Baseball junkies, have you ever watched a video of Walter Johnson pitching?

[MarathonMike]

The video is poor quality, nearly 100 years old but it is fascinating to watch Walter Johnson's motion especially the last part of the video showing his game speed motion. Watch his back leg, it never comes off the pitching rubber! I have never seen anyone pitch like that but according to history Johnson pitched 21 seasons and never had a significant arm injury and was absolutely the best pitcher of his era and possibly of all time. You would think someone would try to emulate his motion, but I don't believe I've ever seen anyone do it. Even great side-armers like Kent Tekulve brought their back leg through after the pitch and they throw slow. Johnson was a pure fastball pitcher.

 

[Frankeneinstein]

big time baseball junkie, first time though I ever saw his motion,...have you ever seen Juan Marichals ?

My father taught me to pitch like him.


If you've never seen Luis Tiant pitch you should check that out

 

[Frankeneinstein]

The video is poor quality, nearly 100 years old but it is fascinating to watch Walter Johnson's motion especially the last part of the video showing his game speed motion. Watch his back leg, it never comes off the pitching rubber! I have never seen anyone pitch like that but according to history Johnson pitched 21 seasons and never had a significant arm injury and was absolutely the best pitcher of his era and possibly of all time. You would think someone would try to emulate his motion, but I don't believe I've ever seen anyone do it. Even great side-armers like Kent Tekulve brought their back leg through after the pitch and they throw slow. Johnson was a pure fastball pitcher.

don't see how he generated so much velocity, that was all arm.

 

[MarathonMike]

big time baseball junkie, first time though I ever saw his motion,...have you ever seen Juan Marichals ?

My father taught me to pitch like him.


If you've never seen Luis Tiant pitch you should check that out

I remember Luis Tiant and Juan Marichal very well. I liked them both I guess I've always been interested in pitchers with funky deliveries. When I pitched in little league I tried to pitch like Juan Marichal kicking my leg as high as I could. It didn't work out too well. lol

 

[MarathonMike]

The video is poor quality, nearly 100 years old but it is fascinating to watch Walter Johnson's motion especially the last part of the video showing his game speed motion. Watch his back leg, it never comes off the pitching rubber! I have never seen anyone pitch like that but according to history Johnson pitched 21 seasons and never had a significant arm injury and was absolutely the best pitcher of his era and possibly of all time. You would think someone would try to emulate his motion, but I don't believe I've ever seen anyone do it. Even great side-armers like Kent Tekulve brought their back leg through after the pitch and they throw slow. Johnson was a pure fastball pitcher.

don't see how he generated so much velocity, that was all arm.

He wasn't a giant either they listed him at 6 1, 200 lbs. They didn't have radar guns but his fastball was measured at 92 mph in a munitions lab. I doubt any other pitcher in that era touched 90.

 

[evenflow1969]

The video is poor quality, nearly 100 years old but it is fascinating to watch Walter Johnson's motion especially the last part of the video showing his game speed motion. Watch his back leg, it never comes off the pitching rubber! I have never seen anyone pitch like that but according to history Johnson pitched 21 seasons and never had a significant arm injury and was absolutely the best pitcher of his era and possibly of all time. You would think someone would try to emulate his motion, but I don't believe I've ever seen anyone do it. Even great side-armers like Kent Tekulve brought their back leg through after the pitch and they throw slow. Johnson was a pure fastball pitcher.

don't see how he generated so much velocity, that was all arm.

The way the ball hops around from that side arm motion and the strange angle it comes from were proly more than enough to tgive the batters fits. The guy won significantly more games than any one else so it obviously worked and well.

 

[rightwinger]

The video is poor quality, nearly 100 years old but it is fascinating to watch Walter Johnson's motion especially the last part of the video showing his game speed motion. Watch his back leg, it never comes off the pitching rubber! I have never seen anyone pitch like that but according to history Johnson pitched 21 seasons and never had a significant arm injury and was absolutely the best pitcher of his era and possibly of all time. You would think someone would try to emulate his motion, but I don't believe I've ever seen anyone do it. Even great side-armers like Kent Tekulve brought their back leg through after the pitch and they throw slow. Johnson was a pure fastball pitcher.

