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Abortion should be banned in the United States

Coyote

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Coyote

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I am pro innocent life but I do support the death penalty.
The death penalty is unequal and there unjust imo. But in terms of innocent life…innocents end up on death and end up killed. If you are truly pro innocent life how can you support the death penalty as it is now?
 

HeyNorm

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So you think they only “appear”
similarly situated.

It’s not too hard to figure out that if you remove the 23 week fetus from the life-support that the mother gives it, it will die because there’s not much modern medical science can do to save it. The 24 week fetus has better odds and that’s it. It’s not a biological timetable trying figure out when each individual thousands of fetuses are developing in the womb actually has developed far enough to live outside the womb. It is a legal timeline to set to regulate abortion clinics because if a woman has not made up her mind whether she wants to terminate her pregnancy or not by 24 weeks society says you’ve had enough time. She cannot get an abortion on demand in my opinion after 23 weeks because she had plenty of time. Most abortions on demand by the rightful person who can demand it because it’s none of your business what goes on inside a woman’s body. However, reasonable people, and a rational society, the civilized society that we all live in have an interest in protecting a fetus that has developed to the time the approximate time, based on science and survivability of actual premature births, so we set it at 24 weeks moved forward from 28 weeks that Roe v. Wade set 50 years ago.

Jewish people who believe life does not begin until first breath have not had a problem with a 28 week end of privacy for the woman. That’s because they like every other woman decides usually by the 12th to 14th week. There is no way that a fetus will survive outside the womb on its own, and with medical advanced care, so leave these women alone it’s none of your business. What the hell is wrong with you? Are you a control freak or what? Do you hate women? What is your problem since you’re not a Christian who believes God creates life at conception. Even Catholics who believe that know it’s none of their business and if it’s a sin to get an abortion, they don’t get one.
You could do that too, but I suspect you only care about the rights of a living human
not viable organism so you can demonize and dehumanized liberals and Democrats just like CarsomyrPlusSix - one of the most vile human beings on this message board.

Interesting. You give a 24 week old right to live, even though they are almost identical. Neither has huge odds if removed to live. So identical human life do not require the same rights. Interesting. Did you know that some 23 week gestated have developed more then some 24 week gestated?

You realize the legal status of “similarly situated” only requires that some have similar traits? Not all, right. Because some hetero couple can’t procreate, same sex couples are considered to those couples, so they can’t be denied marriage rights. Correct?

And your use of “traditions” were tossed out as well.

So, why is the 23 week fetus not to be protected, but the 24 week does when one is similarly situated to the other?
 

HeyNorm

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The death penalty is unequal and there unjust imo. But in terms of innocent life…innocents end up on death and end up killed. If you are truly pro innocent life how can you support the death penalty as it is now?

Does the fetus get a judge and jury with many appeals? And what crime is the fetus accused of. Does the fetus get an attorney even if he/ she can’t afford one?
 

NotfooledbyW

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So, why is the 23 week fetus not to be protected, but the 24 week does when one is similarly situated to the other?
NFBW: The answer has been around fifty years

NFBW230121-#6,815

NFBW: Nixon appointee to the Supreme Court in 1970…. Justice Harry Blackmun, writing the majority opinion for Roe, defined viability as the point where a fetus “has the capability of meaningful life outside the mother’s womb”:

With respect to the State’s important and legitimate interest in potential life, the “compelling” point is at viability. This is so because the fetus then presumably has the capability of meaningful life outside the mother’s womb. State regulation protective of fetal life after viability thus has both logical and biological justifications. If the State is interested in protecting fetal life after viability, it may go so far as to proscribe abortion during that period, except when it is necessary to preserve the life or health of the mother.

END2301242052
 

HeyNorm

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NFBW: The answer has been around fifty years

NFBW230121-#6,815

NFBW: Nixon appointee to the Supreme Court in 1970…. Justice Harry Blackmun, writing the majority opinion for Roe, defined viability as the point where a fetus “has the capability of meaningful life outside the mother’s womb”:

With respect to the State’s important and legitimate interest in potential life, the “compelling” point is at viability. This is so because the fetus then presumably has the capability of meaningful life outside the mother’s womb. State regulation protective of fetal life after viability thus has both logical and biological justifications. If the State is interested in protecting fetal life after viability, it may go so far as to proscribe abortion during that period, except when it is necessary to preserve the life or health of the mother.

