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Republicans Against Science

Flopper

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Jon Huntsman Jr., a former Utah governor and ambassador to China, isn’t a serious contender for the Republican presidential nomination. And that’s too bad, because Mr. Hunstman has been willing to say the unsayable about the G.O.P. — namely, that it is becoming the “anti-science party.” This is an enormously important development. And it should terrify us.

Mr. Perry, the governor of Texas, recently made headlines by dismissing evolution as “just a theory,” one that has “got some gaps in it” — an observation that will come as news to the vast majority of biologists. But what really got peoples’ attention was what he said about climate change: “I think there are a substantial number of scientists who have manipulated data so that they will have dollars rolling into their projects. And I think we are seeing almost weekly, or even daily, scientists are coming forward and questioning the original idea that man-made global warming is what is causing the climate to change.”

That’s a remarkable statement — or maybe the right adjective is “vile.”



http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/29/opinion/republicans-against-science.html
 
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ClosedCaption

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Mr. Perry, the governor of Texas, recently made headlines by dismissing evolution as “just a theory,” one that has “got some gaps in it” — an observation that will come as news to the vast majority of biologists.

You can tell when someone knows jack shit about the topic they are discussing
 

Mad Scientist

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Mr. Perry, the governor of Texas, recently made headlines by dismissing evolution as “just a theory,” one that has “got some gaps in it” — an observation that will come as news to the vast majority of biologists.
You can tell when someone knows jack shit about the topic they are discussing
Until we see the actual first organism that started evolution then it is a theory.

You won't believe in God unless you see him, likewise I won't believe in evolution unless I see "Organism #1".
 

uscitizen

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Mr. Perry, the governor of Texas, recently made headlines by dismissing evolution as “just a theory,” one that has “got some gaps in it” — an observation that will come as news to the vast majority of biologists.
You can tell when someone knows jack shit about the topic they are discussing
Until we see the actual first organism that started evolution then it is a theory.

You won't believe in God unless you see him, likewise I won't believe in evolution unless I see "Organism #1".

Just like a supreme being and after life are theories.
 

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I'd say a theory that can't explain how life formed where there was no life has a pretty big frickin' hole in it.
 
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Jon Huntsman Jr., a former Utah governor and ambassador to China, isn’t a serious contender for the Republican presidential nomination. And that’s too bad, because Mr. Hunstman has been willing to say the unsayable about the G.O.P. — namely, that it is becoming the “anti-science party.” This is an enormously important development. And it should terrify us.

Mr. Perry, the governor of Texas, recently made headlines by dismissing evolution as “just a theory,” one that has “got some gaps in it” — an observation that will come as news to the vast majority of biologists. But what really got peoples’ attention was what he said about climate change: “I think there are a substantial number of scientists who have manipulated data so that they will have dollars rolling into their projects. And I think we are seeing almost weekly, or even daily, scientists are coming forward and questioning the original idea that man-made global warming is what is causing the climate to change.”

That’s a remarkable statement — or maybe the right adjective is “vile.”

The second part of Mr. Perry’s statement is, as it happens, just false: the scientific consensus about man-made global warming — which includes 97 percent to 98 percent of researchers in the field, according to the National Academy of Sciences — is getting stronger, not weaker, as the evidence for climate change just keeps mounting.
In fact, if you follow climate science at all you know that the main development over the past few years has been growing concern that projections of future climate are underestimating the likely amount of warming. Warnings that we may face civilization-threatening temperature change by the end of the century, once considered outlandish, are now coming out of mainstream research groups.

But never mind that, Mr. Perry suggests; those scientists are just in it for the money, “manipulating data” to create a fake threat. In his book “Fed Up,” he dismissed climate science as a “contrived phony mess that is falling apart.”
I could point out that Mr. Perry is buying into a truly crazy conspiracy theory, which asserts that thousands of scientists all around the world are on the take, with not one willing to break the code of silence. I could also point out that multiple investigations into charges of intellectual malpractice on the part of climate scientists have ended up exonerating the accused researchers of all accusations. But never mind: Mr. Perry and those who think like him know what they want to believe, and their response to anyone who contradicts them is to start a witch hunt.

So how has Mr. Romney, the other leading contender for the G.O.P. nomination, responded to Mr. Perry’s challenge? In trademark fashion: By running away. In the past, Mr. Romney, a former governor of Massachusetts, has strongly endorsed the notion that man-made climate change is a real concern. But, last week, he softened that to a statement that he thinks the world is getting hotter, but “I don’t know that” and “I don’t know if it’s mostly caused by humans.” Moral courage!

