Looks like Baghdad imploding

[Oldstyle]

Oldstyle, post: 15109254

The Red Line was in reference to Assad using chemical weapons against the Syrian opposition. Obama threatened a US military response if Assad crossed that "Red Line" but when it was shown that Assad had indeed gassed Syrian's who opposed him, Obama walked that threat back....

Obama walked nothing back. He wanted Cingress to do its job and authorize the use of military force in Syria. During the debate in Congress a diplomatic breakthrough occurred wherein Assad and Putin agreed to destroy and get rid if it's Chem/Bio weapons arsenal in a very short period of time.

Obama achieved his redline threat through diplomacy without US boots on ground.

If only Bush had allowed the UN inspectors resolve Iraq's WMD non-existent threat in March 2003 there would never have been an AQI and eventual ISIS. Just ask Trump.

Ah yes...let the UN handle Saddam Hussein! Would that be the same UN who's Secretary General's son was brokering black market oil deals for Iraq? You're as naive as Barry and the rest!

 

[whutTHEYsay]

ISIL convoys of pickup trucks, each truck carrying four fighters, entered Mosul by shooting at the city's checkpoints.


Oldstyle, post: 15109919

That would be ISIS moving troops, artillery and armor across open desert between Syria and the cities they were attacking in Iraq. You know...the JV team?

Two things:

One. ISIS did not cross Obama's red-line. That was ASSAD. So you lied.

Two: ISIS did not invade Iraq by ISIS moving troops, artillery and armor across open desert between Syria and the cities they were attacking in Iraq as you said.

Convoys of pickup trucks were already in Iraq. Blending in with other civilian trucks.

.
On 4 June, Iraqi police, under the command of Lieutenant General Mahdi Gharawi, cornered ISIL military leader Abu Abdulrahman al-Bilawiin Iraq. Al-Bilawi blew himself up and Gharawi hoped it would prevent an attack.[19] At 02:30 in morning, ISIL convoys of pickup trucks, each truck carrying four fighters, entered Mosul by shooting at the city's checkpoints. Though Mosul's first line of defense was thought to contain 2,500 soldiers, Gharawi says that "reality was closer to 500". He noted that since all of the city's tanks were being used by Iraqi forces in the Anbar province, the city was left with little to combat the ISIL fighters. The insurgents hanged, burned, and crucified some Iraqi soldiers during their attack.[19] ISIL commander Abu Abdulrahman al-Bilawi was killed near Mosul that day.[20] On 5 June, a curfew was imposed in the city.[21] The government used helicopters to bomb the militants. In the southern part of the city, five suicide bombers blasted an arsenal.[22] ISIL began their attack on the northwestern part of the city on 6 June. The ISIL forces in the city totaled 1,500 soldiers, outnumbered by Iraqi forces by 15 to 1.[23] Two suicide bomber cars exploded, in Muwaffakiya, a village near Mosul, killing six Sabak soldiers. After the attacks, most of the fighters either retreated into the desert or camouflaged among the local population.[22]

On 8 June, the group launched a double bomb attack against a Patriotic Union of Kurdistanparty office in Jalula, in which eighteen people died.[24] That day, about a hundred vehicles entered Mosul, carrying at least four hundred men. Sleeper cells hidden within the city were then activated and according to police, "neighbourhoods rallied to them".[19] The group also bombed a police station in the neighborhood of al-Uraybi, and commandeered an abandoned building on the west of Tigris river, transforming it into a headquarters for a group of thirty SWAT members.[19]

