Facts About Judaism

[ding]

Until you provide your summary, all you have are unsubstantiated accusations.

Genesis tells us, in part....

1. God created existence
2. Everything he created is good
3. What he created was done in steps
4. Man is a product of that creation
5. Man is unlike any other creature in creation
6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates
7. Man was told to go forth and be fruitful
8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest
9. Man knows right from wrong
10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong
11. Successful behaviors naturally lead to success
12. Failed behaviors naturally lead to failure
13. Pass it down to the next generation

That summery seems lacking, a lot.
And overly simplistic.

1. God created existence

G-d existed before He created.
As far as I know, Genesis doesn't say "G-d created existence".

2. Everything he created is good

Where does the knowledge of bad fit then?

6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates

Not so precise - animals, to their extent, know as well.
You've missed man speaks.

8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest

Verse?

9. Man knows right from wrong

Not exactly, man knows good an bad.

10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong

Where did that come from? Verse?
Adam tried to rationalized, but he didn't deny he did "wrong".

Again, that summery is superficial,
it's like you've tried on purpose to empty it of all essence.

It’s a summary. It’s supposed to be short and concise. Feel free to add to it if you think it is lacking. I doubt you can.

God created our existence. It’s in the Torah as the account of creation. You may have heard about it.

Of course God existed before he created our existence. God is eternal and unchanging.

Our existence was created ~14 billion years ago when God willed it into existence. You may have heard about it. It’s been in all the science journals and some ancient men knew about it over 6,000 years ago and passed the account down orally for thousands of years from generation to generation until it was recorded in writing by Moses.

Bad or evil so to speak are not extant. They only exist in relation to good and right. In other words, bad is the absence of good and wrong is the absence of right. Everything God created is good. Ancient man knew this over 6,000 years ago and it eventually got written down. Maybe you have read it.

Arguing that man is not set apart from the animal kingdom will be a losing argument. Man is the only animal that has knowledge of good and evil. Ancient man knew this over 6,000 years ago and it eventually got written down. Maybe you have read it.

The sheep does not think the wolf is evil for eating her lamb.

 

[ding]

Well, you do seem to be especially drawn
to every thread that has to do with Judaism.

What's the motivation?

To understand your beliefs about God. For instance, it has been argued on these boards that the G-d of Abraham is cruel. I have argued that’s not how the Jews of the OT saw it. Unfortunately I have yet to find a Jew who is willing to discuss anything on this subject.

Already explained that.

Nice dodge. I didn’t think you could discuss it, but your pride wouldn’t allow you to say so.

Did you really ask a question?

So you go from you already answered it to did I ask a question?

But you aren’t scared, right?

Oh dingy dingy,
you've quoted 2 of my questions,
and none of yours.

Definitely NASA material...

I’m good with that as long as you don’t explain why your predecessors believed God is loving.

Actually I will win either way.

My predecessors knew the words of G-d's prophets
and His commandments that speak of love.

Interesting. So you have no idea that Moses recorded in writing the history that all Jews already knew? You do realize that the account of Genesis was passed down orally from generation to generation for thousands of years before Moses recorded it, right?

Or were you taught that God revealed to Moses the accounts of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and that no one ever knew of that history until Moses revealed it?

But putting that aside, you have skipped thousands of years where your prophets had no name. Or are you suggesting that your people did not know God is loving before Moses?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he condemned mankind to suffer?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he brought forth a flood to kill mankind?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he made Moses wander in the desert for 40 years?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he gave the command to kill every man, woman and child in Canaan?

so if I am to understand you, your only basis in believing that your people believed God is loving is because your prophets told you so? That doesn’t sound like knowledge. That sounds like you are blindly parroting what you were told. sounds like you are what Rosie would call a child of society.

How do you believe the prophets knew God was loving? What was their basis for that belief?

I know.

Seriously ding,
it doesn't matter what I would answer,
You just totally neglect it, and reserve to dumping strawman fallacies.

All these leading talking points You get from the church,
are simple questions dealt with when children study the Humash.

All I can suggest, is try actually reading the book, slowly and carefully,
and refer You to Rashi - because otherwise it's just meaningless waste of time.

dingbat should do some JUMAH things in a mosque-----he can
get a whole bunch more moronic talking points from the weekly
khutbah jumaat feces fling

I would hope the rabbis would be more respectful and actually engage in serious dialogue.

Perhaps you could join in, and show them how it's done?

I have been.

Show me.

I have been.

you’ll have to answer the questions I asked him/her to see more.

So You don't know that real questions don't start with "so You don't know"?
You see we can all be 'that kind' wise...

Btw ding how's your egg-god doing ?
Any chicken yet?
I'm hungry...

Get ready to be schooled by Rabbi ding.

Maybe you can start where luchi flopped:

Q. Vayakhel portion - what is the meaning and purpose of South and East in two,
and what's to North and West in one?

I really wanna know,
though chicken would be nice first.
Has your egg-god emerged yet?

We’re going to do this my way.


Jesus was necessary to reform Judaism. It had become fettered. They had forgotten God and no longer glorified God. In fact, they closed their book 400 years before because God no longer spoke to them. Theology, ritual, authority, grace, mystery and tradition are components of religion. They had become overbalanced in the Jewish faith. Where the form of religion had replaced God. It’s not that theology, ritual, authority, grace, mystery and tradition don’t have a place in worshipping God because they do, but your people had replaced God with them. Effectively they worshipped a false idol. They worshipped the created rather than the Creator. Which incidentally happened to be the original sin. God does not reject theology, ritual, authority, grace, mystery and tradition, God rejects the imbalance.

To your people Jesus was a effectively a rebel child of Judaism. So it is no surprise that your people and you yourself reject him because his message to you was that you are doing it wrong. You are worshipping the created instead of the creator. You are glorifying yourself instead of glorifying the Creator.

God is a rationalist and a moralist. He taught that your people should work out their own salvation with diligence. He is not against your religion. God is against the corruption which entered into Judaism and wanted your people to get back to what was important which is glorifying Him and shining a light on Him instead of yourselves.

Your people are free to crave and cling to impermanent states and things which are incapable of satisfying you. Your people are free to pursue pleasure, wealth, fame and power but none of those things will satisfy your people because you were made for more.

Yiu have forgotten your way. And that was why Jesus was born into this world, and that was the truth he testified to.

Your people were supposed to bear the iniquity of the world but you left it up to God to do it for you because you have forgotten God.

There's an oxymoron. By worshipping Jesus, the Prince instead of the King, one is glorifying the created and not the Creator.

You don’t believe in God anymore than the rest of your tribe. You only care about created things.

I don't have to believe in Him. He's there; all around me, in me, everywhere I go.

