Winningest General?

[mamooth]

Point is, he won. You fight with the army you have. An army that other Russian generals couldn't win with.

And Moscow wasn't his only win. Khalkhin Gol, Kursk, Leningrad, Stalingrad, the great Balkan outflank, Berlin, and more.

 

[whitehall]

Other Russian generals worked for Zhukov. Russia had it's ass kicked until winter set in. What kind of strategy does it take to surround an exhausted army stuck in the snow?

 

[longly]

In my opinion the best general of the last 100 years was North Vietnam's legendary General Giap

Vo Nguyen Giap - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Who could have guessed Giap was Muslim!

I want take this opportunity to ask you question and hope you will answer if you have relevant information: How common was fragging, the murder of officers my enlisted men to a void combat, during the later combat operations in Vietnam? I have heard it said it was fairly common and usually involved black enlisted men killing white lieutenants.

 

[whitehall]

Harry Truman paid the USMC back for their "uncommon valor" in the Pacific by attempting to reduce the Marine Corps into insignificance after WW2. Truman appointed an old WW1 veteran who was called back in WW2 and abandoned his Army on Corrigador and Battan to become the commander of US Troops in Korea. Dugout Doug never spent a single night in Korea and after the Inchon landing he apparently became clinically incoherent. Imagine Marine Generals Lewis "Chesty" Puller and Marine General P.O. Smith dealing with a crazy commander and and a timid president while they were confronting the entire freaking Chinese army. Because of MacArthur's insane lack of intelligence the entire American North Korea advance was stuck in the greatest ambush in history at the Chosin reservoir. Lucky for Truman Chesty Puller was able to pull off the impossible. It might be the first time in history that a front line commander considered himself independent of stupid political appointees and timid political decisions. Legend has it that Puller was informed that he was surrounded he said "good, now we can fire in any direction". Puller led the entire Military spearhead out of the trap and recovered Army dead and wounded.

 

[HenryBHough]

I want take this opportunity to ask you question and hope you will answer if you have relevant information: How common was fragging, the murder of officers my enlisted men to a void combat, during the later combat operations in Vietnam? I have heard it said it was fairly common and usually involved black enlisted men killing white lieutenants.

My information came from more than two but fewer than ten Vietnam war veterans, some of whom are still alive so I will name none of them. Some of the discussion involved several of them so I must discount things a bit as sort of one-upsmanship.

Applying those discounts it would appear that fragging was NOT common though it was far from unknown. In none of the discussions did I ever hear of black-on-white incidents. That may have been the case but, if it was, race was (to the best of my memory) never mentioned. None of the "claims" involved avoiding combat. The common thread was a commanding officer who was getting men killed or maimed unnecessarily. Those with blatant regard for the value of lives and/or setting out to make a name for themselves through pushing recklessly into situations that could have been handled other ways. A common theme was that if the "victim" weren't eliminated there'd be nobody left to tell the tale of his incompetence/arrogance.

That's not to say race was never a factor - only to that my hearing it was nothing anyone bragged about. And yes, at least one of those involved in the discussion was black. One who introduced my wife and I to ethnic foods at his church in what most would call a black ghetto and who, with his very white wife, I introduced to a Kosher deli in a Jewish section of an east coast city. A deli ironically named "Blackie's".

A mean combination, a meal of latkes, knishes and watermelon slices. We all laughed like hell and damn near got thrown out!

 

[william the wie]

Wellington never lost a battle and like Genghis Khan he preferred the defensive and the retreat.

 

[HenryBHough]

Wellington never lost a battle and like Genghis Khan he preferred the defensive and the retreat.

It is said that the statue of Wellington on the plinth in Trafalgar Square has the wrong arm missing. I've never checked that for accuracy - hey' it's the thought that counts. I'm too lazy to look it up but feel free. I'll check it out when I'm there again in a few weeks.

 

[whitehall]

There is a monument in Saratoga NY dedicated to the "greatest general in the Continental Army" but it's only a "boot" and not a real statue.

 

[JakeStarkey]

The victors write the history books. If a general is willing to sacrifice unlimited troops he can overwhelm any enemy force but at a terrible cost to his own side. I would argue that the smartest general in US history was Thomas "Stonewall" Jackson.

