Death of the Republic, the Michael Flynn chapter.

In fact, help me out. Why should I vote Biden over Trump? Or why should I vote at all? Georgia looks to be close this year. So why should I vote Democratic? Not because they love the Constitution. Obviously they do not if they are willing to trample the Fourth, Fifth, and Sixth Amendment to get a guy. Is it because they are totally going to give me a better nation afterwards? Obviously they won’t, because the nation will be founded in whatever they want today, not the rules and laws we have held sacred for more than two centuries.

If you are looking at it like a Constitutional Fetishist, and you think the Founding Slave Rapists shit marble, probably then there is nothing I can do.

I'm more pragmatic. The best constitution in the world does you no good if you have an awful human being in charge. The worst constitution is fine if you have good people in charge. We aren't a country of laws, we are a country of people.

I should also point out it wasn't the DEMOCRATS who went out to get Flynn, it was Mueller and his team, and Mueller was a Republican.

The problem with the GOP is that it has become the Cult of Trump. But you worry more about General Flynn not having all the paperwork filled out when he was caught red handed selling us out to Russia than some poor Hispanic Kid in a cage in the Southwest. I'm sure he'd like to have some Constitutional rights, too.

This is what happens when you hate your opponents. Nothing is too much to get them. Nothing is beyond the line, or too extreme. Laws don’t matter, no matter how high those laws may be. Even the supreme law of the land is irrelevant to make someone pay.

Here's the thing. Trump is corrupt. He's an awful human being by any objective standard. So, yeah, getting him is a primary thing. The constitution actually has several mechanisms for avoiding or getting rid of bad presidents. We didn't avail ourselves of any of them.

Today, we found out that Trump's master Putin was paying bounties to kill US Servicemen in Afghanistan. Trump did nothing about it. Big Surprise there.
Today we find out that the communist Democrat latest lie is that Putin was paying bounties to kill American servicemen in Afghanistan. Where did this come from? Democrat fury that Trump is responsible for killing el Bagdhadi and Democrat hero Soleimanie. They never got over it.
 
A lot of ACLU members are supporting Trump. Or something. If you want to bring politics into it. I voted for Trump. Because IMO he was the least worst option.

And that tells me that I can't trust your judgement. I'm not overly fond of Mrs. Clinton, but frankly, I have no doubt she would have avoided the daily shennanigans Trump engages in.

I had voted Obama, twice. Kerry and Gore before that. Clinton twice. And Democrats all the way back. Today I see the same problem. Two candidates that stink to high heaven. I honestly do not know if I will vote. Or who it would be for. Or against. Right now I honestly believe it is not with the time to cast a ballot. It does not matter who we get. Joe will say anything and mean none of it. Trump has tons of issues too.

You see, I'm kind of the opposite. I voted for Republicans from Reagan to McCain, but then the crazies took over the GOP. The types who think the Rapture is actually going to be a thing that happens, and they look forward to it.

To me, it's a simple choice. Trump has proven himself to be incompetent and corrupt. As much as he whines about the "Deep State", the professionals in government you whine about have kept this from being a LOT worse than it could have been. But now we are in crises that he has no idea how to deal with. Biden isn't an administrative genius nor does he need to be. He just has to have the good sense to let the professionals do their jobs.

Hey I’m with you man. After all, the Constitution is not a Suicide Pact. The cops and prosecutors who got the illegal warrant, should be locked up right next to Flynn. No need to have a trial, we know they are guilty, they admitted it. We can’t let a little thing like due process and the law get in the way. We know who is guilty, they admitted it. No trials, just lock them up. They’re guilty. We’ll worry about when to let them out, later, if ever.

And that pesky first amendment? It is such a bother. If Biden is elected, he can just outlaw all the Republican leaning or conservative websites. Just lock up the people posting the untrue stuff. Who cares about the First Amendment, the Constitution is not a Suicide Pact.

If Trump wins, and he want’s to lock up the Liberal leaning media groups, no problem. Same argument applies. The Constitution is not a suicide pact.

Banning guns? No problem. Who cares what the Constitution says. It isn’t important.

Stop and Frisk is a great idea. In fact, we could really limit crime if we had checkpoints at every county line. That way we could find the guilty before they got anywhere. of course, we would need these checkpoints to check the people out in various points inside the counties. But imagine how much crime we could stop just by getting rid of the fourth amendment, or at least ignoring it. We could get the guilty off the streets once and for all.

