harsh winter, perhaps the harshest one in the last 40-50-60 years.”
What’s the reason of such an aggravation of the problem? Despite the fact that G7 leaders decided not to pay for natural gas in rubles, some countries took a step back and did completely the opposite. And it was the key moment when national interests collided with alliance direction.

View attachment 675514
Countries which are reported to pay for natural gas in rubles

This map shows which countries agreed (green) and refused (red) to pay for natural gas in rubles. Russia has already cut off supplies to Poland, Bulgaria and Finland. Countries which are highlighted by green are said to accept Russian demand and open ruble accounts at Gazprombank.
At the beginning of July the European Commission head Ursula von der Leyen said: “Energy prices are high. People – rightly so – expect us to do something about it.”
So what’s the announced decision? Not so long ago EU Commission revealed their emergency plan which calls for public, commercial buildings and offices to be heated to a maximum of 19 degrees from autumn.
EU does not want to pay Russia for natural gas but in fact they have got no choice. They should deal with this winter and then develop the plan what to do next.

Arms supply
Since the conflict broke out, European countries had begun to actively supply Ukraine with amount of weapons. But how was declared earlier, everything has got its limit and when it was clear that war would be long and slow, arms supply strongly reduced.
The first country which was criticized for it became Germany for its decision not to send heavy weapons to war zone.
While Ukraine strongly needs this kind of weapons not so many countries are ready to give it to them while being aware of potential escalation of conflict with Russia.
Germany is not an exception. Now their government is catching critics not only from EU/NATO partners but from opposition parties inside the country. It’s truly disappointing for German chancellor Olaf Scholz, whose approval rating sinks lower and lower every month.
One more European country which refused to send weapons to Ukraine was Bulgaria. Bulgarian Prime Minister Kiril Petkov confirmed that his government has no plans to send heavy weapons to Ukraine, saying that Bulgaria has “done enough” to help Kyiv with humanitarian relief. “We’ve done enough and we’ll continue to support Ukraine,” he said.
Moreover, Switzerland also didn’t allow the re-export of Swiss war material to Ukraine. Following their policy of military neutrality it was declared that Bern rejected Berlin’s request to send around 12400 rounds of 35-millimetre Swiss ammunition for self-propelled anti-aircraft guns, and for Piranha III wheeled APCs to Kyiv. Similarly, Switzerland denied Denmark’s request to send 22 Swiss-made Piranha III wheeled APCs to Ukraine. Switzerland also vetoed Poland’s request to send Swiss-made war material to Ukraine.

Hungary
Decision-making inside the coalition is not as simple as it looks. There are a lot of examples when representatives from different countries cannot deal with each other discussing various types of questions. But Hungary made a significant step aside if we consider cooperation with EU and NATO.
Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orban during his race for election to a fourth consecutive term said that Hungary would stay out of Ukrainian war.
“Russia looks at Russian interests, while Ukraine looks at Ukrainian interests. Neither the United States, nor Brussels would think with Hungarians’ mind and feel with Hungarians’ hearts. We must stand up for our own interests,” Orban said. “We must stay out of this war… therefore we will not send any troops or weapons to the battlegrounds.”
As a result, Hungary not only doesn’t support Ukraine by weapons but doesn’t allow the transit through its territory.
It’s the whole opposite position in comparison with EU/NATO members. For example, nobody was surprised when Serbia declared that they would not join overall sanctions against Russia and its government while being considered one of the Russian allies; however, when EU and NATO member concludes that participation in the conflict even by supplying Ukrainian army would be harmful for the country interests, it feels at least unusual.
This opinion can be a little bit controversial but at least it deserves some respect. When the interests of alliance contradict national interests and nation’s leader is brave enough not to blindly follow EU/NATO recommendations but stand on his way to improve lives of his country’s citizens – it’s kind of question for European leaders to think about.

