Worrying about what's fair

[daveman]

Fairness, is not a dirty word....i realize some may be using it in that manner....!

but being Fair is what is right and just....and we should always strive for that imo.

Fair in opportunity, or fair in results?

 

[editec]

One man's ceiling is another man's floor, folks.

Debating about fair or just is pointless.

It isn't until we're addressing something concrete that we can give terms such as those real meaning in context..

 

[Wiseacre]

1. free from bias, dishonesty, or injustice: a fair decision; a fair judge.

I suspect that those who scream the loudest about fairness are not exactly free from bias, nor are they entirely honest about it either. And as for justice, is it really just to force some to pay for the injustices done to others and by others?

Wise, what specifically are you talking about on what i hilighted in bold?

Sometimes injustices are done, within the law or not. If the person(s) or organization(s) responsible for the injustice can be convinced or coerced into redressing the wrongs they did, fine. Many times though, that doesn't happen and other people are asked or forced to pay more in the interests of fairness for past injustices. In one sense we are asking someone to make up for injustices they are not responsible for.

 

[The Rabbi]

this what fair means:

fair

1    /fɛər/ Show Spelled [fair] Show IPA adjective, fair·er, fair·est, adverb, fair·er, fair·est, noun, verb
adjective

1.free from bias, dishonesty, or injustice: a fair decision; a fair judge.

Great, now show me where, in the Constitution, the Government is remitted to decide what is fair - according to the dictionary definition.

Just so you know, I find those who respond with a dictionary definition to be somewhat ridiculous.... but, I'll cut you some slack because I know you are not a fool.

being fair is a MUST for our gvt, any other way, would be wrong....an injustice....our entire constitution and eventually added amendments, is based on being 'fair'....allowing our freedom of religion, is fair....allowing freedom of speech is fair, giving blacks citizenship and all other rights of the whites is fair, giving us the right to not have to testify against ourselves is fair, the right to privacy is fair....etc etc etc....

and trying to change ''fair or fairness'' in to a dirty word just because some politicians are bastardizing the word and using it wrongly, is not the way to go...to handle the misuse, imo....

Is it fair to prosecute pedophiles? Is it fair to hunt down terrorists? Is it fair to make corporations pay for things that they had no control over? Or people?
What is a fair tax rate? What is a fair sentence for a murderer?
My mama (and yours) once told you "life isn't fair." It isn't. Nor is it gov'ts job to make it so.

The gov't is about justice and equality of opportunity. If two people stand before a judge, one a Fortune 500 corporation and the other an elderly black janitor, fairness demands an equal hearing with a decision based on the law and the facts. That is justice.

 

[Mr.Nick]

Fairness, is not a dirty word....i realize some may be using it in that manner....!

but being Fair is what is right and just....and we should always strive for that imo.

Fair is what an individual can provide for his or herself...

Its certainly not our governments responsibility to play mommy and daddy to the general public.

But that is the only way the democratic party can survive - by giving people free shit in exchange for a vote.

The government is responsible for ALL our problems because they keep on manipulating society and our markets in the name of (realistically politicians keeping power) but the excuse they use is "fairness."

 

[California Girl]

this what fair means:

fair

1    /fɛər/ Show Spelled [fair] Show IPA adjective, fair·er, fair·est, adverb, fair·er, fair·est, noun, verb
adjective

1.free from bias, dishonesty, or injustice: a fair decision; a fair judge.

Great, now show me where, in the Constitution, the Government is remitted to decide what is fair - according to the dictionary definition.

Just so you know, I find those who respond with a dictionary definition to be somewhat ridiculous.... but, I'll cut you some slack because I know you are not a fool.

being fair is a MUST for our gvt, any other way, would be wrong....an injustice....our entire constitution and eventually added amendments, is based on being 'fair'....allowing our freedom of religion, is fair....allowing freedom of speech is fair, giving blacks citizenship and all other rights of the whites is fair, giving us the right to not have to testify against ourselves is fair, the right to privacy is fair....etc etc etc....

and trying to change ''fair or fairness'' in to a dirty word just because some politicians are bastardizing the word and using it wrongly, is not the way to go...to handle the misuse, imo....