Jackson was brillant in the Valley and at Chancellorsville, while only mediocre at the 7 days.

Grant's campaign against Pemberton to drive the CSA out of the middle of Mississippi into the siege of Vicksburg was a masterpiece of maneuver operations as well as tactics.

 

[whitehall]

The victors write the history books. If a general is willing to sacrifice unlimited troops he can overwhelm any enemy force but at a terrible cost to his own side. I would argue that the smartest general in US history was Thomas "Stonewall" Jackson.

Jackson was brillant in the Valley and at Chancellorsville, while only mediocre at the 7 days.

Grant's campaign against Pemberton to drive the CSA out of the middle of Mississippi into the siege of Vicksburg was a masterpiece of maneuver operations as well as tactics.

Grant gave his generals the authority to punish or execute or destroy and confiscate the property of every (American) civilian who got in the way of the Union Army. The atrocities that the Union Army participated in would have had a Nazi general hanged but the victors write the history books.

 

[JakeStarkey]

The victors write the history books. If a general is willing to sacrifice unlimited troops he can overwhelm any enemy force but at a terrible cost to his own side. I would argue that the smartest general in US history was Thomas "Stonewall" Jackson.

Jackson was brillant in the Valley and at Chancellorsville, while only mediocre at the 7 days.

Grant's campaign against Pemberton to drive the CSA out of the middle of Mississippi into the siege of Vicksburg was a masterpiece of maneuver operations as well as tactics.

Grant gave his generals the authority to punish or execute or destroy and confiscate the property of every (American) civilian who got in the way of the Union Army. The atrocities that the Union Army participated in would have had a Nazi general hanged but the victors write the history books.

Victors write the history books. The Japanese Generals who served in the Philippines and were executed were the ones who beat McArthur's ass and he was the one who was the court-martial authority. The CSA and its supporters got off very lightly.

 

[whitehall]

Jackson was brillant in the Valley and at Chancellorsville, while only mediocre at the 7 days.

Grant's campaign against Pemberton to drive the CSA out of the middle of Mississippi into the siege of Vicksburg was a masterpiece of maneuver operations as well as tactics.

Grant gave his generals the authority to punish or execute or destroy and confiscate the property of every (American) civilian who got in the way of the Union Army. The atrocities that the Union Army participated in would have had a Nazi general hanged but the victors write the history books.

Victors write the history books. The Japanese Generals who served in the Philippines and were executed were the ones who beat McArthur's ass and he was the one who was the court-martial authority. The CSA and its supporters got off very lightly.

Actually the Japanese criminals got off pretty easy compared Nazi criminals because the crazy old WW1 veteran, dugout Doug MacArthur, was appointed king of Japan.

 

[JakeStarkey]

In overall events, yes, you are right.

 

[editec]

In my opinion the best general of the last 100 years was North Vietnam's legendary General Giap

Vo Nguyen Giap - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Who could have guessed Giap was Muslim!

I want take this opportunity to ask you question and hope you will answer if you have relevant information: How common was fragging, the murder of officers my enlisted men to a void combat, during the later combat operations in Vietnam? I have heard it said it was fairly common and usually involved black enlisted men killing white lieutenants.

According to this history, the Army documented hundreds of cases.

The Hard Truth About Fragging

As of July 1972, when the last American soldiers were leaving Vietnam, there had been 551 reported fragging incidents, killing 86 and injuring more than 700.

They do not mention any racial bias associated with it.

Of course in terms of race statistics, the percentage of Enlisted men that were Black would be much higher than the percentage of Officers who were Black.

I met people who claimed they knew somebody who fragged an officer who was a menace to his men.

Those claims were actually rather commonly heard in the military hospital I served in during 70-72.

As far as these guys were concerned?

Fragging was an act of self defence. A way of stopping idiot officers (and sometimes NCOs, but most often officers) from getting good warriors killed for nothing.

 

[regent]

Grant gave his generals the authority to punish or execute or destroy and confiscate the property of every (American) civilian who got in the way of the Union Army. The atrocities that the Union Army participated in would have had a Nazi general hanged but the victors write the history books.

Victors write the history books. The Japanese Generals who served in the Philippines and were executed were the ones who beat McArthur's ass and he was the one who was the court-martial authority. The CSA and its supporters got off very lightly.