On 9 June, ISIL executed fifteen Iraqi security force members who were captured in Tikrit.[25]According to CBS News, ISIL fighters armed with machine guns and rocket-propelled grenades stormed the Nineveh provincial headquarters that same day.[26] By that time, the Fourth Battalion were among the very last local police fighting the attackers, the rest of the defense forces having run away or joined the opposition. Lacking plans and ammunition, Gharawi ordered the Iraqi military to retreat on the advice of retired general Khaled al-Obeidi.[19] On that same night, ISIL and Sunni militants attacked Mosul, causing heavy fighting overnight. Iraqi Army soldiers fled the city while it was under attack, allowing the militants to control much of Mosul by midday on 10 June.[16] The militants seized numerous facilities, including Mosul International Airport, which had served as a hub for the U.S. military in the region.[27] Militants captured the helicopters present at the airport, in addition to "several villages" and a military airbase in south Saladin Province.[26] The Iraqi army "crumbled in the face of the militant assault", which is evidenced by the fact that soldiers abandoned their weapons and dressed as civilians to blend in with the noncombatants.[28]

The city fell to the ISIL on 10 June 2014 after four days of clashes between the insurgents and the Iraqi military. There were reports that the group was advancing from Mosul to Kirkukat the time. While capturing the city, the group freed nearly 1,000 prisoners, some of whom were greeted by the fighters.[9] Black flags were also flown over government buildings.[5]

Fall of Mosul - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It's called reading history and being accurate in what you say about it. You need to try accuracy sometime.

Your attack against Obama doesn't work without your tanks and artillery embellishment.

Is there any source you can provide that confirms your claim about the open desert heavy armored attack on Mosul on June 4 2014?

 

[whutTHEYsay]

Oldstyle, post: 15109989

Ah yes...let the UN handle Saddam Hussein! Would that be the same UN who's Secretary General's son was brokering black market oil deals for Iraq? You're as naive as Barry and the rest!

So you prefer getting 4484 U.S. Troops killed looking for WMDs that did not exist in Iraq over nobody killing anybody going the diplomatic route that was succeeding in Iraq prior to Bush's ignorant decision to find WMD military force. You prefer the creation of ISIS the diplomatic peaceful UN inspection route.

Check!

 

[whutTHEYsay]

Oldstyle, post: 15109254

Obama's weakness emboldened ISIS and led to the fall of major cities in Iraq as well as major oil fields. It's what put ISIS on the map as a terror power.

How about 20,000 Iraq Army and police running away from a 1000 ISIS fighters in Mosul. Obama had no options in that battle. When you lie that credits ISIS's rise in Iraq to weakness on Obama's part you are aiding and abetting the terrorists. You disregard Maliki's corruption and anti-Sunni policy also aids ISIS by finding a false cause of the rise of ISIS.

Check!

 

[whutTHEYsay]

Oldstyle, post: 15109919

That would be ISIS moving troops, artillery and armor across open desert between Syria and the cities they were attacking in Iraq. You know...the JV team?

You've heard the truth long ago:

"Oldstyle 13126386

That's total bullshit on your part...ISIS crossed hundreds of miles of open desert with large numbers of fighters in trucks along with tanks and artillery pieces BEFORE they were able to "embed" themselves in Iraqi cities where it's proving extremely difficult to use air power to dislodge them.

Please note that Mosul is about 150 miles from the Syrian border. Raqqa is over 300 miles southwest of Mosul as the crow flies. It says here that Mosul was attacked from the west and northwest using only pickup trucks. Perhaps a couple hundred pickup trucks.

.
Fall of Mosul On 6 June, ISIL attacked Mosul from the northwest and quickly entered the western part of the city. The ISIL forces numbered approximately 1,500, while there were at least 15 times more Iraqi forces.

Sunni sympathizers live in the west side of the city.

A couple hundred pickup trucks could blend with traffic from many areas and assemble just a few miles from the first Mosul checkpoint. That would keep the element of surprise in the terrorists favor. I doubt they all came at one time. Only two guards were at each checkpoint.

So it is clear Oldstyle that the attackers did not attack across hundreds of miles of open desert from Syria with tanks and artillery pieces. They massed in convoys of pickup truck on Iraqi highways and came through checkpoints.

