In 2020, God finally lost his patience with us and that's why all this bad stuff is happening

[LittleNipper]

The bad stuff happens generally when man thinks he doesn't need GOD. So, GOD obliges. And then those that don't believe in GOD blame HIM for what they themselves couldn't accomplish...

 

[The Original Tree]

Atheists will laugh......of course......

But it does stand to reason

Atheists are part of the problem.

They haughtily declare that man doesn't need God, but everything we see proves the opposite.

Look at Russia and China, both atheist countries.

Would you want to live in either?

I'm what's called a "troubled believer".

I give God credit for creation and all things.
Unfortunately, that includes a history of unbelievable horrors and evil on his planet Earth.

I cannot reconcile 3 year old babies being raped.
For that matter......why do Earth's creatures ALL need to kill another creature to survive? What a brutal creation.
The amount of Terror and horror that takes place on this planet every day defies a loving deity.

The short answer to your troubled mind is that we are in a fallen world. Adam forfeited his crown and throne to Lucifer. Lucifer is the god of this World now and has been ever since he caused the fall of man.

The Creator is Lord over all the Universe, but The Earth is a bit of enemy territory by a contractual obligation via Adam forfeiting his birthright.
When God gets involved in things on Earth, it is like an invasion. This is also why we are told to occupy. That is because we are to take enemy ground and hold it, until Christ comes.

Christ took the first steps in winning that back by leaving heaven and His throne to come in the form of man as The Second Adam, but the process is not finished.

The issue still remains though that The Title, Crown and Throne will not be transferred until The Father is satisfied with the number of true believers he has gathered in to the Son's Sheepfold. When that number and that day, that not even The Son knows is fulfilled, then the first seal on the deed to Earth will be broken and along with it the 1st seal judgment will be released on Lucifer, and his kingdom and all those who follow him, and so on and so forth until all the seals are broken, and The Deed is fully read and entered in to the record of the Court of Heaven and all the Judgments upon the usurper and his kingdom are completed.

That Land Deed or Title is the scroll in The Book of Revelation.

Once Christ Returns, the Earth will be restored as it once was, and the entire Earth will become as The Garden of Eden, and Christ will sit upon the throne as The Second Adam.

What church teaches the above?

Anyone who believes The Gospel knows that one of Christ’s Titles is written as The Second Adam.

That Satan is the god of this world is also in scripture. Otherwise also how could Satan offer Jesus when tempted by Satan all the kingdoms of this world if Jesus would just bow down to him.

Lucifer was not always ruler over Earth, man was, and man was created a little higher than the angels, but falling from grace out us under Satan’s dominion and below The Angels.

The return of Christ is about more than the redemption of man and the vanquishing of Evil. It is also about taking back possession of The Earth from the god of this world, Lucifer, now called Satan.

What church do you attend?

I don't attend any church. I dont believe there is a god, heaven or hell. There is no evidence for any religious garbage and you know it.
If you gave any, which I know you Don't, present it now.
I would appreciate it if you restrained yourself from belching lies about ghosts etc. it simply is Not true.

I was asking Original Tree what church he attended.. Pretty wild stuff.

It's 100% Scriptural. Your issue, is that you "love not the truth".

God will send if He hasn't already sent people such as this, strong delusions so that they will believe lies, and be damned by them.

 

[basquebromance]

if there is no God, the labels "good" and "evil" are simply opinions

 

[ding]

if there is no God, the labels "good" and "evil" are simply opinions

That all depends on if one believes that absolute truth can exist independent of God or not.

It's been my experience that most people who don't believe in God also don't believe in absolute truth. I can see how some might question the former but not the latter yet they still do.

 

[Bernhard]

if there is no God, the labels "good" and "evil" are simply opinions

That all depends on if one believes that absolute truth can exist independent of God or not.

It's been my experience that most people who don't believe in God also don't believe in absolute truth. I can see how some might question the former but not the latter yet they still do.

