Follow along with the video below to see how to install our site as a web app on your home screen.
Note: This feature currently requires accessing the site using the built-in Safari browser.
No. It wasn't a stupid idea. It was a great idea - but it failed. Sometimes, even great ideas fail.
I'm glad someone tried to find an alternative to gasoline. In this case it didn't work, and we need to give up, and stop subsidizing it to the tune of 7 billion dollars a year.
But we should keep trying.
On what planet is burning food for fuel while people are starving a great idea?
You keep saying we need to find an alternative fuel, but there is nothing wrong with the fuel we are using now. You just won't let us get it.
You're a socialist now?
I'm sure American farmers would be happy to sell their corn to people who want to eat it, if they're willing to pay more for it than the ethanol makers are.
NEWS FLASH!!! - Ethanol plants produce a co-product. It is called animal feed DDGS (Distillers Dried Grains) You take feed corn to the ethanol plants & you get back both food & fuel!!!
Cattle that would have eaten the corn grain and soybean meal to supplement their diet, now eat distillers grains as that part of their balanced diet. Equal or better performance (rates of gain for beef cattle or milk yield in dairy cows) are usually reported from cows with up to 20% of their diet from distillers grains are compared with control diets.
Ethanol is only made from the starch in the corn. DDGS contain all the protein that was in the corn. Protein is what builds muscle, not starch. Muscles = Hamburger. The corn starch caused methane in cattle that was released into the atmosphere. It was not making beef, hamburgers, steaks or milk. Methane gas is 15 times more powerful of a greenhouse gas than CO2. Now this starch is converted into ethanol instead of methane gas.
Bernanke's printing press is what is driving up cotton, corn, oil & metals prices. All commodities have risen big-time in price. Even the price of water (the most plentiful comodity) is going up.
EROEI (Energy Returned On Energy Invested) starts at 1.2 to 1 for ethanol if we raised corn the conventional way & used old outdated ethanol plants just to make ethanol & threw out the DDG feed. There is no study on the viability of ethanol that factors in the energy value of the DDG feed that comes out of the plants. They also never factor in how most plants use waste heat from power plants to cook the mash. This waste heat used to go into the atmosphere. These new ethanol plants use much more efficent gmo enzymes. They also do not factor in No Till Farming methods that cut in half the total fuels used to produce corn. I have read all their studies & done all the math. They conveniently leave all the things I mentioned above out of their study intentionally to make their point. When you just add in the feed value the ethanol produces 2.2 units of energy for every 1 unit of energy used or lost in the entire chain from growing corn to making your car move. If you add in No-Till Farming, gmo enzymes & waste energy consumption the EROEI goes much, much higher.
We export more food now than we ever did before ethanol. We even export a larger percentage of our food than we ever did before ethanol. The media controls the peoples minds. On average, the world production of crops grew at a rate 40 percent faster than population.
Ethanol is a bad idea if you grow crops just to make ethanol. It is good if you use the DDGS co-product to feed the same animals that the original crops were going to feed.
There is no scarcity! There are just to damn many dollars circulating. There is probably more dollars than rocks on the ground & that makes dollars as worthless as rocks on the ground. Ask yourself - Why is Cotton 3 times higher than 2 years ago? Oil? Wheat? Copper?
Stories of scarcity & supply disruption get moved up to front page news & main TV coverage because prices rise. It is the tail wagging the dog. Print money now & lie about a year or two later when prices rise. The media & government have brainwashed the planet.
Should have went with Sugar Cane like the Brazilians..but what can ya do?
How about burning, I dunno... GASOLINE?
Why do we have to burn food?
Just dumb.
I dunno, cause gasoline isn't going to be around much longer? We hit peak oil in the 70s and now we are just scrambling for the scraps. Time to stop sucking on the oil teat.
Now...Hemp produces 10 times as much methanol as corn does. Shame we aren't planting hemp crops...
I dunno, cause gasoline isn't going to be around much longer? We hit peak oil in the 70s and now we are just scrambling for the scraps. Time to stop sucking on the oil teat.
Now...Hemp produces 10 times as much methanol as corn does. Shame we aren't planting hemp crops...
Liar
How incredibly dishonorable to call someone a "liar", especially without providing any FACTS to counter the statement I made. We, the United States of America hit peak oil back when President Carter said we did. Had we but listened to him then, we might not be in the dire straights we find ourselves in now.