The assault started at 02:30 in the morning when ISIL convoys of pickup trucks advancing from the west shot their way through the two-man checkpoints into the city. By 03:30, street fighting was raging in Mosul.

Tell us Oldstyle how US bombing could have been ordered to stop street fighting as the assault began.

In southern Mosul, five suicide bombers attacked an arms depot killing 11 soldiers. Two suicide bombers also killed six people in the village of Muaffakiya, near Mosul. Heavy fighting continued in the city the next day. Over the two days, 61 militants, 41 government troops and seven civilians were killed.

They didn't have the tanks and artillery that you claimed they brought across the desert from Syria. Do you realize that you've been lying all this time yet.

As the militants advanced they seized military vehicles and weapons and reportedly hanged soldiers and lit them ablaze, crucified them, and torched them on the hoods of Humvees.

You see they seized them after they were advancing across Mosul.


June 8, 2014 sleeper cells inside Mosul are activated:

By this time, insurgents surged into Mosul, sleeper cells hiding in the city had been activated and neighbourhoods rallied to them.

Some police joined the terrorists.

By the afternoon of 9 June, some 40 members of the fourth police battalion were among the very last local police fighting to hold back the jihadists in western Mosul. The rest had either defected or deserted.

They didn't need tanks they used s water truck.

At 04:30 in the afternoon, a military water tanker, rigged with explosives, raced towards the Mosul Hotel where the policemen were stationed.

They released more terrorist scum recruits from Mosul prison.

The militants also claimed to had released at least 2,400 prisoners, after seizing police stations and prisons across the city.[99][100] However, after the takeover of Badush prison in Mosul, ISIL separated and removed the Sunni inmates, while the remaining 670 prisoners were executed.[101]

In four days it was over:

At the end of 10 June, ISIL was considered to be in control of Mosul.ISIL seized large quantities of US-supplied military equipment. It also freed thousands of prisoners, many of whom are likely to join the insurgency.

Only an idiot could believe US military action could have prevented this or lie about how the fall of Mosul happened.

months preceding the attack:

Sources within the Iraq government allege that in the months preceding the assault, Ba'ath loyalists led by al-Douri had been in contact with disaffected Sunni officers who either defected or withdrew upon the ISIL-Ba'ath attack.

How does Obama know which Iraqi officers to bomb or assassinate if he could do such a thing?

Are you aware of your lies yet Oldstyle?

Northern Iraq offensive (June 2014) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Oldstyle]

ISIL convoys of pickup trucks, each truck carrying four fighters, entered Mosul by shooting at the city's checkpoints.


Oldstyle, post: 15109919

That would be ISIS moving troops, artillery and armor across open desert between Syria and the cities they were attacking in Iraq. You know...the JV team?

Two things:

One. ISIS did not cross Obama's red-line. That was ASSAD. So you lied.

Two: ISIS did not invade Iraq by ISIS moving troops, artillery and armor across open desert between Syria and the cities they were attacking in Iraq as you said.

Convoys of pickup trucks were already in Iraq. Blending in with other civilian trucks.

.
On 4 June, Iraqi police, under the command of Lieutenant General Mahdi Gharawi, cornered ISIL military leader Abu Abdulrahman al-Bilawiin Iraq. Al-Bilawi blew himself up and Gharawi hoped it would prevent an attack.[19] At 02:30 in morning, ISIL convoys of pickup trucks, each truck carrying four fighters, entered Mosul by shooting at the city's checkpoints. Though Mosul's first line of defense was thought to contain 2,500 soldiers, Gharawi says that "reality was closer to 500". He noted that since all of the city's tanks were being used by Iraqi forces in the Anbar province, the city was left with little to combat the ISIL fighters. The insurgents hanged, burned, and crucified some Iraqi soldiers during their attack.[19] ISIL commander Abu Abdulrahman al-Bilawi was killed near Mosul that day.[20] On 5 June, a curfew was imposed in the city.[21] The government used helicopters to bomb the militants. In the southern part of the city, five suicide bombers blasted an arsenal.[22] ISIL began their attack on the northwestern part of the city on 6 June. The ISIL forces in the city totaled 1,500 soldiers, outnumbered by Iraqi forces by 15 to 1.[23] Two suicide bomber cars exploded, in Muwaffakiya, a village near Mosul, killing six Sabak soldiers. After the attacks, most of the fighters either retreated into the desert or camouflaged among the local population.[22]

