CDZ Ginsburg was right , it was about population control.

[Thunderbird]

Why not show basic humanity and condemn Sanger?

Because Sanger was trying to give women the tools they needed, the tools poor and abused women in particular needed, so they and their children could live lives that were more human.

No! Sanger strongly opposed supplying “GRATIS medical and nursing facilities to slum mothers.”

The Pivot of Civilization: The Cruelty of Charity

The Fertility of the Feeble-Minded Neglected Factors of the World Problem The Cruelty of Charity "Fostering the good-for-nothing at the expense of the good is an extreme cruelty. It is a deliberate storing up of miseries for future generations.

www.infoplease.com

You are like the fools who say I must condemn all our Founding Fathers because some of them were slave owners and others made an alliance with slaveowners for the greater good. I stand in the tradition of Thomas Paine, but will even defend from cheap slurs and out-of-context calumny a great and heroic slaveowner and Indian fighter like George Washington, because I understand what he was ... and what he was not.

Did you know Tom Paine vigorously condemned Washington?

I know you are used to asking stupid “gotcha” questions. I usually just ignore them.

Why do you run from my question? Does it frighten you?

Paine do you deny Sanger favored coercion and eugenics?

Some facts to consider:

https://www.issues4life.org/pdfs/1932_peaceplan_margaretsanger.pdf

 

[Tom Paine 1949]

You seem to be addicted to made up quotes.
Is this not just another one?

You seem to be addicted to spreading Marxist Propaganda and LIES.

Not an answer. I tell the truth as I see it. I never lie in discussions, and I am very careful to check any quotes I use. On the very rare occasions I have misquoted unintentionally, I apologize and admit it immediately. I am not — like you — a partisan hack, certainly not to Democrats or Republicans, not to socialists or “Marxists” or capitalists either.

On questions of truth and lies in politics I like to refer to George Orwell.
Guess what? Orwell was himself a democratic socialist.

 

[Devils_Advocate]

The abortion-rights movement did work with population controllers and borrow from their argumentative strategies. Some population controllers did have ties to the eugenic legal reform movement, and population programs at times focused on the fertility of poor, non-white individuals. Nonetheless, arguments conflating the movements for legal abortion, population control, and eugenics are misleading. Indeed, as we shall see, Zero Population Growth, Inc. (ZPG), the only major population-control organization to lobby for abortion reform before Roe, tended to focus on population control within the white American middle class.

Snip

Similar claims found favor with a broad spectrum of politicians, judges, and members of the public, and influential members in the population-control movement endorsed the repeal of abortion bans.78

https://digitalcommons.law.yale.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1336&context=yjlf

------------------------------------------------------------
The crime rate was again blamed on the blacks and less of them would seem to be ok.

Here is my question:

Seeing we have abundance of birth control stemming from condoms to the morning after pill and sex education do we really need abortion after the first trimester?

 

[HaShev]

The following is My Population Crisis essay I think was written around 1996.
Back then, the Population was 6 Billion, so just about 24 years later the world population sprouted to 7.8 billion as of September 2020, according to the most recent United Nations estimates elaborated by Worldometer.

Although the population growth rate has slowed down and is leveling off, it’s still double
-(in 1996?)-what it was in 1960. This planet already holds over 6 Billion and is growing by aprox. 80 million a year (this ended up pretty accurate, just off slightly as it ended up being about 75 million a year).
This is sure to intensify the burden of some weaker nations as well as put a strain on those who’s
environment and economy is already struggling.
Shocking to think about, is the fact that the world population increases every three years, by the same size of the population of the whole United States.
The real strain is on developing countries who already have trouble and
signs of striping it’s resources and causing poor usable water conditions. The higher the population- the higher the consumption, and some developing nations just can’t handle the sudden sprout in population.

What is in store for the future then?
From studies such as Calhoun’s theory of populations increases we can expect a change in the control of multiple births like China does in restrictions & through education, or else expect possible problems.
Calhoun found that with increased populations there was a natural ability to
eventualy corrected itself by decreased natality and increased mortality. Another factor in population control was the sudden increase in violent and aggressive behavior. The conclusion was that nature itself has it’s own checks and balances to adjust itself and correct any explosive population growth.
We have a choice to correct this fairly or nature will correct it for us randomly without mercy.

So its sounds like you are pro eugenics other than climate change? So you are saying covid is good, I think tramp thinks so as well.

