Parties Fighting Legal Battle Over Naked Ballots In Penn..

[candycorn]

Smart people would recognize there is no endgame to this where we don't have a President because votes are still being counted after 1/20/2021. The squealing is there to do one thing; soften the ground up if Trump loses by establishing some manufactured asterisk of there being some doubt as to the outcome.

Man you were really WINNING there until it mattered... Doesn't MATTER because there's a date certain to CERTIFY.. That's true.. But that's a STATE policy.. And FEDERAL COURT CASES can injunct that date.

Not to mention that ANY BALLOTS still being challenged or attempting to get fix will GET TOSSED in dumpster of fire after certification date. Like 600,000 of the 1.5MILL Provisional ballots in California were in 2016. There's massive BAD DESIGN AND INCOMPETENCE right there..

But you don't care if the INACCURACIES and ERRORS are higher than the margin of victory do ya? You like systems designed for the lazy, stupid and cant follow directions.

We've had thousands of votes thrown out before. Can you quote me ever saying squat about it? I can't quote you ever saying squat about it either.

It wasn't an issue until the blob enlisted people like you to try to make it an issue. And presto--here you are.

 

[Pete7469]

I tend to agree...but also...they are faced with figuring out a big change in a short amount of time. and factually...government bureaucracies have never excelled in that arena.

That's what I don't get about the handful of you "libs" who aren't complete jabbering retards and acknowledge that government is generally a complete goat fuck, and in some cases a goat orgy with footballbats. You admit these people are incompetent, ignorant, and lazy.

Then you want them involved in everything from Health Care to regulating you diets? You want them to establish energy policies and regulate entire industries? You believe they can run an economy? Then when a guy comes along that knows how to make money and has put people to work you malign and resist everything he says and does because it reduces the power of the sociopaths enriching themselves and their donors with regulations that stifle anything that creates prosperity.

 

[buckeye45_73]

First the in-person voting was fraudulent...now you guys suddenly prefer it to voting by mail?

It sounds like conserve-hate-ives just don't want more people voting.

Apparently - regardless of how the voting occurs...if it benefits or is mythologized as benefiting Dems it's fraudulent.

That said, it does seem as if there are a lot of valid issues. Lack of good planning for large scale mailings and a concerted effort by the Republicans to suppress voting.

It's not that....its stupid to do this....there is a lack of control.....

Ballots should be treated like evidence in an investigation......if you can't see the chain of custody from voter to counter...than it's not valid....just like evidence

and mail in ballots require a more work and intelligence to fill out and mail back correctly.......democrats are not known to be the sharpest tools in the shed and have had many ballot issues in the past

The same person counting ballots filed in person is counting ballots by mail. There is no "lack of control". It's a manufactured lack of confidence instilled by Trump.

Several states have been voting by mail for years. Nobody ever questioned the validity of those elections in the past.

Well Oregon is not the entire US......sorry, that doesnt matter.......
It's not who is counting the ballot, it's the chain....read my post again.....

Yeah...your post was nonsense. It's not evidence in a trial. It's a ballot. Again, nobody in those states (more than Oregon) ever raised a peep about "the chain". Nor have they done so with the military who has been voting by mail for about a century. Your blob programmed you to be outraged about this and you're not disappointing your master.

You're confused about Absentee ballots and MASS MAILING of UNSOLICITED ballots.. The difference (or one of them) is about a 4 to 10 fold INCREASE in volume for clearing and entering them.. Nevermind the issues of security and "chain of custody" issues where all kinds of paws including less than scrupulous "ballot harvestors" are intercepting 100s of ballots sitting in lobbies of apartment buildings and not put INTO individual mailboxes..

NONE of that happened with "military vote by mail". ONLY security on MASS mail ballots is the signature and the ERROR RATES on signatures is about 10 times the margin of victory in many states in the 2016 election..

Colorado, for one, mails a ballot to every registered voter. Again, up until you were programmed to whine about it...nobody ever questioned the validity of their elections.

A lot of bad reporting on what states actually do.. SOME of the "mass mail" states just do it for local and STATE elections where turnout and interest is low and they have MORE TIME to challenge and process and fix.. Shall we go check if Colorado does it for NATIONAL elections before?

