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Liz Cheney says Trump appears to have been ‘personally involved in planning’ 6 Jan insurrection

ThisIsMe

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ThisIsMe wrote: I'm not normalizing (DJT) him, I'm just trying to point out the fallacy of trying to enact a plan that he knows is going to be scrutinized 9 ways to Sunday, if he knows it's illegal. 21POST09-POST#0922

Correll wrote: Not assumes stuff and then pretends that they are facts. And that other people "know" the same facts he knows. 20NOV10-POST#0930

NFBW wrote: It would be a sign of integrity and decency ThisIsMe , if your friend and fellow DJT normalizer Correll would provide substance with his comments containing lies about me before going back into hiding. His false accusations that I say untrue “stuff” is way too broad and vague to counter in a most reasonable and factual manner so I will just say for now that Correll Is a liar in general to write that I assume “stuff” and then I pretend that they are facts. I never pretended that any stuff is a fact in my life - Correll is a liar. 20NOV12-POST#1003

NFBW wrote:: When you write ThisIsMe that you are trying to point out the fallacy of trying to enact a plan that DJT knows is going to be scrutinized 9 ways to Sunday, if DJT knows it's illegal I do not believe that to be a reasonable statement of fact and here is why. - - - DJT has repeatedly shown that he does not care about legality/constitutionality as evidenced by continuing his BIG LIE even after mid-December when all 50 states certified their electors in preparation for Jan6. Plus the fact that DJT has his major motive in keeping his big lie going because of the golden cash cow the big lie has become to inspire and bilk $millions from his dumbassed supporters and mega donors after he in reality was a big time loser on November 3. 20NOV12-POST#1003
OK, so you believe that Trump knew what he was doing was illegal. Got it.

Because I don't want to retype the same argument again, for the umpteenth time, I'll just say, for obvious reasons, that doesn't make sense.
 

NotfooledbyW

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ThisIsMe wrote: OK, so you believe that Trump knew what he was doing was illegal. 21NOV13-POST#1029

NFBW wrote: No. I do not believe that. I do not know who you are having a discussion with but this is what I believe as I stated in my post that you apparently have not read. 21NOV13-POST#1023

NFBW wrote:: When you write ThisIsMe that you are trying to point out the fallacy of trying to enact a plan that DJT knows is going to be scrutinized 9 ways to Sunday, if DJT knows it's illegal I do not believe that to be a reasonable statement of fact and here is why. - - - DJT has repeatedly shown that he does not care about legality/constitutionality as evidenced by continuing his BIG LIE even after mid-December when all 50 states certified their electors in preparation for Jan6. Plus the fact that DJT has his major motive in keeping his big lie going because of the golden cash cow the big lie has become to inspire and bilk $millions from his dumbassed supporters and mega donors after he in reality was a big time loser on November 3. 20NOV12-POST#1003

NFBW wrote: Well then ThisIsMe , if you cannot counter the points that I am making then just admit it. It makes no sense that you keep repeating the same point against an argument that I have not made. Why don’t you try to find a new way to attempt to normalize DJT. But I am telling you right now there is really no way to normalize DJT specifically after he inspired the riot at the US Capitol on January 6 which was an attempt to try and overturn the election in order to bilk millions from the Babbitts of this world. That’s not normal, it cannot be normal.
21NOV13-POST#1023
 

ThisIsMe

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ThisIsMe wrote: OK, so you believe that Trump knew what he was doing was illegal. 21NOV13-POST#1029

NFBW wrote: No. I do not believe that. I do not know who you are having a discussion with but this is what I believe as I stated in my post that you apparently have not read. 21NOV13-POST#1023

NFBW wrote:: When you write ThisIsMe that you are trying to point out the fallacy of trying to enact a plan that DJT knows is going to be scrutinized 9 ways to Sunday, if DJT knows it's illegal I do not believe that to be a reasonable statement of fact and here is why. - - - DJT has repeatedly shown that he does not care about legality/constitutionality as evidenced by continuing his BIG LIE even after mid-December when all 50 states certified their electors in preparation for Jan6. Plus the fact that DJT has his major motive in keeping his big lie going because of the golden cash cow the big lie has become to inspire and bilk $millions from his dumbassed supporters and mega donors after he in reality was a big time loser on November 3. 20NOV12-POST#1003

NFBW wrote: Well then ThisIsMe , if you cannot counter the points that I am making then just admit it. It makes no sense that you keep repeating the same point against an argument that I have not made. Why don’t you try to find a new way to attempt to normalize DJT. But I am telling you right now there is really no way to normalize DJT specifically after he inspired the riot at the US Capitol on January 6 which was an attempt to try and overturn the election in order to bilk millions from the Babbitts of this world. That’s not normal, it cannot be normal.
21NOV13-POST#1023
I understand all.of that. You are not understanding that there can only be 2 ways of it. Either he KNEW what he was doing was illegal/unconstitutional or he didn't know it was illegal/unconstitutional. Which is it?
 