Trial by jury is so time consuming. And it is such a waste of money and resources. If the police arrest them, they’re guilty, send them to prison. No need for judicial review. Just take the cops word for it. It will save so much time and money and free up the money we would have spent on courts.

Oh what a wonderful world you envision. We could rename the country. Union of Soviet American Citizens. Or the People’s Republic of America.

Don’t worry, you’re not guilty of anything yet. So they won’t lock you up. Yet. But if Trump wins, you’re liable to end up on an enemies list, and be locked up for treason or subversion or something. Of course, I’ll be on the same list, no matter who wins.

Because without the Constitution, that is the world we have. And it has nothing to do with the Founders being men of genius. They were better by far than anyone else of the era. And that is the secret to understanding history. You have to view the people in context of the time they lived in. Today, none of them would be anything but minor individuals. But then, they were the giants, they risked everything to give us independence. And we have squandered it for two centuries, and now it is leaving, and good riddance. We deserve a dictatorship, because we all want one, only we want ourselves as the Dictator. If not us, than someone we choose. Well we’re going to get the dictator, and we have only ourselves to blame. You’ll be ranting and raving if it is Trump, but you will get what you deserve too, because the Constitution is not a suicide pact.
 
Mueller was a clueless figurehead.
His entire team was made up of rabid Hillary and Obama supporters.

If you need to tell yourself that.

Here's the reality, if you took a secret ballot in Washington right now, get rid of Trump would be unanimous... The only thing that keeps the GOP office holders from turning on him is fear of the Mouth Breathers like you.
 
Hey I’m with you man. After all, the Constitution is not a Suicide Pact. The cops and prosecutors who got the illegal warrant, should be locked up right next to Flynn.

No, even the IG found they made a good faith mistake.

Banning guns? No problem. Who cares what the Constitution says. It isn’t important.

Here's the thing. The crazy idea that the Militia Amendment guarantees THESE guys the right to military grade weapons is what's crazy.

1593370763571.png


Because without the Constitution, that is the world we have. And it has nothing to do with the Founders being men of genius. They were better by far than anyone else of the era.

well, no they were a bunch of slave-rapists who didn't want to pay their fair share in taxes. They saved us from the abject horror of being Canadians. I've been to Canada... it's rather nice except for the weather.

Buddy, it's getting a bit difficult to talk to you, if you really think that the guys didn't dot all their t and cross all their i's when they caught Flynn Red Handed is a constitutional crisis and we are all going to die.

The thing is, such matters are issues for juries to decide. Not a prosecutor trying to cover up for his boss firing all the other prosecutors. THAT'S the danger of dictatorship, not holding our public officials to account.
 
Mueller was a clueless figurehead.
His entire team was made up of rabid Hillary and Obama supporters.

If you need to tell yourself that.

Here's the reality, if you took a secret ballot in Washington right now, get rid of Trump would be unanimous... The only thing that keeps the GOP office holders from turning on him is fear of the Mouth Breathers like you.

If you need to tell yourself that.


You need to avoid the truth?
 
In fact, help me out. Why should I vote Biden over Trump? Or why should I vote at all? Georgia looks to be close this year. So why should I vote Democratic? Not because they love the Constitution. Obviously they do not if they are willing to trample the Fourth, Fifth, and Sixth Amendment to get a guy. Is it because they are totally going to give me a better nation afterwards? Obviously they won’t, because the nation will be founded in whatever they want today, not the rules and laws we have held sacred for more than two centuries.

If you are looking at it like a Constitutional Fetishist, and you think the Founding Slave Rapists shit marble, probably then there is nothing I can do.

I'm more pragmatic. The best constitution in the world does you no good if you have an awful human being in charge. The worst constitution is fine if you have good people in charge. We aren't a country of laws, we are a country of people.

I should also point out it wasn't the DEMOCRATS who went out to get Flynn, it was Mueller and his team, and Mueller was a Republican.

The problem with the GOP is that it has become the Cult of Trump. But you worry more about General Flynn not having all the paperwork filled out when he was caught red handed selling us out to Russia than some poor Hispanic Kid in a cage in the Southwest. I'm sure he'd like to have some Constitutional rights, too.