Actually you do. Because you certainly aren’t glorifying him.

BTW what you just described is pantheism. A wholly illogical and irrational belief system and the underlying basis of human secularism which is the scourge of existence and the poster child of worshipping the created rather than the creator which was and is man’s original and biggest sin and the source of all of man’s errors.

You're confusing things here:

Pantheism is seeing creation itself as G-d.
Though not necessary results in worship (Christianity), can be expressed in such way.

Now, all that is different from the Jewish thought, which rejects all worship of any creation,
sees the creation as revelation of G-d, but not limited by it. Or in other words - nothing has existence outside G-d. All creation essentially 'sings' His glory, attests to G-d.

It's what Maimonides means when saying that through observation of the creation,
through studying the complexity of creation, reveals the infinite wisdom hidden in it,
one widens knowledge of G-d - inevitably resulting in fulfillment of one of the main commandments of Judaism - love of G-d.

Big difference.

Seeing God as nature or nature as God is textbook example of pantheism. So, no.

If you want to disregard our beliefs about Jesus, then sure. If you want to honor our beliefs about Jesus, then no. One thing is certain you are dying to talk about Jesus which is hilarious.

That last bit just seems to be words to you. They sound great. Try living it.

 

[rylah]

Until you provide your summary, all you have are unsubstantiated accusations.

Genesis tells us, in part....

1. God created existence
2. Everything he created is good
3. What he created was done in steps
4. Man is a product of that creation
5. Man is unlike any other creature in creation
6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates
7. Man was told to go forth and be fruitful
8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest
9. Man knows right from wrong
10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong
11. Successful behaviors naturally lead to success
12. Failed behaviors naturally lead to failure
13. Pass it down to the next generation

That summery seems lacking, a lot.
And overly simplistic.

1. God created existence

G-d existed before He created.
As far as I know, Genesis doesn't say "G-d created existence".

2. Everything he created is good

Where does the knowledge of bad fit then?

6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates

Not so precise - animals, to their extent, know as well.
You've missed man speaks.

8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest

Verse?

9. Man knows right from wrong

Not exactly, man knows good an bad.

10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong

Where did that come from? Verse?
Adam tried to rationalized, but he didn't deny he did "wrong".

Again, that summery is superficial,
it's like you've tried on purpose to empty it of all essence.

It’s a summary. It’s supposed to be short and concise. Feel free to add to it if you think it is lacking. I doubt you can.

God created our existence. It’s in the Torah as the account of creation. You may have heard about it.

Of course God existed before he created our existence. God is eternal and unchanging.

Our existence was created ~14 billion years ago when God willed it into existence. You may have heard about it. It’s been in all the science journals and some ancient men knew about it over 6,000 years ago and passed the account down orally for thousands of years from generation to generation until it was recorded in writing by Moses.

Bad or evil so to speak are not extant. They only exist in relation to good and right. In other words, bad is the absence of good and wrong is the absence of right. Everything God created is good. Ancient man knew this over 6,000 years ago and it eventually got written down. Maybe you have read it.

Arguing that man is not set apart from the animal kingdom will be a losing argument. Man is the only animal that has knowledge of good and evil. Ancient man knew this over 6,000 years ago and it eventually got written down. Maybe you have read it.

The sheep does not think the wolf is evil for eating her lamb.

Again, look at the title of the thread what does it say? - FACTS

I see you couldn't provide the verses to confirm your claims,
and rather avoided with more assumptions and logical fallacies without basis in text.

You see the thread is not about what you may think about Judaism or Torah,
rather FACTS. Why am I repeating this? Because one fundamental principle of Judaism is that man's words and beliefs are worthless without ability to back them directly in the text.

You can assume stuff - but without basis in Torah, they're just words of a mortal at the least,
and certainly do not suffice the discussion framework at hand as - "FACTS of Judaism".

 

[rylah]

Well, you do seem to be especially drawn
to every thread that has to do with Judaism.

What's the motivation?

To understand your beliefs about God. For instance, it has been argued on these boards that the G-d of Abraham is cruel. I have argued that’s not how the Jews of the OT saw it. Unfortunately I have yet to find a Jew who is willing to discuss anything on this subject.

Already explained that.

Nice dodge. I didn’t think you could discuss it, but your pride wouldn’t allow you to say so.

Did you really ask a question?

So you go from you already answered it to did I ask a question?

But you aren’t scared, right?

Oh dingy dingy,
you've quoted 2 of my questions,
and none of yours.

Definitely NASA material...

I’m good with that as long as you don’t explain why your predecessors believed God is loving.

Actually I will win either way.

My predecessors knew the words of G-d's prophets
and His commandments that speak of love.

Interesting. So you have no idea that Moses recorded in writing the history that all Jews already knew? You do realize that the account of Genesis was passed down orally from generation to generation for thousands of years before Moses recorded it, right?

Or were you taught that God revealed to Moses the accounts of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and that no one ever knew of that history until Moses revealed it?

But putting that aside, you have skipped thousands of years where your prophets had no name. Or are you suggesting that your people did not know God is loving before Moses?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he condemned mankind to suffer?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he brought forth a flood to kill mankind?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he made Moses wander in the desert for 40 years?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he gave the command to kill every man, woman and child in Canaan?

so if I am to understand you, your only basis in believing that your people believed God is loving is because your prophets told you so? That doesn’t sound like knowledge. That sounds like you are blindly parroting what you were told. sounds like you are what Rosie would call a child of society.

How do you believe the prophets knew God was loving? What was their basis for that belief?

I know.

Seriously ding,
it doesn't matter what I would answer,
You just totally neglect it, and reserve to dumping strawman fallacies.

All these leading talking points You get from the church,
are simple questions dealt with when children study the Humash.

All I can suggest, is try actually reading the book, slowly and carefully,
and refer You to Rashi - because otherwise it's just meaningless waste of time.

dingbat should do some JUMAH things in a mosque-----he can
get a whole bunch more moronic talking points from the weekly
khutbah jumaat feces fling

I would hope the rabbis would be more respectful and actually engage in serious dialogue.

Perhaps you could join in, and show them how it's done?

I have been.

Show me.

I have been.

you’ll have to answer the questions I asked him/her to see more.

So You don't know that real questions don't start with "so You don't know"?
You see we can all be 'that kind' wise...

Btw ding how's your egg-god doing ?
Any chicken yet?
I'm hungry...

Get ready to be schooled by Rabbi ding.

Maybe you can start where luchi flopped:

Q. Vayakhel portion - what is the meaning and purpose of South and East in two,
and what's to North and West in one?

I really wanna know,
though chicken would be nice first.
Has your egg-god emerged yet?

We’re going to do this my way.


