Another child sues for being sexually mutilated by the Left

[Curried Goats]

Some of them are publicity hounds. All of them are purposefully or inadvertently enabling their children’s attention-seeking behavior, which has been a personality trait of every single child with a mental disorder that I’ve ever worked with.

This is how you've made your bigotry apparent. There is no research, not a single one, that says children are adopting trans personas as attention seeking behavior and there is no professional organization in any developed world that labels being trans as a mental disorder. They are parents trying to help their children. Period.

No parent who has normal intelligence thinks that their fourteen year old son can insist on using the girl’s bathroom, showering with girls, and playing on girls sports teams and no one will object. They know that this will bring attention and they choose to have their kid do it. Stage mom may not be a precise description, but I believe I said that they are the woke version of stage moms.

Again, you have no evidence all you have to support this claim is your ignorant assault on their character and I don't use ignorant here in a pejorative sense, I mean you literally have no clue about their character because you've never met or spoken to any of these people.

That’s where you go off track. What or who is the imaginary being you refer to?

That would be God.

Telling a child that they are a boy and will grow up to be a man, in spite of the normal confusion they may feel before, during and after puberty is not grooming them. Not unless you believe that Mr. Rogers was a groomer.

Mr. Rodgers was a wonderful human being full of love and empathy. No one ever confuses bigots and racists with Mr. Rodgers. To be clear religion and belief in God aren't inherently bad or harmful. Religious beliefs, ceremonies and experiences can fill the body with endorphins and bring people peace, calm and euphoria. That's chemistry and I'm all for better living through chemistry. It doesn't really matter to me if the delivery vehicle for those feelings of peace and calm come from weed, mushrooms, exercise, meditation or religion. Where it becomes harmful is when it compels people to forgo life saving medical procedures in order to stay on the right side of a vengeful diety.

Not mutilating and poisoning their healthy body is not neglecting their biological self. It is preserving it. A child can socially transition and wait on more permanent changes until they have the maturity to make the decision.

Or they can travel to a non bigot state and with their parents and doctors, make informed medical decisions that work for them.

That’s what I mean by your not knowing how crazy you sound. Just FYI, every time you write “cosplay” in this context, my estimate of your likely IQ goes down a point.

You are either too stupid to know that your arguments are all cosplay and based on the fanfiction you've written in your head (like your fanfiction about parents who you've never met or spoken to) or you're at least bright enough to know its cosplay and fanfiction and it gets under your skin when I point it out. Honestly, I don't know which one to root for.

Examples of the state stepping in to over-ride parental decisions about transgender treatment that you support?

Another great example of cosplay by you. Clearly I was talking about the State having to step in and allow doctors to force children to take treatment that their ignorant religions groomed them to reject and I can provide an example because unlike you (who tried to argue a hypthetical, i.e. cosplay argument) about a child being forced into gender affirming care against their will, I can support my arguments with facts and data.

Connecticut teen to go home after forced chemo treatment

Not every choice parents and medical providers make is by definition appropriate. Some parents would choose genital mutilation for their daughters. Some parents would give their daughters over in marriage to an older man who is a religious leader. The daughters might even agree, having been groomed to believe it is their duty. The state would rightly step in.

What medical provider is prescribing giving away daughters to older men as a medical treatment?

Of course such a study would be “often-criticized.” Doesn’t mean it is true or false.

I included a quote from the studies author that says the right wing is being misleading about the data. 80% of children will see desistence of gender dysphoria by adulthood is what the research said. Not that 80% of children who identify as trans with stop being trans. Desistence of GD is not the same thing as detransitioning.

Do you understand that you are using the fallacy of argument from authority?

Nope. Im pointing out that the right wing keeps misrepresenting the authority they are citing as their evidence.

I’ve never cited that figure, as far as I know. It sounds very high to me.

Ron Desantis and the doctors who ruled to ban gender affirming care in Florida did.

So that is a valid argument you have for whoever is citing it.

That would be the Florids Medical Board and its bigoted governor.

The research you’ve cited has been very problematic as far as methodology. You could even say that it is “often-criticized” since I do often criticize it. See how that works?

Except in this case it is the author of the study saying DeSantis and the Florida Medical Board are full of shit.

Yes, suicide is very high among the transgender, with or without surgery and hormone treatments, with no studies showing that surgery and hormone treatment make any difference in suicide or suicide attempts.

Who ever said the purpose of those treatments were to lower suicide rates? Here's a poll that says the majority of adult trans said surgery has improvred their lives.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2023/03/23/transgender-adults-transitioning-poll/

I’ve seen estimates as high as 32% to 59% of transgenders attempt suicide. Not “report suicidal ideation” but actually tried to kill themselves. That was in an article called “Suicide and Suicidal Behavior among Transgender Persons” by Virupaksha, Muralidhar and Ramakrishna, if you want to look it up. Sorry, cannot link right now.

