Roethlisberger is an Asshole

[Toro]

I don't know if he raped that girl or not, but if I owned the Steelers, he would be gone.

Witness statements make bad situation worse for Roethlisberger | ProFootballTalk.com

 

[Xenophon]

I saw Bradshaw rip him, and Bradshaw likes EVRYBODY.

 

[Paulie]

I don't know much about this story, but I have a real hard time believing that celebrities who can have just about any woman they want, would stoop to raping one.

 

[CrimsonWhite]

I don't know much about this story, but I have a real hard time believing that celebrities who can have just about any woman they want, would stoop to raping one.

Rape isn't about sex. It is about power. So yeah, even though any just about any woman would sleep with him, it is not out of the realm of possibilities. I'm not saying that it happened, just that it is possible.

 

[Paulie]

I don't know much about this story, but I have a real hard time believing that celebrities who can have just about any woman they want, would stoop to raping one.

Rape isn't about sex. It is about power. So yeah, even though any just about any woman would sleep with him, it is not out of the realm of possibilities. I'm not saying that it happened, just that it is possible.

I can kind of see that point, but it's so much more powerful to have the women crawling at your feet begging YOU for the dick, rather than grabbing a random drunk chick in a bar and having your bodyguards cover you while you bang it out real quick. That just seems so much less powerful to me. And rape can be, and is, just about sex sometimes.

And then there's the issue of motive. Who has more motivation here...Ben catching a cheap thrill at the risk of his entire career, livelihood, and freedom...or a random female nobody who knows it'll be payday because she's seen it happen many times already, a-la Kobe, for one?

I'm sure some female poster on here will be along eventually to lambaste me for that, but I don't care. I defer to logic in cases like this, especially when the evidence is merely her word against his.

 

[geauxtohell]

I don't know if he raped that girl or not, but if I owned the Steelers, he would be gone.

Witness statements make bad situation worse for Roethlisberger | ProFootballTalk.com

I was under the impression that an intoxicated person couldn't legally consent to sex anyways?

Why is this not a criminal case? Another bullshit example of american legal duplicity where the celebrity/royalty class plays by their own rules.

 

[goldcatt]

I don't know much about this story, but I have a real hard time believing that celebrities who can have just about any woman they want, would stoop to raping one.

Rape isn't about sex. It is about power. So yeah, even though any just about any woman would sleep with him, it is not out of the realm of possibilities. I'm not saying that it happened, just that it is possible.

I can kind of see that point, but it's so much more powerful to have the women crawling at your feet begging YOU for the dick, rather than grabbing a random drunk chick in a bar and having your bodyguards cover you while you bang it out real quick. That just seems so much less powerful to me. And rape can be, and is, just about sex sometimes.

And then there's the issue of motive. Who has more motivation here...Ben catching a cheap thrill at the risk of his entire career, livelihood, and freedom...or a random female nobody who knows it'll be payday because she's seen it happen many times already, a-la Kobe, for one?

I'm sure some female poster on here will be along eventually to lambaste me for that, but I don't care. I defer to logic in cases like this, especially when the evidence is merely her word against his.

Actually you have a point here. It's sad but human nature, when it's he said/she said and both sides have motivation to lie who do you believe? To be honest I doubt either side is telling the whole truth, but without knowing more or knowing the people involved it's hard to tell exactly how they're lying.

 

[Paulie]

Rape isn't about sex. It is about power. So yeah, even though any just about any woman would sleep with him, it is not out of the realm of possibilities. I'm not saying that it happened, just that it is possible.

I can kind of see that point, but it's so much more powerful to have the women crawling at your feet begging YOU for the dick, rather than grabbing a random drunk chick in a bar and having your bodyguards cover you while you bang it out real quick. That just seems so much less powerful to me. And rape can be, and is, just about sex sometimes.

And then there's the issue of motive. Who has more motivation here...Ben catching a cheap thrill at the risk of his entire career, livelihood, and freedom...or a random female nobody who knows it'll be payday because she's seen it happen many times already, a-la Kobe, for one?

I'm sure some female poster on here will be along eventually to lambaste me for that, but I don't care. I defer to logic in cases like this, especially when the evidence is merely her word against his.

Actually you have a point here. It's sad but human nature, when it's he said/she said and both sides have motivation to lie who do you believe? To be honest I doubt either side is telling the whole truth, but without knowing more or knowing the people involved it's hard to tell exactly how they're lying.

The innocent side has no motivation to lie though, because the truth should be what sets them free.

It has to come down to motive, and I just see a bigger motive on the side of the woman here. She has more to gain by lying about this than Ben would have by raping her.