Now, we don’t know who will win next year’s presidential election. But the odds are that one of these years the world’s greatest nation will find itself ruled by a party that is aggressively anti-science, indeed anti-knowledge. And, in a time of severe challenges — environmental, economic, and more — that’s a terrifying prospect.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/29/opinion/republicans-against-science.html


Here's some more science for Mr. Huntsman--who I believe supported cap n tax.

The Arctic ocean is warming up, icebergs are growing scarcer and in some
places the seals are finding the water too hot, according to a report to the
Commerce Department yesterday from Consulafft, at Bergen, Norway. Reports
from fishermen, seal hunters, and explorers all point to a radical change in
climate conditions and hitherto unheard-of temperatures in the Arctic zone.
Exploration expeditions report that scarcely any ice has been met as far
north as 81 degrees 29 minutes. Soundings to a depth of 3,100 meters
showed the gulf stream still very warm. Great masses of ice have been
replaced by moraines of earth and stones, the report continued, while at
many points well known glaciers have entirely disappeared.

Very few seals and no white fish are found in the eastern Arctic, while
vast shoals of herring and smelts which have never before ventured so far
north, are being encountered in the old seal fishing grounds. Within a few
years it is predicted that due to the ice melt the sea will rise and make
most coastal cities uninhabitable.

I apologize, I neglected to mention that this report was from
November 2, 1922, as reported by the AP and published in
The Washington Post 88+ years ago_
 

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ClosedCaption

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Mr. Perry, the governor of Texas, recently made headlines by dismissing evolution as “just a theory,” one that has “got some gaps in it” — an observation that will come as news to the vast majority of biologists.
You can tell when someone knows jack shit about the topic they are discussing
Until we see the actual first organism that started evolution then it is a theory.

You won't believe in God unless you see him, likewise I won't believe in evolution unless I see "Organism #1".

You ever seen a dinosaur?
 

flacaltenn

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I don't have a problem with the "spark of life" concept creating basic protein building blocks. But the tracing of descendency is NOT "settled science" as previous posters have noted. Go to the Science forum

http://www.usmessageboard.com/4056732-post78.html

and look at the "tree of life" link that I was given to PROVE we know how we ascended from slime mold. We can't even trace the lineage. Which would be a neccessary scientific pre-requistite for proving that Darwinian theory and ONLY Darwinian was the prime mover behind all that Genetic engineering.. Why not cosmic rays? Or foreign DNA from meteorites?

Science my ass.. It's lack of humility and too much hubrous on the part of secular humanists who THINK that they understand the details of Greenhouse theory or the ascent from slime..
 
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Oddball

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Mr. Perry, the governor of Texas, recently made headlines by dismissing evolution as “just a theory,” one that has “got some gaps in it” — an observation that will come as news to the vast majority of biologists.

You can tell when someone knows jack shit about the topic they are discussing
Sentience-out-of-protoplasm evolution is, by its very definition, still just a theory...That is a semantic fact.

Now, I believe that you were saying something about someone who doesn't know jack shit about the topic they are discussing?
 
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Article 15

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Big Black Dog

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I'm a Republican and I never was fond of science. I hated it in high school and took only the required science classes in college.
 
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Flopper

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I find it most disturbing when a candidate rejects scientific conclusions based on numerous studies by scientists worldwide that have been subject to peer review and is endorse by ever major scientific society and national academy of science in the world. Is the candidate just plain stupid? I think not. The candidate is either pandering to political and economic interests or putting personal and religious beliefs ahead of scientific evidence. In either case, it's pretty damn scary.

We saw this with Bush and the stem cell issue. If the scientists present evidence of a newly evolving virus that threatens the future of the human race, will Perry reject the evidence because evolution is just a theory with gaps? If the nation's top scientist warn him of monster hurricanes in the immediate future because warming oceans, will he reject their warning as a scientific conspiracy? When a political leader listens to his political and religious supporters in lieu scientists, he's putting the nation at risk.
 
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Flopper

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Mr. Perry, the governor of Texas, recently made headlines by dismissing evolution as “just a theory,” one that has “got some gaps in it” — an observation that will come as news to the vast majority of biologists.
You can tell when someone knows jack shit about the topic they are discussing
Until we see the actual first organism that started evolution then it is a theory.