Feel free to check. Again...until you were programmed to do so, you never said one word about the validity of Colorado elections. All of the sudden, it's the most important topic in your world...until you're programmed otherwise. Remember back when you were upset about immigration? Funny how you stopped talking about it.

No its not, I said I participated once in CO elections.....that is not the same as the entire US
and like I say, go for mail in......I'm going to laugh at you guys bitching about how unfair they are

 

[buckeye45_73]

Smart people would recognize there is no endgame to this where we don't have a President because votes are still being counted after 1/20/2021. The squealing is there to do one thing; soften the ground up if Trump loses by establishing some manufactured asterisk of there being some doubt as to the outcome.

Man you were really WINNING there until it mattered... Doesn't MATTER because there's a date certain to CERTIFY.. That's true.. But that's a STATE policy.. And FEDERAL COURT CASES can injunct that date.

Not to mention that ANY BALLOTS still being challenged or attempting to get fix will GET TOSSED in dumpster of fire after certification date. Like 600,000 of the 1.5MILL Provisional ballots in California were in 2016. There's massive BAD DESIGN AND INCOMPETENCE right there..

But you don't care if the INACCURACIES and ERRORS are higher than the margin of victory do ya? You like systems designed for the lazy, stupid and cant follow directions.

We've had thousands of votes thrown out before. Can you quote me ever saying squat about it? I can't quote you ever saying squat about it either.

It wasn't an issue until the blob enlisted people like you to try to make it an issue. And presto--here you are.

When I say you, I am referring to the left.....which is you and all your friends......you guys bitched about FL 2000, OH 2004, and WI, MI, PA 2016.....you guys constantly bitch about everything, especially when you lose

 

[Norman]

Local officials say nine Pennsylvania ballots were discarded due to an error, undercutting Trump claims of intentional fraud | CNN Politics

Local officials in Pennsylvania on Friday provided more information about nine potentially mishandled ballots in Luzerne County, which the White House repeatedly cited to attack mail-in voting and question the integrity of November's election.

www.cnn.com

So CNN admits that someone discarded Trump mail in ballots, but says it was an “error”, not fraud.

I guess the worker ‘Accidentally’ threw out the ballot by mistake. Oooops. I guess he was ‘fired’ by mistake too.

all the lies they tell every day must be ‘errors’ too.

FBI is investigating the case by error.

 

[Norman]

Those 9 votes that trump and barr tried to use to say that all his votes will be thrown out, were votes sent in without that secrecy sleeve. So according to what the law says, what trump and you followers want, those without that shield should be thrown out without being counted.

You talking about the ballots in the Wisconsin ditch? Not aware that Trump or Barr had weighed in.. NEED A LINK...

AND -- you're wrong about that load of mail being refuse.. If it WAS -- the FBI and Postal Inspectors wouldn't be investigating.. Got a link for THAT? No -- you dont...

Indeed, it has nowhere been reported that the issue was the security envelope. This is made up fake news.

 

[Norman]

First the in-person voting was fraudulent...now you guys suddenly prefer it to voting by mail?

It sounds like conserve-hate-ives just don't want more people voting.

Apparently - regardless of how the voting occurs...if it benefits or is mythologized as benefiting Dems it's fraudulent.

That said, it does seem as if there are a lot of valid issues. Lack of good planning for large scale mailings and a concerted effort by the Republicans to suppress voting.

If you can't read the instructions -which are no doubt printed in multiple languages- then put the included privacy envelope inside the mailing envelope, then you're too goddamn stupid to have your vote count.

It's not cheating.....You are certifiable dopes.

Fuck you.

Who said it was cheating?





Oh...wait. That was you guys wasn't it?

it's not secure......that's the problem, it opens a pandora's box of cheating......at least you guys will be happy, more stuff to bitch about when you lose.

...yet it's been done for years in multiple states...without widespread fraud.

This is how it turned out this year.

New Local Election Ordered in N.J. After Mail-In Voter Fraud Charges (Published 2020)

A judge ruled that the election in Paterson had been irreversibly tainted. The president has used the case to assail mail-in voting as dangerous, though election experts disagree.

www.nytimes.com

 

[Norman]

Those 9 votes that trump and barr tried to use to say that all his votes will be thrown out, were votes sent in without that secrecy sleeve. So according to what the law says, what trump and you followers want, those without that shield should be thrown out without being counted.