NotfooledbyW

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ThisIsMe wrote: OK, so you believe that Trump knew what he was doing was illegal. 21NOV13-POST#1021

No, I do not believe Trump “knew” comprehended or understood, like a normal President or cognizant human being would know whether or not (directing Pence to refuse to accept the certification of the Biden electors based on the following overt, bold faced, indisputable LIE that DJT blurted out, among many lies on the morning of the insurrection) was or was not constitutional - DJT does not care. It is inconceivable that he cares. DJT told one lie that was a most crucial component in the overt attempt to do through protest and violence what DJT wanted Pence and his allies in Congress to do - to steal an election from the overall national majority that voted against him in seven states that he lost. How in the hell am I supposed to know if DJT knew it was illegal and unconstitutional. I KNOW DJT was acting outside the Constitution beyond a shadow of a doubt because he told one very specific lie in order to keep the con going and alive among his bold anti-democracy supporters like Oldestyle and Death Angel etc , and for milk-toast feeble minded Americans in general such as you ThisIsMe and Correll who tolerate the con and all it’s lying. - - - Think about whether or not you believe DJT lied when he was inciting his crowd to march with him to the Capitol to fight to save America from the seven states he lost. DJT said the states wanted their certifications back in the following excerpt: 21NOV14-POST#1027

“””” States want to revote. The states got defrauded, They were given false information. They voted on it. Now they want to recertify. They want it back.”
- - - DJT lied to the vigilante mob he gathered on Jan6

ttps://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2021-01-13/transcript-of-trumps-speech-at-rally-before-us-capitol-riot?context=amp

Trump rallying the forces at noon January 6, 2021: - - - “John is one of the most brilliant lawyers in the country, and he looked at this and he said, “What an absolute disgrace that this can be happening to our Constitution.”

And he looked at Mike Pence, and I hope Mike is going to do the right thing. I hope so. I hope so. - - - Because if Mike Pence does the right thing, we win the election. All he has to do, all this is, this is from the number one, or certainly one of the top, Constitutional lawyers in our country. He has the absolute right to do it. We’re supposed to protect our country, support our country, support our Constitution, and protect our constitution. - - - States want to revote. The states got defrauded, They were given false information. They voted on it. Now they want to recertify. They want it back. All Vice President Pence has to do is send it back to the states to recertify and we become president and you are the happiest people.” 21JAN06-DJT-jEASTMAN “”””

NFBW wrote: That lie, by a sitting President cannot produce a “constitutional” result of overturning an election that they lost. 21NOV14-POST#1027
 
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ThisIsMe

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ThisIsMe wrote: OK, so you believe that Trump knew what he was doing was illegal. 21NOV13-POST#1021

No, I do not believe Trump “knew” comprehended or understood, like a normal President or cognizant human being would know whether or not (directing Pence to refuse to accept the certification of the Biden electors based on the following overt, bold faced, indisputable LIE that DJT blurted out, among many lies on the morning of the insurrection) was or was not constitutional - DJT does not care. It is inconceivable that he cares. DJT told one lie that was a most crucial component in the overt attempt to do through protest and violence what DJT wanted Pence and his allies in Congress to do - to steal an election from the overall national majority that voted against him in seven states that he lost. How in the hell am I supposed to know if DJT knew it was illegal and unconstitutional. I KNOW DJT was acting outside the Constitution beyond a shadow of a doubt because he told one very specific lie in order to keep the con going and alive among his bold anti-democracy supporters like Oldestyle and Death Angel etc , and for milk-toast feeble minded Americans in general such as you ThisIsMe and Correll who tolerate the con and all it’s lying. - - - Think about whether or not you believe DJT lied when he was inciting his crowd to march with him to the Capitol to fight to save America from the seven states he lost. DJT said the states wanted their certifications back in the following excerpt: 21NOV14-POST#1027

“””” States want to revote. The states got defrauded, They were given false information. They voted on it. Now they want to recertify. They want it back.”
- - - DJT lied to the vigilante mob he gathered on Jan6

ttps://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2021-01-13/transcript-of-trumps-speech-at-rally-before-us-capitol-riot?context=amp

Trump rallying the forces at noon January 6, 2021: - - - “John is one of the most brilliant lawyers in the country, and he looked at this and he said, “What an absolute disgrace that this can be happening to our Constitution.”

