Women say some rape victims should take blame - survey (UK)

[Kalam]

Here's why...Because their clerics say it's always the woman's fault, so it's ok!

You're a bit late, limey. Look up.

 

[Kalam]

does you yell when they attack Christians?? hypocrite! why is just your religion off limits? doyathink?

Whoever said it was "off limits"?

Spout ignorance as much as you'd like, but don't let it spill over into unrelated threads. And no, nobody here applies the same levels of scrutiny and criticism to Christianity that are applied to Islam.

I call it asking questions. You call it "spouting ignorance." Let's just say I am terribly glad not to be a woman in your society.

I see that you've ignored the answer you were provided. That's why I hesitated to address your post in the first place -- knowledge is useless to those who cling to ignorance.

 

[Contessa_Sharra]

BBC News - Women say some rape victims should take blame - survey

Thoughts USMB?

And does anyone think these poll numbers would be vastly different in the U.S. or about the same?

I don't know if they should take the blame, I do know some women lie about being raped. I knew one girl in high school who cried rape a few times, and one night when we were out cruising she sure didn't mind flirting with one of them of the guys who she accused of raping her.
And if you are wasted and he is wasted, and you don't remember having sex, well I don't think you should cry rape either.

I lean towards attributing the 'but for your actions' role to a female as much as a male. You climb into bed with some guy - ie, the scenario outlined in the article (and not the ridiculous fantasy dreamed up by the droolaider Contessa) then, in my female opinion, that female has placed herself in a situation whereby a guy could misinterpret the situation.

key words: but for your actions (not your dress)

What's the matter with you you stupid twat! NO ONE, regardless of circumstances deserves to be raped.

I find it pathetic that you would think any do, but have to say, only a bitch that has offered it up regularly and still gets no takers would take the position you do. Sorry your luck, but then who would want you ? ? ? ?

 

[Modbert]

Sooooooooooo

I knew it was going to happen. After all, this is USMB.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

Instead of attempting to insult my religion, why don't you stay focused on the topic of the discussion?

I am. I yam,, I shall,, but are you unwilling to explain what we read?

Were you able to think for yourselves, no explanation would be necessary.

Say to the believing men that they lower their gaze and restrain their sexual passions. That is purer for them. Surely Allah is Aware of what they do. And say to the believing women that they lower their gaze and restrain their sexual passions and do not display their adornment except what appears thereof. And let them wear their head-coverings over their bosoms. - 24:30-31​

The punishment for rape is death. The victim is blameless.

When a woman went out in the time of the Prophet for prayer, a man attacked her and overpowered (raped) her. She shouted and he went off, and when a man came by, she said: That (man) did such and such to me. And when a company of the Emigrants came by, she said: That man did such and such to me. They went and seized the man whom they thought had had intercourse with her and brought him to her. She said: Yes, this is he. Then they brought him to the Apostle of Allah. When he (the Prophet) was about to pass sentence, the man who (actually) had assaulted her stood up and said: Apostle of Allah, I am the man who did it to her. He (the Prophet) said to her: Go away, for Allah has forgiven you. But he told the man some good words, and of the man who had had intercourse with her, he said: Stone him to death. He also said: He has repented to such an extent that if the people of Medina had repented similarly, it would have been accepted from them. - Sunan Abu Dawud, Prescribed Punishments, no. 4366​

Now, let's return to the discussion at hand.

What is the punishment for taking a n on muslim woman under the rubric of Jihad and having her as a sex slave?

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

As a corollary to the item immediately preceding, about the epidemic of Muslim gang rapes in France, here is the Islamic view of rape as described at Ask the Imam. (Hat tip: Ernie G.)

Q: Please could you tell me if the Virgin female should perform any special prayers, fast etc. JazakAllah for your advise. 2)Has she lost her Vaginity as she was raped? 3)has she also lost her blessings?

A: If a female was raped due to her not maintaining the laws of Hijaab, she is partly to be blamed as the rapist will be considered as being seduced by her revealing form and shape. She should make Tawbah (sincerely repent) by also adhering to the laws of Hijaab.

and Allah Ta'ala Knows Best

Mufti Ebrahim Desai
FATWA DEPT.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

My friend told me that if there is a islamic battle and after winning that battle if muslims capture some women they are free to do whatever they want to do with them...

then they are free to do whatever they want to do with them. i.e have sex without marriage or marry them or kill them or free them or do what ever they please. Is this true. Please narrate any instances if this is true

Slavery was prevalent long before the advent of Nabi (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam) and Nabi (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam) left it to exist even after his attaining prophethood. But Nabi (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam) adopted many schemes to abolish it e.g. continuously encouraging the Sahabah (Radhiallaahu Anhu) to free the slaves and also laying down many conditions for possessing one.

