Point Proven!

Navy1960

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Sep 4, 2008
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WASHINGTON -- Senate Democrats last night dropped a key Medicare expansion plan from the proposed health-care bill in a major last-minute concession to save the legislation from going under.

The plan would have allowed people as young as 55 to enroll in Medicare.

The decision to scrap the idea -- which would have considerably expanded health-care coverage, a key promise made by Democrats in last year's elections -- came as President Obama put heavy pressure on Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid and his fellow Democrats to reach a compromise that they could still call "health-care reform."

Health Dems drop Medicare option - NYPOST.com

Let me see if I understand this, with no public option to speak of and no medicare option that leaves a 1900 plus page bill that strips 500 billion from medicare and allows for pre-existing condition and raises premiums 10 to 13% according to the CBO and also places 20 plus billion in unfunded medicaid mandates on the states as well as mandates the purcahse of healthcare insurance. That is a new definition of healthcare reform. If the democrats pass this legislation they may find that many people will be very disappointed and so much so that in their efforts to get this legislative win for President Obama they have sacrificed not only the needs of those that really wanted healthcare reform , but also the political ambitions of many within their own party the President included. I've said it for a while now, that this bill represents nothing of what the democrats set out to accomplish and even though I may not have agreed with the public option they could have claimed it to be reform in some manner, but lacking that is has become what I have suspected and that is nothing but a bill to give a legislative win for the President and nothing more.
 
Pretty muc as I predicted all along.
Something that will only benefit the health care and insurance industry.
 
"Rahm Emanuel visited Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid in his Capitol office on Sunday evening and personally urged him to cut a deal with recalcitrant Sen. Joe Lieberman, two Democratic sources familiar with the situation told the Huffington Post.

Emanuel, President Obama's chief of staff, has long been identified as leading a faction of White House advisers who have been pushing the Senate simply to pass any health care bill, no matter how weak.

His direct message to Reid (D-Nev.), according to a source close to the negotiations: "Get it done. Just get it done."

of course, this is the heavily biased right wing take as espoused by the heavily biased linked source.
:eusa_whistle:

Rahm Emanuel Personally Pressed Reid To Cut Deal With Lieberman: Sources
 
This has now become a joke. Pass anything just so Obama can tick his fucking 'health care' box. For Gods sake! These people are just fucking useless.
 
I'm just curious, shouldn't healthcare reform at the very least lower premiums for the vast majority of people who pay them? Further, if the goal is to provide healthcare insurance to as many Americans as possible and without any option for people to purcahse health insurance other than state medicaid you don't accomplish much other than put them into a program that is already insolvent. It would be wise for congress to actually sit down and come up with a REAL bill that has REAL healthcare reform other than this legislative morass.
 
the only good part is the no more pre-existing conditions bullshit. its by far one of the most immoral and unethical things being pushed by major companies today.
 
blu that could have been accomplished in a one page bill and most likely gotten broad bi-partisan support as well and need not have had all the other 1900 plus pages of spending and mandates associated with it.
 
There will be some kind of a Health Care Reform bill passed into law no matter how stupid and costly the bill is simply because the Democrats will be left with too much egg on their faces if nothing gets passed. So, instead of passing a quality Health Care Reform bill that would be useful to all Americans, they will pass a sack full of garbage just so they can hit the campaign trail and say "See what we accomplished in spite of Republican opposition!"
 
There will be some kind of a Health Care Reform bill passed into law no matter how stupid and costly the bill is simply because the Democrats will be left with too much egg on their faces if nothing gets passed. So, instead of passing a quality Health Care Reform bill that would be useful to all Americans, they will pass a sack full of garbage just so they can hit the campaign trail and say "See what we accomplished in spite of Republican opposition!"
I only believe that to a certain extent.

If all of the supposedly "crucial" elements are taken out of a bill that is 2,000 pages long, and it is still 2,000 pages long, you have to ask yourself what the hell else is in this bill that is so important, and were those "crucial" elements that are now being dropped really a misdirection play to get the rest of the unknown crap passed.
 
There will be some kind of a Health Care Reform bill passed into law no matter how stupid and costly the bill is simply because the Democrats will be left with too much egg on their faces if nothing gets passed. So, instead of passing a quality Health Care Reform bill that would be useful to all Americans, they will pass a sack full of garbage just so they can hit the campaign trail and say "See what we accomplished in spite of Republican opposition!"
I only believe that to a certain extent.

If all of the supposedly "crucial" elements are taken out of a bill that is 2,000 pages long, and it is still 2,000 pages long, you have to ask yourself what the hell else is in this bill that is so important, and were those "crucial" elements that are now being dropped really a misdirection play to get the rest of the unknown crap passed.