Well from my link above we get some perspectives from trans adults who explain exactly why.

Tim McCoy, a White 72-year-old trans man who lives in Syracuse, N.Y., said he has suffered from chronic depression and anxiety since he was young. Those feelings initially dissipated after he began taking testosterone.

“I was floating on a cloud when I first transitioned,” he said. “I just thought that was the answer to all my problems. I felt wonderful, but after I had transitioned for about five years, the depression came back. Transitioning has definitely made my quality of life better, but it’s not the answer to everything.”

That’s due, he said, in large part to the discrimination trans people face. That has worsened as the political climate has turned increasingly hostile toward trans people, he said.

“You always have that fear of what’s going to happen when you tell somebody you’re transgender, especially these days,” he said. “That definitely affects one’s quality of life. It’s a constant stress.”

One in 4 trans adults say they have been physically attacked because of their gender identity, gender expression or sexual identity, and more than 6 in 10 (64 percent) say they have been verbally attacked.

Coupled with how many of the report being treated in childhood its not hard to see why suicide rates among trans is so high....

Most trans people (59 percent) say they lacked a trusted adult to talk to while growing up, including 64 percent of trans people of color. Those who did have a trusted adult were much more likely to report feeling safe in their childhood homes and to have a happy childhood.

School marked one of the greatest stressors for trans children. More than 4 in 10 say they felt unsafe at school, and one-quarter felt unsafe participating in sports or in other youth activities.

Rogers said she was an “outcast” at school, so few classmates commented when she began cross-dressing as a teenager. But her family grew upset, she said. Rogers said her grandparents committed her to a mental hospital and later sent her to conversion therapy in Colorado. The state has since banned the practice, but Rogers’s experience was commonplace. One in 4 trans adults say they attended religious services as a child or teenager that tried to change their sexual orientation or gender identity, and about 1 in 10 say they attended conversion or reparative therapy.

“I definitely thought about killing myself,” Rogers said. “I was in a terrible situation.”

A few years after Rogers went through conversion therapy, she decided to start taking estrogen. She knew many in her family would reject her once she told them she was a woman.

Though 69 percent of trans people who are out to at least some immediate family members say their families are at least “somewhat supportive” of their gender identity, about 3 in 10 say their families are not supportive, including 13 percent who are “very unsupportive.” Similarly, 29 percent of trans adults say they experienced homelessness or got kicked out of their home while they were growing up, rising to 38 percent among trans people of color.

“I knew I was going to lose some of my family,” Rogers said. “It wasn’t a question of if. It was a question of how many.”

That’s why gender Dysphoria is a mental disorder regardless of the APA’s politically driven parsing. Any mental condition that increases suicide so much compared to non sufferers indicates that people who have it are not mentally healthy.

And this is why I don't take you seriously. The people who wrote the handbook said being trans (diverse gender expressions and identities...) is not itself signs of mental illness and they themselves tell you their feelings of depression and anxiety stem from the vitriol and hate they receive.

I’m sure that the lack of acceptance of transgenders is a big part of the suicide.

Then why do continue to try to imply gender dysphoria increases suicide when its hate? If you remember back to beginning of the thread GD desists in 80% of children by adulthood.

That’s what you should be working to change. What you’re doing now, by pushing permanent treatments on temporarily confused kids is pushing people away from acceptance of transgenders, not toward it.

What evidence do you have that they are temporarily confused? You denied that you even made this claim earlier in this same post and yet here you are repeating it.

If transgenders would accept themselves as they are, it would make it much easier for others to accept them as they are. Caitlin Jenner is a frequent guest on Foxnews, so more acceptance of Transgenderism is not impossible, if you don’t screw it up by going after the kids. When you do that, people will focus on that, and believe that the kids are the true goal.

You're the ones going after kids. You are the ones going after kids, their parents and their doctors as the seek out medical care. The answer to that is not to acquiesce to bigots its properly out them as bigots, ostracize their bigoted beliefs from the mainstream with ridicule and sham and shove them to the fringes where they can be thorougly ignored.

I read it. It was much better as far as documentation, methodology and statistical analysis than the transgender studies you’ve cited. It was not about IQ but about educational testing, though.

I know you take the whole demographics/IQ science very personally in a negative way. But the science is the science.

Yes. Science is science.

For what it’s worth, I believe that nutrition, moreso than genetics is the reason for the disparate IQ’s among races. Read GMR and Intelliegence Quotient (IQ) of the Rice Group on researchgate.com. It shows that frequent consumption of rice, grains, meat and eggs at breakfast especially, is associated with higher verbal, performance, and full scale IQ.