On 8 June, the group launched a double bomb attack against a Patriotic Union of Kurdistanparty office in Jalula, in which eighteen people died.[24] That day, about a hundred vehicles entered Mosul, carrying at least four hundred men. Sleeper cells hidden within the city were then activated and according to police, "neighbourhoods rallied to them".[19] The group also bombed a police station in the neighborhood of al-Uraybi, and commandeered an abandoned building on the west of Tigris river, transforming it into a headquarters for a group of thirty SWAT members.[19]

On 9 June, ISIL executed fifteen Iraqi security force members who were captured in Tikrit.[25]According to CBS News, ISIL fighters armed with machine guns and rocket-propelled grenades stormed the Nineveh provincial headquarters that same day.[26] By that time, the Fourth Battalion were among the very last local police fighting the attackers, the rest of the defense forces having run away or joined the opposition. Lacking plans and ammunition, Gharawi ordered the Iraqi military to retreat on the advice of retired general Khaled al-Obeidi.[19] On that same night, ISIL and Sunni militants attacked Mosul, causing heavy fighting overnight. Iraqi Army soldiers fled the city while it was under attack, allowing the militants to control much of Mosul by midday on 10 June.[16] The militants seized numerous facilities, including Mosul International Airport, which had served as a hub for the U.S. military in the region.[27] Militants captured the helicopters present at the airport, in addition to "several villages" and a military airbase in south Saladin Province.[26] The Iraqi army "crumbled in the face of the militant assault", which is evidenced by the fact that soldiers abandoned their weapons and dressed as civilians to blend in with the noncombatants.[28]

The city fell to the ISIL on 10 June 2014 after four days of clashes between the insurgents and the Iraqi military. There were reports that the group was advancing from Mosul to Kirkukat the time. While capturing the city, the group freed nearly 1,000 prisoners, some of whom were greeted by the fighters.[9] Black flags were also flown over government buildings.[5]

Fall of Mosul - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It's called reading history and being accurate in what you say about it. You need to try accuracy sometime.

Your attack against Obama doesn't work without your tanks and artillery embellishment.

Is there any source you can provide that confirms your claim about the open desert heavy armored attack on Mosul on June 4 2014?

Obama's "Red Line" was with Assad not ISIS. My point...which obviously went right over your head...was that Obama's inaction when Assad thumbed his nose at the ultimatum given him by the US President emboldened the leaders of ISIS to move fighters across the open desert from Syria into Iraq and then move loot BACK across that same open desert.

 

[Oldstyle]

Oldstyle, post: 15109254

Obama's weakness emboldened ISIS and led to the fall of major cities in Iraq as well as major oil fields. It's what put ISIS on the map as a terror power.

How about 20,000 Iraq Army and police running away from a 1000 ISIS fighters in Mosul. Obama had no options in that battle. When you lie that credits ISIS's rise in Iraq to weakness on Obama's part you are aiding and abetting the terrorists. You disregard Maliki's corruption and anti-Sunni policy also aids ISIS by finding a false cause of the rise of ISIS.

Check!

The Iraqi army RAN because they no longer had American support...something that Obama's military advisors warned him was a possibility. Or do you think that if we had the five thousand combat troops that were recommended be left behind still in Iraq that a force of a thousand poorly trained ISIS fighters would have routed them? Let's be honest here...if American forces are still in country then there is no way that ISIS mounts a large offensive against them because we would have slaughtered them.