Easy answer, mandated purchase of healthcare insurance.
 
blu that could have been accomplished in a one page bill and most likely gotten broad bi-partisan support as well and need not have had all the other 1900 plus pages of spending and mandates associated with it.

agreed. its all I really wanted out any of reform. We pay $600 a month for myself, gf, and her son to get insurance (self employeed) and would be willing to pay even more if the stupid pre-existing crap would go away. it makes it insane trying to switch companies or worrying about when to schedule an appt in the future to make sure you fly by the pre-existing condition departments radar. They also use it as an excuse to deny whatever they dont feel like paying for and their is nothing youc an do about it. unlike in a fair free market you cant just drop that insurance and get another b/c they all have oppressive pre-existing condition stipulations.
 
The point that has been proven is that our government is controlled by corporate interests.
Not a thing to be proud of.
 
the only good part is the no more pre-existing conditions bullshit. its by far one of the most immoral and unethical things being pushed by major companies today.
How is it immoral and/or unethical to exclude people who are inordinate risks from a risk pool?

because in many cases they aren't being excluded. your first year of any private plan is your pre-existing conditon period and they will scour over any medical procedure you get even if its just a checkup to try and not have to pay it. they are fucking evil and will just take money and not pay shit out unless forced
 
There will be some kind of a Health Care Reform bill passed into law no matter how stupid and costly the bill is simply because the Democrats will be left with too much egg on their faces if nothing gets passed. So, instead of passing a quality Health Care Reform bill that would be useful to all Americans, they will pass a sack full of garbage just so they can hit the campaign trail and say "See what we accomplished in spite of Republican opposition!"
I only believe that to a certain extent.

If all of the supposedly "crucial" elements are taken out of a bill that is 2,000 pages long, and it is still 2,000 pages long, you have to ask yourself what the hell else is in this bill that is so important, and were those "crucial" elements that are now being dropped really a misdirection play to get the rest of the unknown crap passed.

Easy answer, mandated purchase of healthcare insurance.

While I do agree that everyone should have affordable health care insurance, I have to wonder where in the Constitution it gives power to congress to force Americans to buy something. Seriously, WTF?
 
blu that could have been accomplished in a one page bill and most likely gotten broad bi-partisan support as well and need not have had all the other 1900 plus pages of spending and mandates associated with it.

agreed. its all I really wanted out any of reform. We pay $600 a month for myself, gf, and her son to get insurance (self employeed) and would be willing to pay even more if the stupid pre-existing crap would go away. it makes it insane trying to switch companies or worrying about when to schedule an appt in the future to make sure you fly by the pre-existing condition departments radar. They also use it as an excuse to deny whatever they dont feel like paying for and their is nothing youc an do about it. unlike in a fair free market you cant just drop that insurance and get another b/c they all have oppressive pre-existing condition stipulations.
I'm still waiting for someone...anyone...to give a cogent answer as to why anyone has any right to a third party payer risk pool, when they're an inordinately high risk.
 
I only believe that to a certain extent.

If all of the supposedly "crucial" elements are taken out of a bill that is 2,000 pages long, and it is still 2,000 pages long, you have to ask yourself what the hell else is in this bill that is so important, and were those "crucial" elements that are now being dropped really a misdirection play to get the rest of the unknown crap passed.

Easy answer, mandated purchase of healthcare insurance.

While I do agree that everyone should have affordable health care insurance, I have to wonder where in the Constitution it gives power to congress to force Americans to buy something. Seriously, WTF?

with the current bill I don't think it would stand. the first reasoning was that everyone would be covered no matter what so you ahd to get checkups, tests, etc or you are putting a large risk on the entire system. if everyone isn't covered then its just a fucking scam making the existing insurance companies billions richer while still being pricks. all this bill did was ensure the insurance company CEOs would keep their cocaine supplies steady for decades to come
 
blu that could have been accomplished in a one page bill and most likely gotten broad bi-partisan support as well and need not have had all the other 1900 plus pages of spending and mandates associated with it.

agreed. its all I really wanted out any of reform. We pay $600 a month for myself, gf, and her son to get insurance (self employeed) and would be willing to pay even more if the stupid pre-existing crap would go away. it makes it insane trying to switch companies or worrying about when to schedule an appt in the future to make sure you fly by the pre-existing condition departments radar. They also use it as an excuse to deny whatever they dont feel like paying for and their is nothing youc an do about it. unlike in a fair free market you cant just drop that insurance and get another b/c they all have oppressive pre-existing condition stipulations.
I'm still waiting for someone...anyone...to give a cogent answer as to why anyone has any right to a third party payer risk pool, when they're an inordinately high risk.

as posted already I am talking about people who got accepted into coverage but then get procedures denied for pre-existing conditons, like happened to my gf and a few other people I know who got onto private plans after college
 
Never wanted to indicate that this bill was anything to be proud of citizen, in fact that was another issue that I thought was sort of ironic about this whole thing. Here you had a group of Senators and Congressmen setting up as the villans the Insurance industry and whats interesting here is that same Industry would be the one to reap the benefits. MEdicare, "public option" whatever, would all have been a great business boon for the Industry. as many are under the mistaken Impression that the Govt. actually runs Medicare. Just as an example, when you call Medicare you do know your not actually talking to the Govt. but a contractor.
 

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