Jesus was necessary to reform Judaism. It had become fettered. They had forgotten God and no longer glorified God. In fact, they closed their book 400 years before because God no longer spoke to them. Theology, ritual, authority, grace, mystery and tradition are components of religion. They had become overbalanced in the Jewish faith. Where the form of religion had replaced God. It’s not that theology, ritual, authority, grace, mystery and tradition don’t have a place in worshipping God because they do, but your people had replaced God with them. Effectively they worshipped a false idol. They worshipped the created rather than the Creator. Which incidentally happened to be the original sin. God does not reject theology, ritual, authority, grace, mystery and tradition, God rejects the imbalance.

To your people Jesus was a effectively a rebel child of Judaism. So it is no surprise that your people and you yourself reject him because his message to you was that you are doing it wrong. You are worshipping the created instead of the creator. You are glorifying yourself instead of glorifying the Creator.

God is a rationalist and a moralist. He taught that your people should work out their own salvation with diligence. He is not against your religion. God is against the corruption which entered into Judaism and wanted your people to get back to what was important which is glorifying Him and shining a light on Him instead of yourselves.

Your people are free to crave and cling to impermanent states and things which are incapable of satisfying you. Your people are free to pursue pleasure, wealth, fame and power but none of those things will satisfy your people because you were made for more.

Yiu have forgotten your way. And that was why Jesus was born into this world, and that was the truth he testified to.

Your people were supposed to bear the iniquity of the world but you left it up to God to do it for you because you have forgotten God.

There's an oxymoron. By worshipping Jesus, the Prince instead of the King, one is glorifying the created and not the Creator.

You don’t believe in God anymore than the rest of your tribe. You only care about created things.

I don't have to believe in Him. He's there; all around me, in me, everywhere I go.

Actually you do. Because you certainly aren’t glorifying him.

BTW what you just described is pantheism. A wholly illogical and irrational belief system and the underlying basis of human secularism which is the scourge of existence and the poster child of worshipping the created rather than the creator which was and is man’s original and biggest sin and the source of all of man’s errors.

You're confusing things here:

Pantheism is seeing creation itself as G-d.
Though not necessary results in worship (Christianity), can be expressed in such way.

Now, all that is different from the Jewish thought, which rejects all worship of any creation,
sees the creation as revelation of G-d, but not limited by it. Or in other words - nothing has existence outside G-d. All creation essentially 'sings' His glory, attests to G-d.

It's what Maimonides means when saying that through observation of the creation,
through studying the complexity of creation, reveals the infinite wisdom hidden in it,
one widens knowledge of G-d - inevitably resulting in fulfillment of one of the main commandments of Judaism - love of G-d.

Big difference.

Seeing God as nature or nature as God is textbook example of pantheism. So, no.

If you want to disregard our beliefs about Jesus, then sure. If you want to honor our beliefs about Jesus, then no. One thing is certain you are dying to talk about Jesus which is hilarious.

That last bit just seems to be words to you. They sound great. Try living it.

Where is the word "nature" found in my original post?
You're purposeful misrepresenting my words to avoid them as a defense mechanism.

'G-d as nature' and 'Nature as G-d' are two fundamentally different perspectives,
and gave the 3rd one that excludes both, specifically referring to the perspective of Judaism.

And no, I don't wanna discuss you idol, but seeing how you deflect every thread on Judaism,
attempting to plug him into every discussion, to the point of desperately shutting down any real discussion outside of that scope out of sheer insecurity - I see it as inevitable. So in order to stay on topic, which I prefer, I specifically referred to the words in the work of Ramabam called 'The Misneh Torah', which scope will both indirectly address your missionary none sense, and vastly enrich the topic at hand.

In order to immediately address all that I'll start with the first book in the Mishneh Torah,
called the 'Sefer HaMad'a' or 'The Book of Knowledge', and specifically the first 2 chapters dealing with the Fundamental Laws of Torah, more specifically the first commandments,
and the ways to fulfill them:

• The knowledge of G-d
• Not to consider the thought there is another divinity aside from the G-d of Israel
• To unify G-d
• To Love G-d

But in the meantime as an introduction:

 

[ding]

Until you provide your summary, all you have are unsubstantiated accusations.

Genesis tells us, in part....

1. God created existence
2. Everything he created is good
3. What he created was done in steps
4. Man is a product of that creation
5. Man is unlike any other creature in creation
6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates
7. Man was told to go forth and be fruitful
8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest
9. Man knows right from wrong
10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong
11. Successful behaviors naturally lead to success
12. Failed behaviors naturally lead to failure
13. Pass it down to the next generation

That summery seems lacking, a lot.
And overly simplistic.

1. God created existence

G-d existed before He created.
As far as I know, Genesis doesn't say "G-d created existence".

2. Everything he created is good

Where does the knowledge of bad fit then?

6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates

Not so precise - animals, to their extent, know as well.
You've missed man speaks.

8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest

Verse?

9. Man knows right from wrong

Not exactly, man knows good an bad.

10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong

Where did that come from? Verse?
Adam tried to rationalized, but he didn't deny he did "wrong".

Again, that summery is superficial,
it's like you've tried on purpose to empty it of all essence.

It’s a summary. It’s supposed to be short and concise. Feel free to add to it if you think it is lacking. I doubt you can.

God created our existence. It’s in the Torah as the account of creation. You may have heard about it.

Of course God existed before he created our existence. God is eternal and unchanging.

Our existence was created ~14 billion years ago when God willed it into existence. You may have heard about it. It’s been in all the science journals and some ancient men knew about it over 6,000 years ago and passed the account down orally for thousands of years from generation to generation until it was recorded in writing by Moses.

Bad or evil so to speak are not extant. They only exist in relation to good and right. In other words, bad is the absence of good and wrong is the absence of right. Everything God created is good. Ancient man knew this over 6,000 years ago and it eventually got written down. Maybe you have read it.

Arguing that man is not set apart from the animal kingdom will be a losing argument. Man is the only animal that has knowledge of good and evil. Ancient man knew this over 6,000 years ago and it eventually got written down. Maybe you have read it.

The sheep does not think the wolf is evil for eating her lamb.

Again, look at the title of the thread what does it say? - FACTS

I see you couldn't provide the verses to confirm your claims,
and rather avoided with more assumptions and logical fallacies without basis in text.

You see the thread is not about what you may think about Judaism or Torah,
rather FACTS. Why am I repeating this? Because one fundamental principle of Judaism is that man's words and beliefs are worthless without ability to back them directly in the text.

You can assume stuff - but without basis in Torah, they're just words of a mortal at the least,
and certainly do not suffice the discussion framework at hand as - "FACTS of Judaism".

I believe the original meaning was lost through time because you sure don’t seem to be able to summarize it like I have.