 

[Oldstyle]

Bottom line is that Obama wanted that troop withdrawal because he was going to run on being the guy who stopped military combat for American ground forces in Iraq and that political stump speech was more important to Barry then the advice he was getting from his Generals.

He took political credit for his actions...which means he owns the results!

 

[whutTHEYsay]

The Iraqi army RAN because they no longer had American support...something that Obama's military advisors warned him was a possibility.

Every single US military adviser warned Obama not to keep troops in Iraq without a SOFA granting immunity. Sure they warned all kinds of bad things could happen but Iraq is a sovereign nation and refused to grant immunity in 2012 and beyond.

Would you prefer sending US Troops to Iraq without immunity?

 

[Oldstyle]

The Iraqi army RAN because they no longer had American support...something that Obama's military advisors warned him was a possibility.

Every single US military adviser warned Obama not to keep troops in Iraq without a SOFA granting immunity. Sure they warned all kinds of bad things could happen but Iraq is a sovereign nation and refused to grant immunity in 2012 and beyond.

Would you prefer sending US Troops to Iraq without immunity?

Nice attempt at a deflection! Of course they warned Obama that a new SOFA was needed...just as they warned him that a premature troop pull out would endanger the gains that had been made in Iraq. Once again...Barack Obama never made an attempt to get a new SOFA because Barack Obama had already made a political decision that he would run for reelection as the President who "got us out of Iraq"! Obama made that decision...not the Iraqi leadership. Obama made the call on that and Obama owns the result.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

deltex1, post: 9603587

CNN reporting Maliki sending troops to green zone to protect his job. Someone tell the president...he's at Mcd's in Massatwoshits.

This is the kind of ignorant predictors of doom that voted for Trump.

An implosion of Shiite Run Baghdad was never going to happen?

 

[deltex1]

Ollie North reporting from Mosul...predicting it will take months. Obabble still not arming the Kurds. Obabble is an asshole.

 

[irosie91]

Oldstyle, post: 15106352

Al Queda existed before we even went to war with Iraq.

Of course they did. But they were not in Iraq until after the invasion. AQI was the terror seed that split off from AQ. AQI become ISIS. That ISIS evolved in Iraq not Syria. Bush had every thing to do with it. No invasion in 2003 - no ISIS in Iraq, ever. Baathists were too secular to put up with the threat that AQ and an ISIS could have imposed on Saddam's regime.

If you don't believe me perhaps you'll believe your Republican nominee:

“Maybe don’t go into Iraq originally. We should have never, ever gone in,” Trump, who supported invading Iraq, said at a February town hall in Bluffton, S.C. “But we did. So we made a mistake. The country made a big mistake, and started all of this horrible thing that you see taking place, including ISIS.”

BS. Isis is islam "ISIS" is nothing new------just a new name for a phenomenon that has repeated itself scores of times in the course of the history of ISLAM.--------the same kind of filth even happened in Islamic spain------during the
"GOLDEN AGE" of Islamic filth. Playing FASCIST BAATHISM against MUHAMMAD"S ISIS is about as useful as was playing TALIBAN against Russian occupation of
Afghanistan------similar results

 

[irosie91]

Ollie North reporting from Mosul...predicting it will take months. Obabble still not arming the Kurds. Obabble is an asshole.

much as I sympathize with the kurds-------the idea of arming them makes me itch

 

[deltex1]

Ollie North reporting from Mosul...predicting it will take months. Obabble still not arming the Kurds. Obabble is an asshole.

much as I sympathize with the kurds-------the idea of arming them makes me itch

If they're on our side...arm them. Are they any worse than the Shia or Sunni?

