Would conscription be beneficial to the nation as a whole?

[midcan5]

Conscription is slavery.

So freedom is free for some but costly for others?

Libertarians always remind me of class distinctions, a rather un-American sentiment.

 

[eots]

yes.. people would freak and riot the war would be over in no time

 

[eots]

Conscription is slavery.

So freedom is free for some but costly for others?

Libertarians always remind me of class distinctions, a rather un-American sentiment.

so now Obamas in office the soilders are dying for are freedumbs ?

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Conscription is slavery.

So freedom is free for some but costly for others?

Libertarians always remind me of class distinctions, a rather un-American sentiment.

What are you talking about? People freely choose to join the armed forces for any number of reasons knowing the consequences, and they're free not to choose to join the armed forces. In a draft situation that freedom of choice is taken away from the person.

 

[Lorey-Eileen]

Conscription is slavery.

So freedom is free for some but costly for others?

Libertarians always remind me of class distinctions, a rather un-American sentiment.

Would a Hallelujah be inappropriate? Those in the armed forces give up certain rights. Military personnel relinquish some of their rights so that all Americans will have rights to Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness. If you are willing to exercise the rights won by our armed forces you should also be willing to contribute to maintaining them for yourself and for future generations. This is the only logical and just course of action.

(Not even necessarily through joining the military - if you can't do that. There are other ways of supporting your Sailors, Marines, Airmen, and Soldiers.)

 

[rdean]

I think a draft is a great idea. One without "privileges". Does anyone believe that Bush would have been so quick to rush off to Iraq if he had actually seen combat instead of serving in the Champagne Unit with the sons of senators and 5 Dallas Cowboys?

No wonder he didn't know what war was. He only saw it on TV.

And Cheney with his 5 deferments? 5? That's 1, 2, 3, 4, yet "5"!

There there are those who say, "Oh, but our all volunteer military is the best ever". Not so fast.

Sure, after 9/11, you had an enormous number of people enlisting. I'm a veteran. If I had been young enough, I would have re-enlisted.

90% of those soldiers going to Iraq believed they were invading Iraq in retribution for 9/11. Republicans on this site call them stupid for believing that.

Once it was known that Iraq was NOT connected in any way to 9/11, enlistment dried up. Republicans forced people to stay past their time of departure. Hey, you enlisted. That's your fault.

So how to get new soldiers? Raise the age of private to 40 for one. Waivers if you have no diploma. Waivers if you are a felon. That's right. The military was recruiting felons. Giving them weapons and putting them next to unsuspecting Americans who aren't felons. Of course, there were a few "incidents". That means less felons.

I am all for the draft. Bring it on. I wanted to see Bush send his daughters to Iraq. You think we would have gone then?

 

[frazzledgear]

When answering please consider economics, social aspects, politics, etc. I believe it would be beneficial, but would really like to hear other's views on this. Your opinion would be most helpful if you are not affiliated with the military, but any thoughts are most appreciated! Thanks! ​

Relying on a military jammed pack full of people who don't want to be there is a good thing? That didn't work out so well during Vietnam where the odds that a Lieutenant would be fragged by his own troops were incredibly high. So are you seriously asking if it might not be better if we return to making life hazardous for officers who would not only have to deal with the enemy but watch their back to make sure their own troops are putting a target on their backs?

No nation benefits from a military comprised of those who don't want to be there. They leave as soon as their time is up which drives up training costs. They are less efficient, less skilled, less motivated, more injury prone, more likely to inflict injuries on themselves, more likely to engage in criminal activity. When people are there by choice, training costs drop because they are more likely to stay in longer, over all more skilled and less accident prone because they are more motivated. Morale is best in an all volunteer military and the absolute worst among those who don't want to be there and most importantly, mortality rates tend to be significantly lower in an all volunteer force.

I have to wonder why you would even ask the question. The quality of our military took a massive jump when it went all volunteer and no one would seriously believe there is any benefit by changing that unless and until a war is depleting our forces faster than new recruits can make up the losses.

 

[Lorey-Eileen]

Relying on a military jammed pack full of people who don't want to be there is a good thing? That didn't work out so well during Vietnam where the odds that a Lieutenant would be fragged by his own troops were incredibly high. So are you seriously asking if it might not be better if we return to making life hazardous for officers who would not only have to deal with the enemy but watch their back to make sure their own troops are putting a target on their backs?

No nation benefits from a military comprised of those who don't want to be there. They leave as soon as their time is up which drives up training costs. They are less efficient, less skilled, less motivated, more injury prone, more likely to inflict injuries on themselves, more likely to engage in criminal activity. When people are there by choice, training costs drop because they are more likely to stay in longer, over all more skilled and less accident prone because they are more motivated. Morale is best in an all volunteer military and the absolute worst among those who don't want to be there and most importantly, mortality rates tend to be significantly lower in an all volunteer force.

I have to wonder why you would even ask the question. The quality of our military took a massive jump when it went all volunteer and no one would seriously believe there is any benefit by changing that unless and until a war is depleting our forces faster than new recruits can make up the losses.

