Arctic sea ice melting toward record

[Chris]

Scientists say Arctic sea ice melting toward record
By: Bob Weber, The Canadian Press

19/05/2010 5:02 PM

Arctic sea ice is on track to recede to a record low this year, suggesting that northern waters free of summer ice are coming faster than anyone thought.

The latest satellite data show ice coverage is equal to what it was in 2007, the lowest year on record, and is declining faster than it did that year.

"Could we break another record this year? I think it's quite possible," said Mark Serreze of the National Snow and Ice Data Center in Boulder, Colo.

"We are going to lose the summer sea-ice cover. We can't go back."

Scientists say Arctic sea ice melting toward record - Winnipeg Free Press

 

[elvis]

yawn

 

[GWV5903]

Scientists say Arctic sea ice melting toward record
By: Bob Weber, The Canadian Press

19/05/2010 5:02 PM

Arctic sea ice is on track to recede to a record low this year, suggesting that northern waters free of summer ice are coming faster than anyone thought.

The latest satellite data show ice coverage is equal to what it was in 2007, the lowest year on record, and is declining faster than it did that year.

"Could we break another record this year? I think it's quite possible," said Mark Serreze of the National Snow and Ice Data Center in Boulder, Colo.

"We are going to lose the summer sea-ice cover. We can't go back."

Scientists say Arctic sea ice melting toward record - Winnipeg Free Press

Go back to sleep.....

 

[Chris]

Scientists say Arctic sea ice melting toward record
By: Bob Weber, The Canadian Press

19/05/2010 5:02 PM

Arctic sea ice is on track to recede to a record low this year, suggesting that northern waters free of summer ice are coming faster than anyone thought.

The latest satellite data show ice coverage is equal to what it was in 2007, the lowest year on record, and is declining faster than it did that year.

"Could we break another record this year? I think it's quite possible," said Mark Serreze of the National Snow and Ice Data Center in Boulder, Colo.

"We are going to lose the summer sea-ice cover. We can't go back."

Scientists say Arctic sea ice melting toward record - Winnipeg Free Press

Go back to sleep.....

Is that your mantra?

 

[Chris]

EVERYONE knows how much hotter it feels to wear a black T-shirt, rather than a white one, on a warm day.

In the same way, the melting of sea ice in the Arctic, revealing the dark water below, has been shown by Australian scientists to be the main cause of unusually rapid warming at the top of the world.

Confirmation of this "feedback loop" means the region is likely to continue to warm strongly, with greater loss of sea ice and possible melting of the ice sheets.

James Screen and Ian Simmonds, of the University of Melbourne, said the rise in surface temperatures in the Arctic in the past 20 years had been more than double the global average.

Melting ice makes the Arctic a vicious circle

 

[konradv]

Melting ice makes the Arctic a vicious circle
----------------------------

Add to that methane, also a potent greenhouse gas, previously trapped below ice and now being released and we have another feedback loop at work. That's why the complaint that CO2 is such a small part of the atmosphere doesn't hold water. Like an amplifier on your stereo, a small change in the setting can have a big effect on the sound.

 

[JimH52]

I am sure the nuckle dragging Baggers on this board will come up with a good excuse for this one.

 

[Tom Clancy]

Hmm.. right.

 

[JimH52]

hmm.. Right.

right on cue!

 

[Old Rocks]

What is the source of the second graph? Also, you are showing a rise of 0.5 for the Medivial Warm Period, which may have been correct for the Europe, but was not the case for the rest of the world. The Mann graph is for the whole world.

So you graph comparison is apples and oranges. And dishonest, as you well know.

The Arctic Ice had a big jump in March after tracking the same as 2007 for much of the winter. Unfortunetly, the coverage from that freeze is thin, and now the winds have pushed the thicker ice, what little there is left, east of Greenland, where it will rapidly melt.

 

[Old Rocks]

Melting ice makes the Arctic a vicious circle
----------------------------

Add to that methane, also a potent greenhouse gas, previously trapped below ice and now being released and we have another feedback loop at work. That's why the complaint that CO2 is such a small part of the atmosphere doesn't hold water. Like an amplifier on your stereo, a small change in the setting can have a big effect on the sound.