You talking about the ballots in the Wisconsin ditch? Not aware that Trump or Barr had weighed in.. NEED A LINK...

AND -- you're wrong about that load of mail being refuse.. If it WAS -- the FBI and Postal Inspectors wouldn't be investigating.. Got a link for THAT? No -- you dont...

They are investigating because this is PARTISAN driven.

No kiddo.. They're investigating BECAUSE they are voting ballots.. And it's NOT secure to even TOSS them as garbage..

Tell me..have they investigated EVERY situation like that?

Apparently NOT: Feds, In Unusual Statement, Announce They're Investigating A Few Discarded Ballots

So THAT'S the nine ballots that DANA was talking about.. OK.. THanks.. Not the couple DOZEN found in a Wisconsin ditch...

Remember what I said about incompetence, poor design, poor implementation??? Here's the PROOF.... From your link ---

Based on interviews, however, Freed said investigators had concluded that all the envelopes — likely a very small number — that had been received by the Luzerne County Board of Elections were opened "as a matter of course."

Workers, he wrote, explained that the envelopes used for mail ballot requests were so similar to the ones used for returned mail ballots that they believed they would miss requests if they preserved all the envelopes unopened.

That's inexcusable. Should be marked 2020 National Election Ballot right on the OUTER envelope. This is why RATIONAL folks are VERY pessimistic about the country surviving this huge mistake...

The rest of you don't care.. No big deal if 20% of mail-ins get mishandled, not in security envelopes, or end up in ditches or get bundled and dropped in mailboxes by who knows who.. That's why we don't TRUST the left to TOUCH the election system..

Can you give us ANY good reason why we should trust the RIGHT to TOUCH the election system?

North Carolina GOP Operative Faces New Felony Charges That Allege Ballot Fraud

Leslie McCrae Dowless is accused of leading a scheme to illegally collect, sign and mail in absentee ballots. An investigation into allegations of fraud overturned a 2018 congressional race.

www.npr.org

You are living in an alternate reality again. The right is NOT behind the mail in farce, and is not trying to change the system right before the election.

 

[Dana7360]

This "mass mailing" of ballots is SO well planned and thought out -- What could possibly go wrong? Maybe the whole security of voting IN PRIVATE with as few eyes as possible on your ballot? Maybe folks returning mass mailed ballots can not follow simple directions?

It's been legally required to provide an inner envelope (secrecy envelope) on absentee ballots in most states. That way there is less labor on election day and less folks in the "inner sanctum" to feed them to the counting machines.. This ruling confirms that folks MUST FOLLOW DIRECTIONS and use the secrecy envelope when returning mail ballots. Dems are outraged of course.. Any RULES that must be followed to protect the voting process is "voter disenchisement"..

So -- we're gonna test this shart bomb LIVE on Election day huh?? Without any legislation or hearings or process... Never let Dems design voting process.. They couldn't count to 100,000 in Iowa caucuses for their own puny primary with the people standing there right in front of them.

Philadelphia election official warns 'naked ballot' ruling could jeopardize 100,000 Pennsylvania votes

A top elections official in Philadelphia is warning that 100,000 ballots could be rejected because of a recent ruling regarding so-called "naked ballots."

www.cnbc.com

The top elections official in Philadelphia is warning that a little-noticed aspect of a recent ruling by the Pennsylvania Supreme Court could cause over 100,000 votes statewide to be voided, creating the conditions for a post-election legal battle “the likes of which we have not seen since Florida in 2000.”

Lisa Deeley, the Democratic chairwoman of the city commissioners office, which oversees elections, cited the Thursday decision from the court that invalidated so-called “naked ballots,” or those that are submitted without secrecy envelopes that mask the identity of the voter, in a letter dated Monday and addressed to state lawmakers.

The ruling interpreted a law that specifies that those voting by mail must place their ballots inside envelopes that shield their name. Those envelopes are then placed in a second envelope which has the address of the voter’s election board.