California Girl has a similar position this is what my reply to her was, "That [the lessening of troop quality] is my biggest reservation about saying that conscription would be advantageous. I have grown up in a military community and am planning to pursue a military career and certainly don't want to have to deal with unmotivated military personnel. Do you think that perhaps it would be best if the conscripts worked the jobs that don’t necessarily require military precision and motivation (i.e. working the post office, cleaning, low-priority paper-pushing, etc.)? …. (It could certainly be argued, however, that EVERY job is essential to the mission)…. 
I really believe that the probable benefits of conscription to society must be considered just as much as the negative aspects. I hope that there is a way to introduce more military attitudes, increase skill levels of the populous, and create a greater sense of unity and pride in the nation without decreasing/ diluting the quality of the professional armed forces.

Please keep in mind that countries such as Greece, the Netherlands, Switzerland, Austria, etc. all have conscription. Please also remember that I am not someone who has been isolated from military life. I understand and am wary of the risks and disadvantages of conscription. Perhaps a more apt question would be, "Is conscription worth the risks involved if it could better our society, our people's patriotism, and our people's appreciation for their freedoms and nation?(not to mention providing the government with incentive NOT to get involved in petty wars)" I just want to understand people's different view points. I understand that it would probably never happen. Really, I wanted people (in this discussion) to weigh the pros and cons of each side of the issue and take a position based upon which they view most important. I understand that conscription will probably never be a reality in the U.S. This is just a "What if?" kind of question.

 

[Ringel05]

I oppose a draft but your post seems to put down draftees many of whom served extremely honorably in past wars.

Yea, it does. I'm harsh like that.

But I maintain that conscripts do not make particularly good soldiers - we have a professional military and most military personnel would, I think, prefer it that way. I know that my brothers would not want anyone out with them that was not a professional Marine.

Draftees would go through the same training as everybody else, they had a draft in ww2 and that seemed to work out well for this nation.

Veterans of Foreign Wars (VFW) :: VFW Magazine

Retired Army major general Walter L. Stewart, Jr., writing in Military Review in 2006, summed up the contributions of draftees best: “The power of America’s drafted and draft-induced armies defeated fascism and [Japanese] imperialism and maintained the 38th parallel in Korea. It would defeat the North Viet¬nam¬ese Army and Viet Cong in every fight of significance in Vietnam.”

I remember reading (around ten years ago) a sociological study concerning crime perpetrated by soldiers during WWII and Vietnam. I'll look through my collection to see if I still have it. The rough break down (if I remember correctly) was the vast majority of violent crimes and non-violent committed in war zones by our military personnel (rape, murder, theft, etc.) were committed by draftees.
The primary reason the researchers concluded was resentment against forced conscription, criminals who had chosen military service over jail time and the feeling by these individuals they would not suffer consequences for their actions in an active war zone.
This is not to say most did not service without issue, they did and many even served with distinction but it doesn't take away from the fact the majority of crime related issues were caused by conscripts.

 

[2Parties]

If you support a draft you are no different than a slave owner who trains his slaves to kill people. Please off yourselves now and make the world a better place.

 

[Ringel05]

If you support a draft you are no different than a slave owner who trains his slaves to kill people. Please off yourselves now and make the world a better place.

 

[midcan5]

If you support a draft you are no different than a slave owner who trains his slaves to kill people. Please off yourselves now and make the world a better place.

For sure - seems many today think only of themselves, weird world compared to the past.

 

[blu]

If you support a draft you are no different than a slave owner who trains his slaves to kill people. Please off yourselves now and make the world a better place.

are you not forcing people into combat who otherwise wouldn't be there?

 

[blu]

the draft would be political suicide and cause nation wide riots. if our country didn't start so much shit around the world we wouldn't need a draft. I certainly am not going to die just so that exxon mobile can keep its profits high. send the kids of the board of the directors.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

If you support a draft you are no different than a slave owner who trains his slaves to kill people. Please off yourselves now and make the world a better place.

For sure - seems many today think only of themselves, weird world compared to the past.

Yes, crazy world where people don't want to go kill other people or die in an illegal, unjustified, and unwinnable war.

 

[RadiomanATL]

The answer to the question is "no".

 

[Sunni Man]

I was drafted during the Vietnam War.

You had a choice; 2 years in the Army or 3 years in prison.

I am 100% against the draft unless our country is being invaded.

 

[JW Frogen]

Conscription is a bad idea unless one is in a war so monumental there is no other choice.

No professional warrior wants to fight with some pimply faced liberal arts major quivering next to him or her crying they really should not be there.

 

[RadiomanATL]

Conscription is a bad idea unless one is in a war so monumental there is no other choice.

No professional warrior wants to fight with some pimply faced liberal arts major quivering next to him or her crying they really should not be there.

And that is exactly why conscription is a bad idea.

Our servicemen and women want to be there for the most part.

Imagine the training and other hassles that would lessen the efficiency of our armed forces if we had to try and turn people who don't want to be in the military into effective soldiers? Monumental waste of resources for very little return.

 

[blu]

This is kind of depressing. A lot of what I've heard in response to this hasn't been political or moral debate, but children whining, "I don't wanna" - kind of a weighty statement about the state of American (and the world's) society, right? If you don't agree with my opinions - that's fantastic. That's American. If you just "don't wanna".... well, that's something else entirely and is rather contradictory to the classic American ideals.

maybe to someone else this post makes sense....