Apparently you don’t even realize the Torah starts from the belief that God created everything which includes the universe.

 

[ding]

I see you couldn't provide the verses to confirm your claims,
and rather avoided with more assumptions and logical fallacies without basis in text.

See Genesis Chapters 1&2.

Apparently you don’t know what those chapters mean.

 

[ding]

You see the thread is not about what you may think about Judaism or Torah,
rather FACTS.

The facts are Genesis tells us that.

1. God created existence
2. Everything he created is good
3. What he created was done in steps
4. Man is a product of that creation
5. Man is unlike any other creature in creation
6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates
7. Man was told to go forth and be fruitful
8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest
9. Man knows right from wrong
10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong
11. Successful behaviors naturally lead to success
12. Failed behaviors naturally lead to failure
13. Pass it down to the next generation

 

[ding]

You can assume stuff - but without basis in Torah, they're just words of a mortal at the least,
and certainly do not suffice the discussion framework at hand as - "FACTS of Judaism".

I’m not assuming anything. It’s all in black and white.

The fact that you can’t summarize what genesis tells us tells me you don’t understand it at all.

 

[rylah]

You see the thread is not about what you may think about Judaism or Torah,
rather FACTS.

The facts are Genesis tells us that.

1. God created existence
2. Everything he created is good
3. What he created was done in steps
4. Man is a product of that creation
5. Man is unlike any other creature in creation
6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates
7. Man was told to go forth and be fruitful
8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest
9. Man knows right from wrong
10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong
11. Successful behaviors naturally lead to success
12. Failed behaviors naturally lead to failure
13. Pass it down to the next generation

You can assume stuff - but without basis in Torah, they're just words of a mortal at the least,
and certainly do not suffice the discussion framework at hand as - "FACTS of Judaism".

I’m not assuming anything. It’s all in black and white.

The fact that you can’t summarize what genesis tells us tells me you don’t understand it at all.

That's just repeating what you've already claimed before ad nauseam ,
without providing actual reference, and totally neglecting my remarks pointing to the inconsistency with text.

If you can't admit, so be it, but either respectfully leave - or be so kind to follow the topic.

Again this thread is not about what you may or may not personally understand -
rather the original perspective of Judaism on these issues.

 

[InstantOn]

My claim cuts through the bullsh*t most religmo's manipulate us with Joe

~S~

What the blazes does that mean???????

I think it means he’s not interested in discussing Judaism because he’s super cynical to all religions.

C’mon, Sparky, give JB a chance.

But I’m interested. Do tell more.

I suggest you read the link and then ask me any questions you still have.

LOL. A non-Jew is going to explain Judaism. That's a good one. LOL.

 

[rylah]

Until you provide your summary, all you have are unsubstantiated accusations.

Genesis tells us, in part....

1. God created existence
2. Everything he created is good
3. What he created was done in steps
4. Man is a product of that creation
5. Man is unlike any other creature in creation
6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates
7. Man was told to go forth and be fruitful
8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest
9. Man knows right from wrong
10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong
11. Successful behaviors naturally lead to success
12. Failed behaviors naturally lead to failure
13. Pass it down to the next generation

That summery seems lacking, a lot.
And overly simplistic.

1. God created existence

G-d existed before He created.
As far as I know, Genesis doesn't say "G-d created existence".

2. Everything he created is good

Where does the knowledge of bad fit then?

6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates

Not so precise - animals, to their extent, know as well.
You've missed man speaks.

8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest

Verse?

9. Man knows right from wrong

Not exactly, man knows good an bad.

10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong

Where did that come from? Verse?
Adam tried to rationalized, but he didn't deny he did "wrong".

Again, that summery is superficial,
it's like you've tried on purpose to empty it of all essence.

It’s a summary. It’s supposed to be short and concise. Feel free to add to it if you think it is lacking. I doubt you can.

God created our existence. It’s in the Torah as the account of creation. You may have heard about it.

Of course God existed before he created our existence. God is eternal and unchanging.

Our existence was created ~14 billion years ago when God willed it into existence. You may have heard about it. It’s been in all the science journals and some ancient men knew about it over 6,000 years ago and passed the account down orally for thousands of years from generation to generation until it was recorded in writing by Moses.

Bad or evil so to speak are not extant. They only exist in relation to good and right. In other words, bad is the absence of good and wrong is the absence of right. Everything God created is good. Ancient man knew this over 6,000 years ago and it eventually got written down. Maybe you have read it.

Arguing that man is not set apart from the animal kingdom will be a losing argument. Man is the only animal that has knowledge of good and evil. Ancient man knew this over 6,000 years ago and it eventually got written down. Maybe you have read it.

The sheep does not think the wolf is evil for eating her lamb.

Again, look at the title of the thread what does it say? - FACTS

I see you couldn't provide the verses to confirm your claims,
and rather avoided with more assumptions and logical fallacies without basis in text.

You see the thread is not about what you may think about Judaism or Torah,
rather FACTS. Why am I repeating this? Because one fundamental principle of Judaism is that man's words and beliefs are worthless without ability to back them directly in the text.

You can assume stuff - but without basis in Torah, they're just words of a mortal at the least,
and certainly do not suffice the discussion framework at hand as - "FACTS of Judaism".

I believe the original meaning was lost through time because you sure don’t seem to be able to summarize it like I have.

Apparently you don’t even realize the Torah starts from the belief that God created everything which includes the universe.

Actually no, Torah doesn't start from any belief.
Torah specifically prescribes the commandment to know G-d. as Rambam summarizes:

• "The foundation of all foundations and the pillar of wisdom is to know that there is a Primary Being who brought into being all existence...."

Following with

• "The knowledge of this concept is a positive commandment, as [implied by Exodus 20:2]: "I am G-d, your Lord...." Anyone who presumes that there is another god transgresses a negative commandment, as [Exodus 20:3] states: "You shall have no other gods before Me" and denies a fundamental principle, because this is the great principle upon which all depends."
  
  The knowledge of this concept fulfills a positive commandment, as [implied by Deuteronomy 6:4]: "Hear, Israel, G-d is our Lord, G-d is One."

And most importantly:

• Behold, it is explicitly stated in the Torah and [the works of] the prophets that the Holy One, blessed be He, is not a body or physical form, as [Deuteronomy 4:39] states: "Because G-d, your Lord, is the Lord in the heavens above and the earth below," and a body cannot exist in two places.