YOUR USE OF THE WORD EUGENICS MIGHT BE MISSUED by your conclusion/assumption/attack mentality.
No my essay says fairly attend to the issue, or else nature will do so without mercy, which is either what nature did with Covid-19 or you just admitted you think it was not natural & that the left conspired with globalist elite to unleash the virus for purpose of a thinning out of population you are calling by the term Eugenics or will use the mandatory vaccine to target regions of billions not millions the virus is achieving for a weeding out of populations once again you are calling Eugenics which seems to be beyond the definition of the term. Why else would you call a virus Eugenics unless in your twisted mind that is how you see solving population issues?
-See I can play your make up stuff to demonize your opponent game too.

 

[WelfareQueen]

Even her wiki page talks about her links to the KKK and eugenics.

Not only the Wiki page with its 160 references mentions Margaret Sanger’s support to eugenics and “population control,” but all this is quite central to the theme of this thread. As to “addressing the KKK” (really its women’s auxiliary), Sanger openly defended her decision to do so, as the Klan was one of the largest organizations in the country at that time. I put this whole question into historical perspective in comment #35 and in my many other comments in this thread.

But you of course aren’t interested in historical context. Hell, I suppose you think Thomas Paine was a racist for working with Thomas Jefferson and George Washington ... who were after all slaveowners !

P.S. Your own sentiments are made quite clear by your choice of pen-name and identifying photo.

Thanks for the confirmation. Sanger was a deeply racist eugenist who consorted with the Klan. No wonder she is a hero to Dims.

The US was in eugenics long before Hitler was.

That is true. Sadly, the abortion icon and Leftist darling Margaret Sanger was one of them.

 

[Penelope]

Even her wiki page talks about her links to the KKK and eugenics.

Not only the Wiki page with its 160 references mentions Margaret Sanger’s support to eugenics and “population control,” but all this is quite central to the theme of this thread. As to “addressing the KKK” (really its women’s auxiliary), Sanger openly defended her decision to do so, as the Klan was one of the largest organizations in the country at that time. I put this whole question into historical perspective in comment #35 and in my many other comments in this thread.

But you of course aren’t interested in historical context. Hell, I suppose you think Thomas Paine was a racist for working with Thomas Jefferson and George Washington ... who were after all slaveowners !

P.S. Your own sentiments are made quite clear by your choice of pen-name and identifying photo.

Thanks for the confirmation. Sanger was a deeply racist eugenist who consorted with the Klan. No wonder she is a hero to Dims.

The US was in eugenics long before Hitler was.

That is true. Sadly, the abortion icon and Leftist darling Margaret Sanger was one of them.

US before Hitler, when Hitler was just a young man he probably thinking of eugenics that they did in the US.

Now they don't have to , many women and men gets themselves sterilized.

 

[mudwhistle]

That quote is attributed to Tom Metzgar, a white supremacist and neo-Nazi, not Margaret Sanger. It is directly from this book.

Encyclopedia of White Power

Yeah so that excuses her from all of the other racist statements she made.

 

[John T. Ford]

Yeah so that excuses her from all of the other racist statements she made.

Leftist will ALWAYS excuse the Racism they so adamantly support.

 

[Coyote]

That quote is attributed to Tom Metzgar, a white supremacist and neo-Nazi, not Margaret Sanger. It is directly from this book.

Encyclopedia of White Power

Yeah so that excuses her from all of the other racist statements she made.

It means that you guys will pin outrageously fake quotes in addition to taking quotes out of context in order to smear her. If it's ok to fake it...well, what else is being faked? She's a woman who gave women access to LEGAL and affordable birth control, she actually opposed abortion (so its funny how folks are hung up on that). Seems to me birth control is a good thing if you don't want abortions.

 

[mudwhistle]

That quote is attributed to Tom Metzgar, a white supremacist and neo-Nazi, not Margaret Sanger. It is directly from this book.

Encyclopedia of White Power

Yeah so that excuses her from all of the other racist statements she made.

It means that you guys will pin outrageously fake quotes in addition to taking quotes out of context in order to smear her. If it's ok to fake it...well, what else is being faked? She's a woman who gave women access to LEGAL and affordable birth control, she actually opposed abortion (so its funny how folks are hung up on that). Seems to me birth control is a good thing if you don't want abortions.

Wow.... Now she opposed abortion.

