Wrecking Russia’s economy could be a disaster for the west

buddhallah_the_christ

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Dec 4, 2014
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The west needs to accept a simple fact: that Putin’s response to sanctions is always bizarre. He tends to favour reactions that hit his own people rather than the west. America passed the Magnitsky Act to “punish” those alleged to be responsible for the killing of the lawyer Sergei Magnitsky, and Putin responded by banning adoptions of Russian orphans by Americans. There is no sign that the killers of Magnitsky suffered in any way; indeed the only official being investigated for the crime was released. The west imposed sanctions on Putin’s “cronies” and Russian banks because of the invasion of Ukraine and annexation of Crimea; and Putin responded by banning the import of western foodstuffs.

To keep repeating the same mistake again and again and expecting different results is, as they say, a sign of madness. And if by doing so you punish only ordinary Russian people, then it is also cruel – and counterproductive. Twenty years ago the dream was to rescue the former communist world and bring prosperity and democracy to its people. What we are doing now is impoverishing and alienating the Russians.
We can, of course, stick to our guns and insist that “sanctions are having an effect”. But what will we gain if the only effect is to destroy the Russian economy? Perhaps the hope is to destabilise the country so much that Putin is overthrown. (I detect much schadenfreude among observers, who desperately hope a collapse of the Russian economy will bring about Putin’s fall.) If so, it is a highly dangerous game of chance. Pouring fuel on Kremlin clan wars that we barely understand would be the height of folly. We have no idea what the outcome might be – and it could be much worse than what we have at present.

Or perhaps the hope is that the Russian people, ground down into poverty and despair, will rise up against the Kremlin and install a government of the west’s choosing. Dream on!

It has long been my contention that we should deal with the causes of Putin’s aggressive behaviour, not the symptoms. There is a way to bring him back into the fold (always assuming that anyone actually wishes to do so any more), but it will require fresh ideas that are utterly unappealing to most of the west’s leaders. It will take bold and imaginative thinking, not kneejerk reactions and the false logic of piling on ever tougher sanctions.

Perhaps it is time to recognise that George W Bush’s disastrous foreign policy legacy encompasses far more than just Iraq, torture and the fanning of terrorism. Bush also understood nothing about Russia – right from the moment that he looked into Putin’s eyes and told us how he “got a sense of his soul” – and now we are living with the consequences.
Wrecking Russia s economy could be a disaster for the west Angus Roxburgh Comment is free The Guardian

 
The Obumanations sanctions have had little effect, BUT Saudi Arabia's decision to keep the oil market FLOODED and driving prices down, simply to see at what price the FRACKING of oil in the U.S. would halt, is the REAL CULPRIT!
 
To keep repeating the same mistake again and again and expecting different results is, as they say, a sign of madness.

Depends on the results we expect. The purpose of our reactions isn't necessarily to make Putin respond exactly as we want on a given issue. But to demonstrate to Putin that his actions will cost him. Putin is the kind of man that will take what he thinks he can get away with. And the best way to deal with such people is to make the cost greater than the benefit.

Its the lack of response that emboldens people like Putin, and Russia in relation to the US historically. Its active opposition that discourages such actions. And Russia's gobbling of near by territory has ground to a stuttering halt along with his economy.

Its like....Vietnam. As a war, it wasn't terribly effective. As a display of American resolve against communists and a demonstration that any attempt to advance communism would be met with stiff opposition, it worked beautifully. The advance of communism in east asia stopped cold with Vietnam.

Or perhaps the hope is that the Russian people, ground down into poverty and despair, will rise up against the Kremlin and install a government of the west’s choosing. Dream on!

Putin's domestic response to objective problems with his economy is typical of most authoritarian governments: blame the outside enemy for everything. He, like the Chinese, are playing the nationalism card. And the harder things get for the Russian people, the harder he presses the nationalism button.

The Russian people are going to side with Putin. They aren't our primary audience. Putin and those like him are. And the acts of opposition that cost Russia are well noted in their assessment of future action.
 
The Obumanations sanctions have had little effect, BUT Saudi Arabia's decision to keep the oil market FLOODED and driving prices down, simply to see at what price the FRACKING of oil in the U.S. would halt, is the REAL CULPRIT!
The US and Saudi Arabia have long-term relations, since 60's the US has been investing in Saudi Arabia billions dollars. American oil producing companies influence at Saudi Arabian oil industry. Therefore it's unsurprisingly that oil price is about 60$ now.
 
The Obumanations sanctions have had little effect, BUT Saudi Arabia's decision to keep the oil market FLOODED and driving prices down, simply to see at what price the FRACKING of oil in the U.S. would halt, is the REAL CULPRIT!
The US and Saudi Arabia have long-term relations, since 60's the US has been investing in Saudi Arabia billions dollars. American oil producing companies influence at Saudi Arabian oil industry. Therefore it's unsurprisingly that oil price is about 60$ now.

Oil traded 1 minute ago at $56.55 a barrel... you might find this interesting...