This is what happens when you hate your opponents. Nothing is too much to get them. Nothing is beyond the line, or too extreme. Laws don’t matter, no matter how high those laws may be. Even the supreme law of the land is irrelevant to make someone pay.

Here's the thing. Trump is corrupt. He's an awful human being by any objective standard. So, yeah, getting him is a primary thing. The constitution actually has several mechanisms for avoiding or getting rid of bad presidents. We didn't avail ourselves of any of them.

Today, we found out that Trump's master Putin was paying bounties to kill US Servicemen in Afghanistan. Trump did nothing about it. Big Surprise there.
Today we find out that the communist Democrat latest lie is that Putin was paying bounties to kill American servicemen in Afghanistan. Where did this come from? Democrat fury that Trump is responsible for killing el Bagdhadi and Democrat hero Soleimanie. They never got over it.

Actually we do not know that.


The idea of them paying bounties, or at least helping the Taliban against us is pretty much accepted. The question is if Trump was told. If not, why not?
 
Hey I’m with you man. After all, the Constitution is not a Suicide Pact. The cops and prosecutors who got the illegal warrant, should be locked up right next to Flynn.

No, even the IG found they made a good faith mistake.

Banning guns? No problem. Who cares what the Constitution says. It isn’t important.

Here's the thing. The crazy idea that the Militia Amendment guarantees THESE guys the right to military grade weapons is what's crazy.

View attachment 356370

Because without the Constitution, that is the world we have. And it has nothing to do with the Founders being men of genius. They were better by far than anyone else of the era.

well, no they were a bunch of slave-rapists who didn't want to pay their fair share in taxes. They saved us from the abject horror of being Canadians. I've been to Canada... it's rather nice except for the weather.

Buddy, it's getting a bit difficult to talk to you, if you really think that the guys didn't dot all their t and cross all their i's when they caught Flynn Red Handed is a constitutional crisis and we are all going to die.

The thing is, such matters are issues for juries to decide. Not a prosecutor trying to cover up for his boss firing all the other prosecutors. THAT'S the danger of dictatorship, not holding our public officials to account.

And the Jury would decide it upon what? Not the law? The law proscribes them from even seeing the evidence. Not the Constitution, it is irrelevant.

Why should I oppose Trump. Tell me what crimes he has committed. If you can make a case, in line with your posts here and elsewhere, I will become a full throated opponent and even vote Democratic this November. If you can’t, I will vote Republican, despite my opposition to many Republican arguments and positions.
 
And the Jury would decide it upon what? Not the law? The law proscribes them from even seeing the evidence.

You are going round and round here, buddy. He did what he is accused of, that's the thing. A prosecutor brought a case, his lawyer fought in court and a judge decided... There's really no "new" evidence that exonerates him.

This is using legal trickery to let a guilty man go free, and you know it.
 
And the Jury would decide it upon what? Not the law? The law proscribes them from even seeing the evidence.

You are going round and round here, buddy. He did what he is accused of, that's the thing. A prosecutor brought a case, his lawyer fought in court and a judge decided... There's really no "new" evidence that exonerates him.

This is using legal trickery to let a guilty man go free, and you know it.

Yep. Totally new theory. So no reason to oppose Trump?


1963. Nearly sixty years
 
Yep. Totally new theory. So no reason to oppose Trump?

All sorts of good reasons, but you won't listen to them. You are fine with a criminal president and selling out our country to Russia.

Well we know those reasons won’t be based in law or the Constitution. As for selling out Russia the worst he did was pull out of Syria. Where we should never have been. Syria by the way along with Egypt and Libya are some of the reasons I did not vote for Hillary.

The State Department under Hillary was the driving force in violating international sanctions and arming the rebels which led to the Civil War. The reason Europe is groaning under the flood of Refugees.

That worked out so well she got Libya fired up. That showed she had no clue about international relations. Because anyone with half a brain knew the Russians had one Naval Base in the Med and there was no way they were going to stand by and let that base fall.

Both Libya and Syria remain in Civil Wars. A testament to the genius of Hillary. In fact her Machiavellian tendencies were so inept I literally said before the election. Yes. Trump May bumble us into a war stupidly. But Hillary would probably smart us into the same war trying to be clever and falling short of being just clever enough.
 