END2301242052

You stated that the fetus should be protected at 24 weeks. Roe was overturned.

And we now have similarly situated as the legal argument.

So argue your case, why should one be granted protection, and the other not? I’ve shown they are in many cases, identical.
 

NotfooledbyW

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You stated that the fetus should be protected at 24 weeks. Roe was overturned.
NFBW: No I stated I would support a constitutional amendment that stipulated abortion would be legal nationally up to 24 weeks. It has nothing to do with your idiotic arguments that viability cannot be determined exactly.

If the amendment gets passed the voters decide 24 weeks is a proper timeframe for aborting a fetus in a safe legal medical environment.

END2301242123
 
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HeyNorm

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NFBW: No I stated I would support a constitutional amendment that stipulated abortion would be legal nationally uo to 24 weeks. It has nothing to do with your idiotic arguments that viability cannot determined exactly.

If the amendment gets passed passed the voters decide 24 weeks is a proper timeframe for aborting a fetus in a safe legal medical environment.

Thus providing a constitutional right to protection. And since the 23 week old is similarily situated, it must be given this right as well.

Did you know that it is the courts, not the voter that determine civil rights? Right.
 

NotfooledbyW

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Thus providing a constitutional right to protection. And since the 23 week old is similarily situated, it must be given this right as well.
No it’s giving woman the right to abort a fetus up to 24 weeks after this happens in the privacy of her womb …

1674614705295.png


I do not support a personhood amendment because this is not a person when this happens and lasts 12 hours.

1674614988023.png


Does that look like a person to you HeyNorm ?
 

HeyNorm

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Coyote

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Does the fetus get a judge and jury with many appeals? And what crime is the fetus accused of. Does the fetus get an attorney even if he/ she can’t afford one?
It makes no difference if an innocent person ends up dying.

Does a fertilized egg feel anguish, sorrow, fear?
 

presonorek

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So pro-lifer, you oppose the death penalty?

I am a pro lifer that is against the death penalty. It is impossible for anybody to know if a person committed a crime or not unless they seen it with their own eyes. Putting an innocent person in jail is bad. Executing an innocent person is taking justice further than a human society is capable. Even a confession does not prove a crime happened. Humans lie more times than they tell the truth. Executing a baby for any reason other than self defense is way worse than executing someone accused of a crime.
 

NotfooledbyW

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You just protected the fetus at 24 weeks. You get that, right?
NFBW: No fetus is protected at 24 weeks because it’s specific individual biological development worked out to hit that zinger second at the precise moment at 24 weeks since conception. It is the time limit placed on the woman. So the joke that you call an argument that the amendment then had to be changed to 23 weeks And then to 15 Etc etc until you get here:
1674618005437.png

Constitutional Amendments don’t work that way.

END2301242247
 

HeyNorm

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NFBW: No fetus is protected at 24 weeks because it’s specific individual biological development worked out to hit that zinger second at the precise moment at 24 weeks since conception. It is the time limit placed on the woman. So the joke that you call an argument that the amendment then had to be changed to 23 weeks And then to 15 Etc etc until you get here:
View attachment 750537
Constitutional Amendments don’t work that way.

END2301242247

So we are protecting women from the least harmful time of a pregnancy? That’s the story? 🤷‍♂️
 

HeyNorm

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I am a pro lifer that is against the death penalty. It is impossible for anybody to know if a person committed a crime or not unless they seen it with their own eyes. Putting an innocent person in jail is bad. Executing an innocent person is taking justice further than a human society is capable. Even a confession does not prove a crime happened. Humans lie more times than they tell the truth. Executing a baby for any reason other than self defense is way worse than executing someone accused of a crime.
True
 

presonorek

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No it’s giving woman the right to abort a fetus up to 24 weeks after this happens in the privacy of her womb …

View attachment 750523

I do not support a personhood amendment because this is not a person when this happens and lasts 12 hours.

View attachment 750525

Does that look like a person to you HeyNorm ?

It looks like a tadpole with an extremely long tail playing in bubbles. My great uncle looks that too so maybe yes.
 
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