Yesodei haTorah - Chapter One

www.chabad.org

 

[BreezeWood]

What is "IT" which is "NOT"? You "summarized the knowledge
of ancient man......" ? I am fascinated-----WHEN? In my freshman
college year, "ENGLISH COMP." 101-2 was OBLIGATORY -----
so many were like you---------barely able to write a cogent sentence.
I was assigned to the "REMEDIAL ROOM" to help your fellow nitwits.
One of my "students" was a math savant, but his idea of logical
writing was just like yours. He complained to me that he had gotten
a "D" on his paper even though he had CHECKED THE SPELLING.
No spelling errors!!!

I find it ironic that you would question anyone’s writing ability, Rosie.

"writing ability" was not the only issue in that much dreaded
English Comp. class. The problem that both you and the math
savant have/had is CONTENT

If you could attack the content you would. But you aren’t. So you attack my writing skills instead.

and there’s nothing wrong with my writing skills. I’m actually quite good at articulating my thoughts in writing.

wrong again-----it IS THE CONTENT which is faulty------be patient

But the most important part of knowledge, information, wisdom and truth is passing it down so that they can be built upon.

did you pass high school freshman biology?

Until you provide your summary, all you have are unsubstantiated accusations.

Genesis tells us, in part....

1. God created existence
2. Everything he created is good
3. What he created was done in steps
4. Man is a product of that creation
5. Man is unlike any other creature in creation
6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates
7. Man was told to go forth and be fruitful
8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest
9. Man knows right from wrong
10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong
11. Successful behaviors naturally lead to success
12. Failed behaviors naturally lead to failure
13. Pass it down to the next generation

Genesis tells us, in part....

1. God created existence
2. Everything he created is good
3. What he created was done in steps
4. Man is a product of that creation

.
4th century christianity is hopelessly corrupt in its core, little different for all three desert religions.

time is running out, the Garden is withering.

 

[ding]

You see the thread is not about what you may think about Judaism or Torah,
rather FACTS.

The facts are Genesis tells us that.

1. God created existence
2. Everything he created is good
3. What he created was done in steps
4. Man is a product of that creation
5. Man is unlike any other creature in creation
6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates
7. Man was told to go forth and be fruitful
8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest
9. Man knows right from wrong
10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong
11. Successful behaviors naturally lead to success
12. Failed behaviors naturally lead to failure
13. Pass it down to the next generation

You can assume stuff - but without basis in Torah, they're just words of a mortal at the least,
and certainly do not suffice the discussion framework at hand as - "FACTS of Judaism".

I’m not assuming anything. It’s all in black and white.

The fact that you can’t summarize what genesis tells us tells me you don’t understand it at all.

That's just repeating what you've already claimed before ad nauseam ,
without providing actual reference, and totally neglecting my remarks pointing to the inconsistency with text.

If you can't admit, so be it, but either respectfully leave - or be so kind to follow the topic.

Again this thread is not about what you may or may not personally understand -
rather the original perspective of Judaism on these issues.

How many times do I have to tell you the reference is Chapter 1 and Chapter 2 of Genesis?

Which one of my points can’t you find the reference to?

Are you arguing that Genesis doesn’t tell us that God created everything?

Are you arguing that everything God created wasn’t good?

Are you arguing that Genesis doesn’t tell us that man is a product of that creation?

Are you arguing that Genesis doesn’t tell us that creation was created in steps?

Are you arguing that Genesis doesn't tell us that man is different than God’s other creatures?

Are you arguing that man wasn’t told to go forth and be fruitful?

What exactly are you arguing?

 

[ding]

Until you provide your summary, all you have are unsubstantiated accusations.

Genesis tells us, in part....

1. God created existence
2. Everything he created is good
3. What he created was done in steps
4. Man is a product of that creation
5. Man is unlike any other creature in creation
6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates
7. Man was told to go forth and be fruitful
8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest
9. Man knows right from wrong
10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong
11. Successful behaviors naturally lead to success
12. Failed behaviors naturally lead to failure
13. Pass it down to the next generation

That summery seems lacking, a lot.
And overly simplistic.

1. God created existence

G-d existed before He created.
As far as I know, Genesis doesn't say "G-d created existence".

2. Everything he created is good

Where does the knowledge of bad fit then?

6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates

Not so precise - animals, to their extent, know as well.
You've missed man speaks.

8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest

Verse?

9. Man knows right from wrong

Not exactly, man knows good an bad.

10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong

Where did that come from? Verse?
Adam tried to rationalized, but he didn't deny he did "wrong".

Again, that summery is superficial,
it's like you've tried on purpose to empty it of all essence.

It’s a summary. It’s supposed to be short and concise. Feel free to add to it if you think it is lacking. I doubt you can.

God created our existence. It’s in the Torah as the account of creation. You may have heard about it.

Of course God existed before he created our existence. God is eternal and unchanging.

Our existence was created ~14 billion years ago when God willed it into existence. You may have heard about it. It’s been in all the science journals and some ancient men knew about it over 6,000 years ago and passed the account down orally for thousands of years from generation to generation until it was recorded in writing by Moses.

Bad or evil so to speak are not extant. They only exist in relation to good and right. In other words, bad is the absence of good and wrong is the absence of right. Everything God created is good. Ancient man knew this over 6,000 years ago and it eventually got written down. Maybe you have read it.

Arguing that man is not set apart from the animal kingdom will be a losing argument. Man is the only animal that has knowledge of good and evil. Ancient man knew this over 6,000 years ago and it eventually got written down. Maybe you have read it.

The sheep does not think the wolf is evil for eating her lamb.

Again, look at the title of the thread what does it say? - FACTS

I see you couldn't provide the verses to confirm your claims,
and rather avoided with more assumptions and logical fallacies without basis in text.

You see the thread is not about what you may think about Judaism or Torah,
rather FACTS. Why am I repeating this? Because one fundamental principle of Judaism is that man's words and beliefs are worthless without ability to back them directly in the text.

You can assume stuff - but without basis in Torah, they're just words of a mortal at the least,
and certainly do not suffice the discussion framework at hand as - "FACTS of Judaism".

I believe the original meaning was lost through time because you sure don’t seem to be able to summarize it like I have.

Apparently you don’t even realize the Torah starts from the belief that God created everything which includes the universe.

Actually no, Torah doesn't start from any belief.
Torah specifically prescribes the commandment to know G-d. as Rambam summarizes:

• "The foundation of all foundations and the pillar of wisdom is to know that there is a Primary Being who brought into being all existence...."

Following with

• "The knowledge of this concept is a positive commandment, as [implied by Exodus 20:2]: "I am G-d, your Lord...." Anyone who presumes that there is another god transgresses a negative commandment, as [Exodus 20:3] states: "You shall have no other gods before Me" and denies a fundamental principle, because this is the great principle upon which all depends."
  
  The knowledge of this concept fulfills a positive commandment, as [implied by Deuteronomy 6:4]: "Hear, Israel, G-d is our Lord, G-d is One."