If an Islamic battle breaks out in which the Muslims attain booty which includes women, then the leader will distribute the booty amongst the participants. If a person receives a slave girl in his share allocated to him by the leader then he has the option of either freeing her or keeping her for his own needs, which includes having intimate relations with her without the need for Nikah (i.e. if she is a Muslim, Christian or Jew). The owner and leader both are not allowed to kill the slave girl.

In the present age it is difficult to find Shar’ee slave girls as the rules and regulations of owning slaves are not found, therefore it is not permissible to buy any man or woman nor have intimate relationships with such women without performing Nikah with her first. (Fataawaa Rahimiyyah, Vol. 1, Page 50-58)

and Allah Ta'ala Knows Best

Mufti Muhammad Ashraf
Darul Ifta – Jameah Mahmoodiya, Springs

 

[Kalam]

What is the punishment for taking a n on muslim woman under the rubric of Jihad and having her as a sex slave?

Irrelevant to the discussion at hand. Bring it up somewhere appropriate.

 

[WillowTree]

What is the punishment for taking a n on muslim woman under the rubric of Jihad and having her as a sex slave?

Irrelevant to the discussion at hand. Bring it up somewhere appropriate.

coward

 

[Modbert]

You know Mr. Fitnah, I have to say, you must think that things such as politeness is a Muslim thing. I say this because you certainly haven't shown it in this thread to say the least.

I asked you nicely to not turn this into another Anti-Muslim thread, while both willow and yourself do exactly that.

Muslims and Islam have no real reason to be discussed by themselves in this thread.

Islam in the United Kingdom - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The vast majority of Muslims in the UK live in England and Wales: of 1,591,000 Muslims recorded at the 2001 Census,[7] 1,536,015 were living in England and Wales,[8] where they form 3% of the population; 42,557 were living in Scotland, forming 0.84% of the population[9]; and 1,943 were living in Northern Ireland.[10]

That's like blaming Eskimos here in the United States for the majority of crime.

Now, can we get back on to the topic and discuss this like adults? And I say that last question to everyone who's taking their time to derail this thread.

 

[Kalam]

A: If a female was raped due to her not maintaining the laws of Hijaab, she is partly to be blamed as the rapist will be considered as being seduced by her revealing form and shape.

This is incongruous with the prescriptions of the Prophet (SAWS) in Abu Dawud's book of Hadd, hadith 4366. No mention is made of hijab and no blame is given to the woman. Confine your nonsense to relevant threads.

 

[Sherry]

BBC News - Women say some rape victims should take blame - survey

A majority of women believe some rape victims should take responsibility for what happened, a survey suggests.

Almost three quarters of the women who believed this said if a victim got into bed with the assailant before an attack they should accept some responsibility.

One-third blamed victims who had dressed provocatively or gone back to the attacker's house for a drink.

The survey of more than 1,000 people in London marked the 10th anniversary of the Haven service for rape victims.

More than half of those of both sexes questioned said there were some circumstances when a rape victim should accept responsibility for an attack.

The study found that women were less forgiving of the victim than men.

Of the women who believed some victims should take responsibility, 71% thought a person should accept responsibility when getting into bed with someone, compared with 57% of men.

The survey also found more than one in 10 people were unsure whether they would report being raped to the police, and 2% said they would definitely not do so.

The main reasons were being too embarrassed or ashamed (55%), wanting to forget it had happened (41%) and not wanting to go to court (38%).

Thoughts USMB?

And does anyone think these poll numbers would be vastly different in the U.S. or about the same?

I think it's indicative of a mindset that still exists among some women that the burden of being the responsible party still lies primarily on their shoulders, especially in regards to issues involving sex. Plus, a prevailing attitude among those same women that men have a more difficult challenge containing their sexual urges.

 

[Kalam]

What is the punishment for taking a n on muslim woman under the rubric of Jihad and having her as a sex slave?

Irrelevant to the discussion at hand. Bring it up somewhere appropriate.

coward

I see you've still yet to acknowledge the explanation you asked me to provide twice. Fuck off.

 

[WillowTree]

Irrelevant to the discussion at hand. Bring it up somewhere appropriate.

coward

I see you've still yet to acknowledge the explanation you asked me to provide twice. Fuck off.

On whose orders?

you have explained nada!

 

[Kalam]

My friend told me that if there is a islamic battle and after winning that battle if muslims capture some women they are free to do whatever they want to do with them...

Relations are forbidden other than with believing women who are Muslims, Christians, or Jews.