The global oil market will peak in the very near future. Oil is a finite product that we are running out of.
http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d07283.pdf
We use more energy making Ethanol then we get from the Ethanol.
Ethanol Fuel from Corn Faulted as Unsustainable Subsidized Food Burning
David Pimental, a leading Cornell University agricultural expert, has calculated that powering the average U.S. automobile for one year on ethanol (blended with gasoline) derived from corn would require 11 acres of farmland, the same space needed to grow a year's supply of food for seven people. Adding up the energy costs of corn production and its conversion into ethanol, 131,000 BTUs are needed to make one gallon of ethanol. One gallon of ethanol has an energy value of only 77,000 BTUS. Thus, 70 percent more energy is required to produce ethanol than the energy that actually is in it. Every time you make one gallon of ethanol, there is a net energy loss of 54,000 BTUs.
Mr. Pimentel concluded that "abusing our precious croplands to grow corn for an energy-inefficient process that yields low-grade automobile fuels amounts to unsustainable subsidized food burning".
Ethanol
I've seen this study referenced before. I have a simple study of my own from the get-go about this:
If Ethanol costs more in petro products than it produces, how could it possibly make it to market cheaper than gasoline?
I was thinking the same thing! Chickens eat corn and pigs eat slop (whatever that is)!
Slop is basically, garbage. We had a pig farmer that used to come to my grade school and pick up the garbage from lunch.
BTW... cow are fed increasingly more corn these days than grass.
I know they're fed corn but cows are suppose to eat grass. What they eat affects how they taste, doesn't it? Most beef these days is fairly tasteless, imo.
We use more energy making Ethanol then we get from the Ethanol.
Ethanol Fuel from Corn Faulted as Unsustainable Subsidized Food Burning
David Pimental, a leading Cornell University agricultural expert, has calculated that powering the average U.S. automobile for one year on ethanol (blended with gasoline) derived from corn would require 11 acres of farmland, the same space needed to grow a year's supply of food for seven people. Adding up the energy costs of corn production and its conversion into ethanol, 131,000 BTUs are needed to make one gallon of ethanol. One gallon of ethanol has an energy value of only 77,000 BTUS. Thus, 70 percent more energy is required to produce ethanol than the energy that actually is in it. Every time you make one gallon of ethanol, there is a net energy loss of 54,000 BTUs.
Mr. Pimentel concluded that "abusing our precious croplands to grow corn for an energy-inefficient process that yields low-grade automobile fuels amounts to unsustainable subsidized food burning".
Ethanol
I've seen this study referenced before. I have a simple study of my own from the get-go about this:
If Ethanol costs more in petro products than it produces, how could it possibly make it to market cheaper than gasoline?
Gee, I have no idea. could it be because the government subsidizes it heavily in order to keep the price below that of gasoline?
No, you are right, that could not possibly be it.
Liar
How incredibly dishonorable to call someone a "liar", especially without providing any FACTS to counter the statement I made. We, the United States of America hit peak oil back when President Carter said we did. Had we but listened to him then, we might not be in the dire straights we find ourselves in now.
The global oil market will peak in the very near future. Oil is a finite product that we are running out of.
http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d07283.pdf
We, the United States, now have access to an oil field that is larger than the entire Middle East. How do you figure Carter was right when he said we had peaked?
I've seen this study referenced before. I have a simple study of my own from the get-go about this:
If Ethanol costs more in petro products than it produces, how could it possibly make it to market cheaper than gasoline?
Gee, I have no idea. could it be because the government subsidizes it heavily in order to keep the price below that of gasoline?
No, you are right, that could not possibly be it.
Government subsidizes the oil companies to sell ethanol. Ethanol production is not subsidized. Why don't you factor in the oil wars in the Middle East as subsidy for big oil?
This thread is complete nonsense. Corn is treated as a commodity, not a food-stuff. Commodities are not considered "agriculture", as these are vehicles for nothing but profit, and, by the way - the processing of which uses a ridiculous amount of fossel fuels in the name of "efficiency", which is not considered in the real price of the "food" you are buying. Monsanto and Cargill have bribed congress for decades for the corn and soybean subsidies we have today. We produce far MORE food than we need. From that we get all the processed food crap, high fructose corn syrup in everything, feeding corn to cows (which makes them very sick, which is making US sick) and ethanol. WE PRODUCE TOO MUCH FUCKING CORN FOR EVERYONE TO CONSUME. Far more. And yet we are the most overweight AND malnourished people on the planet.
