Why the fight against Birth Control?

[Dr.Traveler]

In my view, when a woman uses birth control she is not engaging in the same behavior that got her pregnant, she is altering it by taking responsibility. And that means using birth control.

In my view, birth control is nothing but a way for a woman to escape that responsibility.

As soon as the cell in that zygote begins to divide, that is human life. When a woman starts using birth control, she is ending that life. That is the ultimate abandonment of responsibility. And in my view, an act of murder.

That is a pretty darn strong statement and one that places it all at the feet of the woman.

The pill acts, primarily to prevent pregnancy and secondarily to prevent implantation by keeping the womb hostile through the use of natural hormones. We're not incubators for potential life. Most fertalized eggs never even make it that far. Add to that the fact that many married couples also use birth control for family planning - is she escaping responsibility because she doesn't want go through ten or twelve pregnancies? Should a married couple be expected to practice abstinance?

What the fuck? Places at the "feet of women?" Fuck your brains out, spread your legs, get VD, get pregnant, what ever the fuck you want. Just do it on your own dime. What is possibly unclear about that?

Generally speaking, I agree I don't want to pay for other people's choices. The problem here is that I'm going to pay either way, either in the minimal cost of birth control or in the schooling or incarceration of the kid. One is very much cheaper than the other, so I'm going with the cheap one.

That's pure economics here. The only way to 100% avoid paying for unwanted pregnancies as a citizen is to either completely stop funding education via tax money, as well as jails, or to pay for birth control. And dollar for dollar, the birth control is far cheaper.

WHY are you going to pay either way? Isn't that because leftists have decreed that we're going to be forced to take part in other people's private healthcare decisions whether we want to or not?

I love how leftists impose their worldview onto people, and then use that as an excuse why their worldview needs to be imposed even further.

Because in the USA, we have free public education and we have a taxpayer burden for incarceration. Every child born gets a free public education here in the USA, meaning each child born is another burden on property tax. As a society, we've decided (correctly) that the value of an educated populace is worth that cost.

On the flip side though, teenage pregnancy can often lead to poverty level conditions for a young family (more so if the mother remains single). The number one indicator of incarceration is economic setting, meaning that a not insignificant number of those kids may be put in jail at some point. That means you as a tax payer will pay for that.

This isn't a tough argument. It isn't tough to draw a straight line from the birthing room at the hospital to your bottom line. You do pay a cost in every child born, and this is before we get into hospitalization (If they can't pay you will through higher health care costs and increased insurance) and entitlements (Social Security, etc).

 

[Dr.Traveler]

In my view, birth control is nothing but a way for a woman to escape that responsibility.

As soon as the cell in that zygote begins to divide, that is human life. When a woman starts using birth control, she is ending that life. That is the ultimate abandonment of responsibility. And in my view, an act of murder.

That is a pretty darn strong statement and one that places it all at the feet of the woman.

The pill acts, primarily to prevent pregnancy and secondarily to prevent implantation by keeping the womb hostile through the use of natural hormones. We're not incubators for potential life. Most fertalized eggs never even make it that far. Add to that the fact that many married couples also use birth control for family planning - is she escaping responsibility because she doesn't want go through ten or twelve pregnancies? Should a married couple be expected to practice abstinance?

What the fuck? Places at the "feet of women?" Fuck your brains out, spread your legs, get VD, get pregnant, what ever the fuck you want. Just do it on your own dime. What is possibly unclear about that?

Generally speaking, I agree I don't want to pay for other people's choices. The problem here is that I'm going to pay either way, either in the minimal cost of birth control or in the schooling or incarceration of the kid. One is very much cheaper than the other, so I'm going with the cheap one.

That's pure economics here. The only way to 100% avoid paying for unwanted pregnancies as a citizen is to either completely stop funding education via tax money, as well as jails, or to pay for birth control. And dollar for dollar, the birth control is far cheaper.

It's not an either or proposition though. You will still be paying for the bad choices anyway, in addition to birth control...

And why is it that we will be paying for other people's bad choices, exactly? Isn't it because the same people now wanting to force us to pay for birth control previously forced us to take financial responsibility for people's bad healthcare choices?