And most importantly:

• Behold, it is explicitly stated in the Torah and [the works of] the prophets that the Holy One, blessed be He, is not a body or physical form, as [Deuteronomy 4:39] states: "Because G-d, your Lord, is the Lord in the heavens above and the earth below," and a body cannot exist in two places.

Yesodei haTorah - Chapter One

www.chabad.org

You just proved my point that the Torah starts with the belief that God created everything.

You do realize what start means, right? Go to the start of the Torah and read it’s first verse.

you do realize that when you wrote that there is a Primary Being who brought into being all existence...." that that means God created everything, right?

 

[ding]

Again this thread is not about what you may or may not personally understand -
rather the original perspective of Judaism on these issues.

That’s literally what I am doing. Can’t you summarize the original perspective of Judaism on Genesis Chapters 1&2?

maybe then I would understand your perspective.

 

[rylah]

Until you provide your summary, all you have are unsubstantiated accusations.

Genesis tells us, in part....

1. God created existence
2. Everything he created is good
3. What he created was done in steps
4. Man is a product of that creation
5. Man is unlike any other creature in creation
6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates
7. Man was told to go forth and be fruitful
8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest
9. Man knows right from wrong
10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong
11. Successful behaviors naturally lead to success
12. Failed behaviors naturally lead to failure
13. Pass it down to the next generation

That summery seems lacking, a lot.
And overly simplistic.

1. God created existence

G-d existed before He created.
As far as I know, Genesis doesn't say "G-d created existence".

2. Everything he created is good

Where does the knowledge of bad fit then?

6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates

Not so precise - animals, to their extent, know as well.
You've missed man speaks.

8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest

Verse?

9. Man knows right from wrong

Not exactly, man knows good an bad.

10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong

Where did that come from? Verse?
Adam tried to rationalized, but he didn't deny he did "wrong".

Again, that summery is superficial,
it's like you've tried on purpose to empty it of all essence.

It’s a summary. It’s supposed to be short and concise. Feel free to add to it if you think it is lacking. I doubt you can.

God created our existence. It’s in the Torah as the account of creation. You may have heard about it.

Of course God existed before he created our existence. God is eternal and unchanging.

Our existence was created ~14 billion years ago when God willed it into existence. You may have heard about it. It’s been in all the science journals and some ancient men knew about it over 6,000 years ago and passed the account down orally for thousands of years from generation to generation until it was recorded in writing by Moses.

Bad or evil so to speak are not extant. They only exist in relation to good and right. In other words, bad is the absence of good and wrong is the absence of right. Everything God created is good. Ancient man knew this over 6,000 years ago and it eventually got written down. Maybe you have read it.

Arguing that man is not set apart from the animal kingdom will be a losing argument. Man is the only animal that has knowledge of good and evil. Ancient man knew this over 6,000 years ago and it eventually got written down. Maybe you have read it.

The sheep does not think the wolf is evil for eating her lamb.

Again, look at the title of the thread what does it say? - FACTS

I see you couldn't provide the verses to confirm your claims,
and rather avoided with more assumptions and logical fallacies without basis in text.

You see the thread is not about what you may think about Judaism or Torah,
rather FACTS. Why am I repeating this? Because one fundamental principle of Judaism is that man's words and beliefs are worthless without ability to back them directly in the text.

You can assume stuff - but without basis in Torah, they're just words of a mortal at the least,
and certainly do not suffice the discussion framework at hand as - "FACTS of Judaism".

I believe the original meaning was lost through time because you sure don’t seem to be able to summarize it like I have.

Apparently you don’t even realize the Torah starts from the belief that God created everything which includes the universe.

Actually no, Torah doesn't start from any belief.
Torah specifically prescribes the commandment to know G-d. as Rambam summarizes:

• "The foundation of all foundations and the pillar of wisdom is to know that there is a Primary Being who brought into being all existence...."

Following with

• "The knowledge of this concept is a positive commandment, as [implied by Exodus 20:2]: "I am G-d, your Lord...." Anyone who presumes that there is another god transgresses a negative commandment, as [Exodus 20:3] states: "You shall have no other gods before Me" and denies a fundamental principle, because this is the great principle upon which all depends."
  
  The knowledge of this concept fulfills a positive commandment, as [implied by Deuteronomy 6:4]: "Hear, Israel, G-d is our Lord, G-d is One."

And most importantly:

• Behold, it is explicitly stated in the Torah and [the works of] the prophets that the Holy One, blessed be He, is not a body or physical form, as [Deuteronomy 4:39] states: "Because G-d, your Lord, is the Lord in the heavens above and the earth below," and a body cannot exist in two places.

Yesodei haTorah - Chapter One

www.chabad.org

You just proved my point that the Torah starts with the belief that God created everything.

You do realize what start means, right? Go to the start of the Torah and read it’s first verse.

you do realize that when you wrote that there is a Primary Being who brought into being all existence...." that that means God created everything, right?

Doesn't mean belief,
this was explained to you already several times.
The commandment is to KNOW G-d, not belief - fundamentally different.
Belief is the product of blind religiosity - Judaism,Torah doesn't deal with that.

We both know you're just trolling.

 

[rylah]

You see the thread is not about what you may think about Judaism or Torah,
rather FACTS.

The facts are Genesis tells us that.

1. God created existence
2. Everything he created is good
3. What he created was done in steps
4. Man is a product of that creation
5. Man is unlike any other creature in creation
6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates
7. Man was told to go forth and be fruitful
8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest
9. Man knows right from wrong
10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong
11. Successful behaviors naturally lead to success
12. Failed behaviors naturally lead to failure
13. Pass it down to the next generation

You can assume stuff - but without basis in Torah, they're just words of a mortal at the least,
and certainly do not suffice the discussion framework at hand as - "FACTS of Judaism".

I’m not assuming anything. It’s all in black and white.

The fact that you can’t summarize what genesis tells us tells me you don’t understand it at all.

That's just repeating what you've already claimed before ad nauseam ,
without providing actual reference, and totally neglecting my remarks pointing to the inconsistency with text.

If you can't admit, so be it, but either respectfully leave - or be so kind to follow the topic.

Again this thread is not about what you may or may not personally understand -
rather the original perspective of Judaism on these issues.

How many times do I have to tell you the reference is Chapter 1 and Chapter 2 of Genesis?

Which one of my points can’t you find the reference to?

Are you arguing that Genesis doesn’t tell us that God created everything?

Are you arguing that everything God created wasn’t good?

Are you arguing that Genesis doesn’t tell us that man is a product of that creation?

Are you arguing that Genesis doesn’t tell us that creation was created in steps?

