Easter - ABC Style

[maineman]

you are the one who, in this very thread, said that a school changing the name of december vacation from Christmas to Winter RUINED the holiday for everyone.

I asked you if the name change forced families to not put up christmas trees. you did not respond

I asked you if it forced families to not send out Christmas cards, or buy Christmas presents or decorate their homes or attend parties or attend advent worship or do any of the other things that families do to happily celebrate Christmas.... I asked you over and over and over and over again to merely explain to me how that name change RUINED Christmas.

you did not respond.

will you now?

 

[red states rule]

I know you will get it, but here is yet another example

Hospital that 'banned' hot cross buns to avoid offending non-Christians
by JAMES MILLS - More by this author »


Hospital staff claim they were banned from handing out hot cross buns this Easter in case they upset non-Christians.

The decision disappointed patients at Poole Hospital in Dorset and angered catering staff.

In an email to their local paper, sent on Good Friday, catering staff said: 'We the kitchen staff of Poole Hospital were disgusted to find that the patients were not getting hot cross buns this morning.

"The manager of the catering department said he was worried about the ethnic minorities that work here."

The workers, who did not want to be named, said they had been inundated with calls from nurses on the wards asking why there were no buns this year.

Eventually hospital bosses relented and they were distributed on Easter Monday. A spokesman for Poole Hospital NHS Trust denied, however, that the absence of hot cross buns on Good Friday was anything to do with political correctness.

She claimed: "We do apologise to patients who missed out on their hot cross buns on Good Friday.

"This was due to an oversight by the catering manager who forgot to order them in time. It was nothing to do with religious beliefs.

"The buns were handed out on Easter Monday instead."

Hot cross buns have been eaten on Good Friday for centuries.

They are believed by some historians to pre- date Christianity, although they were not called "hot cross buns" until the late 18th century.

They should contain no eggs or dairy products so those who are observing Lent in the traditional way are able to eat them.

This is not the first time they have been the source of controversy.

After the Protestant Reformation in the 16th century the English monarchy saw the buns as a symbol of Catholicism because they were baked from the consecrated dough used to make communion wafers.

But an attempt to ban them failed because they were so popular.

Queen Elizabeth I eventually passed a law permitting bakeries to sell them, but only at Easter and Christmas.

Representatives of other religions in the Poole area did not see any problem with serving the buns in hospital.

Rabbi Neil Amswych from the Bournemouth Reform Synagogue said: "I don't eat hot cross buns for two reasons.

"One is that it is a Christian custom and the second reason is that I am on a diet.

"But I don't see why they shouldn't be available. After all, we're in a Christian country and the state religion is Christianity.

"They shouldn't be force-fed, but there is no reason why they shouldn't be available.

"Perhaps they should offer other ethnic foods - that might be a nice gesture. They could offer latkes for the festival of Chanukah, which is in December. They are oily potato pancakes and very nice."

There have been many examples of official bodies attempting to remove the religious message from Christian festivals in the name of political correctness.

Birmingham Council notoriously called its festive celebrations "Winterval" while Luton advertised its Christmas lights as "luminos".

Christmas cards sent out by public bodies have, almost without exception, been stripped of any Christian references.

Last year's Christmas stamps bore no trace of the Bible story

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=447750&in_page_id=1770

 

[maineman]

and how does this RUIN Christmas?

I will try again and maybe...just maybe, this time you will answer these questions.

Do any of these measures prevent a family from erecting a Christmas tree in their living room? yes or no?

Do any of these measures prevent a family from decorating the outside of their house with Christmas lights? yes or no?

Do any of these measures prevent a family from saying "Merry Christmas" to everyone they meet? yes or no?

Do any of these measures prevent a family from sending Christmas cards to all of their friends and relatives? yes or no?

Do any of these measures prevent a family from throwing a lavish Christmas party for all of their friends, acquaintances, and neighbors? yes or no?

Do any of these measures prevent a family from buying Christmas presents and exchanging them on Christmas morning? yes or no?

Do any of these measures prevent a family from worshiping at their church and celebrating the birth of Jesus? yes or no?

How does the mere fact that a school changes the name of the december vacation from Christmas to Winter RUIN Christmas for ANYBODY? Please. You are the one who made that claim. Just use your own words to explain how, if families can still do all the things I mentioned above, how does that name change RUIN the holiday for them???Don't cut and paste yet another article that talks about yet another community that takes steps to be religion-neutral.... use your own words to back up your claim that the name change RUINS Christmas. Can you do that? yes or no?