Healthcare is a whole other argument tangential to this, but there is a similar through line there. People showing up at the ER who can't pay end up costing you money either way too. Far better and cheaper to get that guy into the doctor on a regular basis before he pops up in an ER. There are a lot of studies that conclusively show preventative care is far far cheaper than ER care.

 

[Cecilie1200]

I love how leftists impose their worldview onto people, and then use that as an excuse why their worldview needs to be imposed even further.[/QUOTE]
Because in the USA, we have free public education and we have a taxpayer burden for incarceration. Every child born gets a free public education here in the USA, meaning each child born is another burden on property tax. As a society, we've decided (correctly) that the value of an educated populace is worth that cost.

On the flip side though, teenage pregnancy can often lead to poverty level conditions for a young family (more so if the mother remains single). The number one indicator of incarceration is economic setting, meaning that a not insignificant number of those kids may be put in jail at some point. That means you as a tax payer will pay for that.

This isn't a tough argument. It isn't tough to draw a straight line from the birthing room at the hospital to your bottom line. You do pay a cost in every child born, and this is before we get into hospitalization (If they can't pay you will through higher health care costs and increased insurance) and entitlements (Social Security, etc).[/QUOTE]

So basically, just what I said. The previous imposition of liberal wonderfulness is now supposed to serve as a reason for further impositions.

 

[Cecilie1200]

That is a pretty darn strong statement and one that places it all at the feet of the woman.

The pill acts, primarily to prevent pregnancy and secondarily to prevent implantation by keeping the womb hostile through the use of natural hormones. We're not incubators for potential life. Most fertalized eggs never even make it that far. Add to that the fact that many married couples also use birth control for family planning - is she escaping responsibility because she doesn't want go through ten or twelve pregnancies? Should a married couple be expected to practice abstinance?

What the fuck? Places at the "feet of women?" Fuck your brains out, spread your legs, get VD, get pregnant, what ever the fuck you want. Just do it on your own dime. What is possibly unclear about that?

Generally speaking, I agree I don't want to pay for other people's choices. The problem here is that I'm going to pay either way, either in the minimal cost of birth control or in the schooling or incarceration of the kid. One is very much cheaper than the other, so I'm going with the cheap one.

That's pure economics here. The only way to 100% avoid paying for unwanted pregnancies as a citizen is to either completely stop funding education via tax money, as well as jails, or to pay for birth control. And dollar for dollar, the birth control is far cheaper.

It's not an either or proposition though. You will still be paying for the bad choices anyway, in addition to birth control...

And why is it that we will be paying for other people's bad choices, exactly? Isn't it because the same people now wanting to force us to pay for birth control previously forced us to take financial responsibility for people's bad healthcare choices?

Healthcare is a whole other argument tangential to this, but there is a similar through line there. People showing up at the ER who can't pay end up costing you money either way too. Far better and cheaper to get that guy into the doctor on a regular basis before he pops up in an ER. There are a lot of studies that conclusively show preventative care is far far cheaper than ER care.

Yeah, so the left keeps asserting, although they don't do much of a job of PROVING their assumption that taxpayer-funded "preventative" care actually does much of anything to reduce taxpayer-funded ER costs.

 

[kaz]

In my view, birth control is nothing but a way for a woman to escape that responsibility.

As soon as the cell in that zygote begins to divide, that is human life. When a woman starts using birth control, she is ending that life. That is the ultimate abandonment of responsibility. And in my view, an act of murder.

That is a pretty darn strong statement and one that places it all at the feet of the woman.

The pill acts, primarily to prevent pregnancy and secondarily to prevent implantation by keeping the womb hostile through the use of natural hormones. We're not incubators for potential life. Most fertalized eggs never even make it that far. Add to that the fact that many married couples also use birth control for family planning - is she escaping responsibility because she doesn't want go through ten or twelve pregnancies? Should a married couple be expected to practice abstinance?

What the fuck? Places at the "feet of women?" Fuck your brains out, spread your legs, get VD, get pregnant, what ever the fuck you want. Just do it on your own dime. What is possibly unclear about that?