Actually the Japanese criminals got off pretty easy compared Nazi criminals because the crazy old WW1 veteran, dugout Doug MacArthur, was appointed king of Japan.

The little I know of the execution of Yamashita for war crimes was itself a crime.

 

[longly]

If you would be willing to open the nominations to world wide applicants I would submit Flavius Aetius. Some would say Alexander The Great, but he was not a general he was king; he did not have to worry about limitations place on him by his superiors. Where General Aetius faced all kinds limitations. On the frontier he was able to manage the German tribes to aid him in his victories, but in it Italy the young Roman men of military age would cut off their thumbs to avoid facing Attila and his Huns. Alexander The Great would have just killed anyone missing a thumb.


Flavius Aetius, (born , Durostorum, Moesia Inferior [modern Silistra, Bulgaria]—died September 21, 454), Roman general and statesman who was the dominating influence over Valentinian III (emperor 425–455).
The son of a magister equitum (“master of the cavalry&#8221, Aetius in his youth spent some time as a hostage with the Visigothic leader Alaric, and later with the Huns, thus acquiring valuable knowledge of the leading tribal peoples of his day. From 423 to 425 he supported the usurper John in Italy. After successful battles in Gaul against the Visigoths and the Franks, Aetius was appointed in 430 magister utriusque militiae (“master of both services&#8221. On the death of his rival Bonifacius in 432, he quickly gained almost complete control over the young emperor Valentinian III. Aetius thereby became the dominant personality in the Western Empire. He was consul three times (432, 437, 446), a unique distinction for one who was not a member of the emperor’s family, and it was said that envoys from the provinces were no longer sent to the emperor, but to Aetius. He was given the title of patrician in 435, and for several years thereafter fought continuously and successfully in Gaul against rebels and hostile tribes. In 435–437 he mercilessly destroyed the Burgundian kingdom at Worms (an event remembered in the Nibelungenlied, a German epic poem written c. 1200) and in 437–439 checked the Visigoths at Toulouse. He returned to Italy in 440. In 451 he joined with the Visigoths in defeating Attila in the Battle of the Catalaunian Plains, but when Attila invaded Italy in the following year, Aetius could do little to oppose him. At the height of his power Aetius was murdered by Valentinian at the instigation of Petronius Maximus, the future emperor.

 

[whitehall]

Victors write the history books. The Japanese Generals who served in the Philippines and were executed were the ones who beat McArthur's ass and he was the one who was the court-martial authority. The CSA and its supporters got off very lightly.

Actually the Japanese criminals got off pretty easy compared Nazi criminals because the crazy old WW1 veteran, dugout Doug MacArthur, was appointed king of Japan.

The little I know of the execution of Yamashita for war crimes was itself a crime.

You could say with a straight face that General MacArthur was in the running for the loosingist (is that a word?) general in US history. He was criticized in WW1 for timid leadership and lack of aggressiveness in supporting a Marine assault. After the War Mac planned and led the successful government attack on unarmed US WW1 Veterans during the infamous "bonus march". FDR called the old soldier back after he retired as COS to be the front line commander in the area most likely to be attacked by the Japanese and Mac abandoned his entire Army (under orders) and was rescued four months after Pearl Harbor. The media loved him though.

 

[westwall]

Today, April 27th, is the birthday of the only general to force the unconditional surrender of three armies!

No other American general has done that.

Was it Dwight Eisenhower, Douglas MacArthur, George Washington or Winfield Scott?


None of 'em.


He was appointed Secretary of War.....turned around and gave the appointment back to the original holder of the office.



Who was it?

The "winningest" general is by far Genghis Kahn.

 

[westwall]

Point is, he won. You fight with the army you have. An army that other Russian generals couldn't win with.

And Moscow wasn't his only win. Khalkhin Gol, Kursk, Leningrad, Stalingrad, the great Balkan outflank, Berlin, and more.

The best Soviet generals were arguably Konev or Rokossosvsky.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Point is, he won. You fight with the army you have. An army that other Russian generals couldn't win with.

And Moscow wasn't his only win. Khalkhin Gol, Kursk, Leningrad, Stalingrad, the great Balkan outflank, Berlin, and more.

The best Soviet generals were arguably Konev or Rokossosvsky.

The best Soviet generals were December, January, and February.