Well we know those reasons won’t be based in law or the Constitution. As for selling out Russia the worst he did was pull out of Syria. Where we should never have been. Syria by the way along with Egypt and Libya are some of the reasons I did not vote for Hillary.

Hey, have you been paying attention. Putin has been paying bounties to kill Servicemen in Afghanistan, and Trump did nothing about it.

He also said he believes Putin before his own intel agencies.

The State Department under Hillary was the driving force in violating international sanctions and arming the rebels which led to the Civil War. The reason Europe is groaning under the flood of Refugees.

That worked out so well she got Libya fired up. That showed she had no clue about international relations. Because anyone with half a brain knew the Russians had one Naval Base in the Med and there was no way they were going to stand by and let that base fall.

You give Hillary way too much credit. The people of those countries rose up against their dictators because they thought they might have a chance to win.
 
Well we know those reasons won’t be based in law or the Constitution. As for selling out Russia the worst he did was pull out of Syria. Where we should never have been. Syria by the way along with Egypt and Libya are some of the reasons I did not vote for Hillary.

Hey, have you been paying attention. Putin has been paying bounties to kill Servicemen in Afghanistan, and Trump did nothing about it.

He also said he believes Putin before his own intel agencies.

The State Department under Hillary was the driving force in violating international sanctions and arming the rebels which led to the Civil War. The reason Europe is groaning under the flood of Refugees.

That worked out so well she got Libya fired up. That showed she had no clue about international relations. Because anyone with half a brain knew the Russians had one Naval Base in the Med and there was no way they were going to stand by and let that base fall.

You give Hillary way too much credit. The people of those countries rose up against their dictators because they thought they might have a chance to win.

Putin has been paying bounties to kill Servicemen in Afghanistan,

Peaceful Muslims, never wanted to harm a soul, started killing Americans because of bounties?

Yeah, that sounds plausible......
 
Well we know those reasons won’t be based in law or the Constitution. As for selling out Russia the worst he did was pull out of Syria. Where we should never have been. Syria by the way along with Egypt and Libya are some of the reasons I did not vote for Hillary.

Hey, have you been paying attention. Putin has been paying bounties to kill Servicemen in Afghanistan, and Trump did nothing about it.

He also said he believes Putin before his own intel agencies.

The State Department under Hillary was the driving force in violating international sanctions and arming the rebels which led to the Civil War. The reason Europe is groaning under the flood of Refugees.

That worked out so well she got Libya fired up. That showed she had no clue about international relations. Because anyone with half a brain knew the Russians had one Naval Base in the Med and there was no way they were going to stand by and let that base fall.

You give Hillary way too much credit. The people of those countries rose up against their dictators because they thought they might have a chance to win.

Well considering the history of Intelligence Agencies and their record of being right chances are you would be better served by a Magic 8 ball. The Aspirin Factory WMD debacle? The typo that allowed the Boston Bombers to escape notice? WMD’s in Iraq? Shall I continue?

As for Hillary getting too much credit regarding Libya and Syria. Nonsense.


The CIA was funneling weapons through Libya to Jordan where the Jordanian CIA was giving some to the moderate Jihadist forces. An oxymoron if there ever was one. But the State Department was the ones funneling the weapons and getting them.

Anyone else violates sanctions. Bad. Bad nation bad people. We do it. No big deal. Get over it. We came. We saw. He died.

Hillary’s history is clever moves that are always just short of clever enough to actually work.
 
Well considering the history of Intelligence Agencies and their record of being right chances are you would be better served by a Magic 8 ball. The Aspirin Factory WMD debacle? The typo that allowed the Boston Bombers to escape notice? WMD’s in Iraq? Shall I continue?

If you have to go back 20 something years for the Aspirin factory, not so much. Not sure how they were supposed to "notice" the Boston Bombers, exactly. Are you saying you want the kind of police state you've just spent the last 20 pages whining about because it cause Benedict Arnold Flynn?

The CIA was funneling weapons through Libya to Jordan where the Jordanian CIA was giving some to the moderate Jihadist forces. An oxymoron if there ever was one. But the State Department was the ones funneling the weapons and getting them.