Hm. I do believe in God, yet don't think "good" and "evil" are absolutes.

It always depends on the situation. One attribute that is evil in one situation, may be good in another. Anger, for example. Most of the time, it's destructive and leads to bad consequences, it often results in hurting people, and that's evil. But if anger gives you the energy to overcome and injustice, it may be good. Likewise, no person is always entirely evil or entirely good. Any person will do a good thing one moment, and an evil thing the next.

Also, I don't think "evil" exists as an independent entity. Evil is the lack of good, the lack of virtue in a given situation. If I get angry and punch someone, it's not because evil tempted me to do so, but because I was lacking the good attribute of self-constraint in this situation.

 

[miketx]

We Americans have been rebelling against God since the sexual revolution in the 1960's.

That's when the birth control pill was invented, and after that, women decided they no longer needed to be moral and began to lead a promiscuous lifestyle of sex without meaning.

Abortion inevitably followed, because birth control doesn't always work, and after Roe v. Wade, our county began murdering babies by the millions.

Also, a nation that was once in Church every Sunday began to abandon prayer, and each generation became further and further from God and the Ten Commandments.

It had to follow from that that such things as mass shootings, drive-by shootings, serial killings, and all other manner of violence would escalate.

Sexual perversion has come out of dark hiding places and into the mainstream and now perversion is openly celebrated in our movies and TV shows while those who are moral are portrayed as villains.

2020 is simply the year that the spark of COVID lit fire to the whole rotting edifice of our rotten society and now that the fire has spread it may not be possible to stop it.

Why hasn't God attacked Russia and China? I know Trump may be protecting Russia, but surely not China.

 

[bodecea]

if there is no God, the labels "good" and "evil" are simply opinions

Not true....look to the Golden Rule

 

[The Original Tree]

We Americans have been rebelling against God since the sexual revolution in the 1960's.

That's when the birth control pill was invented, and after that, women decided they no longer needed to be moral and began to lead a promiscuous lifestyle of sex without meaning.

Abortion inevitably followed, because birth control doesn't always work, and after Roe v. Wade, our county began murdering babies by the millions.

Also, a nation that was once in Church every Sunday began to abandon prayer, and each generation became further and further from God and the Ten Commandments.

It had to follow from that that such things as mass shootings, drive-by shootings, serial killings, and all other manner of violence would escalate.

Sexual perversion has come out of dark hiding places and into the mainstream and now perversion is openly celebrated in our movies and TV shows while those who are moral are portrayed as villains.

2020 is simply the year that the spark of COVID lit fire to the whole rotting edifice of our rotten society and now that the fire has spread it may not be possible to stop it.

Why hasn't God attacked Russia and China? I know Trump may be protecting Russia, but surely not China.

Read Revelations and Ezekiel 38 and Isaiah 37.

God Destroys 90% of the combined armies of Russia, Turkey, China, Iran, Syria, and the other End Times Coalition which includes Libya, Sudan, Ethiopia, Somalian, Northern Africa, & Iraq when they swoop down like a cloud upon The Mountains of Israel to wipe The Hebrew Nation out.

The Earth's Population by the end of The 7 Year Tribulation will be reduced by at least 70% in 7 short years.

I would not want to be one "Left Behind" in that day.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Atheists will laugh......of course......

But it does stand to reason

Haha....no it doesn't. A magical being is grumpy at us and is making bad things happen? How childish and stupid.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

The bad stuff happens generally when man thinks he doesn't need GOD. So, GOD obliges.

Ah, so it was LACK of god that made god drown all the babies in Noahs flood. I swear a guy named Little Nipper told me otherwise.

Do you people even know what is coming out of your mouths next?

 

[ding]

if there is no God, the labels "good" and "evil" are simply opinions

That all depends on if one believes that absolute truth can exist independent of God or not.

It's been my experience that most people who don't believe in God also don't believe in absolute truth. I can see how some might question the former but not the latter yet they still do.