Which is why you suggested you weren't worried about the IQs of incoming immigrants previously, because immigrants don't eat rice..... You're such a magnificant coward.

 

[Seymour Flops]

Cut out a lot of repetitive and angry nonsense.

That would be God.

Oh. That was confusing. I thought you were speaking about a male persona in a biological male child who identifies as a girl as the imaginary being. Try saying what you mean, my dude.

Mr. Rodgers was a wonderful human being full of love and empathy.

Absolutely. That's why he wanted to help children with gender confusion.





"If you were born a boy, you stay a boy."
Again . . .

Another great example of cosplay by you. Clearly I was talking about the State having to step in and allow doctors to force children to take treatment that their ignorant religions groomed them to reject and I can provide an example because unlike you (who tried to argue a hypthetical, i.e. cosplay argument) about a child being forced into gender affirming care against their will, I can support my arguments with facts and data.

So, you don't support the state stepping in to force reluctant parents to provide hormone, and surgery to children confused about gender?

I included a quote from the studies author that says the right wing is being misleading about the data. 80% of children will see desistence of gender dysphoria by adulthood is what the research said. Not that 80% of children who identify as trans with stop being trans. Desistence of GD is not the same thing as detransitioning.

So, you admit it was not me citing that 80% figure? This will go quicker if I don't have to spend so much time correcting your lies about me.

Nope. Im pointing out that the right wing keeps misrepresenting the authority they are citing as their evidence.

I'm not "right wing," so that supposed slur doesn't affect me in the slightest.

Ron Desantis and the doctors who ruled to ban gender affirming care in Florida did.

That would be the Florids Medical Board and its bigoted governor.

Except in this case it is the author of the study saying DeSantis and the Florida Medical Board are full of shit.

They are the Medical Board, and they are trained to interpret studies. Authors of studies often have an agenda, so their pronouncements about who is "full of shit" are not the final word. In the U.S. voters select leaders, who appoint people to boards. Sorry you hate democracy.

Who ever said the purpose of those treatments were to lower suicide rates?

You used to cite an incredibly flawed study that purportedly showed reduction in suicidal ideation in people who had hormones and surgery as children. I'm glad I was able to convince you not to keep doing that.

Here's a poll that says the majority of adult trans said surgery has improvred their lives.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2023/03/23/transgender-adults-transitioning-poll/

A WAPO poll is your idea of science?

Well from my link above we get some perspectives from trans adults who explain exactly why.

Tim McCoy, a White 72-year-old trans man who lives in Syracuse, N.Y., said he has suffered from chronic depression and anxiety since he was young. Those feelings initially dissipated after he began taking testosterone.

“I was floating on a cloud when I first transitioned,” he said. “I just thought that was the answer to all my problems. I felt wonderful, but after I had transitioned for about five years, the depression came back. Transitioning has definitely made my quality of life better, but it’s not the answer to everything.”

This is a very good learning opportunity for you, CG. I strongly encourage you to read the study below on testosterone and depression. It shows that testosterone has a significant effect on depression, with no reference to gender dysphoria. Point is that science shows that the chemical properties of testosterone, not the transitioning, is what helped his depression.

Also, this article shows what a real study looks like. There is a control group given a placebo, and there is double blind data taking. If you don't know what those are, please educate yourself, so you don't keep getting taken in.

That’s due, he said, in large part to the discrimination trans people face. That has worsened as the political climate has turned increasingly hostile toward trans people, he said.

“You always have that fear of what’s going to happen when you tell somebody you’re transgender, especially these days,” he said. “That definitely affects one’s quality of life. It’s a constant stress.”

Here is what you do not get about depression: It is a disorder of persistent sadness, chronic anxiety, feelings of worthlessness, suicidal ideation, and inability to function, often with no logical cause. The point is that it is chronic and persistent, and it is not about being sad for a logical reason, like facing discrimination. Unfortunately, Americans use "I'm depressed" coloquially to mean "I'm sad about . . . " That isn't clinical depression.

We can't base policy on people claiming to be depressed.

One in 4 trans adults say they have been physically attacked because of their gender identity, gender expression or sexual identity, and more than 6 in 10 (64 percent) say they have been verbally attacked.

I'm sure that's true. When I was a kid, I was physically and verbally attacked because of my short stature, because I was so book smart, and because I was a wise guy to people less witty than I. We all have our tales of childhood bullying. Stop being such a drama mamma.

Coupled with how many of the report being treated in childhood its not hard to see why suicide rates among trans is so high....