And he looked at Mike Pence, and I hope Mike is going to do the right thing. I hope so. I hope so. - - - Because if Mike Pence does the right thing, we win the election. All he has to do, all this is, this is from the number one, or certainly one of the top, Constitutional lawyers in our country. He has the absolute right to do it. We’re supposed to protect our country, support our country, support our Constitution, and protect our constitution. - - - States want to revote. The states got defrauded, They were given false information. They voted on it. Now they want to recertify. They want it back. All Vice President Pence has to do is send it back to the states to recertify and we become president and you are the happiest people.” 21JAN06-DJT-jEASTMAN “”””

NFBW wrote: That lie, by a sitting President cannot produce a “constitutional” result of overturning an election that they lost. 21NOV14-POST#1027
OK, so then you believe that Trump didn't know whether or not the plan was illegal or unconstitutional, he just did it?

I don't buy that, and I don't think you do either. There is no way he didn't know the legal and constitutional implications of what he was doing.

He either believed he had legal and constitutional justification for the plan, or he believed he didn't. I don't buy "he just did it and didn't know the implications".

If he didn't think he had legal and constitutional grounds to attempt the plan, then, I don't think he does it. It wouldn't make sense to enact something he KNEW was wrong, because the whole country was watching. In doing something like that, you HAVE to think you're in the right.

By the way, you keep intersecting, randomly, names of other posters, throughout your responses. It's odd. Are you sure you're not an advanced bot? Lol. Do you know "saltydancin"?
 

NotfooledbyW

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ThisIsMe wrote: OK, so then you believe that Trump didn't know whether or not the plan was illegal or unconstitutional, he just did it? 21NOV14-POST#1028

NFBW wrote: Why do you feel the need to tell me what I believe? - - - Because I prefer to deal only with the facts, I am telling you that I do not know whether DJT knew or didn’t know that the Eastman plan was unconstitutional, or if it might work, I just know that he tried to follow it by pressuring Pence to do it based on the big lie that I told you about. - - - There is no way that I can know what is going on inside the head of a deranged man. - - - I see that you have not commented on DJT‘s lie that seven states wanted PENCE to send their certified results back. It is a lie and there is no excuse for DJT stating that lie to the mob that he promoted and assembled on January 6 to pressure Mike Pence and Congress to send the certifications back. That lie was to provoke an unconstitutional act in an attempt to defraud the government of the United States of America. And all you wanna do is take part in trying to read DJT’s mind. - - - So why are you avoiding discussing his big lie ThisIsMe that seven states that he lost wanted their certified results back.m? - - - That is a lie. No state wanted those results back. It never happened. DJT made it up. And he incited the crowd that he was speaking to because it gave them hope that he was going to win if MIKE PENCE did the right thing. - - - Did DJT think that lie to subvert the election was going to work? Who the fuck knows? - - - Do you think DJT cared if his plan was going to work? - - - I see DJT desperately throwing shit at the wall and hoping something sticks, … why can’t you? - - - And there’s the issue DJT just wanted to keep generating expectations of a win among his base and big donors so they keep sending him lots and lots of money. 21NOV14-POST#1029
 
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NotfooledbyW

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ThisIsMe wrote: In doing something like that, you HAVE to think you're in the right. 21NOV14-POST#1028

NFBW wrote: Trump told his vigilante mob on the ellipse right before telling them to march to the Capitol to take the law into their own hands. because “States want to revote. The states got defrauded, They were given false information. They voted on it. Now they want to recertify. They want it back. All Vice President Pence has to do is send it back to the states to recertify and we become president and you are the happiest”

It was a lie. No states, as in zero out of fifty, wanted their certifications back and even if they did, it wouid make no difference because there is no constitutional way to get their certifications back. Are you telling me ThisIsMe that DJT thought telling that lie was right because he thought he was right to tell that lie? 21NOV14-POST#1030
 

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ThisIsMe wrote: In doing something like that, you HAVE to think you're in the right. 21NOV14-POST#1028

NFBW wrote: referring back to my ( 21OCT26-POST#401 ) where I was discussing Eastman with struth but I have not seen where you have ever commented on anything regarding Eastman prior to and ever since Trump’s Jan6 Lawyer, who wrote the plan to steal the election from Biden, was subpoenaed to testify before the Committee that you say ThisIsMe is too biased against the victim and the far right and the white evangelical Christian’s precious DJT, to find a single fact let alone the truth about everything that happened on Jan6. - - - So do you ThisIsMe think Eastman was in the right to tell lies to the angry Trump voters just as the Pro-Trump militia identified as the indicted Oath Keepers were preparing to initiate their long planned Oldestyle attack on the US Capitol to carry out the exact wording of the Eastman Plan? 21NOV15-POST#1032

