Colorado baker told to bake that cake

[HeyNorm]

Some thoughts:

• I don't like big government, and don't believe that the gov't should be involved in this, other than to state what is the law.
• Our economy allows for choice, under most circumstances. The person wanting the cake has every right to deny the transaction as well. Take your business elsewhere. As should the baker have the right to deny service based on whatever reason they choose. It's their business.
• Christians need to stop putting too much spiritual weight in a business transaction. Even though either party can deny each other the service and or the business transaction, Christians need to stop thinking that a simple business transaction equates to spiritual acceptance. It's a cake. God doesn't give two rats asses who you're making a cake for. So make the friggin cake. I actually believe that's what Christ would have done had he been a baker and not a carpenter.
• For any Christian business owner, do you have a 100 question survey attempting to uncover any unrighteousness? Point, you can't possibly know everyone's personal details. That cake you made last week for that couple well, guess what the woman cheated on the husband. Or, the man beats and emotionally abuses his wife. Are you doing background checks on every person that walks through your door.
• I suspect most Christian's business would shut down if they had access to everyone browser history
• How about the Woman at the Well story. Jesus asked a woman to give him a drink. She knew the customs and that samaritans didn't interact with Jews. Yet, If Jesus can ask for a glass of water from a jewish outcast, why can't a Christian bake a simple cake?

This is real simple. The transgender is asking the baker to risk everlasting damnation for a $100 transaction. Just raise the price to 2.5 billion, and the problem is solved.

 

[BS Filter]

Actually, not the case. The couple involved in the original case picked him because he was in their neighborhood, and their families had used his services in the past.

Masterpiece Cakeshop v. Colorado Civil Rights Commission - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

When he refused their request, he was in violation of the state's public accommedation law.

So if someone tells you they want a tablecloth made with a swastika, you will make it even though you don't want to?

 

[HeyNorm]

And the human rights law is a State civil rights law. Aren't you wingnuts always the ones going on and on about state's rights?



Which isn't the case here. The baker agree to make a pink cake with blue frosting, until he found out what it was for. He also makes wedding cakes, so it's not a case of him being unable to make the product.


So if you offer cakes for other occasions, you can offer it for these occasions.

He would refuse to make the wedding cake regardless if the same sex couple was homosexual or heterosexual.

If an opposite sex couple orders a cake, and they are both gay? No problemo as well. When do you want it?


He discriminated against no one.

It’s really really simple. He doesn’t offer the product.

 

[jbrownson0831]

Absolutely. Public businesses should serve the public. You advocate for Jim Crow.

But they don't have to. A private business may choose to serve or not serve whomever they want Commie.

 

[BS Filter]

Actually, not the case. The couple involved in the original case picked him because he was in their neighborhood, and their families had used his services in the past.

Masterpiece Cakeshop v. Colorado Civil Rights Commission - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

When he refused their request, he was in violation of the state's public accommedation law.

Show me where it says the family had bought from his store in the past. I can't seem to find it.

 

[BS Filter]

Sure got quiet.

 

[Chillicothe]

can’t force a business to produce a product that they don’t offer. Sorry, it’s how things work.

-------------------------------------------------
You ain't gonna let that go, eh?

It is THIS simple:

• He bakes cakes.
• Cakes are what he offers.
• Not pot roast. Not cannabis. Not bourbon. But cakes.
• Cakes....he does offer.

He's gotta bake the cake.
Because he bakes cakes for others.
Duh!!

ps.....Norm, are you really gonna stick with that "everlasting damnation" schtick?
Over a sweet cake? Is that the hill you.....or your Gods.....wanna die on?

If you think that is a real deal, a real risk that YOUR God, ---or the baker's God ---- is gonna put him in 'eternal damnation' for baking a cake.....well, amigo, either you are frivolous and silly......or those Gods of the two of you are.

In the real world of real people.....our God(s) got more important things to fret about than sweet cakes.

Jeeeezus H.!!

But I still love this bar.

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Doesn't he have that freedom of choice thingy

Yupper he does. With some provisos or exceptions.
Sorry, it’s how things work.
-----------------------------------------------------------

We reserve the right to refuse service.

You can, but........
But.....with some provisos and exceptions.
Sorry, it’s how things work.

 

[BS Filter]

-------------------------------------------------
You ain't gonna let that go, eh?

It is THIS simple:

• He bakes cakes.
• Cakes are what he offers.
• Not pot roast. Not cannabis. Not bourbon. But cakes.
• Cakes....he does offer.

He's gotta bake the cake.
Because he bakes cakes for others.
Duh!!

ps.....Norm, are you really gonna stick with that "everlasting damnation" schtick?
Over a sweet cake? Is that the hill you.....or your Gods.....wanna die on?

If you think that is a real deal, a real risk that YOUR God, ---or the baker's God ---- is gonna put him in 'eternal damnation' for baking a cake.....well, amigo, either you are frivolous and silly......or those Gods of the two of you are.

In the real world of real people.....our God(s) got more important things to fret about than sweet cakes.

Jeeeezus H.!!

But I still love this bar.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------


Yupper he does. With some provisos or exceptions.
Sorry, it’s how things work.
-----------------------------------------------------------

You can, but........
But.....with some provisos and exceptions.
Sorry, it’s how things work.

That can be changed. Any business owner should have the right to refuse business. He was targeted and everyone knows it.

 

[August West]

Being afraid of masks just wasn`t enough for these Snowflakes. Now we can add cakes to the list and of course, books.