The state Democratic Party had argued that while the election code directed voters to use the secrecy envelope, it did not authorize officials to discard their ballots if they did not do so. The state Republican Party, on the other hand, argued that counting naked ballots would compromise the integrity of the secret ballot.

Justice Max Baer wrote that based on the text of the law it was clear that the state legislature intended that “it should not be readily apparent who the elector is, with what party he or she affiliates, or for whom the elector has voted.”

Those 9 votes that trump and barr tried to use to say that all his votes will be thrown out, were votes sent in without that secrecy sleeve. So according to what the law says, what trump and you followers want, those without that shield should be thrown out without being counted.

Seven of those nine votes were for trump. Do you want them thrown out because they didn't have that sleeve?

So you can't have it both ways. Either those ballots without that sleeve should not be counted or they should but shouldn't ever be used by trump or barr to lie about voter fraud.

Seven of those nine votes were for trump. Do you want them thrown out because they didn't have that sleeve?

Yes...They should all be thrown out, because the mail-in system isn't secure.

Fair and square.

What's your objection now, cheater?

You can reply without calling me names. I never gave any hint about how I felt about that sleeve beyond pointing out that the 9 ballots people like you threw fits over didn't have those sleeves.

Then why all the fuss over those ballots?

The far right went nuts over them.

I'm with you, I believe any ballot without that secrecy sleeve should be thrown out.

I never had any objection to it. What my problem was that people like you threw totally hypocritical hissy fits over those ballots.

Now you want them thrown out. Good. They should have been. The secrecy sleeve was not there.

So now what is your objection cheater?

 

[Dana7360]

Those 9 votes that trump and barr tried to use to say that all his votes will be thrown out, were votes sent in without that secrecy sleeve. So according to what the law says, what trump and you followers want, those without that shield should be thrown out without being counted.

You talking about the ballots in the Wisconsin ditch? Not aware that Trump or Barr had weighed in.. NEED A LINK...

AND -- you're wrong about that load of mail being refuse.. If it WAS -- the FBI and Postal Inspectors wouldn't be investigating.. Got a link for THAT? No -- you dont...

No, I'm talking about the 9 ballots in PA. Can you read? I clearly posted the words 9 ballots. Nothing about a ditch.

You people went nuts over them.

The reason why they were thrown out was because they didn't have that sleeve.

If you honestly want to read about it find your own link. Nothing is stopping you from putting keywords in a search, hit enter then read about it.

It's not my job to spoon feed you information. Especially information everyone knows, there are threads about it on this message board and information you won't read. I've played that game with people like you. I can provide links that fill a message box, you will never read it.

So I take it you think that those 9 ballots should have been counted don't you? Even though you put up a thread advocating that ballots without that sleeve should be thrown out.

Can you be more hypocritical and dishonest?

Are you now saying they should have been counted?

 

[Dana7360]

Those 9 votes that trump and barr tried to use to say that all his votes will be thrown out, were votes sent in without that secrecy sleeve. So according to what the law says, what trump and you followers want, those without that shield should be thrown out without being counted.

You talking about the ballots in the Wisconsin ditch? Not aware that Trump or Barr had weighed in.. NEED A LINK...

AND -- you're wrong about that load of mail being refuse.. If it WAS -- the FBI and Postal Inspectors wouldn't be investigating.. Got a link for THAT? No -- you dont...

They are investigating because this is PARTISAN driven.

No kiddo.. They're investigating BECAUSE they are voting ballots.. And it's NOT secure to even TOSS them as garbage..

Tell me..have they investigated EVERY situation like that?

Apparently NOT: Feds, In Unusual Statement, Announce They're Investigating A Few Discarded Ballots

Those are the ballots that didn't have the sleeve and were thrown out.

Now trump an barr are investigating it.

They did what they law required. What the OP has been advocating.

 

[candycorn]

Smart people would recognize there is no endgame to this where we don't have a President because votes are still being counted after 1/20/2021. The squealing is there to do one thing; soften the ground up if Trump loses by establishing some manufactured asterisk of there being some doubt as to the outcome.

