Wind Turbine Burning Fossil Fuels?

[jon_berzerk]

According to your bad logic there, hydrocarbons somehow create nitrogen when burned. Can you tell us how that happens?


i will post the "basics" for you

however you really should learn to

be an independent thinker instead of a sheep




Introduction
Diesel engine, like other internal combustion engines, converts chemical energy contained in the fuel into mechanical power. Diesel fuel is a mixture of hydrocarbons which—during an ideal combustion process—would produce only carbon dioxide (CO2) and water vapor (H2O). Indeed, diesel exhaust gases are primarily composed of CO2, H2O and the unused portion of engine charge air. The volumetric concentrations of these gases in diesel exhaust are typically in the following ranges:

• CO2 - 2 ... 12%
• H2O - 2 ... 12%
• O2 - 3 ... 17%
• N2 - balance.

What Are Diesel Emissions

 

[jon_berzerk]

however you not correct --LOL

Yes, I am. You failed at common sense here.

you are assuming that 100 percent of the fuel is turned into CO2

No, just the carbon, which represents about 80% of the weight of a hydrocarbon fuel. However, oxygen at 16 is heavier than carbon at 12, so makes up for the 80% being less than 100%, and the mass of the CO2 is about triple the mass of the hydrocarbon that gets burned.

which is not the case

around 12 percent of the diesel fuel will be converted to co2

Combustion-engine exhaust gases
All figures are approximate % of total
Compound Petrol Diesel
nitrogen 71 67
carbon dioxide 14 12
water vapor 13 11
oxygen 10

According to your bad logic there, hydrocarbons somehow create nitrogen when burned. Can you tell us how that happens?

Your mistake is that tailpipe exhaust is a mix of unburned atmosphere and burned fuel, and therefore the gas fractions of exhaust gas do not represent the gas fractions produced by burning a fuel.

i just noticed this

are you really this stupid

if so you are dismissed

Your mistake is that tailpipe exhaust is a mix of unburned atmosphere and burned fuel, and therefore the gas fractions of exhaust gas do not represent the gas fractions produced by burning a fuel.


--LOL

what kind of nonsense is that

--LOL

exhaust represents everything coming out of the firing of the engine

--LOL

how the fuck does it get into the atmosphere if it does not come through the exhaust

--LOL


in the best situation a diesel is only 45 % efficient

 

[mamooth]

Your mistake is that tailpipe exhaust is a mix of unburned atmosphere and burned fuel, and therefore the gas fractions of exhaust gas do not represent the gas fractions produced by burning a fuel.

--LOL

what kind of nonsense is that

It's very basic logic, which anyone who isn't stupid could easily grasp.

Atmosphere goes into the engine.

Some of the atmospheric oxygen gets "burned" in the fuel combustion process. Some of it doesn't.

The products of combustion along with the "unburned" atmosphere go out the tailpipe.

--LOL

exhaust represents everything coming out of the firing of the engine

And according to your idiot theory, the firing of the engine somehow creates nitrogen. It's crazy thing to say, that combustion can make new elements, but you say it proudly.

Meanwhile, the normal people point out that exhaust is largely nitrogen because all the nitrogen in the atmosphere passes through the engine unchanged, except for a trace that gets converted to N2O.

And the normal people also point out that a hydrocarbon fuel, when burned, results in about 3 times its mass in CO2 being created.

This isn't rocket science. You're just totally wrong, and you need to stop bothering the grownups with your stupidity.

 

[jon_berzerk]

Your mistake is that tailpipe exhaust is a mix of unburned atmosphere and burned fuel, and therefore the gas fractions of exhaust gas do not represent the gas fractions produced by burning a fuel.

--LOL

what kind of nonsense is that

It's very basic logic, which anyone who isn't stupid could easily grasp.

Atmosphere goes into the engine.

Some of the atmospheric oxygen gets "burned" in the fuel combustion process. Some of it doesn't.

The products of combustion along with the "unburned" atmosphere go out the tailpipe.

--LOL

exhaust represents everything coming out of the firing of the engine

And according to your idiot theory, the firing of the engine somehow creates nitrogen. It's crazy thing to say, that combustion can make new elements, but you say it proudly.

Meanwhile, the normal people point out that exhaust is largely nitrogen because all the nitrogen in the atmosphere passes through the engine unchanged, except for a trace that gets converted to N2O.

And the normal people also point out that a hydrocarbon fuel, when burned, results in about 3 times its mass in CO2 being created.

