Is Bush a robot with no heart?

[CharlestonChad]

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,10117,19850334-401,00.html

US President George W. Bush has used his first veto to block legislation expanding embryonic stem cell research, putting him at odds with top scientists, most Americans and some in his own Republican Party.

"It crosses a moral boundary," Mr Bush said.
Mr Bush acted after the US Senate yesterday approved the legislation, which has also been passed by the House of Representatives.

But neither chamber expects to have the two-thirds majority needed to override the veto.

In 2001, Mr Bush allowed scientists to use 78 stem-cell lines then in existence, most of which proved unsuitable for research.

But he opposes expanded federally-funded research because it entails destruction of human embryos.


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The president had long vowed to veto the bill because of his deeply held moral beliefs that destroying human life is wrong - even in its earliest form, and even in the interest of research that could lead to potentially life-saving medical breakthroughs.

The president has planned a White House signing ceremony for alternative bioethics legislation known as "The Fetus Farming Prohibition Act."

Present for the announcement were several families with "snowflake babies" - children conceived via donated embryos left over from in vitro fertilisation (IVF) treatments.

The stem cell research endorsed by the Senate yesterday would have used leftover IVF embryos, which opponents say is morally wrong because human life is destroyed in the process.

The president vetoed the Stem Cell Research Enhancement Act despite widespread support by the US public and ardent backers in Congress, who had urged Bush today to reconsider his stance.

The Senate approved the measure by a 63-37 vote -- a margin too small to override a presidential veto.

Stem cell research advocates say the technique shows promise for the treatment of degenerative diseases such as Alzheimer's and Parkinson's, and for diabetes.

The bill would have lifted rules set by Mr Bush in 2001 making federal funds available only for research on a small number of embryonic stem cell lines which existed at that time.

Government money is barred from supporting work on new lines derived from human embryos - a restriction that opponents say hampers overall research.

In London, Martin Rees, the president of the Royal Society - Britain's de facto academy of sciences - said the US policy "is slowing down the global effort to develop therapies for a range of diseases and illnesses".

Democrats expressed dismay over Mr Bush's decision.


"With his swift veto today, the president may think he has put the issue of stem cell research behind him," said US Senator Ted Kennedy.

"But it is not over for the child with diabetes who struggles with endless injections of insulin. It is not over for those who must watch helplessly as a parent or spouse succumbs to the tremors of Parkinson's disease," said Senator Kennedy, a leading Democrat who vowed that politicians would take up the legislation again soon.

How can someone be so ignorant, self centered, heartless, and apathetic to veto a bill helping stem-cell research.

I don't care what he made on the SAT or how well he did in college, the man is an idiot.


IF you disagree with me, then please post something that shows that Bush is right on this issue.

 

[Gunny]

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,10117,19850334-401,00.html



How can someone be so ignorant, self centered, heartless, and apathetic to veto a bill helping stem-cell research.

I don't care what he made on the SAT or how well he did in college, the man is an idiot.


IF you disagree with me, then please post something that shows that Bush is right on this issue.

How can you lefties continually harangue about stem cell research that may someday lead to a cure for something. I consider anyone that wants to spend MY tax dollars on THAT to be ignorant, self-centered, and willing to beleive just about anything.

And, btw, just how many threads are you libs going to start on this topic, and in how many forums?

 

[CharlestonChad]

How can you lefties continually harangue about stem cell research that may someday lead to a cure for something. I consider anyone that wants to spend MY tax dollars on THAT to be ignorant, self-centered, and willing to beleive just about anything.

And, btw, just how many threads are you libs going to start on this topic, and in how many forums?

"lefties" AND "righties" want to pursue stem-cell research with more money. Infact, the only support Bush is getting is from the christian fundamentalist.

 

[Emmett]

Even if stem cell research produces desireabke results such as being able to cure genetic problems, diseases and cancer who do you think is going to have the result made available to them?

Do you think Willie Jackson is going to reap any benefit from it?

Get real! Only the very rich will feel any benefit from the results of stem cell. Why then, are the dems so stuck on it?

 

[Gunny]

"lefties" AND "righties" want to pursue stem-cell research with more money. Infact, the only support Bush is getting is from the christian fundamentalist.