That's a good one.

 

[Tom Paine 1949]

Ever since Thomas Robert Malthus in 1798 wrote An Essay on the Principle of Population, debates on overpopulation have taken many forms. Probably the fiercest and most memorable comprehensive critique of classic Malthusianism was made by Marx & Engels and was continued by socialist and labor organizers after them. “Neo-Malthusian” arguments remained popular among the upper classes in many different forms in many countries for over two centuries, and always were mixed up with many other developments.

The U.S. came quite late to these debates because it had plenty of land and needed people. Fears of the upper classes for their private property, fears of revolution, colonial empire building, racist thinking, pseudo “scientific” fads like social Darwinism and eugenics, finally “lebensraum“ and Nazism, all these rubbed up against countervailing forces working ultimately for greater democracy: growing middle class demands, unionism, anti-colonial struggles, abolitionism, women’s suffrage, even democratic socialism. Nothing occurred in a vacuum. In modern times technology has always advanced, and thus social changes formed a background to cultural change. Worries about “overpopulation,” competition for resources, the threat of war, modern ecological fears, these rarely are based solely on one’s personal wealth. Even less was this true for the early battles for women’s legal rights, or women’s right to birth control.

The growth of trade, manufactures and cities and finally the industrial revolution did indeed lead to unprecedented population increases, which had until then increased very slowly over centuries. As late as 1963 world population was increasing at accelerating rates (reaching a frightening 2% a year). Today population in advanced economies, from the U.S. to Europe to China and Japan, are leveling off or declining ... a result of prevailing economic and social forces and individual family planning decisions. Uneven economic development has its own dangers of course. Many poor societies are dramatically failing, and nobody knows what lies ahead in terms of global sustainability or war.

The OP spoke to the the issue of women’s rights, abortion rights and overpopulation. We see the Ginsburg replacement drama as central, but it is unlikely to substantially change basic trends in population, as it will not outlaw birth control and family planning. A woman’s individual right to choose to have an abortion when all else has failed will likely only be ended in particular states. It is hard to imagine matters going much further that that.

I said the U.S. was late to worry about overpopulation because of our low population and empty continent. But we were FIRST in outlawing contraception in the Western world! Despite our supposed frontier spirit, the old Puritan influences way back in 1873 allowed for passage of the infamous FEDERAL “Comstock Law” essentially outlawing birth control devices and education as lewd and pornographic.

Anthony Comstock's "Chastity" Laws | American Experience | PBS

It wasn’t until 1936 that Margaret Sanger, after much suffering, had begun to win lawsuits against the Comestock Law. There remained strong obstacles forbidding import or distribution across state lines of birth control devices and pamphlets. By 1924 Sanger’s notoriety had at least won her grudging respect among elements of “proper” society, which in those days was mostly profoundly racist. The Republican John D. Rockefeller Jr. and his family gave her much needed annual $5,000 contributions. Of course the years after WWI were terrible years of racism and a national renewal of the KKK. But Sanger was no longer a socialist feminist voice being dragged off to jail, having to flee to England, her sister force-fed in another prison.

It wasn’t until WWII that the fight against the Nazis made eugenics/race laws unpopular, though the U.S. remained a racially segregated society. The ideological atmosphere changed fundamentally when the U.S. emerged as leader of the free world and had to compete with the USSR. Now it’s apartheid rule in southern states, it’s anti-miscegenation laws in most states, these became real propaganda burdens to U.S. aims internationally. Overpopulation in underdeveloped countries in this period also became a tremendous problem as medical advances and cereal revolution occurred, but all around economic development did not keep pace.

It was not until the 1960s that open discussion of women’s sexual needs and access to still technologically-limited forms of birth control became reality for most North American women. The greater legal freedoms women won to control their lives, to work in professional jobs, to plan their families with birth control and eventually legal abortion, these were the issues that absorbed the attention of Ruth Bader Ginsburg.

 

[EvilCat Breath]

The abortion-rights movement did work with population controllers and borrow from their argumentative strategies. Some population controllers did have ties to the eugenic legal reform movement, and population programs at times focused on the fertility of poor, non-white individuals. Nonetheless, arguments conflating the movements for legal abortion, population control, and eugenics are misleading. Indeed, as we shall see, Zero Population Growth, Inc. (ZPG), the only major population-control organization to lobby for abortion reform before Roe, tended to focus on population control within the white American middle class.