Are you arguing that Genesis doesn't tell us that man is different than God’s other creatures?

Are you arguing that man wasn’t told to go forth and be fruitful?

What exactly are you arguing?

Post #679
Either reconcile the contradictions in your claims quoting the text.,
or have the integrity to admit those are just baseless opinions - if can neither stop trolling.

 

[Mindful]

Until you provide your summary, all you have are unsubstantiated accusations.

Genesis tells us, in part....

1. God created existence
2. Everything he created is good
3. What he created was done in steps
4. Man is a product of that creation
5. Man is unlike any other creature in creation
6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates
7. Man was told to go forth and be fruitful
8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest
9. Man knows right from wrong
10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong
11. Successful behaviors naturally lead to success
12. Failed behaviors naturally lead to failure
13. Pass it down to the next generation

That summery seems lacking, a lot.
And overly simplistic.

1. God created existence

G-d existed before He created.
As far as I know, Genesis doesn't say "G-d created existence".

2. Everything he created is good

Where does the knowledge of bad fit then?

6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates

Not so precise - animals, to their extent, know as well.
You've missed man speaks.

8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest

Verse?

9. Man knows right from wrong

Not exactly, man knows good an bad.

10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong

Where did that come from? Verse?
Adam tried to rationalized, but he didn't deny he did "wrong".

Again, that summery is superficial,
it's like you've tried on purpose to empty it of all essence.

It’s a summary. It’s supposed to be short and concise. Feel free to add to it if you think it is lacking. I doubt you can.

God created our existence. It’s in the Torah as the account of creation. You may have heard about it.

Of course God existed before he created our existence. God is eternal and unchanging.

Our existence was created ~14 billion years ago when God willed it into existence. You may have heard about it. It’s been in all the science journals and some ancient men knew about it over 6,000 years ago and passed the account down orally for thousands of years from generation to generation until it was recorded in writing by Moses.

Bad or evil so to speak are not extant. They only exist in relation to good and right. In other words, bad is the absence of good and wrong is the absence of right. Everything God created is good. Ancient man knew this over 6,000 years ago and it eventually got written down. Maybe you have read it.

Arguing that man is not set apart from the animal kingdom will be a losing argument. Man is the only animal that has knowledge of good and evil. Ancient man knew this over 6,000 years ago and it eventually got written down. Maybe you have read it.

The sheep does not think the wolf is evil for eating her lamb.

Again, look at the title of the thread what does it say? - FACTS

I see you couldn't provide the verses to confirm your claims,
and rather avoided with more assumptions and logical fallacies without basis in text.

You see the thread is not about what you may think about Judaism or Torah,
rather FACTS. Why am I repeating this? Because one fundamental principle of Judaism is that man's words and beliefs are worthless without ability to back them directly in the text.

You can assume stuff - but without basis in Torah, they're just words of a mortal at the least,
and certainly do not suffice the discussion framework at hand as - "FACTS of Judaism".

I believe the original meaning was lost through time because you sure don’t seem to be able to summarize it like I have.

Apparently you don’t even realize the Torah starts from the belief that God created everything which includes the universe.

Actually no, Torah doesn't start from any belief.
Torah specifically prescribes the commandment to know G-d. as Rambam summarizes:

• "The foundation of all foundations and the pillar of wisdom is to know that there is a Primary Being who brought into being all existence...."

Following with

• "The knowledge of this concept is a positive commandment, as [implied by Exodus 20:2]: "I am G-d, your Lord...." Anyone who presumes that there is another god transgresses a negative commandment, as [Exodus 20:3] states: "You shall have no other gods before Me" and denies a fundamental principle, because this is the great principle upon which all depends."
  
  The knowledge of this concept fulfills a positive commandment, as [implied by Deuteronomy 6:4]: "Hear, Israel, G-d is our Lord, G-d is One."

And most importantly:

• Behold, it is explicitly stated in the Torah and [the works of] the prophets that the Holy One, blessed be He, is not a body or physical form, as [Deuteronomy 4:39] states: "Because G-d, your Lord, is the Lord in the heavens above and the earth below," and a body cannot exist in two places.

Yesodei haTorah - Chapter One

www.chabad.org

You just proved my point that the Torah starts with the belief that God created everything.

You do realize what start means, right? Go to the start of the Torah and read it’s first verse.

you do realize that when you wrote that there is a Primary Being who brought into being all existence...." that that means God created everything, right?

Are you reading from the King James' Bible? Or The Torah?

 

[ding]

Until you provide your summary, all you have are unsubstantiated accusations.

Genesis tells us, in part....

1. God created existence
2. Everything he created is good
3. What he created was done in steps
4. Man is a product of that creation
5. Man is unlike any other creature in creation
6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates
7. Man was told to go forth and be fruitful
8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest
9. Man knows right from wrong
10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong
11. Successful behaviors naturally lead to success
12. Failed behaviors naturally lead to failure
13. Pass it down to the next generation

That summery seems lacking, a lot.
And overly simplistic.

1. God created existence

G-d existed before He created.
As far as I know, Genesis doesn't say "G-d created existence".

2. Everything he created is good

Where does the knowledge of bad fit then?

6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates

Not so precise - animals, to their extent, know as well.
You've missed man speaks.

8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest

Verse?

9. Man knows right from wrong

Not exactly, man knows good an bad.

10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong

Where did that come from? Verse?
Adam tried to rationalized, but he didn't deny he did "wrong".

Again, that summery is superficial,
it's like you've tried on purpose to empty it of all essence.

It’s a summary. It’s supposed to be short and concise. Feel free to add to it if you think it is lacking. I doubt you can.

God created our existence. It’s in the Torah as the account of creation. You may have heard about it.

Of course God existed before he created our existence. God is eternal and unchanging.

Our existence was created ~14 billion years ago when God willed it into existence. You may have heard about it. It’s been in all the science journals and some ancient men knew about it over 6,000 years ago and passed the account down orally for thousands of years from generation to generation until it was recorded in writing by Moses.

Bad or evil so to speak are not extant. They only exist in relation to good and right. In other words, bad is the absence of good and wrong is the absence of right. Everything God created is good. Ancient man knew this over 6,000 years ago and it eventually got written down. Maybe you have read it.

Arguing that man is not set apart from the animal kingdom will be a losing argument. Man is the only animal that has knowledge of good and evil. Ancient man knew this over 6,000 years ago and it eventually got written down. Maybe you have read it.

The sheep does not think the wolf is evil for eating her lamb.

Again, look at the title of the thread what does it say? - FACTS

I see you couldn't provide the verses to confirm your claims,
and rather avoided with more assumptions and logical fallacies without basis in text.