I probably wouldn't be so apt to take that position if not for the plethora of cases over the years where a celebrity was accused of a crime and ended up paying the plaintiff large sums of money, guilty verdict or not.

 

[Toro]

I don't know much about this story, but I have a real hard time believing that celebrities who can have just about any woman they want, would stoop to raping one.

Rape isn't about sex. It is about power. So yeah, even though any just about any woman would sleep with him, it is not out of the realm of possibilities. I'm not saying that it happened, just that it is possible.

I can kind of see that point, but it's so much more powerful to have the women crawling at your feet begging YOU for the dick, rather than grabbing a random drunk chick in a bar and having your bodyguards cover you while you bang it out real quick. That just seems so much less powerful to me. And rape can be, and is, just about sex sometimes.

And then there's the issue of motive. Who has more motivation here...Ben catching a cheap thrill at the risk of his entire career, livelihood, and freedom...or a random female nobody who knows it'll be payday because she's seen it happen many times already, a-la Kobe, for one?

I'm sure some female poster on here will be along eventually to lambaste me for that, but I don't care. I defer to logic in cases like this, especially when the evidence is merely her word against his.

What is his motivation? That he wanted to have sex, and he gets what he wants.

Celebrities and professional athletes have a sense of entitlement, that no one can say no to them and they can get anything they want. So when someone does say no, they feel entitled to it anyways and just take it. In some ways, they are kind of like the mob, only without the guns and brutality.

This isn't the first time Roethlisberger has been accused of this, and that includes other incidences besides the woman in Colorado. Almost always, when you hear about some guy doing this over and over, there is a big element of truth to it.

 

[random3434]

As it turns out, the alleged victim gave two handwritten statements. The statement given after the passage of time is neat and legible. The earlier one is hard to read, since it was written while the alleged victim was still intoxicated. Here's part of what it said:

"His bodyguards took him back to the rooms w/bathroom and I said, 'I don't know if this is a good idea' and he said 'it's OK.' He has sex w/me and meanwhile his bodyguards told me friends they couldn't pass them to get to me. My friends found me & talked to a Milledgeville policeman and he said to report it."

During his Monday press conference, district attorney Fred Bright mentioned the sketchy initial statement followed by the more detailed second statement. He also pointed out that, at the hospital, the alleged victim said, "A boy kind of raped me." Moreover, the officer who received the initial complaint wrote that the alleged victim's recollection was "foggy from to [sic] her intoxication level."

The inconsistencies in her statements and her intoxication create fertile ground for "reasonable doubt." Though this gives rise to an unfortunate reality that women who are intoxicated will have difficulty obtaining justice if raped, the fact remains that our legal system employs a high standard of proof in order to ensure that innocent men are not wrongfully imprisoned (notwithstanding all of the supposedly innocent men who already are in prison).

Meanwhile, we detected a strong degree of consistency and credibility regarding the statements from the alleged victim's friends, who nevertheless could contribute only circumstantial evidence to the investigation, since no one saw the exchange between Roethlisberger and the alleged victim. For example, Ann Marie Lubatti said that she saw Roethlisberger's bodyguards guide the alleged victim to a side door, and that two minutes later she saw Roethlisberger walk back there. "I immediately went up to the other bodyguard and said, 'this isn't right,'" Lubatti said in her statement. "'My friend is back there with Ben. She needs to come back right now.' The bodyguard wouldn't look at me, he just said, 'I don't know what you are talking about.'"

From this, and trying to be objective, it sure sounds like the he didn't keep his dick in his pants after all, and she wasn't 'asking' for it either.

 

[Paulie]

Rape isn't about sex. It is about power. So yeah, even though any just about any woman would sleep with him, it is not out of the realm of possibilities. I'm not saying that it happened, just that it is possible.

I can kind of see that point, but it's so much more powerful to have the women crawling at your feet begging YOU for the dick, rather than grabbing a random drunk chick in a bar and having your bodyguards cover you while you bang it out real quick. That just seems so much less powerful to me. And rape can be, and is, just about sex sometimes.

And then there's the issue of motive. Who has more motivation here...Ben catching a cheap thrill at the risk of his entire career, livelihood, and freedom...or a random female nobody who knows it'll be payday because she's seen it happen many times already, a-la Kobe, for one?

I'm sure some female poster on here will be along eventually to lambaste me for that, but I don't care. I defer to logic in cases like this, especially when the evidence is merely her word against his.

What is his motivation? That he wanted to have sex, and he gets what he wants.

Celebrities and professional athletes have a sense of entitlement, that no one can say no to them and they can get anything they want. So when someone does say no, they feel entitled to it anyways and just take it. In some ways, they are kind of like the mob, only without the guns and brutality.