Snip

Similar claims found favor with a broad spectrum of politicians, judges, and members of the public, and influential members in the population-control movement endorsed the repeal of abortion bans.78

https://digitalcommons.law.yale.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1336&context=yjlf

------------------------------------------------------------
The crime rate was again blamed on the blacks and less of them would seem to be ok.

I support abortion only in the black community

It should be all democrats.

 

[Turtlesoup]

Sanger was a Racist who ... wanted to wipe Black people off the face of this planet.

This lie is truly Orwellian in scope. Even the slightest acquaintance with Margaret Sanger’s life history would show this to be false and slanderous:


W. E. B. Du Bois served on the board of Sanger's Harlem clinic

Sanger worked with African American leaders and professionals who saw a need for birth control in their communities. In 1929, James H. Hubert, a black social worker and the leader of New York's Urban League, asked Sanger to open a clinic in Harlem. Sanger secured funding ... and opened the clinic, staffed with black doctors, in 1930. The clinic was directed by a 15-member advisory board consisting of black doctors, nurses, clergy, journalists, and social workers. The clinic was publicized in the African-American press as well as in black churches, and it received the approval of W. E. B. Du Bois, the co-founder of the NAACP and the editor of its magazine, The Crisis. Sanger did not tolerate bigotry among her staff, nor would she tolerate any refusal to work within interracial projects. Sanger's work with minorities earned praise from Martin Luther King, Jr., in his 1966 acceptance speech for the Margaret Sanger award.[79]

Margaret Sanger - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Even her wiki page talks about her links to the KKK and eugenics. But Dims lie....it's what you do.

Eugenics isn't based on race--

Eugenics is based more on birth defects----like not allowing the mentally handicapped to have children because their kids would be at higher risk for being mentally handicapped.

No. Eugenics is what the Nazi's practiced. Selective breeding and culling to produce allegedly better humans.

Lord have mercy---they did both---------eugenics and race breeding and and killed off undesirables as well.

But again--------------Eugenics is not based on race. It basically targetted druggies/alcoholics and those with birth defects particularily down syndrome mentally handicapped for sterilization in order to prevent the offspring from suffering......
Sanger was a nurse-------------she and others with COMMON SENSE----didn't want to see children suffer and realized that handicapped people and others could not take care of themselves much less children especially children who were also severely handicapped. Sanger and her family were also known pro-civil rights activists. Her intentions was to prevent suffering and to provide a better life for the fewer children while providing their mothers an opportunity to take care of them instead of watching kids suffer and starve due to overpopulation poverty and birth defects.

I fully support Eugenics--------------it is absolutely stupid to allow certain people to breed-------creating more problems.

 

[Turtlesoup]

Sanger was a Racist who ... wanted to wipe Black people off the face of this planet.

This lie is truly Orwellian in scope. Even the slightest acquaintance with Margaret Sanger’s life history would show this to be false and slanderous:


W. E. B. Du Bois served on the board of Sanger's Harlem clinic

Sanger worked with African American leaders and professionals who saw a need for birth control in their communities. In 1929, James H. Hubert, a black social worker and the leader of New York's Urban League, asked Sanger to open a clinic in Harlem. Sanger secured funding ... and opened the clinic, staffed with black doctors, in 1930. The clinic was directed by a 15-member advisory board consisting of black doctors, nurses, clergy, journalists, and social workers. The clinic was publicized in the African-American press as well as in black churches, and it received the approval of W. E. B. Du Bois, the co-founder of the NAACP and the editor of its magazine, The Crisis. Sanger did not tolerate bigotry among her staff, nor would she tolerate any refusal to work within interracial projects. Sanger's work with minorities earned praise from Martin Luther King, Jr., in his 1966 acceptance speech for the Margaret Sanger award.[79]

Margaret Sanger - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Even her wiki page talks about her links to the KKK and eugenics. But Dims lie....it's what you do.

Eugenics isn't based on race--

Eugenics is based more on birth defects----like not allowing the mentally handicapped to have children because their kids would be at higher risk for being mentally handicapped.

No. Eugenics is what the Nazi's practiced. Selective breeding and culling to produce allegedly better humans.

and oh my gawd, do you really think drug addicts and alcoholics should be allowed to have children which creates birth defects and suffering?

 

[mudwhistle]

Wow.... Now she opposed abortion. That's a good one.

