Will America Turn to Free Market Capitalism within 10-20 years?

[Wedn]

Will American Turn to Free Market Capitalism within 10-20 years?

There are days when I have no hope. Like today. Are we bound forever to Corporatism, or maybe descending to Socialism? How can the Free Market be established here?

Wedn

 

[Wedn]

Doesn't anyone care that America is going down the drain?

No free market - no America?

 

[freedombecki]

Welcome to USMB, Wedn. Yes, I care. Our board has a very dedicated grouping of people who fight those in high places who work against free enterprise. I hope you meet them. You will like them. They have answers. They're awesome.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

The American left is economically to the left of Communists

 

[Oddball]

Will American Turn to Free Market Capitalism within 10-20 years?

There are days when I have no hope. Like today. Are we bound forever to Corporatism, or maybe descending to Socialism? How can the Free Market be established here?

Wedn

It already is....The drug trade.

 

[Wedn]

Thanks everyone for the responses...
surely there are enough good Americans left to make the right decisions
to lead us to the free market -
Isn't that what this upcoming presidential election is all about?
Is there a candidate who can truly lead the country in the right direction?

 

[Wedn]

All Americans should ask themselves what they want out of life- is it liberty? or is it prosperity and comfort? or is it both? Individuals decide- but individuals must also decide what kind of society they prefer to live in- and what they will do to achieve it... but the free market - will this not provide everything- the opportunity for everything that is- each individual making his own way- looking out for his own personal interests- and then, when that is done on a society wide basis, truly everything else takes care of itself!

 

[PoliticalChic]

Will American Turn to Free Market Capitalism within 10-20 years?

There are days when I have no hope. Like today. Are we bound forever to Corporatism, or maybe descending to Socialism? How can the Free Market be established here?

Wedn

Welcome.

The answer to your question is inseparably wedded to the concept of equality. Even the 'educated' seem to accept the FDR appropriation of the economic system and, the use of government coercion to bring about some sort of Utopian equality.

Until the people realize that one can have equality, or prosperity, but not both, we cannot have a free market economy.

The election of 2012 will go far in suggesting the direction of America.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Will American Turn to Free Market Capitalism within 10-20 years?

I doubt it. Capitalism is hard to understand, while a well regulated welfare start is not.

 

[Wedn]

Thank you PoliticalChic and EdwardBaiamonte- If the American people move toward Socialism at this point- will this not speak volumes of what America has become? Perhaps the whole world is destined for this result... Europe has steadily moved that way... and the Chinese model has been called State Capitalism (a long way from free markets!) ... so maybe we are just moving toward one global system where all real liberty has been extinguished... and what then are people living for? just more and more stuff?

 

[dblack]

Will American Turn to Free Market Capitalism within 10-20 years?

There are days when I have no hope. Like today. Are we bound forever to Corporatism, or maybe descending to Socialism? How can the Free Market be established here?

Wedn

I'm not sure. Corporatism is definitely the trend. Our leaders want power and freedom doesn't fill the bill.

 

[Wedn]

dblack- thank you, and you are right about our leaders- they want power and wealth for themselves. But how did they get to be our leaders? Why do Americans keep re-electing the same people over and over who say the same things over and over and do nothing but make themselves rich and secure? Why do Americans not rise up to reclaim liberty and economic freedom? We still have the right to vote- has even our representative democracy- our republic- broken down completely?

 

[expat_panama]

...they want power and wealth for themselves. But how did they get to be our leaders?

Why do Americans keep re-electing the same people over and over who say the same things over and over and do nothing but make themselves rich and secure?

Why do Americans not rise up to reclaim liberty and economic freedom?

We still have the right to vote- has even our representative democracy- our republic- broken down completely?

You're absolutely right, it doesn't make any sense. We need to fix that right now and make sense out of it.

Let's start with the fact that people are good, in fact almost all of us are very good and the sicko's are a very small (although very noisy) minority. Next lets realize that our leaders are us, and are also mostly working hard to do what's right, and usually don't screw up. Finally, let's accept the fact that all this works darn well, that human kind is far better off than we were a century ago and even more so than a millennial ago. If you want, I can even show how we're much better off than just ten years ago.