This isn't the first time Roethlisberger has been accused of this, and that includes other incidences besides the woman in Colorado. Almost always, when you hear about some guy doing this over and over, there is a big element of truth to it.

And this may very well be the case.

But, the fact that he is already stigmatized by a history of alleged sexual assault accusations lends itself to someone who might want to take advantage of it and pin yet another one on him hoping to get a payoff out of it.

Clearly there is motivation on both sides of this story.

And I'll preempt those who think a drunk chick couldn't contrive something like that by saying that when you're fucked up you'll come up with almost ANYTHING.

 

[goldcatt]

I can kind of see that point, but it's so much more powerful to have the women crawling at your feet begging YOU for the dick, rather than grabbing a random drunk chick in a bar and having your bodyguards cover you while you bang it out real quick. That just seems so much less powerful to me. And rape can be, and is, just about sex sometimes.

And then there's the issue of motive. Who has more motivation here...Ben catching a cheap thrill at the risk of his entire career, livelihood, and freedom...or a random female nobody who knows it'll be payday because she's seen it happen many times already, a-la Kobe, for one?

I'm sure some female poster on here will be along eventually to lambaste me for that, but I don't care. I defer to logic in cases like this, especially when the evidence is merely her word against his.

Actually you have a point here. It's sad but human nature, when it's he said/she said and both sides have motivation to lie who do you believe? To be honest I doubt either side is telling the whole truth, but without knowing more or knowing the people involved it's hard to tell exactly how they're lying.

The innocent side has no motivation to lie though, because the truth should be what sets them free.

It has to come down to motive, and I just see a bigger motive on the side of the woman here. She has more to gain by lying about this than Ben would have by raping her.

I probably wouldn't be so apt to take that position if not for the plethora of cases over the years where a celebrity was accused of a crime and ended up paying the plaintiff large sums of money, guilty verdict or not.

On one hand, Ben was at minimum stupid. If he didn't do it, he set himself up for the claims with some of his more well-documented actions. It also doesn't help his all American image to be seen as an arrogant horn dog. Gotta sell those jerseys for the kiddos, you know. So of course he wants to cover that up.

On the other hand, there are too many proven instances of women making false rape claims for money and/or revenge not to question. Women who do that should be prosecuted for more than filing a false report if you ask me, they do too much damage to real victims.

I don't understand a rapist's motivations, so I can't judge on that. Of course it's about power, but why that particular expression of it? I hope I'm never sick enough to get it. But both sides have an interest in making certain public claims. I simply reserve judgment until (and unless) we see what happens in court and what actual evidence there is.

 

[Paulie]

As it turns out, the alleged victim gave two handwritten statements. The statement given after the passage of time is neat and legible. The earlier one is hard to read, since it was written while the alleged victim was still intoxicated. Here's part of what it said:

"His bodyguards took him back to the rooms w/bathroom and I said, 'I don't know if this is a good idea' and he said 'it's OK.' He has sex w/me and meanwhile his bodyguards told me friends they couldn't pass them to get to me. My friends found me & talked to a Milledgeville policeman and he said to report it."

During his Monday press conference, district attorney Fred Bright mentioned the sketchy initial statement followed by the more detailed second statement. He also pointed out that, at the hospital, the alleged victim said, "A boy kind of raped me." Moreover, the officer who received the initial complaint wrote that the alleged victim's recollection was "foggy from to [sic] her intoxication level."

The inconsistencies in her statements and her intoxication create fertile ground for "reasonable doubt." Though this gives rise to an unfortunate reality that women who are intoxicated will have difficulty obtaining justice if raped, the fact remains that our legal system employs a high standard of proof in order to ensure that innocent men are not wrongfully imprisoned (notwithstanding all of the supposedly innocent men who already are in prison).

Meanwhile, we detected a strong degree of consistency and credibility regarding the statements from the alleged victim's friends, who nevertheless could contribute only circumstantial evidence to the investigation, since no one saw the exchange between Roethlisberger and the alleged victim. For example, Ann Marie Lubatti said that she saw Roethlisberger's bodyguards guide the alleged victim to a side door, and that two minutes later she saw Roethlisberger walk back there. "I immediately went up to the other bodyguard and said, 'this isn't right,'" Lubatti said in her statement. "'My friend is back there with Ben. She needs to come back right now.' The bodyguard wouldn't look at me, he just said, 'I don't know what you are talking about.'"

From this, and trying to be objective, it sure sounds like the he didn't keep his dick in his pants after all, and she wasn't 'asking' for it either.

What if he really did approach her in that kind of way, but ultimately a rape didn't actually occur?