Hm. I do believe in God, yet don't think "good" and "evil" are absolutes.

It always depends on the situation. One attribute that is evil in one situation, may be good in another. Anger, for example. Most of the time, it's destructive and leads to bad consequences, it often results in hurting people, and that's evil. But if anger gives you the energy to overcome and injustice, it may be good. Likewise, no person is always entirely evil or entirely good. Any person will do a good thing one moment, and an evil thing the next.

Also, I don't think "evil" exists as an independent entity. Evil is the lack of good, the lack of virtue in a given situation. If I get angry and punch someone, it's not because evil tempted me to do so, but because I was lacking the good attribute of self-constraint in this situation.

I agree with most of that. No one is all good or all bad. Evil is not extant. It is the absence of good. But I do believe in a final sate of fact. Which is objective truth or reality. So while the line between good and evil maybe hard to see, there is a line. Good will arise from evil, but shouldn't be used to rationalize there is no line. All things work for good. We just don't always know how.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

We Americans have been rebelling against God since the sexual revolution in the 1960's.

This is just as idiotic, wrong, and ridiculous now as it was last October.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

The bad stuff happens generally when man thinks he doesn't need GOD. So, GOD obliges. And then those that don't believe in GOD blame HIM for what they themselves couldn't accomplish...

This is also idiotic, wrong, and ridiculous.

 

[beautress]

I read the Bible frequently and taught Sunday School for years while my kids were growing up. My impression is that God created us, that God is very good, and that he loves his creations. If one of us asks him for patience he will give patience to that believer.

It is also my understanding that he gave us a free will to do whatever we decide is the right thing to do. It a gift to have free will. Not every society gives that gift to everyone. That is why our American founders prayed together to end bad governance by the people who then ruled us.

I think our nation, once a glowing inspiration to people across the planet, has gone down the wrong path because many lost their traditional love and obedience to the Lord, God.

If we call on him, he answers with a patience for our impoverished attitudes or overly positive ones.

I'll say a little prayer asking God to renew our faith and tolerance for each other. And I pray believing that those who believe will be renewed in his holy presence. In the exquisite love for you that God has for each of you, amen.

 

[Bernhard]

if there is no God, the labels "good" and "evil" are simply opinions

That all depends on if one believes that absolute truth can exist independent of God or not.

It's been my experience that most people who don't believe in God also don't believe in absolute truth. I can see how some might question the former but not the latter yet they still do.

Hm. I do believe in God, yet don't think "good" and "evil" are absolutes.

It always depends on the situation. One attribute that is evil in one situation, may be good in another. Anger, for example. Most of the time, it's destructive and leads to bad consequences, it often results in hurting people, and that's evil. But if anger gives you the energy to overcome and injustice, it may be good. Likewise, no person is always entirely evil or entirely good. Any person will do a good thing one moment, and an evil thing the next.

Also, I don't think "evil" exists as an independent entity. Evil is the lack of good, the lack of virtue in a given situation. If I get angry and punch someone, it's not because evil tempted me to do so, but because I was lacking the good attribute of self-constraint in this situation.

I agree with most of that. No one is all good or all bad. Evil is not extant. It is the absence of good. But I do believe in a final sate of fact. Which is objective truth or reality. So while the line between good and evil maybe hard to see, there is a line. Good will arise from evil, but shouldn't be used to rationalize there is no line. All things work for good. We just don't always know how.

I agree, there is objective truth and reality. But I'm not sure if all things work for good.

I'd say all in creation strives towards God, without ever reaching Him. What does that mean? As I said above, God and creation are on opposite ends: God is endless, one and undivided, while creation has an end and is divided into myriads of tiny parts.

Creation striving towards God then means, it attempts to become more similar to God: When all the tiny, seperate parts of creation form structure to become less divided, they become more similar to the undivided oneness of God.