Okay, if I wanted to hear whacky Conspiracy theories, I'd talk to Dale Smith . He's absolutely convinced that George Floyd was a mannequin.
 
Well considering the history of Intelligence Agencies and their record of being right chances are you would be better served by a Magic 8 ball. The Aspirin Factory WMD debacle? The typo that allowed the Boston Bombers to escape notice? WMD’s in Iraq? Shall I continue?

If you have to go back 20 something years for the Aspirin factory, not so much. Not sure how they were supposed to "notice" the Boston Bombers, exactly. Are you saying you want the kind of police state you've just spent the last 20 pages whining about because it cause Benedict Arnold Flynn?

The CIA was funneling weapons through Libya to Jordan where the Jordanian CIA was giving some to the moderate Jihadist forces. An oxymoron if there ever was one. But the State Department was the ones funneling the weapons and getting them.

Okay, if I wanted to hear whacky Conspiracy theories, I'd talk to Dale Smith . He's absolutely convinced that George Floyd was a mannequin.

Joe Blowhard, the bloated, card carrying commie doesn't acknowledge that ISIS was a proxy army for the CIA, MI5, MI6, Saudi intel and the Mossad. 540 million FDRs given to a U.K public relations firm to make fake ISIS beheading videos. Military whistleblower Scott Bennett discovered the source of ISIS funding in Swiss bank accounts that led back to CIA front groups and Saudi Arabia and no one in the DOJ, the executive branch or even the IRS was interested.

"He's absolutely convinced that George Floyd was a mannequin"
Telling a half truth is one of the most cowardly things a person can do...which explains as to why you are a commie coward. I certainly occupy some space in that chasm that passes for your sloped, neanderthal skull. You are definitely my "bitch"......

(snicker)
 
Well we know those reasons won’t be based in law or the Constitution. As for selling out Russia the worst he did was pull out of Syria. Where we should never have been. Syria by the way along with Egypt and Libya are some of the reasons I did not vote for Hillary.

Hey, have you been paying attention. Putin has been paying bounties to kill Servicemen in Afghanistan, and Trump did nothing about it.

He also said he believes Putin before his own intel agencies.

The State Department under Hillary was the driving force in violating international sanctions and arming the rebels which led to the Civil War. The reason Europe is groaning under the flood of Refugees.

That worked out so well she got Libya fired up. That showed she had no clue about international relations. Because anyone with half a brain knew the Russians had one Naval Base in the Med and there was no way they were going to stand by and let that base fall.

You give Hillary way too much credit. The people of those countries rose up against their dictators because they thought they might have a chance to win.

"Hey, have you been paying attention. Putin has been paying bounties to kill Servicemen in Afghanistan, and Trump did nothing about it"

Hey, Joe Blowhard, the card carrying, bloated commie? MY un-named and unsubstantiated sources say that your contention 100 % total bullshit....and when the NYT and WAPO ( two propaganda arms of the CFR) that have had to constantly retract and walk back shit that they have put in print? Let's just say that their credibility is as pathetic as watching you trying to bypass a bakery or turn down thirds at dinner time. What else is becoming evident is that you are totally fucking clueless about Libya, the Benghazi attack that the jug-eared mulatto marxist denied having any knowledge of and how Barrypuppet was made to look "small" on the world stage when he claimed that the Assad used chemical weapons on his own people when it was actually CIA trained mercenaries that perpetrated the event. Barrypuppet is ready to start a ground war when Putin offers to come in as a mediator much to the chagrin of the Barrypuppet, the 2nd biggest "empty suit" to have taken the oath of office. Ukraine was a coup d'etat financed by Soros and his NGOs and the IMF that controls the E.U. Crimea was the sweetest plum in the tree and these banking oligarchs were denied it. Putin bitchslapped these globalist sacks of shit.

I know more than you, Joe Blowhard, he of the size 42 waist line.......infinitely more, "guy"

(snicker)
 
Joe Blowhard, the bloated, card carrying commie doesn't acknowledge that ISIS was a proxy army for the CIA, MI5, MI6, Saudi intel and the Mossad.

You see, SavannahMann , this is what a crazy conspiracy theory sounds like. People have no agency, everything is a vast plot of the Jesuit/Bilderberger/Lizardman Conspiracy. No, no, a simpler explanation, like when we took away power from the Sunni Minority in Iraq, they might actually resent that.. that's to simple for Dmitri Smirnov... I mean Dale Smith.