That would be some "righties," and where from the right he is getting support is nothing more than speculation. I don't see it as particularly a "Chrisitian" issue, so no sale on that one.

I see it as something my tax dollars should not have fund. If you want to fund it, donate. No one's stopping you.

And I guess you aren't even going to take a stab at my last question. So far, we have a thread on this topic in Politics, Religion, and Current Events. I'm sure Education can use one, and of course, Legal Matter since I'm sure y'all lefties will be accusing Bush of doing something unconstitutional before it's all over.

 

[CharlestonChad]

Even if stem cell research produces desireabke results such as being able to cure genetic problems, diseases and cancer who do you think is going to have the result made available to them?

Do you think Willie Jackson is going to reap any benefit from it?

Willie Jackson already gets health care paid for my the upper and middle class.

 

[CharlestonChad]

That would be some "righties," and where from the right he is getting support is nothing more than speculation. I don't see it as particularly a "Chrisitian" issue, so no sale on that one.

http://policycouncil.nationaljourna...rica/38b45843-59b2-4280-9da4-7573bd47d016.htm

I see it as something my tax dollars should not have fund. If you want to fund it, donate. No one's stopping you.

That's pure bull shit. How can you be as dense as to say that your tax dollars shouldn't fund one of the only positive programs to come from our government in the last decade. You support killing people in other countries, but not saving American lives.

And I guess you aren't even going to take a stab at my last question. So far, we have a thread on this topic in Politics, Religion, and Current Events. I'm sure Education can use one, and of course, Legal Matter since I'm sure y'all lefties will be accusing Bush of doing something unconstitutional before it's all over.

I thought you were just making a poor attempt at a joke (similiar to the title I gave this thread). I'm sorry that 3 threads are enough get your panties in a wad.

 

[BaronVonBigmeat]

There is a reason government is funding stem cell research--private companies have given up on it, because it is a dead end for researchers. Private companies were all over it, but since it showed little promise, they have abandoned it. Government billions have not discovered a cure for cancer or AIDS, so don't sweat it too much.

Or at least that's what I read while thumbing through "The Politically Incorrect Guide to Science" at a bookstore. It's not really one of my pet issues, so feel free to correct me.

 

[CharlestonChad]

There is a reason government is funding stem cell research--private companies have given up on it, because it is a dead end for researchers. Private companies were all over it, but since it showed little promise, they have abandoned it. Government billions have not discovered a cure for cancer or AIDS, so don't sweat it too much.

Or at least that's what I read while thumbing through "The Politically Incorrect Guide to Science" at a bookstore. It's not really one of my pet issues, so feel free to correct me.

Did that book state whether they gave up because of the inability to produce desired results, or the inability to produce financially profitable results?

 

[JeffWartman]

Did that book state whether they gave up because of the inability to produce desired results, or the inability to produce financially profitable results?

Trust me, long term profit planning is something any company would take into consideration given the amount of profit that could be made if a Parkinson's or Alzheimer's, cancer or AIDS wonderdrug could be reasonably found.

The problem is the scientists recognized that the research was going nowhere.

And, in all honesty, I have NO moral problem with the use of stem cells for research. I welcome any attempt to attempt to cure those diseases through stem cell research. But it's not something that we should be throwing taxpayers money at.

 

[Gunny]

http://policycouncil.nationaljourna...rica/38b45843-59b2-4280-9da4-7573bd47d016.htm

Now THERE's an unbiased source.

That's pure bull shit. How can you be as dense as to say that your tax dollars shouldn't fund one of the only positive programs to come from our government in the last decade. You support killing people in other countries, but not saving American lives.

Bullshit would be calling embryonic stem cell research "positive," when it positively has produced NOTHING.

What I don't support is flushing my money down the toilet based on the pipedreams of nimrods.


I thought you were just making a poor attempt at a joke (similiar to the title I gave this thread). I'm sorry that 3 threads are enough get your panties in a wad.

Sorry to burst your late-night fantasy bubble, but I don't have any panties, bud. Obviously, you're just way into spinning on this one.

Run your suck all you want. Maybe you'll even have something worth reading at some point.