Dead matter forms certain structures already, but is limited. Plant life is much more complex already, so it's closer to God than dead matter. Animals are even closer. But since only man has the potential to recognize God, man is potentially closest to God (that's IMO the meaning of "pinnacle of creation"). Because no other entity in creation is as complex as man with his brain and capacity to create -- yet, of course, man can never reach God.

Being "good" then means showing virtues and acquiring spiritual understanding in order to get as close to God as possible. The failure of displaying virtues in any given moment when they are needed, and spiritual deafness, keeps us from striving closer to God, but drags us down, closer to the lower level of mere matter.

It's not evil when animals behave this way. But humans have the potential to do better. So it might be called "evil" when a human constantly stays below his potential and refuses to strive closer to God.

 

[ding]

if there is no God, the labels "good" and "evil" are simply opinions

That all depends on if one believes that absolute truth can exist independent of God or not.

It's been my experience that most people who don't believe in God also don't believe in absolute truth. I can see how some might question the former but not the latter yet they still do.

Hm. I do believe in God, yet don't think "good" and "evil" are absolutes.

It always depends on the situation. One attribute that is evil in one situation, may be good in another. Anger, for example. Most of the time, it's destructive and leads to bad consequences, it often results in hurting people, and that's evil. But if anger gives you the energy to overcome and injustice, it may be good. Likewise, no person is always entirely evil or entirely good. Any person will do a good thing one moment, and an evil thing the next.

Also, I don't think "evil" exists as an independent entity. Evil is the lack of good, the lack of virtue in a given situation. If I get angry and punch someone, it's not because evil tempted me to do so, but because I was lacking the good attribute of self-constraint in this situation.

I agree with most of that. No one is all good or all bad. Evil is not extant. It is the absence of good. But I do believe in a final sate of fact. Which is objective truth or reality. So while the line between good and evil maybe hard to see, there is a line. Good will arise from evil, but shouldn't be used to rationalize there is no line. All things work for good. We just don't always know how.

I agree, there is objective truth and reality. But I'm not sure if all things work for good.

I'd say all in creation strives towards God, without ever reaching Him. What does that mean? As I said above, God and creation are on opposite ends: God is endless, one and undivided, while creation has an end and is divided into myriads of tiny parts.

Creation striving towards God then means, it attempts to become more similar to God: When all the tiny, seperate parts of creation form structure to become less divided, they become more similar to the undivided oneness of God.

Dead matter forms certain structures already, but is limited. Plant life is much more complex already, so it's closer to God than dead matter. Animals are even closer. But since only man has the potential to recognize God, man is potentially closest to God (that's IMO the meaning of "pinnacle of creation"). Because no other entity in creation is as complex as man with his brain and capacity to create -- yet, of course, man can never reach God.

Being "good" then means showing virtues and acquiring spiritual understanding in order to get as close to God as possible. The failure of displaying virtues in any given moment when they are needed, and spiritual deafness, keeps us from striving closer to God, but drags us down, closer to the lower level of mere matter.

It's not evil when animals behave this way. But humans have the potential to do better. So it might be called "evil" when a human constantly stays below his potential and refuses to strive closer to God.

Paul struggled with effectively the same thing in Romans Chapters 9-11 (I think) and concluded that Gods ways are inscrutable. The belief that everything works for good is deeply embedded in my faith, but for me I can see logically why this is true. Error can't stand so eventually it fails. So man is free to pursue anything he wants but in the end he discovers what is true. He learns from his failures. In this regard his failures leads to good.

 

[Bernhard]

if there is no God, the labels "good" and "evil" are simply opinions

That all depends on if one believes that absolute truth can exist independent of God or not.

It's been my experience that most people who don't believe in God also don't believe in absolute truth. I can see how some might question the former but not the latter yet they still do.

Hm. I do believe in God, yet don't think "good" and "evil" are absolutes.

