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Zone1 Do Christians Proselytize out of “Love” - or Arrogance?

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Lisa558

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you are placing restrictions on freedom of
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i pointed out upthread the parallels between Evangelical Christians and those on the fsr-left. In this instance, the EC disagrees with you, so she’s attempting to silence you.

(I appreciate your input here. Thank you.)
 
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Lisa558

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She started out saying it's arrogant to SHARE your faith. Turns out, it's the assertion that Jesus Christ is the only way to God that she doesn't like. Per her own words. So while I think she doesn't like when Christians proselytize, she also just does not like the "intolerant" message that there are not many paths to God. Which she seems to have a problem acknowledging.

The intolerant message is that everyone who isn’t Christian is going to hell, and going around telling people of other religions that is both arrogant and rude.

And why put “intolerant“ in quotes when you say nobody has a path to G-d but Christians, when I am pointing out that Judaism allows there is more than one path? Your view of course is much more limited - your way is the only way.

And as I said repeatedly, I’m fine that you think Jesus is the only way. If you have been a good person, you will see heaven. I just want Christians to stop badgering Jews to abandon their religion - the guy who followed me in Vegas said “You are wrong and I will explain why” AFTER I told him I didn’t want to hear it - and show some respect to those of us with different beliefs.
 

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Having been on the receiving end of Evangelical Christians‘ relentless attempts to get me to abandon my religion (Judaism), I have often heard them say they do it out of love to “share the Truth.” The attempt to convert usually escalates to dire warnings of the hell that awaits and how angry G-d is with Jews.

So is this really love? There are numerous religions in the world, with the majority of people not believing in Jesus, and one‘s religious beliefs are as much the truth to them as Christians beliefs are to Christians.

In this article, it explains how force-feeding one’s religious beliefs onto others, with the insistence that their way and only their way is the path to G-d, is both arrogant and disrespectful. I hope that those who have been aggressively proselytizing will give it some thought.


If you saw someone about to walk off a cliff, would it be arrogant to warn them?

If one truly believes the words of the New Testament how could they not try and tell everyone and save as many as possible?

There is no gray area in the New Testament, one either follows Jesus or they burn in hell for eternity.
 

Golfing Gator

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The intolerant message is that everyone who isn’t Christian is going to hell, and going around telling people of other religions that is both arrogant and rude.

Yet it is the heart of the message of Jesus. One cannot claim to follow Jesus and the ignore His words.
 

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It should also be pointed out that Jesus' final words on earth were a command to go and preach His gospel to the world and bring people to Him.
 

Indeependent

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Please elaborate why so many Jews choose to live in Da Evul Xian majority countries if they are such Evul murderers and bigots. Did your former Muslim allies for 1,200 years steal your lunch money?
Please explain why the RCC tells you they love you and then murders you?
 
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Lisa558

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Because we have previously had a long, rational discussion and she basically lost her mind at the "only way to God" part. You can also stop projecting on me any bigotry toward Jews, which I do not have. Or be reported, your choice.
You think I don’t know that Christians think their way is the only way to G-d? I know they think that. The Evangelicals just need to stop hounding Jews about it. PLEASE.

And think about that. Since Jews already know that (some) Christians think they, the Jews, are damned to hell if they don’t abandon their religion, what’s the point telling them? Do you think Jews are oblivious to that opinion?

I remember as a young teen, my parents had a fundamentalist Christian couple over for dinner, and the wife told my mother that it bothers her knowing Mom is doomed since she doesn’t accept Jesus. My mom said, nicely, ”I appreciate your concern, but I believe I’ll be fine,“ and…..here’s the important part: the Christian woman dropped it.

So that’s it. Say it once if you have to, and then stop. The neighbors who had hounded me for years were so bad that I dreaded running into them. EVERY conversation was about how they were right, and I was wrong. Enough is enough.
 

OhPleaseJustQuit

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That’s too bad. I don’t mind when they invite me to church or gently make a suggestion about Jesus, but it’s when they start to get belligerent and aggressive in the face of a polite “no thank you” that it becomes problematic.
I had an experience with a Mormon, for whom a polite "No thank you" was not nearly enough. I pointed to my "NO SOLICITING" sign and the punk started arguing with my definition of "soliciting", and then began to assert his legal right to be on my property. I had to get physical, taking a couple of steps closer to him and demanding he get off of my property in a raised voice.
 
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Lisa558

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Because we have previously had a long, rational discussion and she basically lost her mind at the "only way to God" part. You can also stop projecting on me any bigotry toward Jews, which I do not have. Or be reported, your choice.
You say you have no bigotry toward Jews, yet you think G-d is going to send us to hell. That implies G-d thinks less of us, disapproves of our beliefs, is angry at us, whatever, and will punish us for being ”bad.” There is an underlying bigotry toward Jews is that.

And I’ve found that myself in my (unfortunate and forced) conversion lectures by ECs. At first they say it’s out of love, but eventually some pretty awful opinions about Jews emerge.
 