Maybe his drunk ass, dick exposing, retarded moron self just put him in a perfect position to be taken advantage of legally?

Once the accusation is made, the court of public opinion is what ultimately decides the case. Whether he's guilty or not, he'll probably end up paying this girl some kind of money in a civil suit.

 

[Toro]

As it turns out, the alleged victim gave two handwritten statements. The statement given after the passage of time is neat and legible. The earlier one is hard to read, since it was written while the alleged victim was still intoxicated. Here's part of what it said:

"His bodyguards took him back to the rooms w/bathroom and I said, 'I don't know if this is a good idea' and he said 'it's OK.' He has sex w/me and meanwhile his bodyguards told me friends they couldn't pass them to get to me. My friends found me & talked to a Milledgeville policeman and he said to report it."

During his Monday press conference, district attorney Fred Bright mentioned the sketchy initial statement followed by the more detailed second statement. He also pointed out that, at the hospital, the alleged victim said, "A boy kind of raped me." Moreover, the officer who received the initial complaint wrote that the alleged victim's recollection was "foggy from to [sic] her intoxication level."

The inconsistencies in her statements and her intoxication create fertile ground for "reasonable doubt." Though this gives rise to an unfortunate reality that women who are intoxicated will have difficulty obtaining justice if raped, the fact remains that our legal system employs a high standard of proof in order to ensure that innocent men are not wrongfully imprisoned (notwithstanding all of the supposedly innocent men who already are in prison).

Meanwhile, we detected a strong degree of consistency and credibility regarding the statements from the alleged victim's friends, who nevertheless could contribute only circumstantial evidence to the investigation, since no one saw the exchange between Roethlisberger and the alleged victim. For example, Ann Marie Lubatti said that she saw Roethlisberger's bodyguards guide the alleged victim to a side door, and that two minutes later she saw Roethlisberger walk back there. "I immediately went up to the other bodyguard and said, 'this isn't right,'" Lubatti said in her statement. "'My friend is back there with Ben. She needs to come back right now.' The bodyguard wouldn't look at me, he just said, 'I don't know what you are talking about.'"

From this, and trying to be objective, it sure sounds like the he didn't keep his dick in his pants after all, and she wasn't 'asking' for it either.

I don't know if he raped the girl or not. What I do know is that she was underaged, they were drunk, he took her to the back of a public bar, exposed himself, posted a bodyguard who would not allow anyone to pass including her friend, then had sex with her while she at least initially protested. At the very least, the guys is a ******* moron, and not someone I whom I would want to be the face of one of the most popular and storied franchises in America's biggest sporting league.

 

[Paulie]

As it turns out, the alleged victim gave two handwritten statements. The statement given after the passage of time is neat and legible. The earlier one is hard to read, since it was written while the alleged victim was still intoxicated. Here's part of what it said:

"His bodyguards took him back to the rooms w/bathroom and I said, 'I don't know if this is a good idea' and he said 'it's OK.' He has sex w/me and meanwhile his bodyguards told me friends they couldn't pass them to get to me. My friends found me & talked to a Milledgeville policeman and he said to report it."

During his Monday press conference, district attorney Fred Bright mentioned the sketchy initial statement followed by the more detailed second statement. He also pointed out that, at the hospital, the alleged victim said, "A boy kind of raped me." Moreover, the officer who received the initial complaint wrote that the alleged victim's recollection was "foggy from to [sic] her intoxication level."

The inconsistencies in her statements and her intoxication create fertile ground for "reasonable doubt." Though this gives rise to an unfortunate reality that women who are intoxicated will have difficulty obtaining justice if raped, the fact remains that our legal system employs a high standard of proof in order to ensure that innocent men are not wrongfully imprisoned (notwithstanding all of the supposedly innocent men who already are in prison).

Meanwhile, we detected a strong degree of consistency and credibility regarding the statements from the alleged victim's friends, who nevertheless could contribute only circumstantial evidence to the investigation, since no one saw the exchange between Roethlisberger and the alleged victim. For example, Ann Marie Lubatti said that she saw Roethlisberger's bodyguards guide the alleged victim to a side door, and that two minutes later she saw Roethlisberger walk back there. "I immediately went up to the other bodyguard and said, 'this isn't right,'" Lubatti said in her statement. "'My friend is back there with Ben. She needs to come back right now.' The bodyguard wouldn't look at me, he just said, 'I don't know what you are talking about.'"

From this, and trying to be objective, it sure sounds like the he didn't keep his dick in his pants after all, and she wasn't 'asking' for it either.