It always depends on the situation. One attribute that is evil in one situation, may be good in another. Anger, for example. Most of the time, it's destructive and leads to bad consequences, it often results in hurting people, and that's evil. But if anger gives you the energy to overcome and injustice, it may be good. Likewise, no person is always entirely evil or entirely good. Any person will do a good thing one moment, and an evil thing the next.

Also, I don't think "evil" exists as an independent entity. Evil is the lack of good, the lack of virtue in a given situation. If I get angry and punch someone, it's not because evil tempted me to do so, but because I was lacking the good attribute of self-constraint in this situation.

I agree with most of that. No one is all good or all bad. Evil is not extant. It is the absence of good. But I do believe in a final sate of fact. Which is objective truth or reality. So while the line between good and evil maybe hard to see, there is a line. Good will arise from evil, but shouldn't be used to rationalize there is no line. All things work for good. We just don't always know how.

I agree, there is objective truth and reality. But I'm not sure if all things work for good.

I'd say all in creation strives towards God, without ever reaching Him. What does that mean? As I said above, God and creation are on opposite ends: God is endless, one and undivided, while creation has an end and is divided into myriads of tiny parts.

Creation striving towards God then means, it attempts to become more similar to God: When all the tiny, seperate parts of creation form structure to become less divided, they become more similar to the undivided oneness of God.

Dead matter forms certain structures already, but is limited. Plant life is much more complex already, so it's closer to God than dead matter. Animals are even closer. But since only man has the potential to recognize God, man is potentially closest to God (that's IMO the meaning of "pinnacle of creation"). Because no other entity in creation is as complex as man with his brain and capacity to create -- yet, of course, man can never reach God.

Being "good" then means showing virtues and acquiring spiritual understanding in order to get as close to God as possible. The failure of displaying virtues in any given moment when they are needed, and spiritual deafness, keeps us from striving closer to God, but drags us down, closer to the lower level of mere matter.

It's not evil when animals behave this way. But humans have the potential to do better. So it might be called "evil" when a human constantly stays below his potential and refuses to strive closer to God.

Paul struggled with effectively the same thing in Romans Chapters 9-11 (I think) and concluded that Gods ways are inscrutable. The belief that everything works for good is deeply embedded in my faith, but for me I can see logically why this is true. Error can't stand so eventually it fails. So man is free to pursue anything he wants but in the end he discovers what is true. He learns from his failures. In this regard his failures leads to good.

Regarding to what I said earlier, while I believe the spiritual truths in the Bible are indeed true, I think the explanations given about material matters in the Bible are just a reflection of the people who wrote the Bible, the limited knowledge and wisdom of their time. Essentially, it were mere fallible humans who wrote down their experiences with God, to their best knowledge and according to the wisdom of their respective times. Also, it was written in a manner that an audience 2000 years ago would be able to understand it.

That means that many Biblical explanations regarding the material world now seem to contradict today's scientific consensus. But that doesn't mean the experiences with God as laid down in the Bible are false, it just means the people who made them didn't have the technological and scientific knowledge we have today.

The problems start when certain Christians take every line in the Bible literally and confuse it with a book on natural science, ignoring that it was never intended to be a book explaining the material world, and that people in the Middle East 2000 years ago had a much different idea of the relation between fact and poetic language than we have been having in the past 300 years or so.

IMO.

 

[Votto]

My faith in God is confirmed when I see the Catholic Church fighting against abortion.

My faith in God is weakened when I see the Catholic Church having so many problems with pedophile priests within its ranks.

But I prefer the Catholic Church, even with its flaws, to the atheist governments who murdered millions in the name of creating a better society.

The only reason I'm not a Bible Thumper is because of the Horrors and Terror inflicted on so many living beings.
I just cannot fathom that a "Loving God" could oversee such wickedness and evil...and pass on stopping it.
I am a saver of life.......but most of his world are takers of life.

When you look into the face of evil, hell begins to look more and more righteous.