NFBW wrote: Here are some excerpts from ( 21OCT26-POST#401 ) to refresh your memory:

“”” Capitol riot committee to subpoena Trump lawyer who authored coup memo: report “”” John Wright October 26, 2021 Capitol riot committee to subpoena Trump lawyer who authored coup memo: report

NFBW wrote: Then Eastman should be eager to talk to the House Committee about the impact his legal advice had on DJT’s attempt to overturn the election and the riot that Eastman helped incite when he lied to the gathered mob 21OCT26-POST#401

“”” John Eastman, an endowed professor and constitutional law scholar at Chapman, spoke alongside Trump’s personal attorney Rudy Giuliani at the “Save America” rally Jan. 6, making the unsubstantiated claim that “secret folders” inside ballot-counting machines skewed both the presidential and Georgia Senate race results in Democrats’ favor.”””

NFBW wrote: Constitutional lawyers close to a President who lost an election should not lie to a mob who believe they are attending a “Save America” rally and March to the Capitol to stop what worthless politicians were doing there to transfer power to the winners 21OCT26-POST#401 “”””” re-posted 21NOV15-POST#1032


NFBW wrote: Are you curious yet ThisIsMe about Bannon’s participation and communications with Trump and all his associates at the ‘command center’ at the Willard Hotel o Jan5 and as the attack on the Capitol commenced apparently led by the OATH KEEPERS who were also at the Willard Hotel 21NOV15-POST#1032

ThisIsMe wrote: Again, as was previously mentioned, bannon left the white house years before the capitol riot, so, why even subpoena him? Why does schiff feel the need to threaten him, for something he had no part of? 21OCT12-POST#53
 
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Faun

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Why wouldn't you use non lethal force to stop said mob? You know...LIKE POLICE USED AGAINST LIBERAL PROTESTERS ALL ACROSS THE COUNTRY FOR THE BETTER PART OF TWO FREAKING YEARS!!! Why is it that an unarmed conservative protester that hadn't hurt anyone can be shot at point blank range by an officer laying in wait...while literally thousands of liberals protesters were allowed to loot, burn and assault Police officers in dozens of violent riots and yet not a single one of them was executed like Ashli Babbitt?
Because you can't keep a violent mob out without lethal force. You'll note, that violent mob entered virtually every other part of the building they wanted when lethal force wasn't employed.
 

NotfooledbyW

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Because you can't keep a violent mob out without lethal force. You'll note, that violent mob entered virtually every other part of the building they wanted when lethal force wasn't employed
And at the point where Babbitt was part of a marauding mob searching for lawmakers she (1) was getting dangerously close to lawmakers and (2) she was the first dumbfuck Trump voter with a violent mob likely to follow her through the opening she was attempting to get through.

Officer Byrd did what he thought he needed to do to protect himself and the lawmakers not from just one harmless protester. He had to be aware that there were tens of thousands of angry Trump voters surrounding the Capitol. He had no way of knowing whether one would follow the first idiot through the window or one hundred .. if he let her come through.

Oldestyle needs to find a way to focus on reality and not the illusion that Babbitt was just a protester in a hallway all alone who could be placed under arreste and managed by one police officer with not much to do that day.
 
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NotfooledbyW

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ThisIsMe wrote: If he didn't think he had legal and constitutional grounds to attempt the plan, then, I don't think he does it. 21NOV14-POST#102

NFBW wrote: DJT did it, he really did it. So the real problem in America is you ThisIsMe .- - - America survived Trumpism’s Jan6-2021 attempt to overturn the election because a few Republican election officials in key states and the leadership of the US Military put honor, the truth , the law and the Constitution thankfully above your Trumpism ThisIsMe. You need to cease embracing Trumpism if you truly love America and want to live in a multicultural truly unique and viable free society. 21NOV16-POST#1035

NFBW wrote: America’s problem is not DJT himself and it won’t be resolved by finding DJT guilty of some crime and frog marching him to prison with chants of lock him up. - - - America’s problem is that Americans like you ThisIsMe @Correwho saw what DJT inspired on Jan6, work so hard to deny reality and facts to excuse and normalize the brazen attack on democracy that DJT is openly and without a shadow of a doubt guilty of committing against the CONSTITUTION of the UNITED STATES of AMERICA. 21NOV16-POST#1035
 

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