And whoever among you cannot afford to marry free believing women, (let him marry) such of your believing maidens as your right hands possess. And Allah knows best your faith -- you are the one from the other. So marry them with the permission of their masters, and give them their dowries justly, they being caste, not fornicating, nor receiving paramours; then if they are guilty of adultery when they are taken in marriage, they shall suffer half the punishment for free married women. This is for him among you who fears falling into evil. And that you abstain is better for you. And Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. - 4:25​

Marriage is a necessary prerequisite. Furthermore, this applies only to female prisoners of war, whose consent must also be obtained as part of the ritual of nikah. The Prophet (SAWS) forbade the capture of new slaves; the applicability of this passage is limited to prisoners of war, which may always be taken during war-time. Confine your nonsense to relevant threads.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

Cue the denials that these people have no standing In Islam nor represent any part of Islamic thought.

 

[Kalam]

coward

I see you've still yet to acknowledge the explanation you asked me to provide twice. Fuck off.

On whose orders?

you have explained nada!

Do not attribute your lack of comprehension skills to my failure to explain anything.

Were you able to think for yourselves, no explanation would be necessary.

Say to the believing men that they lower their gaze and restrain their sexual passions. That is purer for them. Surely Allah is Aware of what they do. And say to the believing women that they lower their gaze and restrain their sexual passions and do not display their adornment except what appears thereof. And let them wear their head-coverings over their bosoms. - 24:30-31​

The punishment for rape is death. The victim is blameless.

When a woman went out in the time of the Prophet for prayer, a man attacked her and overpowered (raped) her. She shouted and he went off, and when a man came by, she said: That (man) did such and such to me. And when a company of the Emigrants came by, she said: That man did such and such to me. They went and seized the man whom they thought had had intercourse with her and brought him to her. She said: Yes, this is he. Then they brought him to the Apostle of Allah. When he (the Prophet) was about to pass sentence, the man who (actually) had assaulted her stood up and said: Apostle of Allah, I am the man who did it to her. He (the Prophet) said to her: Go away, for Allah has forgiven you. But he told the man some good words, and of the man who had had intercourse with her, he said: Stone him to death. He also said: He has repented to such an extent that if the people of Medina had repented similarly, it would have been accepted from them. - Sunan Abu Dawud, Prescribed Punishments, no. 4366​

Now, let's return to the discussion at hand.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

My friend told me that if there is a islamic battle and after winning that battle if muslims capture some women they are free to do whatever they want to do with them...

Relations are forbidden other than with believing women who are Muslims, Christians, or Jews.

And whoever among you cannot afford to marry free believing women, (let him marry) such of your believing maidens as your right hands possess. And Allah knows best your faith -- you are the one from the other. So marry them with the permission of their masters, and give them their dowries justly, they being caste, not fornicating, nor receiving paramours; then if they are guilty of adultery when they are taken in marriage, they shall suffer half the punishment for free married women. This is for him among you who fears falling into evil. And that you abstain is better for you. And Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. - 4:25​

Marriage is a necessary prerequisite. Furthermore, this applies only to female prisoners of war, whose consent must also be obtained as part of the ritual of nikah. The Prophet (SAWS) forbade the capture of new slaves; the applicability of this passage is limited to prisoners of war, which may always be taken during war-time. Confine your nonsense to relevant threads.

I think the verse you were looking for is this one


33:50. O Prophet (Muhammad SAW)! Verily, We have made lawful to you your wives, to whom you have paid their Mahr (bridal money given by the husband to his wife at the time of marriage), and those (captives or slaves) whom your right hand possesses - whom Allâh has given to you, and the daughters of your 'Amm (paternal uncles) and the daughters of your 'Ammah (paternal aunts) and the daughters of your Khâl (maternal uncles) and the daughters of your Khâlah (maternal aunts) who migrated (from Makkah) with you, and a believing woman if she offers herself to the Prophet, and the Prophet wishes to marry her; a privilege for you only, not for the (rest of) the believers. Indeed We know what We have enjoined upon them about their wives and those (captives or slaves) whom their right hands possess, - in order that there should be no difficulty on you. And Allâh is Ever Oft Forgiving, Most Merciful.

 

[Kalam]

Cue the denials that these people have no standing In Islam nor represent any part of Islamic thought.

Or, failing that, scripture proving that what you posted is incorrect. Sorry to disappoint. Now, fuck off.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

What is the punishment for taking a non muslim woman under the rubric of Jihad and having her as a sex slave?

Irrelevant to the discussion at hand. Bring it up somewhere appropriate.

Well I beg to differ.