Hard to believe he could generate so much velocity with a sidearm motion and not much leverage from his legs

His arms do seem very long

 

[rightwinger]

big time baseball junkie, first time though I ever saw his motion,...have you ever seen Juan Marichals ?

My father taught me to pitch like him.


If you've never seen Luis Tiant pitch you should check that out

July 2, 1963: Marichal outduels Spahn in 16-inning thriller | Society for American Baseball Research

At slightly past eight o’clock, Marichal took the Candlestick Park mound. Four hours and 15 innings later, he was still toiling there. And so was Warren Spahn–in a scoreless pitching duel.

In the 16th, Marichal allowed a two-out single to Menke, and then registered his 48th out of the night on Larker’s comebacker to the mound. It was Marichal’s 227th pitch.

When the Giants hit, Spahn retired Harvey Kuenn on a fly out. That brought up future Hall of Famer Mays, still hitless on the long night. Now, Mays drove Spahn’s first pitch through the teeth of the wind in left. The ball cleared the fence, and with that, a masterfully-pitched game dramatically ended. Marichal was the exhausted victor; Spahn, the valiantly defeated.

 

[Frankeneinstein]

The guy won significantly more games than any one else so it obviously worked and well.

I think Cy Young may have won more

 

[MarathonMike]

big time baseball junkie, first time though I ever saw his motion,...have you ever seen Juan Marichals ?

My father taught me to pitch like him.


If you've never seen Luis Tiant pitch you should check that out

July 2, 1963: Marichal outduels Spahn in 16-inning thriller | Society for American Baseball Research

At slightly past eight o’clock, Marichal took the Candlestick Park mound. Four hours and 15 innings later, he was still toiling there. And so was Warren Spahn–in a scoreless pitching duel.

In the 16th, Marichal allowed a two-out single to Menke, and then registered his 48th out of the night on Larker’s comebacker to the mound. It was Marichal’s 227th pitch.

When the Giants hit, Spahn retired Harvey Kuenn on a fly out. That brought up future Hall of Famer Mays, still hitless on the long night. Now, Mays drove Spahn’s first pitch through the teeth of the wind in left. The ball cleared the fence, and with that, a masterfully-pitched game dramatically ended. Marichal was the exhausted victor; Spahn, the valiantly defeated.

Wow! Can you imagine that happening today? If a pitcher completes a game, they practically name him a Cy Young candidate.

 

[rightwinger]

big time baseball junkie, first time though I ever saw his motion,...have you ever seen Juan Marichals ?

My father taught me to pitch like him.


If you've never seen Luis Tiant pitch you should check that out

July 2, 1963: Marichal outduels Spahn in 16-inning thriller | Society for American Baseball Research

At slightly past eight o’clock, Marichal took the Candlestick Park mound. Four hours and 15 innings later, he was still toiling there. And so was Warren Spahn–in a scoreless pitching duel.

In the 16th, Marichal allowed a two-out single to Menke, and then registered his 48th out of the night on Larker’s comebacker to the mound. It was Marichal’s 227th pitch.

When the Giants hit, Spahn retired Harvey Kuenn on a fly out. That brought up future Hall of Famer Mays, still hitless on the long night. Now, Mays drove Spahn’s first pitch through the teeth of the wind in left. The ball cleared the fence, and with that, a masterfully-pitched game dramatically ended. Marichal was the exhausted victor; Spahn, the valiantly defeated.

Wow! Can you imagine that happening today? If a pitcher completes a game, they practically name him a Cy Young candidate.

Can you imagine 227 pitches?
They pull you at 100 today
And Marichal was no junk ball pitcher

Warren Spahn pitching 15 scoreless innings at age 42

 

[DGS49]

The problem is mainly with COLLEGE COACHES. In past generations, pitchers were brought along slowly, and rarely threw large numbers of pitches before age 25. The great ones pitched into their late 30's (and beyond), effectively. NCAA development was not anywhere near as significant as today. Most promising pitchers chose to get into professonal baseball as soon as possible, where tney are treated as long-term investments.

College coaches today need to justify their existence, so have conspired to extend seasons almost indefinitely, and they have these older children pitching at least 10 months a year. The successful ones in college INVARIABLY need major arm surgery within two years of being promoted to the majors.