 

[red states rule]

I was right - you did not get it

 

[maineman]

I was right - you did not get it

why can't you answer simple questions?

 

[red states rule]

why can't you answer simple questions?

I have answerd your simple questions - your simple mind cannot accept the facts

Libs say celebrate Christmas not where we will see it and be offended and be forced to sue you

 

[maineman]

nine simple yes or no questions.... you have not ever answered one of them. please answer them now:

and how does this RUIN Christmas?

I will try again and maybe...just maybe, this time you will answer these questions.

Do any of these measures prevent a family from erecting a Christmas tree in their living room? yes or no?

Do any of these measures prevent a family from decorating the outside of their house with Christmas lights? yes or no?

Do any of these measures prevent a family from saying "Merry Christmas" to everyone they meet? yes or no?

Do any of these measures prevent a family from sending Christmas cards to all of their friends and relatives? yes or no?

Do any of these measures prevent a family from throwing a lavish Christmas party for all of their friends, acquaintances, and neighbors? yes or no?

Do any of these measures prevent a family from buying Christmas presents and exchanging them on Christmas morning? yes or no?

Do any of these measures prevent a family from worshiping at their church and celebrating the birth of Jesus? yes or no?

How does the mere fact that a school changes the name of the december vacation from Christmas to Winter RUIN Christmas for ANYBODY? Please. You are the one who made that claim. Just use your own words to explain how, if families can still do all the things I mentioned above, how does that name change RUIN the holiday for them???Don't cut and paste yet another article that talks about yet another community that takes steps to be religion-neutral.... use your own words to back up your claim that the name change RUINS Christmas. Can you do that? yes or no?

 

[red states rule]

nine simple yes or no questions.... you have not ever answered one of them. please answer them now:

Still stuck on repeat and avoiding the overwhelming evidence how liberals attack the holidays

 

[maineman]

Still stuck on repeat and avoiding the overwhelming evidence how liberals attack the holidays

1. I am not sure why you continue to say that it is LIBERALS who attack the holidays when it is secularists and non-Christians.

2. I am not sure why you feel that Christians or their holidays are so weak that they cannot withstand some criticism from non-believers. It is clear to me that you are NOT a true Christian or you would not be so upset about things that clearly have no bearing on your ability to worship the risen Christ.

3. I will stay "stuck on repeat" repeating my questions to you until you show the balls and the brains necessary to actually fucking answer them. Will that be happening anytime soon?

 

[red states rule]

1. I am not sure why you continue to say that it is LIBERALS who attack the holidays when it is secularists and non-Christians.

2. I am not sure why you feel that Christians or their holidays are so weak that they cannot withstand some criticism from non-believers. It is clear to me that you are NOT a true Christian or you would not be so upset about things that clearly have no bearing on your ability to worship the risen Christ.

3. I will stay "stuck on repeat" repeating my questions to you until you show the balls and the brains necessary to actually fucking answer them. Will that be happening anytime soon?

Look who is out there trying to ban the holidays from the public view - the ACLU and Barry Linn

Criticism? It is an all out war

You have nothing to counter the many examples of the libs war on the holiday and their effots to impose thier secular views on people

 

[maineman]

Look who is out there trying to ban the holidays from the public view - the ACLU and Barry Linn

Criticism? It is an all out war

You have nothing to counter the many examples of the libs war on the holiday and their effots to impose thier secular views on people

the ACLU represents Nazis too... they represent ANYONE whose has a bill of rights case.

If it is all out war, Christians - true Christians - see no need to fight it. Removing the cross from the wall of the courthouse will never remove the shadow that the cross casts upon my heart. I could care less if the iconography of chrsitianity is removed from public buildings. The cross still stands tall on the altar of my chuch and rests easy on the chain around my neck.

secularists of all political persuasions and non-Christians seek to remove the iconography of any ONE religion in public places funded by peope who were NOT adherents of that religion.

You have yet to answer my nine questions above and explain to me how the simple act of changing the name of a school holiday RUINS CHRISTMAS.

Will you be answering those questions anytime soon?

 

[red states rule]

the ACLU represents Nazis too... they represent ANYONE whose has a bill of rights case.

If it is all out war, Christians - true Christians - see no need to fight it. Removing the cross from the wall of the courthouse will never remove the shadow that the cross casts upon my heart. I could care less if the iconography of chrsitianity is removed from public buildings. The cross still stands tall on the altar of my chuch and rests easy on the chain around my neck.

secularists of all political persuasions and non-Christians seek to remove the iconography of any ONE religion in public places funded by peope who were NOT adherents of that religion.