Of course our short bus members will reject any real work done by real scientists.

Methane bubbling from Siberian thaw lakes as a positive feedback to climate warming : Abstract : Nature


Methane bubbling from Siberian thaw lakes as a positive feedback to climate warming
K. M. Walter1, S. A. Zimov2, J. P. Chanton3, D. Verbyla4 and F. S. Chapin, III1

Top of pageLarge uncertainties in the budget of atmospheric methane, an important greenhouse gas, limit the accuracy of climate change projections1, 2. Thaw lakes in North Siberia are known to emit methane3, but the magnitude of these emissions remains uncertain because most methane is released through ebullition (bubbling), which is spatially and temporally variable. Here we report a new method of measuring ebullition and use it to quantify methane emissions from two thaw lakes in North Siberia. We show that ebullition accounts for 95 per cent of methane emissions from these lakes, and that methane flux from thaw lakes in our study region may be five times higher than previously estimated3. Extrapolation of these fluxes indicates that thaw lakes in North Siberia emit 3.8 teragrams of methane per year, which increases present estimates of methane emissions from northern wetlands (< 6–40 teragrams per year; refs 1, 2, 4–6) by between 10 and 63 per cent. We find that thawing permafrost along lake margins accounts for most of the methane released from the lakes, and estimate that an expansion of thaw lakes between 1974 and 2000, which was concurrent with regional warming, increased methane emissions in our study region by 58 per cent. Furthermore, the Pleistocene age (35,260–42,900 years) of methane emitted from hotspots along thawing lake margins indicates that this positive feedback to climate warming has led to the release of old carbon stocks previously stored in permafrost.

Top of pageInstitute of Arctic Biology, University of Alaska Fairbanks, Alaska 99775, USA
Northeast Science Station, Cherskii 678830, Russia
Department of Oceanography, Florida State University, Florida 32306, USA
Forest Science Department, University of Alaska Fairbanks, Alaska 99775, USA

 

[Old Rocks]

As Arctic Ocean warms, megatonnes of methane bubble up - environment - 17 August 2009 - New Scientist

It's been predicted for years, and now it's happening. Deep in the Arctic Ocean, water warmed by climate change is forcing the release of methane from beneath the sea floor.

Over 250 plumes of gas have been discovered bubbling up from the sea floor to the west of the Svalbard archipelago, which lies north of Norway. The bubbles are mostly methane, which is a greenhouse gas much more powerful than carbon dioxide.

The methane is probably coming from reserves of methane hydrate beneath the sea bed. These hydrates, also known as clathrates, are water ice with methane molecules embedded in them.

The methane plumes were discovered by an expedition aboard the research ship James Clark Ross, led by Graham Westbrook of the University of Birmingham and Tim Minshull of the National Oceanography Centre, Southampton, both in the UK

 

[westwall]

Hmmmm, they claim that the ice is thinner then it actually is, they claim it is melting faster than it actually is (this year saw the latest beginning of the ice breakup in years) and they will only admit to natural cycles when forced too....


World's climate could cool first, warm later - environment - 04 September 2009 - New Scientist

Sounds like par for the course for the AGW fraudsters.

 

[konradv]

Hmmmm, they claim that the ice is thinner then it actually is, they claim it is melting faster than it actually is (this year saw the latest beginning of the ice breakup in years) and they will only admit to natural cycles when forced too....


World's climate could cool first, warm later - environment - 04 September 2009 - New Scientist

Sounds like par for the course for the AGW fraudsters.

You're the fraud! "They will only admit to natural cycles when forced too...." is a lie. No climate scientist would deny natural cycles. That's why the whole subject is so complex and why we're even having this discussion. Fortunately, we know the properties of CO2 and that its been going up. So, unless the deniers have an "out" for the principle of Conservation of Energy, warming is in our future, if greenhouse gas concentrations keep going up.

 

[Old Rocks]

So here we are six years down the road from this forecast, and things are still getting warmer. In spite of a strong and persistant La Nina, and a near record low in solar activity and TSI, 2008 turned out to be either the 8th or 10th warmest year on record. 2009 tied for the second warmest year on record. And 2010 may well go down as the warmest year on record, for at least one year.