This isn't rocket science. You're just totally wrong, and you need to stop bothering the grownups with your stupidity.

that combustion can make new elements, but you say it proudly.

see i have never said any of that

however it does since Nitrogen does not like to be alone

and wants to bond

but that is beyond the point jackass


however it still remains

that nitrogen is the biggest product that comes out of the exhaust

and no matter how you rant and rave at best

the diesel engine is 45 percent efficient



And according to your idiot theory, the firing of the engine somehow creates nitrogen


you are the only one saying creates

it is not my theory idiot it is fact

it is the one of the actual products coming out of the exhaust


once again you fail to see the proof

it has been posted several times now


CO2 released

12 percent not 80 percent as you falsely claim

What Are Diesel Emissions

Diesel engine, like other internal combustion engines, converts chemical energy contained in the fuel into mechanical power. Diesel fuel is a mixture of hydrocarbons which—during an ideal combustion process—would produce only carbon dioxide (CO2) and water vapor (H2O). Indeed, diesel exhaust gases are primarily composed of CO2, H2O and the unused portion of engine charge air. The volumetric concentrations of these gases in diesel exhaust are typically in the following ranges:

• 
  
  
  • CO2 - 2 ... 12%
  • H2O - 2 ... 12%
  • O2 - 3 ... 17%
  • N2 - balance.

The concentrations depend on the engine load, with the content of CO2 and H2O increasing and that of O2 decreasing with increasing engine load. None of these principal diesel emissions (with the exception of CO2 for its greenhouse gas properties) have adverse health or environmental effects.

Diesel emissions include also pollutants that can have adverse health and/or environmental effects. Most of these pollutants originate from various non-ideal processes during combustion, such as incomplete combustion of fuel, reactions between mixture components under high temperature and pressure, combustion of engine lubricating oil and oil additives as well as combustion of non-hydrocarbon components of diesel fuel, such as sulfur compounds and fuel additives. Common pollutants include unburned hydrocarbons (HC), carbon monoxide (CO), nitrogen oxides (NOx) or particulate matter (PM). Total concentration of pollutants in diesel exhaust gases typically amounts to some tenths of one percent—this is schematically illustrated in Figure 1. Much lower, “near-zero” levels of pollutants are emitted from modern diesel engines equipped with emission aftertreatment devices such as NOx reduction catalysts and particulate filters.

What Are Diesel Emissions

 

[mamooth]

it is the one of the actual products coming out of the exhaust

once again you fail to see the proof

The proof of what?

You've never stated what you're trying to prove. You just list the components of diesel exhaust, and yell that it "proves" something.

it has been posted several times now

CO2 released

The percentage of CO2 released from a tailpipe is not at all related to the fact that burning a hydrocarbon creates about 3 times that mass in CO2. You keep posting an idiot red herring over and over.

12 percent not 80 percent as you falsely claim

And as I never claimed 80% of what comes out of tailpipe is CO2, why did you just tell such a stupid lie?

 

[jon_berzerk]

it is the one of the actual products coming out of the exhaust

once again you fail to see the proof

The proof of what?

You've never stated what you're trying to prove. You just list the components of diesel exhaust, and yell that it "proves" something.

it has been posted several times now

CO2 released

The percentage of CO2 released from a tailpipe is not at all related to the fact that burning a hydrocarbon creates about 3 times that mass in CO2. You keep posting an idiot red herring over and over.

12 percent not 80 percent as you falsely claim

And as I never claimed 80% of what comes out of tailpipe is CO2, why did you just tell such a stupid lie?

The proof of what?

the proof that that a diesel engine performs anywhere near 100 percent


You just list the components of diesel exhaust, and yell that it "proves" something.

it has already been posted several times that what comes out of the tailpipe

contains 12 percent C02 not 80 percent as you claim

plus it "proves" what comes out the combustion

And as I never claimed 80% of what comes out of tailpipe is CO2, why did you just tell such a stupid lie?


oh im not lying you went on a long ramble of the percentages of Carbon to hydrogen

as if all the carbon was used which it is not

so you agree that only 12 percent co2 is released into the atmosphere

 

[Crick]

The problem here is that you (Jon) weren't able to follow Mamooth's description of the reaction products of hydrocarbon combustion. Move on. This isn't going to make up for your faux pas with the CO2 mass. Don't worry about it. At least you were reading the post.

 

[jon_berzerk]

The problem here is that you (Jon) weren't able to follow Mamooth's description of the reaction products of hydrocarbon combustion. Move on. This isn't going to make up for your faux pas with the CO2 mass. Don't worry about it. At least you were reading the post.

he problem here is that you (Jon) weren't able to follow Mamooth's description of the reaction products of hydrocarbon combustion

yes that is was a ramble

the fact remains that

only 12 percent of what leaves the chamber is CO2

not 3 times the amount of the total weight of the fuel to begin with

 

[Crick]

When fuel is burned, it combines with atmospheric oxygen and does indeed produce three times its weight in CO2. Look it up yourself.