You have yet to answer my nine questions above and explain to me how the simple act of changing the name of a school holiday RUINS CHRISTMAS.

Will you be answering those questions anytime soon?

You just made my point

Libs say - keep your Christian faith out of the public view - if you don't like it - to bad

 

[maineman]

You just made my point

Libs say - keep your Christian faith out of the public view - if you don't like it - to bad

If I want to plaster the side of my house with a Giant "Jesus Saves" sign, for all the public to read, that is certainly my right. secularists do not want Christianity to be the state religion of America.... Neither do I.... because then the state will think it can tell me how to worship. I like it when the state stays out of the church and the church stays out of the state.

Now....will you be answering MY questions anytime soon?

 

[red states rule]

If I want to plaster the side of my house with a Giant "Jesus Saves" sign, for all the public to read, that is certainly my right. secularists do not want Christianity to be the state religion of America.... Neither do I.... because then the state will think it can tell me how to worship. I like it when the state stays out of the church and the church stays out of the state.

Now....will you be answering MY questions anytime soon?

Don't be to sure. there have many instances where libs have a cow over the US flag being displayed on private property

 

[red states rule]

the ACLU represents Nazis too... they represent ANYONE whose has a bill of rights case.

If it is all out war, Christians - true Christians - see no need to fight it. Removing the cross from the wall of the courthouse will never remove the shadow that the cross casts upon my heart. I could care less if the iconography of chrsitianity is removed from public buildings. The cross still stands tall on the altar of my chuch and rests easy on the chain around my neck.

secularists of all political persuasions and non-Christians seek to remove the iconography of any ONE religion in public places funded by peope who were NOT adherents of that religion.

You have yet to answer my nine questions above and explain to me how the simple act of changing the name of a school holiday RUINS CHRISTMAS.

Will you be answering those questions anytime soon?

PBS's Charlie Rose Spent Good Friday Hacking At Easter Story With Gnostic Gospels
Posted by Tim Graham on April 15, 2007 - 15:06.
You know you must be watching PBS when Good Friday is a time to interview promoters of gnostic gospels and leftist preachers who equate the persecutors of Christ with "rugged individualism." On this Good Friday, April 6, Charlie Rose interviewed Princeton professor Elaine Pagels and Harvard professor Karen King, who explored with Rose how the "Gospel of Judas" shows parallels between early Christian martyrs and modern-day Islamic suicide bombers. Leftist Rev. James Forbes of New York’s Riverside Church carried the anti-individualist message.


Rose began with the professors by promising "some fascinating new information about Judas and Jesus. The New Testament presents Judas’ actions towards Jesus as the most infamous of betrayals. The long-lost Gospel of Judas tells a very different story. It shows Judas as Jesus` favorite disciple and willing collaborator."

CHARLIE ROSE: Tell me where Judas stood among the other disciples? I mean, how is he in terms of age, in terms of relationship, in terms of where he came from?

ELAINE PAGELS: We know little about Judas Iscariot. All we know is that he was one of the disciples .

CHARLIE ROSE: His betrayal.

ELAINE PAGELS: And that for some reason and, as I said, the first gospel doesn’t even speculate. It just seems so mysterious. And later people -- there were various stories and ways of talking about it, trying to figure out why he would do that.

CHARLIE ROSE: You both say that you emerged from the first reading of this feeling that he was an angry man.

ELAINE PAGELS: There is a lot of vehemence in this book, and I think what Karen said, he is angry at the leaders of the church who`re basically telling, I would imagine, young people to go die for God as martyrs.

CHARLIE ROSE: Right. Right. But the anger - the anger was primarily about the notion of going to die for God .

ELAINE PAGELS: Yes.

CHARLIE ROSE: -- and not wanting to see people sacrifice .

ELAINE PAGELS: Right. And it`s not .

CHARLIE ROSE: -- because the idea was Jesus was a loving person rather than someone who wanted you to die for him.

ELAINE PAGELS: Well, it`s not saying that -- if you`re up against, you know, denying your convictions, you might -- you might die for them.

CHARLIE ROSE: Right.

ELAINE PAGELS: But -- but to say you should go out and do that, you`ll get great rewards in heaven if you`re a martyr. You`ll get a, you know, a glorified body and other things, to say that is - is kind of a complicit in murder.

CHARLIE ROSE: As we now know, I mean, there are people who in today’s religious fanaticism --

ELAINE PAGELS: Yes.

CHARLIE ROSE: -- or deeply religious thoughts, people are engaged in all kinds of self-sacrifice.