Who orders the music?
It’s not a secret that armed conflict has got some visible reasons of its escalation and it serves for the people who are interested in it.
On the one hand, it could be quite logical to find one to blame in conflict’s escalation but the complexity of this situation mean that it should be viewed not only from one side.
If we are going to suggest that this war will end with Russia achieving all its goals – the so-called “release” of Ukraine and annexation of its territories as it was with Crimea – the last guy who laughs will be exactly Putin. But it’s not the only way possible.
It’s important to find out who makes profit from the situation that armed conflict in Ukraine hasn’t any tendency to end soon. Anybody quickly can think about the United States, who has got their own interests in this war.
US government is fighting for saving US dollar as a main world currency. The reason is that some countries including China and Russia are step-by-step refusing from mutual payments in dollar and beginning to make payments in national currency. This fact of weakening dollar of course is confusing US when they are fighting for its strengthening and, as a result, for stability of their economy.
Moreover, Russian energy ban opens doors for the increased energy import from the US. The US will send 15 billion cubic meters of natural gas to the European countries. As a result, US economy will feel safer and Europe will depend on US stronger.
In addition to that, also Russia in the last 20 years developed their economy as well as their armed forces. Putin declared that time for mono-polar world was over. It’s doubtful that US will agree with this statement so easy, and it’s indirectly confirmed by US enormous arms supply to Ukraine, including HIMARS (High Mobility Artillery Rocket System) which made a significant shift in this war.
If we talk about arms supply - war in Ukraine is a good chance for some countries including US to send Ukrainians their old weapons and equipment. While it’s off to Ukraine, US supposedly will update their weapon systems.
It will be wrong to admit that only US is making significant contribution to the Ukrainian conflict continuation. But it’s a matter of fact that US are trying to strengthen their position as a world leader by way of supporting the prolongation of this war.

Conclusion
It’s not a secret that the large part of the above-mentioned problems – natural gas prices, inflation, pro-Russian governments – had existed long before the Ukrainian war escalated. Unfortunately, at this moment actions of the European countries’ governments and Russian counteractions have leaded only to negative consequences concerning EU citizens’ wellbeing. It’s the stalemate situation – on the one hand if EU/NATO countries follow US requests and approve economic sanctions against Russia it causes financial losses not only for Putin’s government but for themselves (for example, not so long ago dollar for the first time in 20 years exchanged for euro equally) and without any doubt makes their citizens angry. As a result British Prime Minister Boris Johnson and the Prime Minister of Italy Mario Draghi have decided to leave their posts because of their lack of ability to handle the situation.
On the other hand if European leaders refuse to take measures against Russia which is based on their desire not to leave their citizens without cheap gas and fuel, - they are going through tough critics form their colleagues form EU and NATO.
We can suppose how the situation in Europe will develop in the upcoming months. First variant – Europe follows its way of absolute support of Ukraine, refusing the cooperation with Russia, what makes a great advantage for US but not for Europeans.
Second way is to stop confrontation with Russia and search for peaceful decisions of existing problems with Putin as well as between European leaders. Why is this variant look quite acceptable? Everything depends on the war ending and timing; analysts are making the different predictions, European leaders strongly hope that everything would be solved before the winter begins, but nobody truly believes it. Moreover, they don’t approach the end of the war while giving Ukraine enormous amount of weapons. What we have for now – Europe is frozen in waiting for the winter and its consequences, searching for US and Middle East natural gas and it is not clear now how long they could live using only their resources. Anyways, the majority of European governments would have decided to buy natural gas in Russia despite the fact that it would strengthen Russia’s economy.
In a short-term perspective a lot of these problems could be solved by way of compromise and restarting the dialogue with Russian government. Can Europe follow this way? Without a doubt. Will they have a chance to do it? Probably not, because Europe depends on US as well as it depends on Russia. How can they find a decision which would be acceptable for anyone? It’s kind of question which can’t be answered for 5 months. It’s clear that Europe will soon collide with very cold winter. How is it justified and what will be Europeans attitude for these events, – upcoming half of the year will show us that. We can only wait what decision will be made by the leaders of “free” and “independent” Europe.
:thankusmile: The fact two of USMBs resident trolls hate your post proves you nailed it.lol
 

Ringo

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"The U.S. government’s plan to conquer Russia is based upon a belief in, and the fundamental plan to establish, “Nuclear Primacy” against Russia — an American ability to win a nuclear war against, and so conquer, Russia."
 

Baron

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Second way is to stop confrontation with Russia and search for peaceful decisions of existing problems with Putin as well as between European leaders.

A good approach but in the area of dreams.
Putin talks with the US only because the country is the ONLY decision-maker.
Moreover the confrontation will be not stop because Russia and the West go different ways since 2014.
 

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The trajectory of this war is going to end up in favor of Ukraine..

The only true winner is China, Russia and its natural resources are on the best way to became a part of it
 

Baron

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US ruled by crazy criminals
"The U.S. government’s plan to conquer Russia is based upon a belief in, and the fundamental plan to establish, “Nuclear Primacy” against Russia — an American ability to win a nuclear war against, and so conquer, Russia."

Don't forget idiots siting in Kremlin
Twenty years were enough time to stop corruption and rebuild the country
 

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This is how monuments to Soviet soldiers, who died during the liberation of Poland are demolished.
For a better understanding: 600 thousand Soviet soldiers and officers lost their lives so that poles would not go to the soap factory.
Such videos can't cause anything but outrageous hatred for these scum
 

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