You will now see flag draped coffins on the news

[Toome]

Wow! The speculation is amazing and humorous at the same time.

It boils down to this: preserving the dignity of our fallen warriors. For some families, it means not showing the pictures of their loved ones and for others, it's the exact opposite: to not show the pictures is to ignore their sacrifices.

What I approve of is that it's up to the families. I think this is much more reasonable than a simple ban across the board or a simple lifting of the ban across the board.

so, if i understand you, you would not allow any photos of the coffins until they have been released to the custody of the families, is that it?

I am saying that I support the decision. Of course, the details have yet to be released, but it appears as though the wishes of the families will be taken into account. Some families prefer not to have media coverage whereas others believe that such coverage only serves to publicly acknowledge the sacrifice of their loved ones.

I think this is a much better alternative than the government either enforcing a total ban or allowing a total free-for-all.

 

[DiveCon]

Wow! The speculation is amazing and humorous at the same time.

It boils down to this: preserving the dignity of our fallen warriors. For some families, it means not showing the pictures of their loved ones and for others, it's the exact opposite: to not show the pictures is to ignore their sacrifices.

What I approve of is that it's up to the families. I think this is much more reasonable than a simple ban across the board or a simple lifting of the ban across the board.

so, if i understand you, you would not allow any photos of the coffins until they have been released to the custody of the families, is that it?

I am saying that I support the decision. Of course, the details have yet to be released, but it appears as though the wishes of the families will be taken into account. Some families prefer not to have media coverage whereas others believe that such coverage only serves to publicly acknowledge the sacrifice of their loved ones.

I think this is a much better alternative than the government either enforcing a total ban or allowing a total free-for-all.

but there wasnt a total ban
thats the point you are missing
the media wants to show the coffins before they have been released to the families
THAT was what was banned
after they were released to the families, the families had control over that
but, at that point the media doesnt have the show of multiple coffins at once
so, this is just for a media circus

 

[Terry]

If people have to see images to think about the statistics, then they don't really care about the statistics enough to be informed.

Well I am a combat veteran, been to Iraq in 2005 and going to Kuwait later on this year. And I support my family having the right to make a decision on whether or not to allow photographs if something happens to me.

Why not during pre-deployment training the GI sign a release of yes or No to any pictures or video? This would stop the Cindy's of the world.

I just wanted to add that I don't think our Military should have to even worry about this. If they want it public I'm sure their family would know this and invite the Media to the funeral! Why fix something that isn't broken? Oh I know, dumb me, for I watched it all unfold on TV as a teen during the VN war!

 

[Gunny]

They have to have the permission from the Families, I see big lawsuits abound if any news organization over steps their bounds on this one.

They do not have to have the family's permission.

"If the family of one of the fallen says that they do not want media coverage ... then that will be the decision. There will be no media decision. If they say that's OK with them, then it will be available," Gates told reporters at a Pentagon briefing.

That's a verbal, and voluntary though. It isn't against the law.

 

[Gunny]

Well until we start communicating with the dead, I think the family is as close to the soldiers wishes as we can get.

This is why they shouldn't be shown at all in the media, unless they left it in a will there is no way to know if they want to. Anyone who dies deserves the right to rest in peace, just because they are soldiers though everyone has to use them as political pawns ... so again, what about the dead soldiers wishes?

The problem is, some soldiers and their families see it as an honor for their fallen one's sacrifice to be reported in the media. They do not want the sacrifices of their loved ones to be hidden from view. Of course we do not live in a perfect world where one solution fits all, but what about the dead soldier who wanted their photos of their funeral on the news? Are we respecting their wishes by having an all out media ban?

That is why the families I believe are the ones to look to. After all who do you leave in charge of making your funeral arrangements? Whether it be buried in the ground, or having your ashes scattered in the seas, you trust your family to fulfill your wishes. That is why the families should be given the same discretion when it comes to the media coverage, if they want privacy to grieve they can have it. If they wish for the media to cover the funeral then so be it. Remember the families of fallen soldiers are also victims in the war.

All too often, the sacrifices of our military are hidden from view," Paul Rieckhoff, executive director of the Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans of America. "The sight of flag-draped coffins is, and should be, a sobering reminder to all Americans of the ultimate sacrifice our troops have made and the high price of our freedom."

Media Can Photograph War Dead

I really don't agree. I wouldn't want my death, doing something I believed worth dying for, to be used as political propaganda. I can't say I knew many Marines that would want that.

You also mentioned the soldiers' families being the closest to the soldier's wishes. I don't know how other services do it, but in the Corps, they push having a will pretty hard. I would imagine the servicemember could express his/her desire that way.

 

[Gunny]

If people have to see images to think about the statistics, then they don't really care about the statistics enough to be informed.