 

[jon_berzerk]

When fuel is burned, it combines with atmospheric oxygen and does indeed produce three times its weight in CO2. Look it up yourself.

sorry only 12 percent of what comes out the tailpipe is co2

which is not three time the weight of the fuel

 

[Crick]

I don't care if it's 1% of what comes out the tailpipe. If I burn a pound of gasoline, I will get roughly three pounds of CO2.

 

[Old Rocks]

Your mistake is that tailpipe exhaust is a mix of unburned atmosphere and burned fuel, and therefore the gas fractions of exhaust gas do not represent the gas fractions produced by burning a fuel.

--LOL

what kind of nonsense is that

It's very basic logic, which anyone who isn't stupid could easily grasp.

Atmosphere goes into the engine.

Some of the atmospheric oxygen gets "burned" in the fuel combustion process. Some of it doesn't.

The products of combustion along with the "unburned" atmosphere go out the tailpipe.

--LOL

exhaust represents everything coming out of the firing of the engine

And according to your idiot theory, the firing of the engine somehow creates nitrogen. It's crazy thing to say, that combustion can make new elements, but you say it proudly.

Meanwhile, the normal people point out that exhaust is largely nitrogen because all the nitrogen in the atmosphere passes through the engine unchanged, except for a trace that gets converted to N2O.

And the normal people also point out that a hydrocarbon fuel, when burned, results in about 3 times its mass in CO2 being created.

This isn't rocket science. You're just totally wrong, and you need to stop bothering the grownups with your stupidity.

that combustion can make new elements, but you say it proudly.

see i have never said any of that

however it does since Nitrogen does not like to be alone

and wants to bond

but that is beyond the point jackass


however it still remains

that nitrogen is the biggest product that comes out of the exhaust

and no matter how you rant and rave at best

the diesel engine is 45 percent efficient



And according to your idiot theory, the firing of the engine somehow creates nitrogen


you are the only one saying creates

it is not my theory idiot it is fact

it is the one of the actual products coming out of the exhaust


once again you fail to see the proof

it has been posted several times now


CO2 released

12 percent not 80 percent as you falsely claim

What Are Diesel Emissions

Diesel engine, like other internal combustion engines, converts chemical energy contained in the fuel into mechanical power. Diesel fuel is a mixture of hydrocarbons which—during an ideal combustion process—would produce only carbon dioxide (CO2) and water vapor (H2O). Indeed, diesel exhaust gases are primarily composed of CO2, H2O and the unused portion of engine charge air. The volumetric concentrations of these gases in diesel exhaust are typically in the following ranges:

• 
  
  
  • CO2 - 2 ... 12%
  • H2O - 2 ... 12%
  • O2 - 3 ... 17%
  • N2 - balance.

The concentrations depend on the engine load, with the content of CO2 and H2O increasing and that of O2 decreasing with increasing engine load. None of these principal diesel emissions (with the exception of CO2 for its greenhouse gas properties) have adverse health or environmental effects.

Diesel emissions include also pollutants that can have adverse health and/or environmental effects. Most of these pollutants originate from various non-ideal processes during combustion, such as incomplete combustion of fuel, reactions between mixture components under high temperature and pressure, combustion of engine lubricating oil and oil additives as well as combustion of non-hydrocarbon components of diesel fuel, such as sulfur compounds and fuel additives. Common pollutants include unburned hydrocarbons (HC), carbon monoxide (CO), nitrogen oxides (NOx) or particulate matter (PM). Total concentration of pollutants in diesel exhaust gases typically amounts to some tenths of one percent—this is schematically illustrated in Figure 1. Much lower, “near-zero” levels of pollutants are emitted from modern diesel engines equipped with emission aftertreatment devices such as NOx reduction catalysts and particulate filters.

What Are Diesel Emissions

Jesus fucking Christ, you are beyond stupid. No, while the new diesels are individually cleaner than the old diesels, the accumulative emissions are still to high. And Nitrogen, as in the atmosphere, is simple a neutral rider in the firing of ICE engines. It takes no part in the combustion.

So, you get about 3 times the weight of the fuel out the tailpipe in the form of CO2.

 

[jon_berzerk]

Your mistake is that tailpipe exhaust is a mix of unburned atmosphere and burned fuel, and therefore the gas fractions of exhaust gas do not represent the gas fractions produced by burning a fuel.