Man you were really WINNING there until it mattered... Doesn't MATTER because there's a date certain to CERTIFY.. That's true.. But that's a STATE policy.. And FEDERAL COURT CASES can injunct that date.

Not to mention that ANY BALLOTS still being challenged or attempting to get fix will GET TOSSED in dumpster of fire after certification date. Like 600,000 of the 1.5MILL Provisional ballots in California were in 2016. There's massive BAD DESIGN AND INCOMPETENCE right there..

But you don't care if the INACCURACIES and ERRORS are higher than the margin of victory do ya? You like systems designed for the lazy, stupid and cant follow directions.

We've had thousands of votes thrown out before. Can you quote me ever saying squat about it? I can't quote you ever saying squat about it either.

It wasn't an issue until the blob enlisted people like you to try to make it an issue. And presto--here you are.

When I say you, I am referring to the left.....which is you and all your friends......you guys bitched about FL 2000, OH 2004, and WI, MI, PA 2016.....you guys constantly bitch about everything, especially when you lose

You guys bitch about everything when you are allegedly "winning".....

See this thread for all the evidence you'd need.

 

[Adrenochrome Junkie]

Those 9 votes that trump and barr tried to use to say that all his votes will be thrown out, were votes sent in without that secrecy sleeve. So according to what the law says, what trump and you followers want, those without that shield should be thrown out without being counted.

You talking about the ballots in the Wisconsin ditch? Not aware that Trump or Barr had weighed in.. NEED A LINK...

AND -- you're wrong about that load of mail being refuse.. If it WAS -- the FBI and Postal Inspectors wouldn't be investigating.. Got a link for THAT? No -- you dont...

No, I'm talking about the 9 ballots in PA. Can you read? I clearly posted the words 9 ballots. Nothing about a ditch.

You people went nuts over them.

The reason why they were thrown out was because they didn't have that sleeve.

If you honestly want to read about it find your own link. Nothing is stopping you from putting keywords in a search, hit enter then read about it.

It's not my job to spoon feed you information. Especially information everyone knows, there are threads about it on this message board and information you won't read. I've played that game with people like you. I can provide links that fill a message box, you will never read it.

So I take it you think that those 9 ballots should have been counted don't you? Even though you put up a thread advocating that ballots without that sleeve should be thrown out.

Can you be more hypocritical and dishonest?

Are you now saying they should have been counted?

If you’re gonna claim something and make an argument it’s YOUR RESPONSIBILITY to provide a source.

if I claimed Joe Biden had a sex tape of him fucking a donkey I would include a link. I wouldn’t just tell everybody else to go search for it on the internet, unless if I were full of shit.

if you want credibility, post the link to your news source.

or

just be taken as another batshit crazy DemonRat

 

[buckeye45_73]

Smart people would recognize there is no endgame to this where we don't have a President because votes are still being counted after 1/20/2021. The squealing is there to do one thing; soften the ground up if Trump loses by establishing some manufactured asterisk of there being some doubt as to the outcome.

Man you were really WINNING there until it mattered... Doesn't MATTER because there's a date certain to CERTIFY.. That's true.. But that's a STATE policy.. And FEDERAL COURT CASES can injunct that date.

Not to mention that ANY BALLOTS still being challenged or attempting to get fix will GET TOSSED in dumpster of fire after certification date. Like 600,000 of the 1.5MILL Provisional ballots in California were in 2016. There's massive BAD DESIGN AND INCOMPETENCE right there..

But you don't care if the INACCURACIES and ERRORS are higher than the margin of victory do ya? You like systems designed for the lazy, stupid and cant follow directions.

We've had thousands of votes thrown out before. Can you quote me ever saying squat about it? I can't quote you ever saying squat about it either.

It wasn't an issue until the blob enlisted people like you to try to make it an issue. And presto--here you are.

When I say you, I am referring to the left.....which is you and all your friends......you guys bitched about FL 2000, OH 2004, and WI, MI, PA 2016.....you guys constantly bitch about everything, especially when you lose

You guys bitch about everything when you are allegedly "winning".....

See this thread for all the evidence you'd need.

No, we bitch before the election, you guys only bitch after you lose......your bitching is solely based on the outcome....ours is in a general dislike of rushing a process on such a fundamental right.....