You see the thread is not about what you may think about Judaism or Torah,
rather FACTS. Why am I repeating this? Because one fundamental principle of Judaism is that man's words and beliefs are worthless without ability to back them directly in the text.

You can assume stuff - but without basis in Torah, they're just words of a mortal at the least,
and certainly do not suffice the discussion framework at hand as - "FACTS of Judaism".

I believe the original meaning was lost through time because you sure don’t seem to be able to summarize it like I have.

Apparently you don’t even realize the Torah starts from the belief that God created everything which includes the universe.

Actually no, Torah doesn't start from any belief.
Torah specifically prescribes the commandment to know G-d. as Rambam summarizes:

• "The foundation of all foundations and the pillar of wisdom is to know that there is a Primary Being who brought into being all existence...."

Following with

• "The knowledge of this concept is a positive commandment, as [implied by Exodus 20:2]: "I am G-d, your Lord...." Anyone who presumes that there is another god transgresses a negative commandment, as [Exodus 20:3] states: "You shall have no other gods before Me" and denies a fundamental principle, because this is the great principle upon which all depends."
  
  The knowledge of this concept fulfills a positive commandment, as [implied by Deuteronomy 6:4]: "Hear, Israel, G-d is our Lord, G-d is One."

And most importantly:

• Behold, it is explicitly stated in the Torah and [the works of] the prophets that the Holy One, blessed be He, is not a body or physical form, as [Deuteronomy 4:39] states: "Because G-d, your Lord, is the Lord in the heavens above and the earth below," and a body cannot exist in two places.

Yesodei haTorah - Chapter One

www.chabad.org

You just proved my point that the Torah starts with the belief that God created everything.

You do realize what start means, right? Go to the start of the Torah and read it’s first verse.

you do realize that when you wrote that there is a Primary Being who brought into being all existence...." that that means God created everything, right?

Doesn't mean belief,
this was explained to you already several times.
The commandment is to KNOW G-d, not belief - fundamentally different.
Belief is the product of blind religiosity - Judaism,Torah doesn't deal with that.

We both know you're just trolling.

You are splitting hairs trying to undermine the wisdom and knowledge that was passed down for thousands of years. Knowing God begins with a belief that God is the matrix and source of everything. Knowing God begins with the belief that everything God created is good. Knowing God begins with the belief that humans hold a special place in his creation.

it’s like you want to forget about everything that was passed down.

 

[ding]

Until you provide your summary, all you have are unsubstantiated accusations.

Genesis tells us, in part....

1. God created existence
2. Everything he created is good
3. What he created was done in steps
4. Man is a product of that creation
5. Man is unlike any other creature in creation
6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates
7. Man was told to go forth and be fruitful
8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest
9. Man knows right from wrong
10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong
11. Successful behaviors naturally lead to success
12. Failed behaviors naturally lead to failure
13. Pass it down to the next generation

That summery seems lacking, a lot.
And overly simplistic.

1. God created existence

G-d existed before He created.
As far as I know, Genesis doesn't say "G-d created existence".

2. Everything he created is good

Where does the knowledge of bad fit then?

6. Man is made in God’s image in that he is a being which knows and creates

Not so precise - animals, to their extent, know as well.
You've missed man speaks.

8. Man was told to do as the original creator; to create for 6 days and then rest

Verse?

9. Man knows right from wrong

Not exactly, man knows good an bad.

10. Rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong when man does wrong, he rationalizes he didn’t do wrong

Where did that come from? Verse?
Adam tried to rationalized, but he didn't deny he did "wrong".

Again, that summery is superficial,
it's like you've tried on purpose to empty it of all essence.

It’s a summary. It’s supposed to be short and concise. Feel free to add to it if you think it is lacking. I doubt you can.

God created our existence. It’s in the Torah as the account of creation. You may have heard about it.

Of course God existed before he created our existence. God is eternal and unchanging.

Our existence was created ~14 billion years ago when God willed it into existence. You may have heard about it. It’s been in all the science journals and some ancient men knew about it over 6,000 years ago and passed the account down orally for thousands of years from generation to generation until it was recorded in writing by Moses.

Bad or evil so to speak are not extant. They only exist in relation to good and right. In other words, bad is the absence of good and wrong is the absence of right. Everything God created is good. Ancient man knew this over 6,000 years ago and it eventually got written down. Maybe you have read it.

Arguing that man is not set apart from the animal kingdom will be a losing argument. Man is the only animal that has knowledge of good and evil. Ancient man knew this over 6,000 years ago and it eventually got written down. Maybe you have read it.

The sheep does not think the wolf is evil for eating her lamb.

Again, look at the title of the thread what does it say? - FACTS

I see you couldn't provide the verses to confirm your claims,
and rather avoided with more assumptions and logical fallacies without basis in text.

You see the thread is not about what you may think about Judaism or Torah,
rather FACTS. Why am I repeating this? Because one fundamental principle of Judaism is that man's words and beliefs are worthless without ability to back them directly in the text.

You can assume stuff - but without basis in Torah, they're just words of a mortal at the least,
and certainly do not suffice the discussion framework at hand as - "FACTS of Judaism".

I believe the original meaning was lost through time because you sure don’t seem to be able to summarize it like I have.

Apparently you don’t even realize the Torah starts from the belief that God created everything which includes the universe.

Actually no, Torah doesn't start from any belief.
Torah specifically prescribes the commandment to know G-d. as Rambam summarizes:

• "The foundation of all foundations and the pillar of wisdom is to know that there is a Primary Being who brought into being all existence...."

Following with

• "The knowledge of this concept is a positive commandment, as [implied by Exodus 20:2]: "I am G-d, your Lord...." Anyone who presumes that there is another god transgresses a negative commandment, as [Exodus 20:3] states: "You shall have no other gods before Me" and denies a fundamental principle, because this is the great principle upon which all depends."
  
  The knowledge of this concept fulfills a positive commandment, as [implied by Deuteronomy 6:4]: "Hear, Israel, G-d is our Lord, G-d is One."

And most importantly:

• Behold, it is explicitly stated in the Torah and [the works of] the prophets that the Holy One, blessed be He, is not a body or physical form, as [Deuteronomy 4:39] states: "Because G-d, your Lord, is the Lord in the heavens above and the earth below," and a body cannot exist in two places.

Yesodei haTorah - Chapter One

www.chabad.org

You just proved my point that the Torah starts with the belief that God created everything.

You do realize what start means, right? Go to the start of the Torah and read it’s first verse.

you do realize that when you wrote that there is a Primary Being who brought into being all existence...." that that means God created everything, right?

Are you reading from the King James' Bible? Or The Torah?

Tell you what, you summarize what the Torah says and then compare it to what I wrote and answer that for yourself.

don’t elevate a book above God.