At the risk of repeating myself, where - precisely - in the Constitution is the Government remitted to decide what is 'fair'.

I support 'fairness' in life, most certainly for individuals.... however, it is not the remit of Government to provide 'fairness', any more than it is their remit to 'take care' of people. I don't consider 'fairness' to be a dirty word, just an unConstitutional one for our Government.

Individuals are entitled to achieve for themselves. I do not ask you to carry my load, nor do I expect to carry yours. I will - because I choose to, but I will not be forced to. Because forcing some people to carry others is not 'fair'.

 

[chanel]

Great, now show me where, in the Constitution, the Government is remitted to decide what is fair - according to the dictionary definition.

Just so you know, I find those who respond with a dictionary definition to be somewhat ridiculous.... but, I'll cut you some slack because I know you are not a fool.

being fair is a MUST for our gvt, any other way, would be wrong....an injustice....our entire constitution and eventually added amendments, is based on being 'fair'....allowing our freedom of religion, is fair....allowing freedom of speech is fair, giving blacks citizenship and all other rights of the whites is fair, giving us the right to not have to testify against ourselves is fair, the right to privacy is fair....etc etc etc....

and trying to change ''fair or fairness'' in to a dirty word just because some politicians are bastardizing the word and using it wrongly, is not the way to go...to handle the misuse, imo....

Is it fair to prosecute pedophiles? Is it fair to hunt down terrorists? Is it fair to make corporations pay for things that they had no control over? Or people?
What is a fair tax rate? What is a fair sentence for a murderer?
My mama (and yours) once told you "life isn't fair." It isn't. Nor is it gov'ts job to make it so.

The gov't is about justice and equality of opportunity. If two people stand before a judge, one a Fortune 500 corporation and the other an elderly black janitor, fairness demands an equal hearing with a decision based on the law and the facts. That is justice.

"Justice and equality of opportunity". Beautifully said. Too many in govt. believe that equality of opportunity = equality of outcome. It doesn't, and no matter how benevolent and well-meaning the intention, it won't make it so. Magical thinking perhaps?

 

[Care4all]

Great, now show me where, in the Constitution, the Government is remitted to decide what is fair - according to the dictionary definition.

Just so you know, I find those who respond with a dictionary definition to be somewhat ridiculous.... but, I'll cut you some slack because I know you are not a fool.

being fair is a MUST for our gvt, any other way, would be wrong....an injustice....our entire constitution and eventually added amendments, is based on being 'fair'....allowing our freedom of religion, is fair....allowing freedom of speech is fair, giving blacks citizenship and all other rights of the whites is fair, giving us the right to not have to testify against ourselves is fair, the right to privacy is fair....etc etc etc....

and trying to change ''fair or fairness'' in to a dirty word just because some politicians are bastardizing the word and using it wrongly, is not the way to go...to handle the misuse, imo....

At the risk of repeating myself, where - precisely - in the Constitution is the Government remitted to decide what is 'fair'.

I support 'fairness' in life, most certainly for individuals.... however, it is not the remit of Government to provide 'fairness', any more than it is their remit to 'take care' of people. I don't consider 'fairness' to be a dirty word, just an unConstitutional one for our Government.

Individuals are entitled to achieve for themselves. I do not ask you to carry my load, nor do I expect to carry yours. I will - because I choose to, but I will not be forced to. Because forcing some people to carry others is not 'fair'.

and my answer was and still is, EVERY WHERE in the constitution.

Fair means just....not equal out comes, but equal opportunity if we bring this conversation on fair, down to just people.

 

[Richard-H]

This thread has certainly gotten to be fairly aethereal!