Yes, and hormones and surgeries have never been shown scientifically to change that.

Most trans people (59 percent) say they lacked a trusted adult to talk to while growing up, including 64 percent of trans people of color. Those who did have a trusted adult were much more likely to report feeling safe in their childhood homes and to have a happy childhood.

Are you saying that people of color are more bigoted than whtes?

Jesus, Goats! You really needed a survey to know that kids who have a trusted adult are more likely to feel safe and have a happy childhood? Can't you just use your common sense for anything at all?

School marked one of the greatest stressors for trans children. More than 4 in 10 say they felt unsafe at school, and one-quarter felt unsafe participating in sports or in other youth activities.

Yes, when you're different, you get bullied. Happened to me, and to anyone else who was ever different in some way, which is almost everyone at one time or another.

Rogers said she was an “outcast” at school, so few classmates commented when she began cross-dressing as a teenager. But her family grew upset, she said. Rogers said her grandparents committed her to a mental hospital and later sent her to conversion therapy in Colorado. The state has since banned the practice, but Rogers’s experience was commonplace. One in 4 trans adults say they attended religious services as a child or teenager that tried to change their sexual orientation or gender identity, and about 1 in 10 say they attended conversion or reparative therapy.

Yes, gender dysphoria is a mental disorder that is associated with a high suicide rate. Of course parents will try to help a child out of it.

“I definitely thought about killing myself,” Rogers said. “I was in a terrible situation.”

A few years after Rogers went through conversion therapy, she decided to start taking estrogen. She knew many in her family would reject her once she told them she was a woman.

Estrogen has also been shown to help with depression without reference to transgenderism. I hope she was helped by that.

Neither of your two anectdotes involve children, praise Allah.

Though 69 percent of trans people who are out to at least some immediate family members say their families are at least “somewhat supportive” of their gender identity, about 3 in 10 say their families are not supportive, including 13 percent who are “very unsupportive.” Similarly, 29 percent of trans adults say they experienced homelessness or got kicked out of their home while they were growing up, rising to 38 percent among trans people of color.

“I knew I was going to lose some of my family,” Rogers said. “It wasn’t a question of if. It was a question of how many.”

Yes, families don't always support everything you do. My dad didn't want me to go into the Army, but it was great for me.

Are these the first times you've ever heard about bullying, and family conflicts? You write about them in such shocked tones, and seem to think that they are new problems specific to trans folk.

Then why do continue to try to imply gender dysphoria increases suicide when its hate? If you remember back to beginning of the thread GD desists in 80% of children by adulthood.

You have no scientific evidence that it is "hate" that causes suicides in transfolk. Gender Dysphoria is a mental disorder that is co-morbid with other mental disorders. Most mental disorders are associated with increased suicide rates. In fact an increased suicide rate used to be part of the definition of a mental disorder. Then the APA changed that so that homosexuality could be taken out of the category of mental disorder.

What evidence do you have that they are temporarily confused? You denied that you even made this claim earlier in this same post and yet here you are repeating it.

Some are temporarily confused and some are firmly convinced their gender is different from their biological sex.

Worried about your gender identity? Advice for teenagers

Find out what support is available on the NHS if you're worried about your gender identity.

www.nhs.uk

If you feel confused about your gender identity, you're not alone.

Many teenagers question their gender, whether they feel female, male, non-binary or any of the other terms used on the gender spectrum.

Why are you so insistent on going after kids with the hormones and scalpels before we know which it is?

You're the ones going after kids. You are the ones going after kids, their parents and their doctors as the seek out medical care. The answer to that is not to acquiesce to bigots its properly out them as bigots, ostracize their bigoted beliefs from the mainstream with ridicule and sham and shove them to the fringes where they can be thorougly ignored.

Answer the questions: Should the state step in if counselors believe a child should be referred to a transgender specialist and the parent refuses? Should the state step in if the parent takes their child to a transgender specialists who provides hormones and surgery but the parent refuses?

Yes. Science is science.

Which is why you suggested you weren't worried about the IQs of incoming immigrants previously, because immigrants don't eat rice..... You're such a magnificant coward.

I never suggested any such thing. Many immigrants are from Asia and they eat plenty of rice. They become entrepreneurs and their kids become doctors (in larger numbers than multi-generation Americans who do not eat as much rice). I know you hate science, but science is still science.

I don't worry about low-IQ immigrants becaus a solid economy needs menial laborers. Their kids will eat an American diet and develop intelligence on par or close to on par with multi generation Americans.

That's what make America great, Goats. You really missed out on that by constantly whining, when you were lucky enough to escape a socialist hellhole.

Hey! You are sad without logical reason to be. Have you talked to your doctor about testosterone?