 

[JoeB131]

We reserve the right to refuse service.

as long as you aren't violating the law in the process, I have no problem with that.

 

[JoeB131]

This is real simple. The transgender is asking the baker to risk everlasting damnation for a $100 transaction. Just raise the price to 2.5 billion, and the problem is solved.

Okay.
1) Prove in court that souls are real.
2) Prove in court that you would be damned for baking a cake

Then we have something to talk about. Otherwise he is in violation of the public accommodation laws.

He would refuse to make the wedding cake regardless if the same sex couple was homosexual or heterosexual.

If an opposite sex couple orders a cake, and they are both gay? No problemo as well. When do you want it?


He discriminated against no one.

It’s really really simple. He doesn’t offer the product.

Except he does offer the product. So he doesn't have an argument.

Show me where it says the family had bought from his store in the past. I can't seem to find it.

The part where the mom went to the store the next day and asked why he wouldn't serve her son. Indicates a prior relationship.

 

[HeyNorm]

Okay.
1) Prove in court that souls are real.
2) Prove in court that you would be damned for baking a cake

Then we have something to talk about. Otherwise he is in violation of the public accommodation laws.




Except he does offer the product. So he doesn't have an argument.


The part where the mom went to the store the next day and asked why he wouldn't serve her son. Indicates a prior relationship.

Prove he ever promoted the sale of transition cake or same sex wedding cake.

 

[JoeB131]

Being afraid of masks just wasn`t enough for these Snowflakes. Now we can add cakes to the list and of course, books.

And M&M's.

 

[JoeB131]

Prove he ever promoted the sale of transition cake or same sex wedding cake.

You don't have to.

He offers wedding cakes and custom cakes, so he can't deny them to gay or trans people.

The whole argument he is making here is that a wedding cake is a 'sacred' thing central to his religion, which is bullshit.
If someone asked for a wedding cake for a movie set, he'd probably have no problem baking it, even if someone wasn't getting hitched that day.

There is no religious signifigance to a wedding cake.

 

[HeyNorm]

You don't have to.

He offers wedding cakes and custom cakes, so he can't deny them to gay or trans people.

The whole argument he is making here is that a wedding cake is a 'sacred' thing central to his religion, which is bullshit.
If someone asked for a wedding cake for a movie set, he'd probably have no problem baking it, even if someone wasn't getting hitched that day.

There is no religious signifigance to a wedding cake.

He would deny them to heterosexuals or homosexuals as well. He simply does not offer the product.

And I loved your post about the baker proving he had a Soul in a court of law.

The burden of proof is on the State, not the accused Joe. Is this something we need to change as well for your itty bitty community? Now defendants have to prove their innocence instead of the State having to prove their guilt?

All because you think heterosexual sex is icky?

 

[JoeB131]

He would deny them to heterosexuals or homosexuals as well. He simply does not offer the product.

And I loved your post about the baker proving he had a Soul in a court of law.

The burden of proof is on the State, not the accused Joe. Is this something we need to change as well for your itty bitty community? Now defendants have to prove their innocence instead of the State having to prove their guilt?

Not at all. Irrational beliefs are not a good reason to disobey the law.

If they were, then I declare myself to be a follower of Quetzalcoatl, and therefor murder laws don't apply to me and I can cut out the hearts of my enemies with an obsidian dagger!

There's no question of the homophobic baker's guilt. He was perfectly fine with baking the cake until he was told where it was going. Violation of the public accommodation law.

 

[Grumblenuts]

The Supreme Court has historically rejected free exercise challenges to neutral laws that regulate action, especially actions that harm other citizens. Interpreting a free exercise right to be exempted from anti-discrimination laws would have no practical limits, inviting discrimination against all protected classes not only in places of public accommodation, but many other contexts, FFRF asserts. This interpretation would also violate Establishment Clause principles by singling out religiously motivated action for special exemption from civil laws.

FFRF files amicus brief against anti-gay cake maker - Freedom From Religion Foundation

The Freedom From Religion Foundation has filed an amicus brief in the famous case currently before the U.S. Supreme Court about whether a baker can re...

ffrf.org

 

[HeyNorm]

Not at all. Irrational beliefs are not a good reason to disobey the law.

If they were, then I declare myself to be a follower of Quetzalcoatl, and therefor murder laws don't apply to me and I can cut out the hearts of my enemies with an obsidian dagger!

There's no question of the homophobic baker's guilt. He was perfectly fine with baking the cake until he was told where it was going. Violation of the public accommodation law.

They said the same of the same sex cake case. Didn’t end that way Joe. He just doesn’t offer the product.

Oh, and Joe, Murder is not nearly the same as not offering a product for sale.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

He would refuse to make the wedding cake regardless if the same sex couple was homosexual or heterosexual.

If an opposite sex couple orders a cake, and they are both gay? No problemo as well. When do you want it?


He discriminated against no one.

It’s really really simple. He doesn’t offer the product.

I just dont reecognise these relationships that you are describing.
What is a same sec heterosexual couple. ?

Can you point to one so that I can understand it better ?

 

[HeyNorm]

I just dont reecognise these relationships that you are describing.
What is a same sec heterosexual couple. ?

Can you point to one so that I can understand it better ?

You really should read the law before commenting then.

Obergfell made same sex marriage legal Timmy. Not gay marriage. Gays have married as long as marriage existed. They just had to marry gays of the opposite sex.

Same sex does not discriminate based on sexuality. That would be against the law.