Were the scientists wrong about the NAO? No. But they definately underestimated the strength of the warming.

World's climate could cool first, warm later - environment - 04 September 2009 - New Scientist

Cold Atlantic
Latif predicted that in the next few years a natural cooling trend would dominate over warming caused by humans. The cooling would be down to cyclical changes to ocean currents and temperatures in the North Atlantic, a feature known as the North Atlantic Oscillation (NAO).

Breaking with climate-change orthodoxy, he said NAO cycles were probably responsible for some of the strong global warming seen in the past three decades. "But how much? The jury is still out," he told the conference. The NAO is now moving into a colder phase.

Latif said NAO cycles also explained the recent recovery of the Sahel region of Africa from the droughts of the 1970s and 1980s. James Murphy, head of climate prediction at the Met Office, agreed and linked the NAO to Indian monsoons, Atlantic hurricanes and sea ice in the Arctic. "The oceans are key to decadal natural variability," he said.

 

[Si modo]

Hmmmm, they claim that the ice is thinner then it actually is, they claim it is melting faster than it actually is (this year saw the latest beginning of the ice breakup in years) and they will only admit to natural cycles when forced too....


World's climate could cool first, warm later - environment - 04 September 2009 - New Scientist

Sounds like par for the course for the AGW fraudsters.

You're the fraud! "They will only admit to natural cycles when forced too...." is a lie. No climate scientist would deny natural cycles. That's why the whole subject is so complex and why we're even having this discussion. Fortunately, we know the properties of CO2 and that its been going up. So, unless the deniers have an "out" for the principle of Conservation of Energy, warming is in our future, if greenhouse gas concentrations keep going up.

Your dishonesty is on display. You have been told that unless CO2 concentrations are the only variable in any warming, your point is nothing more than nonsense and you've been told this at least four times by me. Also, correlation is not causation. At least the fourth time by me, again.

Willfull ignorance or dishonesty on your part? I say both.

 

[Old Rocks]

More dishonesty by Si. No one ever claimed that CO2 was the only variable. In fact, it has been pointed out many times by the honest posters here that the TSI, NAO, and La Nina, El Nino oscilations all contribute to the variability of the weather.

However, CO2 is the biggest single factor now that we have increased the amount in the atmosphere by nearly 40%. In spite of the fact that we should have started a slow descent into another ice age at present, we are instead rapidly warming. The reason why is contained in this site from the American Institute of Physics.

The Carbon Dioxide Greenhouse Effect

 

[Si modo]

More dishonesty by Si. No one ever claimed that CO2 was the only variable. In fact, it has been pointed out many times by the honest posters here that the TSI, NAO, and La Nina, El Nino oscilations all contribute to the variability of the weather.

However, CO2 is the biggest single factor now that we have increased the amount in the atmosphere by nearly 40%. In spite of the fact that we should have started a slow descent into another ice age at present, we are instead rapidly warming. The reason why is contained in this site from the American Institute of Physics.

The Carbon Dioxide Greenhouse Effect

If I said someone did say it was the only variable, you might have a point. What I said (now at least the fifth time) is that if CO2 concentration were the only variable, then the kid's point would not necessarily be nonsense.

I know. It's a difficult distinciton to make, for morons.

 

[Old Rocks]

Si;

Your dishonesty is on display. You have been told that unless CO2 concentrations are the only variable in any warming, your point is nothing more than nonsense and you've been told this at least four times by me. Also, correlation is not causation. At least the fourth time by me, again.

And what other variable has changed by an apreciable percentage? And for the fourth time again, you spout nonsense.

 

[Si modo]

Si;

Your dishonesty is on display. You have been told that unless CO2 concentrations are the only variable in any warming, your point is nothing more than nonsense and you've been told this at least four times by me. Also, correlation is not causation. At least the fourth time by me, again.

And what other variable has changed by an apreciable percentage? And for the fourth time again, you spout nonsense.

I have no idea what you are trying to say. Not in the least.

Perhaps someone can help you to articulate something.