Generally speaking, I agree I don't want to pay for other people's choices. The problem here is that I'm going to pay either way, either in the minimal cost of birth control or in the schooling or incarceration of the kid. One is very much cheaper than the other, so I'm going with the cheap one.

That's pure economics here. The only way to 100% avoid paying for unwanted pregnancies as a citizen is to either completely stop funding education via tax money, as well as jails, or to pay for birth control. And dollar for dollar, the birth control is far cheaper.

WHY are you going to pay either way? Isn't that because leftists have decreed that we're going to be forced to take part in other people's private healthcare decisions whether we want to or not?

I love how leftists impose their worldview onto people, and then use that as an excuse why their worldview needs to be imposed even further.

Because in the USA, we have free public education and we have a taxpayer burden for incarceration. Every child born gets a free public education here in the USA, meaning each child born is another burden on property tax. As a society, we've decided (correctly) that the value of an educated populace is worth that cost.

On the flip side though, teenage pregnancy can often lead to poverty level conditions for a young family (more so if the mother remains single). The number one indicator of incarceration is economic setting, meaning that a not insignificant number of those kids may be put in jail at some point. That means you as a tax payer will pay for that.

This isn't a tough argument. It isn't tough to draw a straight line from the birthing room at the hospital to your bottom line. You do pay a cost in every child born, and this is before we get into hospitalization (If they can't pay you will through higher health care costs and increased insurance) and entitlements (Social Security, etc).

And people can't get birth control without government? Kids need vegetable, government should pay for that, parents might not want to spend their money on vegetables. We need to give them books too, parents may not buy them books. We want literate kids.

I know you're not a flaming liberal, Dr. But where does it stop? Why birth control? Why not everything that's good for us?

 

[Dr.Traveler]

That is a pretty darn strong statement and one that places it all at the feet of the woman.

The pill acts, primarily to prevent pregnancy and secondarily to prevent implantation by keeping the womb hostile through the use of natural hormones. We're not incubators for potential life. Most fertalized eggs never even make it that far. Add to that the fact that many married couples also use birth control for family planning - is she escaping responsibility because she doesn't want go through ten or twelve pregnancies? Should a married couple be expected to practice abstinance?

What the fuck? Places at the "feet of women?" Fuck your brains out, spread your legs, get VD, get pregnant, what ever the fuck you want. Just do it on your own dime. What is possibly unclear about that?

Generally speaking, I agree I don't want to pay for other people's choices. The problem here is that I'm going to pay either way, either in the minimal cost of birth control or in the schooling or incarceration of the kid. One is very much cheaper than the other, so I'm going with the cheap one.

That's pure economics here. The only way to 100% avoid paying for unwanted pregnancies as a citizen is to either completely stop funding education via tax money, as well as jails, or to pay for birth control. And dollar for dollar, the birth control is far cheaper.

WHY are you going to pay either way? Isn't that because leftists have decreed that we're going to be forced to take part in other people's private healthcare decisions whether we want to or not?

I love how leftists impose their worldview onto people, and then use that as an excuse why their worldview needs to be imposed even further.

Because in the USA, we have free public education and we have a taxpayer burden for incarceration. Every child born gets a free public education here in the USA, meaning each child born is another burden on property tax. As a society, we've decided (correctly) that the value of an educated populace is worth that cost.

On the flip side though, teenage pregnancy can often lead to poverty level conditions for a young family (more so if the mother remains single). The number one indicator of incarceration is economic setting, meaning that a not insignificant number of those kids may be put in jail at some point. That means you as a tax payer will pay for that.

This isn't a tough argument. It isn't tough to draw a straight line from the birthing room at the hospital to your bottom line. You do pay a cost in every child born, and this is before we get into hospitalization (If they can't pay you will through higher health care costs and increased insurance) and entitlements (Social Security, etc).

And people can't get birth control without government? Kids need vegetable, government should pay for that, parents might not want to spend their money on vegetables. We need to give them books too, parents may not buy them books. We want literate kids.

I know you're not a flaming liberal, Dr. But where does it stop? Why birth control? Why not everything that's good for us?