Read the god-damn discussion! You are making a fool of yourself!

Not at all.
She's ignoring the woman's history.
She's like John Kerry, she was against abortion before she was for it.
The point should be that Margaret Sanger wanted to eliminate the black race first by BC, then by abortion.

 

[WelfareQueen]

Sanger was a Racist who ... wanted to wipe Black people off the face of this planet.

This lie is truly Orwellian in scope. Even the slightest acquaintance with Margaret Sanger’s life history would show this to be false and slanderous:


W. E. B. Du Bois served on the board of Sanger's Harlem clinic

Sanger worked with African American leaders and professionals who saw a need for birth control in their communities. In 1929, James H. Hubert, a black social worker and the leader of New York's Urban League, asked Sanger to open a clinic in Harlem. Sanger secured funding ... and opened the clinic, staffed with black doctors, in 1930. The clinic was directed by a 15-member advisory board consisting of black doctors, nurses, clergy, journalists, and social workers. The clinic was publicized in the African-American press as well as in black churches, and it received the approval of W. E. B. Du Bois, the co-founder of the NAACP and the editor of its magazine, The Crisis. Sanger did not tolerate bigotry among her staff, nor would she tolerate any refusal to work within interracial projects. Sanger's work with minorities earned praise from Martin Luther King, Jr., in his 1966 acceptance speech for the Margaret Sanger award.[79]

Margaret Sanger - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Even her wiki page talks about her links to the KKK and eugenics. But Dims lie....it's what you do.

Eugenics isn't based on race--

Eugenics is based more on birth defects----like not allowing the mentally handicapped to have children because their kids would be at higher risk for being mentally handicapped.

No. Eugenics is what the Nazi's practiced. Selective breeding and culling to produce allegedly better humans.

and oh my gawd, do you really think drug addicts and alcoholics should be allowed to have children which creates birth defects and suffering?

Who is supposed to play God and determine who is worthy to live and who must die, Would that be you? Tell us what your criteria would be? Are white babies more valuable that black babies? Your thoughts on this should be interesting.

 

[Monk-Eye]

" More And Drearier "

* Incompetence *

Who is supposed to play God and determine who is worthy to live and who must die, Would that be you? Tell us what your criteria would be? Are white babies more valuable that black babies? Your thoughts on this should be interesting.

There is an 800 million population in latin america and it is full of socialist , dictatorship , shit holes because the populations have bred themselves into poverty , so be sure to thank the catholic church of psychopathy .

Does the us need to ignore carrying capacity limits and shoot for population gluttony by raising its 333 million with a median iq of 100 to 800 million with a median iq of 85 through first come first served , non merit based for iq or skill set , immigration from countries such as china with 1.2 billion , or india with 1.2 billion , or africa with 1 billion , that are already over populated and over represented globally , to satisfy your expectations for an answer to such a spurious question ?

The catholic church forbid birth control in haiti and what used to be 95% tropical jungle is now 95% dirt and shanty towns ; and , even puerto ricans have very low regard for haitians .

So the mental degenerate slave owners , who could have given less than a damn about anything other than how much money they could acquire , had a black slave population in the south that was more than twice the number of whites ; and , your fake outrage for ignoring huge populations whose capacity for cultural development was a mud hut and body modification makes about as much sense .

http://www.eisenhowerfoundation.org/docs/kerner.pdf

Even if violence does not occur, the consequences are unacceptable. Development of a racially integrated society, extraordinarily difficult today, will be virtually impossible when the present black ghetto population of 12.5 million has grown to almost 21 million.

 

[John T. Ford]

It means that you guys will pin outrageously fake quotes in addition to taking quotes out of context in order to smear her. If it's ok to fake it...well, what else is being faked? She's a woman who gave women access to LEGAL and affordable birth control, she actually opposed abortion (so its funny how folks are hung up on that). Seems to me birth control is a good thing if you don't want abortions.

I'm pretty sure no normal thinking person is buying your history revision BS.

 

[John T. Ford]

Wow.... Now she opposed abortion.

That's a good one.

Next you will hear Sanger was responsible for the Civil Rights Act of 1965 .....

 

[Monk-Eye]

" Fake Moral Outrage "

* Excuses For Mindless Agenda *

I'm pretty sure no normal thinking person is buying your history revision BS.

A normal thinking person is not buying a conjecture by wasps that their concern for blacks is authentic .