Creation is good, we must be grateful.

 

[dblack]

dblack- thank you, and you are right about our leaders- they want power and wealth for themselves. But how did they get to be our leaders? Why do Americans keep re-electing the same people over and over who say the same things over and over and do nothing but make themselves rich and secure? Why do Americans not rise up to reclaim liberty and economic freedom? We still have the right to vote- has even our representative democracy- our republic- broken down completely?

In his book "The Rise and Decline of Nations: Economic Growth, Stagflation, and Social Rigidities", Mancur Olson proposes that what we're seeing is, outside of anomalous events, the natural progression of large democracies. His view (or rather, what I recall of it) was that older, industrialized democracies tend to become dominated by voting blocks organized around vested interests. In such a scenario the individual voter loses much of their influence and group identity becomes paramount. The government plays into this as a 'broker', essentially distributing power and resources among the various blocks.

This dynamic is, essentially, corporatism, though iirc Olson didn't use the term. It's extremely difficult to break out of, usually requiring massive upheaval to disintegrate the existing power blocks.

 

[expat_panama]

...the individual voter loses much of their influence and group identity becomes paramount. The government plays into this as a 'broker', essentially distributing power and resources among the various blocks...

Only it's not happening and I'll bet it's not what Wedn was talking about.

What's happening is that individuals like us are finding more power (not less) by banding together. Always been that way and it always will be. What I think Wedn is concerned with is the power of incorporated businesses. Personally, as a corp. CEO myself I got no problem with 'em...

 

[dblack]

...the individual voter loses much of their influence and group identity becomes paramount. The government plays into this as a 'broker', essentially distributing power and resources among the various blocks...

Only it's not happening and I'll bet it's not what Wedn was talking about.

What's happening is that individuals like us are finding more power (not less) by banding together. Always been that way and it always will be. What I think Wedn is concerned with is the power of incorporated businesses. Personally, as a corp. CEO myself I got no problem with 'em...

The fact that voting is essentially useless unless you 'band together' makes the point. It is happening. Highly organized blocks of political influence dominate and lobby government for special perks. Often these are large, incorporated businesses, or quasi-cartels thereof, but often they are not.

In any case, the problem isn't the groups themselves, but the fact that unscrupulous and unprincipled politicians cater to them. It creates government that is more about divvying up the spoils of taxation than about protecting individual rights.

 

[Wedn]

dblack -
"This dynamic is, essentially,corporatism, though Olson didn't use the term. It's extremely difficult to break out of, usually requiring massive upheaval to disintegrate the existing power blocks."

Yes dblack, a power structure is in place, and it is becoming ever more oppressive- in fact, one may say a system of competing power structures are now in place and these structures are working against ordinary citizens who strive for representative democracy- and the free market is today no longer to be found except in isolated pockets in local settings...

 

[Wedn]

expat_panama, I wish I could be a cheerful optimists and feel all is well with the world, the way I felt when I was very young and protected- but today I crumble under the weight of all that has gone wrong and may yet go further wrong... I cannot help but be pessimistic, though even in me- hope springs eternal... personally, I have had a blessed life, and I cannot complain for myself... but I feel the pain of so many others who suffer mightily the slings and arrows of life-
a level playing field - that's what I want
Wedn

 

[dblack]

Yes dblack, a power structure is in place, and it is becoming ever more oppressive- in fact, one may say a system of competing power structures are now in place and these structures are working against ordinary citizens who strive for representative democracy- and the free market is today no longer to be found except in isolated pockets in local settings...

Exactly. The health care reform efforts of the current administration are a perfect example. Even with a massive public mandate to address the problem, even with the obvious insanity that the average person in one of the richest countries in history can barely afford basic health care, our government indulged the corporatist urge and turned it all into a backroom deal - attending to the interests of the 'major players' in the health care industry first and foremost. The average voter is not a 'major player'.

 

[Wedn]

The question for me remains- how many Americans believe in Laissez-faire Capitalism these days... based on the behavior of the major political parties, is there evidence for such belief there? and do modern Americans (in the majority) even care, or think about it? Of course everyone wants to make money, and have a quality material life- but at what price?

Are there enough individualists left out there to make a real difference any more?
Wedn