--LOL

what kind of nonsense is that

It's very basic logic, which anyone who isn't stupid could easily grasp.

Atmosphere goes into the engine.

Some of the atmospheric oxygen gets "burned" in the fuel combustion process. Some of it doesn't.

The products of combustion along with the "unburned" atmosphere go out the tailpipe.

--LOL

exhaust represents everything coming out of the firing of the engine

And according to your idiot theory, the firing of the engine somehow creates nitrogen. It's crazy thing to say, that combustion can make new elements, but you say it proudly.

Meanwhile, the normal people point out that exhaust is largely nitrogen because all the nitrogen in the atmosphere passes through the engine unchanged, except for a trace that gets converted to N2O.

And the normal people also point out that a hydrocarbon fuel, when burned, results in about 3 times its mass in CO2 being created.

This isn't rocket science. You're just totally wrong, and you need to stop bothering the grownups with your stupidity.

that combustion can make new elements, but you say it proudly.

see i have never said any of that

however it does since Nitrogen does not like to be alone

and wants to bond

but that is beyond the point jackass


however it still remains

that nitrogen is the biggest product that comes out of the exhaust

and no matter how you rant and rave at best

the diesel engine is 45 percent efficient



And according to your idiot theory, the firing of the engine somehow creates nitrogen


you are the only one saying creates

it is not my theory idiot it is fact

it is the one of the actual products coming out of the exhaust


once again you fail to see the proof

it has been posted several times now


CO2 released

12 percent not 80 percent as you falsely claim

What Are Diesel Emissions

Diesel engine, like other internal combustion engines, converts chemical energy contained in the fuel into mechanical power. Diesel fuel is a mixture of hydrocarbons which—during an ideal combustion process—would produce only carbon dioxide (CO2) and water vapor (H2O). Indeed, diesel exhaust gases are primarily composed of CO2, H2O and the unused portion of engine charge air. The volumetric concentrations of these gases in diesel exhaust are typically in the following ranges:

• 
  
  
  • CO2 - 2 ... 12%
  • H2O - 2 ... 12%
  • O2 - 3 ... 17%
  • N2 - balance.

The concentrations depend on the engine load, with the content of CO2 and H2O increasing and that of O2 decreasing with increasing engine load. None of these principal diesel emissions (with the exception of CO2 for its greenhouse gas properties) have adverse health or environmental effects.

Diesel emissions include also pollutants that can have adverse health and/or environmental effects. Most of these pollutants originate from various non-ideal processes during combustion, such as incomplete combustion of fuel, reactions between mixture components under high temperature and pressure, combustion of engine lubricating oil and oil additives as well as combustion of non-hydrocarbon components of diesel fuel, such as sulfur compounds and fuel additives. Common pollutants include unburned hydrocarbons (HC), carbon monoxide (CO), nitrogen oxides (NOx) or particulate matter (PM). Total concentration of pollutants in diesel exhaust gases typically amounts to some tenths of one percent—this is schematically illustrated in Figure 1. Much lower, “near-zero” levels of pollutants are emitted from modern diesel engines equipped with emission aftertreatment devices such as NOx reduction catalysts and particulate filters.

What Are Diesel Emissions

Jesus fucking Christ, you are beyond stupid. No, while the new diesels are individually cleaner than the old diesels, the accumulative emissions are still to high. And Nitrogen, as in the atmosphere, is simple a neutral rider in the firing of ICE engines. It takes no part in the combustion.

So, you get about 3 times the weight of the fuel out the tailpipe in the form of CO2.

once again gasoline is not pure octane and diesels even less

 

[Crick]

Again, if I burn a pound of gasoline, I will produce approximately 2.72 lbs of CO2. The rest of this argument you're making is completely irrelevant.

 

[jon_berzerk]

too many variables to make your claim with any accuracy

the same problem that occurs with the bogus warming models

--LOL

 

[Skull Pilot]

Hell even your favorite Wall Street mogul Warren Buffet says windmills are a bad investment

http://www.usnews.com/opinion/blogs...buffet-admits-wind-energy-is-a-bad-investment

Despite being famous for touting the idea that the rich don’t pay their fair share of taxes, investor Warren Buffet seems to be perfectly fine with receiving tax breaks for making investments in Big Wind. "I will do anything that is basically covered by the law to reduce Berkshire's tax rate," Buffet told an audience in Omaha, Nebraska recently. "For example, on wind energy, we get a tax credit if we build a lot of wind farms. That's the only reason to build them. They don't make sense without the tax credit."