How Low Can It Go Already below 60 a Barrel the Price of Oil Just Keeps Going Down Forex Magnates
 
The Obumanations sanctions have had little effect, BUT Saudi Arabia's decision to keep the oil market FLOODED and driving prices down, simply to see at what price the FRACKING of oil in the U.S. would halt, is the REAL CULPRIT!
The US and Saudi Arabia have long-term relations, since 60's the US has been investing in Saudi Arabia billions dollars. American oil producing companies influence at Saudi Arabian oil industry. Therefore it's unsurprisingly that oil price is about 60$ now.

Oil traded 1 minute ago at $56.55 a barrel... you might find this interesting...

How Low Can It Go Already below 60 a Barrel the Price of Oil Just Keeps Going Down Forex Magnates
Crude Oil Price Oil Energy Petroleum Oil Price WTI Brent Oil Oil Price Charts and Oil Price Forecast
What about Brent?
 
The Obumanations sanctions have had little effect, BUT Saudi Arabia's decision to keep the oil market FLOODED and driving prices down, simply to see at what price the FRACKING of oil in the U.S. would halt, is the REAL CULPRIT!
The US and Saudi Arabia have long-term relations, since 60's the US has been investing in Saudi Arabia billions dollars. American oil producing companies influence at Saudi Arabian oil industry. Therefore it's unsurprisingly that oil price is about 60$ now.

Oil traded 1 minute ago at $56.55 a barrel... you might find this interesting...

How Low Can It Go Already below 60 a Barrel the Price of Oil Just Keeps Going Down Forex Magnates
Crude Oil Price Oil Energy Petroleum Oil Price WTI Brent Oil Oil Price Charts and Oil Price Forecast
What about Brent?

What one does the other follows!
 
The west needs to accept a simple fact: that Putin’s response to sanctions is always bizarre. He tends to favour reactions that hit his own people rather than the west. America passed the Magnitsky Act to “punish” those alleged to be responsible for the killing of the lawyer Sergei Magnitsky, and Putin responded by banning adoptions of Russian orphans by Americans. There is no sign that the killers of Magnitsky suffered in any way; indeed the only official being investigated for the crime was released. The west imposed sanctions on Putin’s “cronies” and Russian banks because of the invasion of Ukraine and annexation of Crimea; and Putin responded by banning the import of western foodstuffs.

To keep repeating the same mistake again and again and expecting different results is, as they say, a sign of madness. And if by doing so you punish only ordinary Russian people, then it is also cruel – and counterproductive. Twenty years ago the dream was to rescue the former communist world and bring prosperity and democracy to its people. What we are doing now is impoverishing and alienating the Russians.
We can, of course, stick to our guns and insist that “sanctions are having an effect”. But what will we gain if the only effect is to destroy the Russian economy? Perhaps the hope is to destabilise the country so much that Putin is overthrown. (I detect much schadenfreude among observers, who desperately hope a collapse of the Russian economy will bring about Putin’s fall.) If so, it is a highly dangerous game of chance. Pouring fuel on Kremlin clan wars that we barely understand would be the height of folly. We have no idea what the outcome might be – and it could be much worse than what we have at present.

Or perhaps the hope is that the Russian people, ground down into poverty and despair, will rise up against the Kremlin and install a government of the west’s choosing. Dream on!

It has long been my contention that we should deal with the causes of Putin’s aggressive behaviour, not the symptoms. There is a way to bring him back into the fold (always assuming that anyone actually wishes to do so any more), but it will require fresh ideas that are utterly unappealing to most of the west’s leaders. It will take bold and imaginative thinking, not kneejerk reactions and the false logic of piling on ever tougher sanctions.

Perhaps it is time to recognise that George W Bush’s disastrous foreign policy legacy encompasses far more than just Iraq, torture and the fanning of terrorism. Bush also understood nothing about Russia – right from the moment that he looked into Putin’s eyes and told us how he “got a sense of his soul” – and now we are living with the consequences.
Wrecking Russia s economy could be a disaster for the west Angus Roxburgh Comment is free The Guardian

Perhaps it is time to recognise that George W Bush’s disastrous foreign policy legacy encompasses far more than just Iraq, torture and the fanning of terrorism. Bush also understood nothing about Russia

I'm glad Obama and Hillary where available with their much better understanding of Russia with the foreign policy reset in 2009. And then Obama telling Medvedev he'd have more flexibility after the 2012 elections. It must have worked, because Putin didn't cause any trouble since Obama became president. LOL!
What a putz.
 
WWII started and ended in a shorter time frame than the Obama Presidency. At some point even the most diehard Obama Fluffer has to realize that blaming Booooosh is a weak, failed strategy
 
The Obumanations sanctions have had little effect, BUT Saudi Arabia's decision to keep the oil market FLOODED and driving prices down, simply to see at what price the FRACKING of oil in the U.S. would halt, is the REAL CULPRIT!
The US and Saudi Arabia have long-term relations, since 60's the US has been investing in Saudi Arabia billions dollars. American oil producing companies influence at Saudi Arabian oil industry. Therefore it's unsurprisingly that oil price is about 60$ now.

There are those who believe that the Saudis' are pivoting towards the East. They kill two birds with one stone: kill fracking in the west while de-dollarizing it at the same time, and hitch their wagon to a new emergent global currency. In that case, we are toast.
Whatever the case, the 4th TURNING is underway.
 

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