 

[irosie91]

Ollie North reporting from Mosul...predicting it will take months. Obabble still not arming the Kurds. Obabble is an asshole.

much as I sympathize with the kurds-------the idea of arming them makes me itch

If they're on our side...arm them. Are they any worse than the Shia or Sunni?

we armed the MUJAHADEEN from Pakistan in the 1980s---"in order to fight the Russians"-----I remember it well.
I remember reading ADULATIONS of the MUJAHADEEN in
the popular press-----if my memory serves---even in NEWSWEEK. I was not all that delighted.------I have known LOTS of Pakistanis----sunnis from what was then WEST PAKISTAN-------good people but considering the propaganda to which they were subjected since kindergarten about THE WEST-----I would be reluctant to put a cap-gun
in their hands-------the other factor is their take on ISLAAAM---even the utterly non-religious muttered the canards. ----turns out (blush) I was RIGHT-----the mujahadeen of the 1980s are the TALIBAN today-------in the 1980s thru 90s----Pakistanis I knew BOASTED of relatives and school mates
IN THE NOBLE GROUP. I sympathize with kurds----they have a right to PROTECTION-----but arm them??? sheeeesh------how would that pan out?

 

[Moonglow]

Ollie North reporting from Mosul...predicting it will take months. Obabble still not arming the Kurds. Obabble is an asshole.

McConnell and McCain cover those bases..

 

[Moonglow]

Ollie North reporting from Mosul...predicting it will take months. Obabble still not arming the Kurds. Obabble is an asshole.

much as I sympathize with the kurds-------the idea of arming them makes me itch

If they're on our side...arm them. Are they any worse than the Shia or Sunni?

we armed the MUJAHADEEN from Pakistan in the 1980s---"in order to fight the Russians"-----I remember it well.
I remember reading ADULATIONS of the MUJAHADEEN in
the popular press-----if my memory serves---even in NEWSWEEK. I was not all that delighted.------I have known LOTS of Pakistanis----sunnis from what was then WEST PAKISTAN-------good people but considering the propaganda to which they were subjected since kindergarten about THE WEST-----I would be reluctant to put a cap-gun
in their hands-------the other factor is their take on ISLAAAM---even the utterly non-religious muttered the canards. ----turns out (blush) I was RIGHT-----the mujahadeen of the 1980s are the TALIBAN today-------in the 1980s thru 90s----Pakistanis I knew BOASTED of relatives and school mates
IN THE NOBLE GROUP. I sympathize with kurds----they have a right to PROTECTION-----but arm them??? sheeeesh------how would that pan out?

Rambo made a movie with them....to show solidarity...

 

[irosie91]

Ollie North reporting from Mosul...predicting it will take months. Obabble still not arming the Kurds. Obabble is an asshole.

McConnell and McCain cover those bases..

really? good? McCain is OVER THERE?

 

[irosie91]

Ollie North reporting from Mosul...predicting it will take months. Obabble still not arming the Kurds. Obabble is an asshole.

much as I sympathize with the kurds-------the idea of arming them makes me itch

If they're on our side...arm them. Are they any worse than the Shia or Sunni?

we armed the MUJAHADEEN from Pakistan in the 1980s---"in order to fight the Russians"-----I remember it well.
I remember reading ADULATIONS of the MUJAHADEEN in
the popular press-----if my memory serves---even in NEWSWEEK. I was not all that delighted.------I have known LOTS of Pakistanis----sunnis from what was then WEST PAKISTAN-------good people but considering the propaganda to which they were subjected since kindergarten about THE WEST-----I would be reluctant to put a cap-gun
in their hands-------the other factor is their take on ISLAAAM---even the utterly non-religious muttered the canards. ----turns out (blush) I was RIGHT-----the mujahadeen of the 1980s are the TALIBAN today-------in the 1980s thru 90s----Pakistanis I knew BOASTED of relatives and school mates
IN THE NOBLE GROUP. I sympathize with kurds----they have a right to PROTECTION-----but arm them??? sheeeesh------how would that pan out?

Rambo made a movie with them....to show solidarity...

moonie------are you posting thru your ass?