Corn Subsidies: How Congress is shortchanging our health | Static
This thread is complete nonsense. Corn is treated as a commodity, not a food-stuff. Commodities are not considered "agriculture", as these are vehicles for nothing but profit, and, by the way - the processing of which uses a ridiculous amount of fossel fuels in the name of "efficiency", which is not considered in the real price of the "food" you are buying. Monsanto and Cargill have bribed congress for decades for the corn and soybean subsidies we have today. We produce far MORE food than we need. From that we get all the processed food crap, high fructose corn syrup in everything, feeding corn to cows (which makes them very sick, which is making US sick) and ethanol. WE PRODUCE TOO MUCH FUCKING CORN FOR EVERYONE TO CONSUME. Far more. And yet we are the most overweight AND malnourished people on the planet.
Corn Subsidies: How Congress is shortchanging our health | Static
We produce too much corn for everyone to eat, yet there are hundreds of millions of people starving throughout the world. So many people are starving that there are riots/protests/rebellions in nations throughout the world. Such as what we've seen in Tunisia, Egypt, Behrain, Libya, Jordan, Syria, etc.
But no clearly none of those people could possibly eat any of the corn we produce. Instead, we should burn the perfectly good food so we can create an inefficient additive to our gasoline, rather than simply drill for more oil ourselves.
How many people have to die before it becomes obvious that this is a stupid idea?
The Chinese ministry of commerce has said it will begin an investigation into US dumping of livestock feed on China’s farm market...
Local Chinese ethanol producers also want to sell their DDGs, and it is their concerns that are presumably driving this latest investigation. China produces about 3.5 million tonnes of DDGs per year.
China cannot produce enough livestock feed on its own, and has been importing corn, soybeans, and DDGs. It is expected that the country is to import some 3 million metric tons of DDGs this year and as such will be the largest importer of DDGS.
But no clearly none of those people could possibly eat any of the corn we produce. Instead, we should burn the perfectly good food so we can create an inefficient additive to our gasoline, rather than simply drill for more oil ourselves.
Liar
How incredibly dishonorable to call someone a "liar", especially without providing any FACTS to counter the statement I made. We, the United States of America hit peak oil back when President Carter said we did. Had we but listened to him then, we might not be in the dire straights we find ourselves in now.
The global oil market will peak in the very near future. Oil is a finite product that we are running out of.
http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d07283.pdf
We, the United States, now have access to an oil field that is larger than the entire Middle East. How do you figure Carter was right when he said we had peaked?
World starves as Americans burn food to stay on the road | The Australian
I hate to say I told you so, but burning corn for Ethenol was a really stupid idea.
How incredibly dishonorable to call someone a "liar", especially without providing any FACTS to counter the statement I made. We, the United States of America hit peak oil back when President Carter said we did. Had we but listened to him then, we might not be in the dire straights we find ourselves in now.
The global oil market will peak in the very near future. Oil is a finite product that we are running out of.
http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d07283.pdf
We, the United States, now have access to an oil field that is larger than the entire Middle East. How do you figure Carter was right when he said we had peaked?
Liar
How incredibly dishonorable to call someone a "liar", especially without providing any FACTS to counter the statement I made. We, the United States of America hit peak oil back when President Carter said we did. Had we but listened to him then, we might not be in the dire straights we find ourselves in now.
The global oil market will peak in the very near future. Oil is a finite product that we are running out of.
http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d07283.pdf
We, the United States, now have access to an oil field that is larger than the entire Middle East. How do you figure Carter was right when he said we had peaked?
We, the United States, now have access to an oil field that is larger than the entire Middle East. How do you figure Carter was right when he said we had peaked?
Kinda like when it was said during the Carter years that a new ice age was coming.
Look how that worked out.
Sup Infidel....hows that Jamaica trip looken?
Kinda like when it was said during the Carter years that a new ice age was coming.
Look how that worked out.
Sup Infidel....hows that Jamaica trip looken?