What else is becoming evident is that you are totally fucking clueless about Libya, the Benghazi attack that the jug-eared mulatto marxist denied having any knowledge of and how Barrypuppet was made to look "small" on the world stage when he claimed that the Assad used chemical weapons on his own people when it was actually CIA trained mercenaries that perpetrated the event.

And when were the Lizard People involved, Dmitri?
 
I have written my opinion before. It is simple. The Federal Agents, and DOJ were caught violating the Brady Rule, and misleading the Court on the evidence. These violations are very common. I mentioned at the time that it was routine even. However, that routine violation, does not make it right.

The DOJ was caught literally red handed. It tainted the case, and made prosecution risky, especially with the probability that Flynn would be found Not Guilty. There are a number of precedents to this type of action. The Judge may order the Defendant released dismissing all charges. The judge may suppress the evidence, favorable to the Prosecution.

An example. Let’s say there was a Bank Robbery. The Bank Cameras did not catch the face of the robber, nor the license of the car driven away. However a woman’s street camera did. The woman is out of town, and instead of getting the video of the street camera via a Subpoena, the Police hacked the camera and got the information. This would be illegal. The Police use it to find the Robber. During the preliminary hearings this information is gotten out.

Now, there is no direct evidence obtained legally to tie the suspect to the crime. The Judge suppresses that evidence, and all the Police have left is that the guy had money when they searched, but the search was a result of the illegally obtained information. So that evidence is suppressed. The Prosecutor moves to dismiss the charges. He has no choice. He has no evidence to take to the Jury.

That is not exactly what happened in the Flynn Case. The warrants were gotten illegally, and the Defense was denied exculpatory information. That is a violation of what is known as the Brady Rule. The Supreme Court ruled that the Defense is entitled to all information pertaining to the case. Even if the Prosecutor does not intend to use it. If requested, the Prosecutor must also hand over the history of the agents involved, have they ever been caught providing false or misleading testimony.

So the way it normally plays out is that the Prosecutor when caught, just folds his cards, and walks away from the table. Normally these violations are routine, and they are handled routinely.

However, this time, it is different. Now, the routine violations are treated as though they don’t really matter. They happen all the time. So why should Flynn get a pass because of a routine matter, no different than speed limits that nobody obeys.

To me, the Outrage is the fact that such violations are routine.

Judge Sullivan asked a retired Judge to examine this, sort of a Judicial review of a Judicial act. All informal, and with no history of being done before. But here is the rub. A extraordinary act to decide if the routine violation of the Brady Law and misleading statements of the FBI were sufficient to drop the charges. This review determined that the violations were no big deal, the Judge should reject the motion to dismiss, and hold Flynn accountable for his earlier plea bargain deal. He lied during his plea bargain deal, so Perjury for him.


I have argued for a very long time that Civil Rights matter. The rights in the Constitution should be sacrosanct. They should be viewed one and all as sacred. They are written in plain English, thou shall not. Thou shall not do this, or that.

Now, it is Thou Shall Not, unless you don’t like this guy, or he is a political annoyance.

It is the Brady Rule that got Cliven Bundy off. You see, the Government is expected to follow the rules, and tell the truth. When they do not do that, the case against the accused goes away.

Arguing that allowing agents to provide false and misleading information and testimony to the Court is so routine that it is fine and dandy means we do not have a Justice System. We have essentially Mafia control of our Country. The laws don’t matter. The rules are irrelevant for those on the inside. The Made Men of the country.

The Republic is dying. It isn’t BLM or ANTIFA killing it. It isn’t the Deplorable's. It isn’t the Right Wing, or the Left. It is our own apathy, and determination to get them no matter what rules are broken. They are the enemy.

This is the new Fascist America, where law is selectively enforced against political opponents. From the Hussein ordering the spying of the incoming Trump Administration, to his imprisonment of authors that wrote books criticizing him.

And now of course local mayors and governors who have the power to pull back police, are doing just that and allowing their leftwing mob to destroy small businesses and attack innocent people. In effect, they are using terrorism against their political opponents, the middle class. This is Fascism, and the left have mastered these fascist tactics.
 

Forum List

Back
Top