I don't know if he raped the girl or not. What I do know is that she was underaged, they were drunk, he took her to the back of a public bar, exposed himself, posted a bodyguard who would not allow anyone to pass including her friend, then had sex with her while she at least initially protested. At the very least, the guys is a ******* moron, and not someone I whom I would want to be the face of one of the most popular and storied franchises in America's biggest sporting league.

Like I said earlier, I don't know a whole lot about this story.

Is there evidence that sexual contact occured, other than the girl saying so?

 

[Toro]

I can kind of see that point, but it's so much more powerful to have the women crawling at your feet begging YOU for the dick, rather than grabbing a random drunk chick in a bar and having your bodyguards cover you while you bang it out real quick. That just seems so much less powerful to me. And rape can be, and is, just about sex sometimes.

And then there's the issue of motive. Who has more motivation here...Ben catching a cheap thrill at the risk of his entire career, livelihood, and freedom...or a random female nobody who knows it'll be payday because she's seen it happen many times already, a-la Kobe, for one?

I'm sure some female poster on here will be along eventually to lambaste me for that, but I don't care. I defer to logic in cases like this, especially when the evidence is merely her word against his.

What is his motivation? That he wanted to have sex, and he gets what he wants.

Celebrities and professional athletes have a sense of entitlement, that no one can say no to them and they can get anything they want. So when someone does say no, they feel entitled to it anyways and just take it. In some ways, they are kind of like the mob, only without the guns and brutality.

This isn't the first time Roethlisberger has been accused of this, and that includes other incidences besides the woman in Colorado. Almost always, when you hear about some guy doing this over and over, there is a big element of truth to it.

And this may very well be the case.

But, the fact that he is already stigmatized by a history of alleged sexual assault accusations lends itself to someone who might want to take advantage of it and pin yet another one on him hoping to get a payoff out of it.

Clearly there is motivation on both sides of this story.

And I'll preempt those who think a drunk chick couldn't contrive something like that by saying that when you're fucked up you'll come up with almost ANYTHING.

That, or the guy is a serial rapist.

I get that some women are lying pieces of shit. I've seen it happen. But I also know that some guys are pieces of shit too. I've also seen sports stars take advantage of their status and get away with things most of the rest of us could not.

 

[goldcatt]

What is his motivation? That he wanted to have sex, and he gets what he wants.

Celebrities and professional athletes have a sense of entitlement, that no one can say no to them and they can get anything they want. So when someone does say no, they feel entitled to it anyways and just take it. In some ways, they are kind of like the mob, only without the guns and brutality.

This isn't the first time Roethlisberger has been accused of this, and that includes other incidences besides the woman in Colorado. Almost always, when you hear about some guy doing this over and over, there is a big element of truth to it.

And this may very well be the case.

But, the fact that he is already stigmatized by a history of alleged sexual assault accusations lends itself to someone who might want to take advantage of it and pin yet another one on him hoping to get a payoff out of it.

Clearly there is motivation on both sides of this story.

And I'll preempt those who think a drunk chick couldn't contrive something like that by saying that when you're fucked up you'll come up with almost ANYTHING.

That, or the guy is a serial rapist.

I get that some women are lying pieces of shit. I've seen it happen. But I also know that some guys are pieces of shit too. I've also seen sports stars take advantage of their status and get away with things most of the rest of us could not.

Yep, on all points. And they both have a financial interest in their "side" getting out there in the court of public opinion. Which is why this thing could go either way. Sad, but true.

I agree even if he didn't rape her Ben's an asshole, though. Can't blame him for chasing the women, but he's really been classless about it - and that's an understatement for the record books.

 

[geauxtohell]

Am I missing something here? The woman's statement was that she said "no" multiple times but that they still had sex.

How is that not rape?

It doesn't have to be forcible rape to be rape, especially when the victim is intoxicated and states that they don't want to participate.

 

[Paulie]

Am I missing something here? The woman's statement was that she said "no" multiple times but that they still had sex.

How is that not rape?

It doesn't have to be forcible rape to be rape, especially when the victim is intoxicated and states that they don't want to participate.

The woman's statement is good enough for you to convict the guy?

 

[goldcatt]

I don't know that anybody is saying her claims, if true, aren't rape. I'm certainly not.

It's simply whether she's telling the truth, looking for a payday, or something in between.

Anybody can say anything to the media, and they do. The fact that this is a civil suit rather than a criminal case raises a question for me. As does the fact that she is actively seeking out the media through her agents. It could very well be she is telling the truth and feels the need to defend herself against the celebrity PR machine. Or not. I don't know, but there have been enough of these claims against various celebs turn out to be false to take everything said to and in the media at face value. It's just too hard to judge.