Liberals are beta / Conservatives are Alpha (Forum Study)

Publius1787

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Liberals are beta / Conservatives are Alpha (Forum Study)

No, this is not a flame/troll thread. After a few days of reviewing the thread below I whish to tell you what I've concluded. I posted this in the clean debate section because I do not want a bunch of name calling and diversions, but solid analysis. To review the same thread, click below.

http://www.usmessageboard.com/polit...y-most-embodies-the-alpha-male-mentality.html
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My Findings

Liberals of this forum have mostly accepted beta status for the following reasons.

1. They are more likely to criticize alphas (a default assumption of beta status)
2. Many liberals perceive alphas as conservative which is why many of them criticize alphas.
3. Few defend liberals as alphas
4. Liberals are more likely refuse to contribute on the basis that "The thread is stupid."

Conservatives of this forum have mostly accepted alpha status for the following reasons.

1. They proudly assume the title of alpha
2. They criticize liberals as betas
3. They likewise perceive conservatives as alpha
4. They are more likely not to call the thread stupid.





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Now there are a number of holes due to the limitations of utilizing a forum such as this. I also did not define either alpha or beta, but allowed people to define it for themselves. I also did not define liberal or conservative. There are plenty more but you get the gist.
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Implications

Liberals view themselves as betas and are threatened by the power of the alpha. They are more insecure than conservatives, and thus, this is perhaps the reason they adopt a more collectivist ideology. A more collectivist ideology dictates that everyone pull together for security. The alphas pose a threat to this security.

Bing a beta, liberals are more passive on foreign policy issues.

Conservatives view themselves as alphas and are more independent. They have confidence in themselves, and thus, this is perhaps the reason they adopt a more individualistic tone. A more individualistic ideology dictates that everyone should be left to their own devises so as long as they aren't hurting another (Harm Principle). Collectivized betas pose a threat to individualists in a democratic system.

Being an Alpha, conservatives are more aggressive on foreign policy issues.

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So what do you wish to add, critique, or object to in a reasonable manner?
 
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Publius1787

Publius1787

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Conservatives are hunter gathers and moderates are creators.

Liberals are just confused moderates that have self hatred of themselves.
Fair enough. Utilizing an example or two, where does this self hatred come from?

And conservatives can't be creators? I would figure their individual nature demands that they create. Creativity is at the heart of self sustainment and making the most out of negative liberty. Are liberals not those who depend on the creativity of others so as to establish a higher degree of security and/or positive liberty? Isn't it these differences that make up the divide of the two ideologies bent toward either negative or positive liberty?
 
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Tresha91203

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Progressives are the explorers, visionaries, dreamers, etc. Conservatives are the order, structure, security, established, etc. Liberals (on either end of the yardstick) are the philosophers, the thinkers. There are degrees of each. Each has strengths and flaws.

I don't find either particularly more Alpha. The leaders on both ends seem to be Alpha to me. The people just living our lives appear to be Beta on that scale (although many will be Alpha within their smaller circle). Politically, the Alphas fight their fight during the season to determine who THE Alpha is. Then, the Betas grumble but submit and pretty much just go on about their lives.
 
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Publius1787

Publius1787

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If you have to claim to be an alpha, you're not.
I think the criticisms of alphas speak louder than the claims of being an alpha. Nevertheless, I ceded that point in the op.
 

jasonnfree

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Liberals are beta / Conservatives are Alpha (Forum Study)

No, this is not a flame/troll thread. After a few days of reviewing the thread below I whish to tell you what I've concluded. I posted this in the clean debate section because I do not want a bunch of name calling and diversions, but solid analysis. To review the same thread, click below.

http://www.usmessageboard.com/polit...y-most-embodies-the-alpha-male-mentality.html
-------------------------------------------------------------------





My Findings

Liberals of this forum have mostly accepted beta status for the following reasons.

1. They are more likely to criticize alphas (a default assumption of beta status)
2. Many liberals perceive alphas as conservative which is why many of them criticize alphas.
3. Few defend liberals as alphas
4. Liberals are more likely refuse to contribute on the basis that "The thread is stupid."

Conservatives of this forum have mostly accepted alpha status for the following reasons.

1. They proudly assume the title of alpha
2. They criticize liberals as betas
3. They likewise perceive conservatives as alpha
4. They are more likely not to call the thread stupid.





---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Now there are a number of holes due to the limitations of utilizing a forum such as this. I also did not define either alpha or beta, but allowed people to define it for themselves. I also did not define liberal or conservative. There are plenty more but you get the gist.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------





Implications

Liberals view themselves as betas and are threatened by the power of the alpha. They are more insecure than conservatives, and thus, this is perhaps the reason they adopt a more collectivist ideology. A more collectivist ideology dictates that everyone pull together for security. The alphas pose a threat to this security.

Bing a beta, liberals are more passive on foreign policy issues.

Conservatives view themselves as alphas and are more independent. They have confidence in themselves, and thus, this is perhaps the reason they adopt a more individualistic tone. A more individualistic ideology dictates that everyone should be left to their own devises so as long as they aren't hurting another (Harm Principle). Collectivized betas pose a threat to individualists in a democratic system.

Being an Alpha, conservatives are more aggressive on foreign policy issues.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So what do you wish to add, critique, or object to in a reasonable manner?
Howard Zinn, notorious liberal, actually engaged the Germans in their own backyard by bombing them. The only time Dick Cheney, notorious conservative, shot someone was when he was hunting and most likely drunk.
Which one's an alpha? beta?
 