ELAINE PAGELS: Right.

CHARLIE ROSE: For what they say, for religious purposes and on the promise that the world they`re going to --

ELAINE PAGELS: Yes.

CHARLIE ROSE: – will be much better. Is there any connection, say, between Islam and what it says or what people who are Muslim say, especially those who are committing acts of suicide? And this -- some of the kinds of things we`re talking about early Christianity?

ELAINE PAGELS: Well, both Christians and Muslims have radical groups in which martyrdom, and even killing people is sometimes condoned. And this seems like .

CHARLIE ROSE: In the name of God.

ELAINE PAGELS: In the name of God. And this is a religious leader who says, doing that, encouraging people to die that way is a kind of .

CHARLIE ROSE: Yeah.

ELAINE PAGELS: . a complicity in murder, and it certainly condemns that violence.

That was the most shocking part, but this earlier elaboration of the "Gospel of Judas" was also eyebrow-raising:

KAREN KING: This text has a very complicated position on martyrdom, because on the one hand, Judas is actually for this text the first martyr. And he doesn`t commit suicide the way we learn from the gospels. He is actually put to death by the other 12. But this text is angry

CHARLIE ROSE: To death by the other 12?

KAREN KING: By the other 12.

CHARLIE ROSE: How do they put him to death?

KAREN KING: They stone him. He has a vision in which - in which he sees the 12 stoning him to death. And - and yet the anger in this text is directed at those Christian leaders who are telling other Christians that God wants them to die, that God wants their deaths to glorify him, that they are sacrifices pleasing to God. And the Gospel of Judas says, what kind of god is that? What kind of god would desire the death of his son, would desire of the death of martyrs?

CHARLIE ROSE: And so, it was concerned that .

KAREN KING: That`s a false god.

CHARLIE ROSE: This gospel was concerned that people were going out willingly dying for God, and that was a - it didn’t -- and was - was worried that people would be doing that because it was part of Jesus’ sacrifice.

ELAINE PAGELS: Yes, and when -- you know, the usual story you hear from Christians and from Christian history is that Christian martyrs went joyfully to their deaths because it was a great thing to do. We now see what happens to groups of people, real people, when some leaders are arrested, they`re tortured, various people are taken to prison, strangled, and - and publicly exhibited for his torture and execution. This divided people. They said -- as you said -- some said, "That`s great. I mean, God loves to see his -- his beloved die as martyrs." And this author says, you`re making God into a monster.

Before that came the interview with Rev. James Forbes, who said his Easter message this year would warn of the War on Terror: "We are locked into an epidemic of anxiety, post-traumatic stress disorder; paranoia." He added: "The struggle is revealed in the crucifixion. That is, if you stand for love, hate will be in the corners waiting to win the day. If you stand for community, rugged individualism that has no respect for other human beings will say, I'm the way."

Rugged individualism and the Christian gospel can certainly be at odds, but when it comes to the Left, you can also suspect they need a lecture that secular or scientific socialism and the Christian gospel can also be at odds. Rev. Forbes also insisted that belief in Jesus and his Resurrection is, well, sort of optional for him:

CHARLIE ROSE: Is accepting the idea more important than having to believe the reality?

REV. JAMES FORBES: My response to you is my life`s history. You know, some years when I`m doing the Easter service, I`m thinking this thing is absolutely literally true. And other times I`m saying, "It`s - it`s a metaphor for life." At other times I`m saying, they believed it, and I receive strength from what they believe. And other times I`m not so sure. So what I think is this is one of those powerful stories. If you want to take it literally, you got it. If you want to see the metaphor, that is where the depth of the meaning applies to our hearts, no matter which of these positions we take. So I would say some folks get it. You ask me how I know he lives he lives within my heart.

CHARLIE ROSE: And you say to all of them, that however you accept it is OK.

REV. JAMES FORBES: I say I have a responsibility to answer what does the God in me reveal to be the meaning for me in this story? Each of us will have to take that for ourselves. I do not discredit those who can`t buy the whole miracle part, who can`t buy the ascension part. Take what you can. This is a story that each individual can appropriate. Now, religious organizations say if you can`t buy it literally true, you are desecrating the whole tradition itself. I am not in that camp. I`m in a camp that believes that the God in me, the spirit in me, accepts me in those years when I`m more literalistic and those years when I`m more metaphorical, and those years when I`m saying, "Oh, I don`t know." That God is in me, and assists me in appropriating what I need now.

http://newsbusters.org/node/12051