Well I am a combat veteran, been to Iraq in 2005 and going to Kuwait later on this year. And I support my family having the right to make a decision on whether or not to allow photographs if something happens to me.

Why not make that decision yourself via a will?

 

[Gunny]

Well I am a combat veteran, been to Iraq in 2005 and going to Kuwait later on this year. And I support my family having the right to make a decision on whether or not to allow photographs if something happens to me.

Then leave a will that states that, problem solved.

I said I support my family having the right to make the decision, thankfully the government agrees and has chosen to step aside in this matter. No will is needed, my family understands my wishes well.

I disagree, again. No way do I step into a combat zone without a will.

 

[Gunny]

Wow! The speculation is amazing and humorous at the same time.

It boils down to this: preserving the dignity of our fallen warriors. For some families, it means not showing the pictures of their loved ones and for others, it's the exact opposite: to not show the pictures is to ignore their sacrifices.

What I approve of is that it's up to the families. I think this is much more reasonable than a simple ban across the board or a simple lifting of the ban across the board.

so, if i understand you, you would not allow any photos of the coffins until they have been released to the custody of the families, is that it?

I am saying that I support the decision. Of course, the details have yet to be released, but it appears as though the wishes of the families will be taken into account. Some families prefer not to have media coverage whereas others believe that such coverage only serves to publicly acknowledge the sacrifice of their loved ones.

I think this is a much better alternative than the government either enforcing a total ban or allowing a total free-for-all.

Stated like this, I can agree. However, I still will be leery of and cry foul the minute I see anyone politicizing it. That is disrespectful to the sacrifice that servicemember made.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Let me see if I get this right. Acknowledging the truth, that a soldier has died due to combat, and the coffins are photographed as they come off a plane wrapped in flags is disrespectful?

Why?

Why is the truth disrespectful?

 

[Toome]

so, if i understand you, you would not allow any photos of the coffins until they have been released to the custody of the families, is that it?

I am saying that I support the decision. Of course, the details have yet to be released, but it appears as though the wishes of the families will be taken into account. Some families prefer not to have media coverage whereas others believe that such coverage only serves to publicly acknowledge the sacrifice of their loved ones.

I think this is a much better alternative than the government either enforcing a total ban or allowing a total free-for-all.

but there wasnt a total ban
thats the point you are missing
the media wants to show the coffins before they have been released to the families
THAT was what was banned
after they were released to the families, the families had control over that
but, at that point the media doesnt have the show of multiple coffins at once
so, this is just for a media circus

I think you're both reading into what I said and misreading what the actual decision is. I never said there was a total ban. I said that given a choice between a total ban and total lack of restrictions, this is the best decision.

As for the decision itself, as far as I know from when I last read the article, no details have been made yet other than the families having a say. I support the general idea that the families have a say.

As for whether or not it turns into a media circus, I agree with you. With the media, it's always a circus. I'm very curious how the details will be worded, and then it will be only a matter of time until some clever journalist figures out how to circumvent it. Such is the nature of the beast.

 

[KittenKoder]

Let me see if I get this right. Acknowledging the truth, that a soldier has died due to combat, and the coffins are photographed as they come off a plane wrapped in flags is disrespectful?

Why?

Why is the truth disrespectful?

It's not the truth being debated here. Anyone can look at the government websites to see the statistics any time they want. Hell, you could ask for a hard copy to by mail. These are not statistics, these are people you are talking about, and while I don't care what happens after I die, anyone who does care should have that decision respected, regardless of who they are. It's the final respect owed to anyone, especially people who die for a country (even if the war is stupid). The only reason they want to show the pictures is for sensationalism, and to go against a persons final wishes for that reason is wrong, no matter who it is. Would you think it was okay to show all the dead of a mass murderer and flaunt them on TV just for ratings? Remember, all the media is interested in is getting people to watch, for good or bad, they don't care about the dead, the victims, or the soldiers, all they care about is getting people to pay attention to their station or publication. Even with all that aside, again I say, if you HAVE to see pictures of the dead to understand a statistic, then you really don't care about the statistic, or the person.

 

[Toome]

Let me see if I get this right. Acknowledging the truth, that a soldier has died due to combat, and the coffins are photographed as they come off a plane wrapped in flags is disrespectful?

Why?

Why is the truth disrespectful?

LOL.

Surely, you aren't so trusting of the media, are you? There was a photograph of Cindy Sheehan (I believe, but may be mistaken) at what appeared to be an anti-war rally. Rather, it looked like a rally because of the way the picture had been cropped. It looked like she was in the middle of a crowd of folks. The uncropped picture revealed that it was only a handful of people gathered in front of the camera.

I don't think anyone can hide the fact that we have young men and women returning home in coffins. It's not about showing pictures of flag drapped coffins. It's the accompanying headlines and the gist of the story that can be disrespectful.