You won't believe in God unless you see him, likewise I won't believe in evolution unless I see "Organism #1".
Have you ever hear of a virus?
 

flacaltenn

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I find it most disturbing when a candidate rejects scientific conclusions based on numerous studies by scientists worldwide that have been subject to peer review and is endorse by ever major scientific society and national academy of science in the world. Is the candidate just plain stupid? I think not. The candidate is either pandering to political and economic interests or putting personal and religious beliefs ahead of scientific evidence. In either case, it's pretty damn scary.

We saw this with Bush and the stem cell issue. If the scientists present evidence of a newly evolving virus that threatens the future of the human race, will Perry reject the evidence because evolution is just a theory with gaps? If the nation's top scientist warn him of monster hurricanes in the immediate future because warming oceans, will he reject their warning as a scientific conspiracy? When a political leader listens to his political and religious supporters in lieu scientists, he's putting the nation at risk.

1) Bush never put stem cell research at risk. In fact, embryonic lines were allowed, but MOST ALL recent advances have been with ADULT stem cell material NOT ESCells.. THere's a good thread on this on USMB some where.

2) Do you contend that Darwins' theory of evolution explains every transistion from slime mold thru Homo Sapien? If so you are declaring a knowledge not only of the EXACT lineage of the tree of life -- but also a detailed knowledge of the environmental and competitive aspects of "natural selection" that occurred at each mutation.. Can you seriously declare that there are not "gaps" (arguably SEVERE gaps) in all that theory?

ON the Science forum thread I linked, a poster aptly noted that EVOLUTION is a TOOL not a complete explanation for the origin and ascendency of ALL life.. If you INSIST on politicizing all this -- knock your humble self out...
 

flacaltenn

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You can tell when someone knows jack shit about the topic they are discussing
Until we see the actual first organism that started evolution then it is a theory.

You won't believe in God unless you see him, likewise I won't believe in evolution unless I see "Organism #1".
Have you ever hear of a virus?

Yes.. And according to scientific theory and the "tree of life" as science draws it -- Viruses are NOT primordial relatives for the human clan. THey are one of the earliest branches AWAY from the lines of ascendency to apes and man.

Life on Earth
 
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Flopper

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I'd say a theory that can't explain how life formed where there was no life has a pretty big frickin' hole in it.
Evolution does not address the origin of life, only the evolution of life . Abiogenesis does.
Abiogenesis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

If we are to reject scientific theory because it does not answer all questions on the subject, then in addition to Global Warming, and Evolution we would have to add Einstein's Theory of Relativity, Theory of Quantum Mechanics, Plate Techtonics, and many others. Everyday we add new knowledge. Someday we may have a theory of the origin of life that is widely accepted in the scientific community.
 
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rdean

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Republicans say they are FOR science and then everything they say afterwards proves they're not.

Do they really think they can have it both ways?
 

Article 15

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Carl Everett is a man of conviction. As an Apostolic Christian, he believes that the Bible, interpreted literally, is the infallible authority on all matters. As the cocksure centerfielder for the Boston Red Sox he believes in taking on pitchers and questions alike with the same absolute assuredness. The man plays and talks with all the subtlety of a sledgehammer. Just ask.

Interleague play? "Don't like it," Everett responds. "They only have it because of two teams [the New York Mets and the New York Yankees]. It's all about the money." Yankees shortstop Derek Jeter? "Not a star." The Mets, one of his former teams? "All those [management] people are hypocrites and idiots." The Atlanta Braves' starting pitchers? "You can run on them all day." Big cities? "Hate 'em. I need space." American League baseball? "Boring." Dinosaurs? "Didn't exist."

Uh, come again?

"God created the sun, the stars, the heavens and the earth, and then made Adam and Eve," Everett said last Friday, before the Red Sox lost two of three in Atlanta. "The Bible never says anything about dinosaurs. You can't say there were dinosaurs when you never saw them. Someone actually saw Adam and Eve. No one ever saw a Tyrannosaurus rex."

What about dinosaur bones?

"Made by man," he says.

Everett has trouble, too, with the idea of man actually walking on the moon. After first rejecting the notion, he concedes, "Yeah, that could have happened. It's possible. That is something you could prove. You can't prove dinosaurs ever existed. I feel it's far-fetched."

CNNSI.com - SI Online - This Week's Issue of Sports Illustrated - SI Flashback: Carl Everett is a man of many opinions - Wednesday July 19, 2000 12:11 PM
 

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