Have you ever looked into the face of evil, like in a Nazi concentration camp? If you have. you begin to wonder why God is so patient and merciful.

 

[ding]

if there is no God, the labels "good" and "evil" are simply opinions

That all depends on if one believes that absolute truth can exist independent of God or not.

It's been my experience that most people who don't believe in God also don't believe in absolute truth. I can see how some might question the former but not the latter yet they still do.

Hm. I do believe in God, yet don't think "good" and "evil" are absolutes.

It always depends on the situation. One attribute that is evil in one situation, may be good in another. Anger, for example. Most of the time, it's destructive and leads to bad consequences, it often results in hurting people, and that's evil. But if anger gives you the energy to overcome and injustice, it may be good. Likewise, no person is always entirely evil or entirely good. Any person will do a good thing one moment, and an evil thing the next.

Also, I don't think "evil" exists as an independent entity. Evil is the lack of good, the lack of virtue in a given situation. If I get angry and punch someone, it's not because evil tempted me to do so, but because I was lacking the good attribute of self-constraint in this situation.

I agree with most of that. No one is all good or all bad. Evil is not extant. It is the absence of good. But I do believe in a final sate of fact. Which is objective truth or reality. So while the line between good and evil maybe hard to see, there is a line. Good will arise from evil, but shouldn't be used to rationalize there is no line. All things work for good. We just don't always know how.

I agree, there is objective truth and reality. But I'm not sure if all things work for good.

I'd say all in creation strives towards God, without ever reaching Him. What does that mean? As I said above, God and creation are on opposite ends: God is endless, one and undivided, while creation has an end and is divided into myriads of tiny parts.

Creation striving towards God then means, it attempts to become more similar to God: When all the tiny, seperate parts of creation form structure to become less divided, they become more similar to the undivided oneness of God.

Dead matter forms certain structures already, but is limited. Plant life is much more complex already, so it's closer to God than dead matter. Animals are even closer. But since only man has the potential to recognize God, man is potentially closest to God (that's IMO the meaning of "pinnacle of creation"). Because no other entity in creation is as complex as man with his brain and capacity to create -- yet, of course, man can never reach God.

Being "good" then means showing virtues and acquiring spiritual understanding in order to get as close to God as possible. The failure of displaying virtues in any given moment when they are needed, and spiritual deafness, keeps us from striving closer to God, but drags us down, closer to the lower level of mere matter.

It's not evil when animals behave this way. But humans have the potential to do better. So it might be called "evil" when a human constantly stays below his potential and refuses to strive closer to God.

Paul struggled with effectively the same thing in Romans Chapters 9-11 (I think) and concluded that Gods ways are inscrutable. The belief that everything works for good is deeply embedded in my faith, but for me I can see logically why this is true. Error can't stand so eventually it fails. So man is free to pursue anything he wants but in the end he discovers what is true. He learns from his failures. In this regard his failures leads to good.

Regarding to what I said earlier, while I believe the spiritual truths in the Bible are indeed true, I think the explanations given about material matters in the Bible are just a reflection of the people who wrote the Bible, the limited knowledge and wisdom of their time. Essentially, it were mere fallible humans who wrote down their experiences with God, to their best knowledge and according to the wisdom of their respective times. Also, it was written in a manner that an audience 2000 years ago would be able to understand it.

That means that many Biblical explanations regarding the material world now seem to contradict today's scientific consensus. But that doesn't mean the experiences with God as laid down in the Bible are false, it just means the people who made them didn't have the technological and scientific knowledge we have today.

The problems start when certain Christians take every line in the Bible literally and confuse it with a book on natural science, ignoring that it was never intended to be a book explaining the material world, and that people in the Middle East 2000 years ago had a much different idea of the relation between fact and poetic language than we have been having in the past 300 years or so.

IMO.

I don't read the Bible literally. At least not the passages that are intended to be read allegorically. My faith teaches that God creates from nothing and that man arose from His creation. Both of which are consistent with science.