"Spahn and Sain and pray for (two days of) rain." The NORM was pitching on three days' rest. Today that qualifies them for a Purple Heart. 100 pitches per start? You gotta be kidding. Nobody was even counting pitches.

 

[rightwinger]

The problem is mainly with COLLEGE COACHES. In past generations, pitchers were brought along slowly, and rarely threw large numbers of pitches before age 25. The great ones pitched into their late 30's (and beyond), effectively. NCAA development was not anywhere near as significant as today. Most promising pitchers chose to get into professonal baseball as soon as possible, where tney are treated as long-term investments.

College coaches today need to justify their existence, so have conspired to extend seasons almost indefinitely, and they have these older children pitching at least 10 months a year. The successful ones in college INVARIABLY need major arm surgery within two years of being promoted to the majors.

"Spahn and Sain and pray for (two days of) rain." The NORM was pitching on three days' rest. Today that qualifies them for a Purple Heart. 100 pitches per start? You gotta be kidding. Nobody was even counting pitches.

Don’t know how many games Satchel Paige pitched
He would go out every day

 

[Stasha_Sz]

Luis Tiant? Watched him several times at the old Municipal Stadium when he was with the Tribe.
No one had a windup like he did. Here he is with the Red Sox:

The 1968 Indians provide a good perspective of pitching then & now. The Tribe finished third in the AL that year, all on pitching.
Sam McDowell went 15-14 with a 1.81 ERA, started 38 games, completed 11 of them with 3 shutouts.
Luis Tiant recorded 21-9; 1.60; 32 starts; 19 CG; 9 SO
Sonny Siebert was 12-10; 2.97; 30 starts; 8 CG; 4 SO
Stan Williams went 13-11; 2.50 ERA; 24 starts; 6 CG; 2 SO (along with 9 saves as he was a spot starter, even though they did not count saves back then)
Steve Hargan in an hard luck season was 8-15; 4.15 ERA; 27 starts; 4 CG; 2 SO.
They had a team ERA of 2.66, 1st in the league, that season.

The 2017 Indians best ERA was Kluber's 2.25; he started 29 games and completed 5 to lead the team in that category.
The Tribe once again lead the league in ERA, 3.30... .64 points higher.

 

[MarathonMike]

The problem is mainly with COLLEGE COACHES. In past generations, pitchers were brought along slowly, and rarely threw large numbers of pitches before age 25. The great ones pitched into their late 30's (and beyond), effectively. NCAA development was not anywhere near as significant as today. Most promising pitchers chose to get into professonal baseball as soon as possible, where tney are treated as long-term investments.

College coaches today need to justify their existence, so have conspired to extend seasons almost indefinitely, and they have these older children pitching at least 10 months a year. The successful ones in college INVARIABLY need major arm surgery within two years of being promoted to the majors.

"Spahn and Sain and pray for (two days of) rain." The NORM was pitching on three days' rest. Today that qualifies them for a Purple Heart. 100 pitches per start? You gotta be kidding. Nobody was even counting pitches.

Yes college coaches especially at lower tier schools blow up more arms than Viet Nam. And it starts even earlier than college. You see young kids especially here in Arizona playing baseball all year round and the kids with the best arms get pitched to exhaustion. Oh but you'll hear "It's all about the kids" from the coaches.

 

[rightwinger]

Luis Tiant? Watched him several times at the old Municipal Stadium when he was with the Tribe.
No one had a windup like he did. Here he is with the Red Sox:

The 1968 Indians provide a good perspective of pitching then & now. The Tribe finished third in the AL that year, all on pitching.
Sam McDowell went 15-14 with a 1.81 ERA, started 38 games, completed 11 of them with 3 shutouts.
Luis Tiant recorded 21-9; 1.60; 32 starts; 19 CG; 9 SO
Sonny Siebert was 12-10; 2.97; 30 starts; 8 CG; 4 SO
Stan Williams went 13-11; 2.50 ERA; 24 starts; 6 CG; 2 SO (along with 9 saves as he was a spot starter, even though they did not count saves back then)
Steve Hargan in an hard luck season was 8-15; 4.15 ERA; 27 starts; 4 CG; 2 SO.
They had a team ERA of 2.66, 1st in the league, that season.