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Publius1787

Publius1787

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Liberals are beta / Conservatives are Alpha (Forum Study)

No, this is not a flame/troll thread. After a few days of reviewing the thread below I whish to tell you what I've concluded. I posted this in the clean debate section because I do not want a bunch of name calling and diversions, but solid analysis. To review the same thread, click below.

http://www.usmessageboard.com/polit...y-most-embodies-the-alpha-male-mentality.html
-------------------------------------------------------------------





My Findings

Liberals of this forum have mostly accepted beta status for the following reasons.

1. They are more likely to criticize alphas (a default assumption of beta status)
2. Many liberals perceive alphas as conservative which is why many of them criticize alphas.
3. Few defend liberals as alphas
4. Liberals are more likely refuse to contribute on the basis that "The thread is stupid."

Conservatives of this forum have mostly accepted alpha status for the following reasons.

1. They proudly assume the title of alpha
2. They criticize liberals as betas
3. They likewise perceive conservatives as alpha
4. They are more likely not to call the thread stupid.





---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Now there are a number of holes due to the limitations of utilizing a forum such as this. I also did not define either alpha or beta, but allowed people to define it for themselves. I also did not define liberal or conservative. There are plenty more but you get the gist.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------





Implications

Liberals view themselves as betas and are threatened by the power of the alpha. They are more insecure than conservatives, and thus, this is perhaps the reason they adopt a more collectivist ideology. A more collectivist ideology dictates that everyone pull together for security. The alphas pose a threat to this security.

Bing a beta, liberals are more passive on foreign policy issues.

Conservatives view themselves as alphas and are more independent. They have confidence in themselves, and thus, this is perhaps the reason they adopt a more individualistic tone. A more individualistic ideology dictates that everyone should be left to their own devises so as long as they aren't hurting another (Harm Principle). Collectivized betas pose a threat to individualists in a democratic system.

Being an Alpha, conservatives are more aggressive on foreign policy issues.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So what do you wish to add, critique, or object to in a reasonable manner?
Howard Zinn, notorious liberal, actually engaged the Germans in their own backyard by bombing them. The only time Dick Cheney, notorious conservative, shot someone was when he was hunting and most likely drunk.
Which one's an alpha? beta?
I read Howard Zinns Peoples History and I could not believe the amount of information he left out. It was victim this and victim that throughout without true historical and cultural context. It was an American hate epic and highly non-academic.

In any case, the results above have nothing to do with either Zinn or Cheney, but liberal and conservative alpha/beta culture of the forum (with a larger implication). It does not attest that all liberals are beta and all conservatives are alpha. I used the words like "more likely" to make my case. What you just did was pick two people, tossed them together, and expected that case to be the standard. I do not wish to turn this into an off topic flame/troll thread in the clean debate forum. I have named no names in the op and instead concentrated on the larger picture. You want to make a thread about Zinn vs. Cheney elsewhere I will gladly address it.
 

AquaAthena

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Liberals are beta / Conservatives are Alpha (Forum Study)

It really does seem that way, based upon my observations.
 

G.T.

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Conservatives can be narcissists and arrogant.
Liberals can be pious and arrogant.

Neither is more or less alpha as an entire group.

Each person here is an attention whore, no other reason to be "thread creating" under anonymous user handles.
 

Sallow

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The topic is a flame/troll topic.

Hopefully the mods move this to the appropriate forum.
 

kiwiman127

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In general, neither liberals or conservatives are Alphas because they are dedicated followers of an ideology. Alphas are not followers, period.
So the true alphas are the fence sitters?:confused:
If they are alphas, they'd make their own decisions and not let an ideology make their decisions for them. Is that fence sitting or not?
Calling someone who thinks for themselves a fence-sitter is a cop-out.
 

G.T.

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Being independent is not fence sitting. That's just an intellectually lazy thing to say.
 

Iceweasel

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In general, neither liberals or conservatives are Alphas because they are dedicated followers of an ideology. Alphas are not followers, period.
So the true alphas are the fence sitters?:confused:
If they are alphas, they'd make their own decisions and not let an ideology make their decisions for them. Is that fence sitting or not?
Calling someone who thinks for themselves a fence-sitter is a cop-out.
No, it's a cop out to assume that someone who develops their ideology over time follows the ideology and the "independant" is somehow superior. Why can't an independant thinker arrive at the conclusion that consevativism (or liberalism) is the right answer? No two liberal or conservatives agree on everything so your point makes no sense. Except that you were trying to demonstrate some superior outlook.
 

G.T.

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So the true alphas are the fence sitters?:confused:
If they are alphas, they'd make their own decisions and not let an ideology make their decisions for them. Is that fence sitting or not?
Calling someone who thinks for themselves a fence-sitter is a cop-out.
No, it's a cop out to assume that someone who develops their ideology over time follows the ideology and the "independant" is somehow superior. Why can't an independant thinker arrive at the conclusion that consevativism (or liberalism) is the right answer? No two liberal or conservatives agree on everything so your point makes no sense. Except that you were trying to demonstrate some superior outlook.
It is not rational to be all conservative or all liberal. Independent is rational because it properly labels the paradigm described in the last sentence.
 

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