 

[CharlestonChad]

So it's okay for the radical christians on this board to post links for pro-jesus psuedo-biblical science websites and call that a source, but it's not okay for me to post a link from a biased source?

Here are some unbiased sites that might enlighten you.

http://stemcellfacts.ucsf.edu/

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/07/17/AR2006071701153.html

 

[CharlestonChad]

Trust me, long term profit planning is something any company would take into consideration given the amount of profit that could be made if a Parkinson's or Alzheimer's, cancer or AIDS wonderdrug could be reasonably found.

The problem is the scientists recognized that the research was going nowhere.

And, in all honesty, I have NO moral problem with the use of stem cells for research. I welcome any attempt to attempt to cure those diseases through stem cell research. But it's not something that we should be throwing taxpayers money at.

It CAN save lives. We throw taxpayers money at soooooooooooo many useless programs that do nothing to advance America or help anyone but special interest groups, and you choose to pick on a program that could actually make America a better place, and the world too.

 

[Gunny]

So it's okay for the radical christians on this board to post links for pro-jesus psuedo-biblical science websites and call that a source, but it's not okay for me to post a link from a biased source?

Here are some unbiased sites that might enlighten you.

http://stemcellfacts.ucsf.edu/

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/07/17/AR2006071701153.html

Which radical Chrisitians would THOSE be? You mean the Christians who continually have to answer the same "Prove There is a God" challenge three times a week in the religious forum posted by some radical, anti-religious types?

I can solve this little dilemna for you though .... it's not my board, post what you want. I merely asked a question that begs an answer.

And thanks but no thanks .... I already know all I need to know about embyonic stem cell research. If a bunch of tripe that relegates human life to a collection of cells sells you on what you want to hear, you are the one in need of education, not I.

 

[Gunny]

It CAN save lives. We throw taxpayers money at soooooooooooo many useless programs that do nothing to advance America or help anyone but special interest groups, and you choose to pick on a program that could actually make America a better place, and the world too.

Can it? You of course have evidence hidden from the rest of us? So far, barring the miraculous within the past few minutes, it has saved no one and cured nothing.

 

[Said1]

So it's okay for the radical christians on this board to post links for pro-jesus psuedo-biblical science websites and call that a source, but it's not okay for me to post a link from a biased source?

]

People do that here, outside of threads that evolve into some form of Christian discussions? I've never seen that, but I don't read everything, I'm not the Bonic Woman, ya know.

 

[fuzzykitten99]

In reading all the threads on this my conclusion is this.

Stem cell research could possibly save lives and cure all sorts of things. This is a great goal for any research. But this research Bush specifically vetoed federal funding on, is on human embryos.

Now, from what I have read, human embryos may serve better than adult stem cells, based on biology.

Personally, I am torn on whether or not this part is ok to me. I hear from both sides that the embryos are either left overs from IVF, and/or abortions. the latter of which, I am adamantly oppose unless the life of the mother is threatened. To me, the use of the aborted fetus for research makes it sound like they are trying to put sugar on bullshit and calling it apple pie.

Then I see all these celebrities, all of which make more money in a year than I will ever see in a lifetime. Many of the people I see pushing for government sponsorship, like Bill Gates and the late Christopher Reeve, are rolling in dough.

I want to know why they don't join together and invest in private research? The only answer I can come up with, is there is no guarantee of ever finding anything in this research, so they want everyone to pay for the gamble.

I even have seen a few of the liberals on here, when challenged with the same question, say there's no money in it. Well, then why put everyone's money into a program that many in this country are against, just to find out there is nothing in the research that can help anyone? We already are raped for taxes in this country, much of which goes to programs that are a waste.

 

[Bonnie]

Chad..Is Bush a robot with no heart?

No!!

 

[liberalogic]

How can you lefties continually harangue about stem cell research that may someday lead to a cure for something. I consider anyone that wants to spend MY tax dollars on THAT to be ignorant, self-centered, and willing to beleive just about anything.

And, btw, just how many threads are you libs going to start on this topic, and in how many forums?

Your tax dollars fund many things that you may not support. Don't single this out.

 

[Gunny]

People do that here, outside of threads that evolve into some form of Christian discussions? I've never seen that, but I don't read everything, I'm not the Bonic Woman, ya know.

Not what I heard ....