I'm curious: do you find the images of 9/11 in bad taste? The networks don't show any images of the people jumping from the towers. In fact, they tend to tone down any reference to the dead victims of terrorism. Kind of inconsistent reporting standards, don't you think?

 

[michiganFats]

Does any reasonable person trust the media to be responsible and respectful? I've caught enough of their act to know that that's asking too much of them.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Let me see if I get this right. Acknowledging the truth, that a soldier has died due to combat, and the coffins are photographed as they come off a plane wrapped in flags is disrespectful?

Why?

Why is the truth disrespectful?

It's not the truth being debated here. Anyone can look at the government websites to see the statistics any time they want. Hell, you could ask for a hard copy to by mail. These are not statistics, these are people you are talking about, and while I don't care what happens after I die, anyone who does care should have that decision respected, regardless of who they are. It's the final respect owed to anyone, especially people who die for a country (even if the war is stupid). The only reason they want to show the pictures is for sensationalism, and to go against a persons final wishes for that reason is wrong, no matter who it is. Would you think it was okay to show all the dead of a mass murderer and flaunt them on TV just for ratings? Remember, all the media is interested in is getting people to watch, for good or bad, they don't care about the dead, the victims, or the soldiers, all they care about is getting people to pay attention to their station or publication. Even with all that aside, again I say, if you HAVE to see pictures of the dead to understand a statistic, then you really don't care about the statistic, or the person.

When I see a soldier's coffin come off a plane wrapped in the flag I feel a profound solemnity and sadness.

I don't think it's disrespectful.

 

[Toome]

Let me see if I get this right. Acknowledging the truth, that a soldier has died due to combat, and the coffins are photographed as they come off a plane wrapped in flags is disrespectful?

Why?

Why is the truth disrespectful?

It's not the truth being debated here. Anyone can look at the government websites to see the statistics any time they want. Hell, you could ask for a hard copy to by mail. These are not statistics, these are people you are talking about, and while I don't care what happens after I die, anyone who does care should have that decision respected, regardless of who they are. It's the final respect owed to anyone, especially people who die for a country (even if the war is stupid). The only reason they want to show the pictures is for sensationalism, and to go against a persons final wishes for that reason is wrong, no matter who it is. Would you think it was okay to show all the dead of a mass murderer and flaunt them on TV just for ratings? Remember, all the media is interested in is getting people to watch, for good or bad, they don't care about the dead, the victims, or the soldiers, all they care about is getting people to pay attention to their station or publication. Even with all that aside, again I say, if you HAVE to see pictures of the dead to understand a statistic, then you really don't care about the statistic, or the person.

When I see a soldier's coffin come off a plane wrapped in the flag I feel a profound solemnity and sadness.

I don't think it's disrespectful.

I certainly understand and appreciate that. But what if it was a loved one? That's the whole point: some folks grieve alone and demand complete privacy while others want to grieve publicly. The one thing they have in common is that it is never easy and it is always painful.

These are things that need to be considered before some clown decides to snap pictures.

If I come across as cynical, it's because I have yet to meet anyone from the media who warranted any respect (and I've had several personal encounters). I just don't trust news people.

 

[garyd]

Using people, dead or alive, without their permission, to promote your own political agenda is wrong whatever your agenda is.

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

They are going to lift the ban that makes the war dead invisible.

No News there... The Lord of the Idiots is a subversive whose goal is to undermine the American culture; part and parcel of that is to undermine the US war on terror, by using the coffins of the fallen...

It's Subversion of the Culture 101.

 

[bk1983]

Then leave a will that states that, problem solved.

I said I support my family having the right to make the decision, thankfully the government agrees and has chosen to step aside in this matter. No will is needed, my family understands my wishes well.

I disagree, again. No way do I step into a combat zone without a will.

Sorry if I gave you the wrong idea in what I meant, I currently do have a will, but in my will it does not state whether or not I wish the media to photograph my coffin if something happened. That decision I will leave to my family members if they are left to face it, although they already know my wishes and what I would want.

 

[KittenKoder]

I said I support my family having the right to make the decision, thankfully the government agrees and has chosen to step aside in this matter. No will is needed, my family understands my wishes well.

I disagree, again. No way do I step into a combat zone without a will.

Sorry if I gave you the wrong idea in what I meant, I currently do have a will, but in my will it does not state whether or not I wish the media to photograph my coffin if something happened. That decision I will leave to my family members if they are left to face it, although they already know my wishes and what I would want.

Which is why in absence of a will it's sometimes best to rely on the family, if they are to be found or know you well enough they will generally also know what you want. But the people who want to show the coffins do not care what the soldiers themselves want, and that's what's wrong with some people. It's the "give an inch they'll take a mile" concept, I doubt the media will ask for permission most times once this is repealed.

 

[garyd]

About as often as the Phelps crowd Kit.