The 2017 Indians best ERA was Kluber's 2.25; he started 29 games and completed 5 to lead the team in that category.
The Tribe once again lead the league in ERA, 3.30... .64 points higher.

You forgot Ricky Vaughn the Wild Thing

 

[Darkwind]

The video is poor quality, nearly 100 years old but it is fascinating to watch Walter Johnson's motion especially the last part of the video showing his game speed motion. Watch his back leg, it never comes off the pitching rubber! I have never seen anyone pitch like that but according to history Johnson pitched 21 seasons and never had a significant arm injury and was absolutely the best pitcher of his era and possibly of all time. You would think someone would try to emulate his motion, but I don't believe I've ever seen anyone do it. Even great side-armers like Kent Tekulve brought their back leg through after the pitch and they throw slow. Johnson was a pure fastball pitcher.

don't see how he generated so much velocity, that was all arm.

I wonder how he managed to keep from destroying his elbow.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Luis Tiant? Watched him several times at the old Municipal Stadium when he was with the Tribe.
No one had a windup like he did. Here he is with the Red Sox:

The 1968 Indians provide a good perspective of pitching then & now. The Tribe finished third in the AL that year, all on pitching.
Sam McDowell went 15-14 with a 1.81 ERA, started 38 games, completed 11 of them with 3 shutouts.
Luis Tiant recorded 21-9; 1.60; 32 starts; 19 CG; 9 SO
Sonny Siebert was 12-10; 2.97; 30 starts; 8 CG; 4 SO
Stan Williams went 13-11; 2.50 ERA; 24 starts; 6 CG; 2 SO (along with 9 saves as he was a spot starter, even though they did not count saves back then)
Steve Hargan in an hard luck season was 8-15; 4.15 ERA; 27 starts; 4 CG; 2 SO.
They had a team ERA of 2.66, 1st in the league, that season.

The 2017 Indians best ERA was Kluber's 2.25; he started 29 games and completed 5 to lead the team in that category.
The Tribe once again lead the league in ERA, 3.30... .64 points higher.

Ever see El Duque throw the glove?

 

[DGS49]

When I was a kid, the boys in my neighborhood used to play a game (we called it "step ball") where we threw a ball - usually a tennis ball - at the bottom step of a set of stairs - often the entry stairs of one of our houses. The thrower was considered the "batter." There were three possibilities (basically) when throwing the ball and hitting the step like this: if you struck the step slightly BELOW the corner of the step, the ball bounced out to the "fielders" as a "grounder" and if they caught it cleanly you had one out. If you threw the ball slightly ABOVE the corner of the step, the ball would carom off the next higher step and create a lazy fly ball which, if caught by the fielder, was also an out.

But if you precisely hit the corner of the step, the ball would take off, often so far that it went over the fielders' heads for a "Home Run." We scored it like baseball, of course, and played games of as many innings as it took to bore us to death. Lots of innings.

Well...

A couple of my formative years were spent playing this game, hour after hour, and as you might imagine, for best results you had to throw the ball sidearm.

So when I started playing Little League I - unknown to me - had a weird sidearm motion that caused the ball to curve to the right (like a screwball). My arm was also pretty strong. When I started pitching, this motion had the dual effect of making the ball look like it was going directly at the RH batters, and maintaining that left-to-right curve. It was devastating, but of course my control was to put it kindly, not good.

I had good success in Little League, Pony League, and my first year of Colt League (15 years old). When I turned 16, we got a new coach on the Colt team, and he refused to allow me to pitch, believing that my motion would ruin my arm. Until that time, no one had ever even mentioned to me that my throwing motion was odd -probably because I was having success. Nor did the coach explain to me what he thought was my throwing flaw or how to correct it. Ass-hole.

But having a car, a job (or two), a girlfriend and better things to do, I quit baseball and never looked back.

My throwing motion was very much like that of Walter Johnson in the video. It STILL feels natural to me to throw sidearm (I'll be 70 in a couple weeks), although when called upon to throw something (usually a softball) I throw overhand.

 

[rightwinger]

Not many sidewinders in the game today