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Lisa558

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I had an experience with a Mormon, for whom a polite "No thank you" was not nearly enough. I pointed to my "NO SOLICITING" sign and the punk started arguing with my definition of "soliciting", and then began to assert his legal right to be on my property. I had to get physical, taking a couple of steps closer to him and demanding he get off of my property in a raised voice.
Yes, it’s beyond annoying how some of them can be. They can’t take a polite “no” for an answer.
 

Golfing Gator

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I had an experience with a Mormon, for whom a polite "No thank you" was not nearly enough. I pointed to my "NO SOLICITING" sign and the punk started arguing with my definition of "soliciting", and then began to assert his legal right to be on my property. I had to get physical, taking a couple of steps closer to him and demanding he get off of my property in a raised voice.

I had this issue with the JWs for a while. Simple fix, I finally invited them in and we spent an hour of me showing them in the bible where they were wrong. They were both young and new converts. One came back the next Saturday with one of their elders and things went the same way. After that they never knocked on my door again, I would even see them in the neighborhood and they would bypass my house totally.
 

OhPleaseJustQuit

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All I’ve done is say that it is rude and arrogant to approach Jews, and with increasing aggression, to tell us our religion is wrong and that we are damned unless we abandon it. We aren’t doing that to Christians.

It sure seems you want the right for Christians to harass Jews about their beliefs - I once had some Evangelical Christian follow me from one hotel to another in Vegas, which is a long distance, harping on me why I’m wrong - but you get incensed if a Jew points out how arrogant and rude that is.
Absolutely true.
 

irosie91

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All I’ve done is say that it is rude and arrogant to approach Jews, and with increasing aggression, to tell us our religion is wrong and that we are damned unless we abandon it. We aren’t doing that to Christians.

It sure seems you want the right for Christians to harass Jews about their beliefs - I once had some Evangelical Christian follow me from one hotel to another in Vegas, which is a long distance, harping on me why I’m wrong - but you get incensed if a Jew points out how arrogant and rude that is.
the VERY annoying habit of many christian
proselytizers involves concerted attempts to
influence children. There are even comic book
style pamphlets targeted at jewish kids. IMO
it is crude
 

irosie91

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Jesus was a Jew, so I'm gonna guess that he beleived in their religion.
IMO there is not a word that can be credibly
attributed to Jesus which contradicts orthodox,
pharisaic Judaism in the "New Testament"
There is clear evidence that Jesus was a pharisee
and a follower of Hillel. It is clear that he not
only KNOWS about talmudic Judaism and often
quotes the talmud. Poor Constantine seems
to have let these realities SLIP THRU
 
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Lisa558

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the VERY annoying habit of many christian
proselytizers involves concerted attempts to
influence children. There are even comic book
style pamphlets targeted at jewish kids. IMO
it is crude
I haven’t see that, but that’s yet another similarity between Christian proselytizers and leftists: influence the children to believe that their own parents are wrong.
 

irosie91

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I haven’t see that, but that’s yet another similarity between Christian proselytizers and leftists: influence the children to believe that their own parents are wrong.
some time ago ---as a single mother of a nine
year old and having move to NYC because of
my work----I discovered NO SAFE PLACE TO
live. The hospital in which I worked was host
of one gunshot wound in the head after the
other. SO.....I moved into a chassidic neighbor-
hood. Not an easy move for me not being
"one of theirs" There was a book store on the
main drag. I sometimes bought books there--
for me or my kid. Every time I bought a kids'
book ----I found naive sorta comic style
christian propaganda pamphlets inserted
between the pages. I even found some in a
cookbook I bought for myself. As it turns out,
that book store was a TARGET for eager
proselytizers who just walked in and stuck
their stuff into books of all kinds. Weird but
true----almost funny
 
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Lisa558

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some time ago ---as a single mother of a nine
year old and having move to NYC because of
my work----I discovered NO SAFE PLACE TO
live. The hospital in which I worked was host
of one gunshot wound in the head after the
other. SO.....I moved into a chassidic neighbor-
hood. Not an easy move for me not being
"one of theirs" There was a book store on the
main drag. I sometimes bought books there--
for me or my kid. Every time I bought a kids'
book ----I found naive sorta comic style
christian propaganda pamphlets inserted
between the pages. I even found some in a
cookbook I bought for myself. As it turns out,
that book store was a TARGET for eager
proselytizers who just walked in and stuck
their stuff into books of all kinds. Weird but
true----almost funny
Yes, these proselytizers are sneaky.

When I was around 17 or 18, a new boy showed up at a singles dance at my synagogue, flirted with me, and invited me on a date - to a Jewish performance, he said. I went, all the people on stage were all singing “Yoshua, Yoshua,” which meant nothing to me, other than it was weird for Jews to sing praise to some guy named Yoshua, whoever that was. Then it hit me that it was a Hebrew name for Jesus, and this guy had manipulated me into a Jews-for-Jesus event.

I told him he was not honest with me, and asked him to take me home, which he did.
 

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