I'm about saving money and improving quality of life. If charity works for a region as a solution, I am all about that. I'd like to see as many government/charity partnerships as possible so that where the charities can help, they do so, where they can't, a government safety net is there.

You did ask where it ends? I'm convinced the big solution to all of this is we debate is one single thing: Universal Guaranteed Income. Take your tax money, cut everyone a check, and then cut off all of the other welfare programs period. End of story. Out of that check you have to buy your own healthcare, provide for your own retirement, feed yourself, and educate your kids. That paycheck is forfeited if you commit a crime to pay for your incarceration. It has to cover your photo id to vote. There's no minimum wage as you're getting an amount of money necessary to eek out a life. Not a great one, but you won't starve and you won't go homeless.

That one solution solves all of this. You want to have 50 kids then go be happy and do. Hope you're willing to find a job to supplement your income or you're willing to live dirt poor. You don't want to have kids? Great, you can live a little more comfortably. You want to work at McDonald's? Great, you won't be paid $15 dollars an hour, you'll be paid market. Want to be a teacher, doctor, lawyer? Great, you get paid market wages. You want to give all of that money to your local church? Fine. You don't? Great.

All the bureaucracy in Washington and in the State Capitals is gone. You'll need a military, an IRS, and a bursar to cut the checks. Past that any other program better have a damn good reason to exist because there are no other handouts going out of the Federal coffers.

 

[danielpalos]

In my view, when a woman uses birth control she is not engaging in the same behavior that got her pregnant, she is altering it by taking responsibility. And that means using birth control.

In my view, birth control is nothing but a way for a woman to escape that responsibility.

As soon as the cell in that zygote begins to divide, that is human life. When a woman starts using birth control, she is ending that life. That is the ultimate abandonment of responsibility. And in my view, an act of murder.

That is a pretty darn strong statement and one that places it all at the feet of the woman.

The pill acts, primarily to prevent pregnancy and secondarily to prevent implantation by keeping the womb hostile through the use of natural hormones. We're not incubators for potential life. Most fertalized eggs never even make it that far. Add to that the fact that many married couples also use birth control for family planning - is she escaping responsibility because she doesn't want go through ten or twelve pregnancies? Should a married couple be expected to practice abstinance?

What the fuck? Places at the "feet of women?" Fuck your brains out, spread your legs, get VD, get pregnant, what ever the fuck you want. Just do it on your own dime. What is possibly unclear about that?

can we ask the right to stop practicing the abomination of hypocrisy, simply for the sake of the greater glory of our immortal souls?

 

[danielpalos]

That is a pretty darn strong statement and one that places it all at the feet of the woman.

The pill acts, primarily to prevent pregnancy and secondarily to prevent implantation by keeping the womb hostile through the use of natural hormones. We're not incubators for potential life. Most fertalized eggs never even make it that far. Add to that the fact that many married couples also use birth control for family planning - is she escaping responsibility because she doesn't want go through ten or twelve pregnancies? Should a married couple be expected to practice abstinance?

What the fuck? Places at the "feet of women?" Fuck your brains out, spread your legs, get VD, get pregnant, what ever the fuck you want. Just do it on your own dime. What is possibly unclear about that?

Generally speaking, I agree I don't want to pay for other people's choices. The problem here is that I'm going to pay either way, either in the minimal cost of birth control or in the schooling or incarceration of the kid. One is very much cheaper than the other, so I'm going with the cheap one.

That's pure economics here. The only way to 100% avoid paying for unwanted pregnancies as a citizen is to either completely stop funding education via tax money, as well as jails, or to pay for birth control. And dollar for dollar, the birth control is far cheaper.

WHY are you going to pay either way? Isn't that because leftists have decreed that we're going to be forced to take part in other people's private healthcare decisions whether we want to or not?

I love how leftists impose their worldview onto people, and then use that as an excuse why their worldview needs to be imposed even further.

Because in the USA, we have free public education and we have a taxpayer burden for incarceration. Every child born gets a free public education here in the USA, meaning each child born is another burden on property tax. As a society, we've decided (correctly) that the value of an educated populace is worth that cost.

On the flip side though, teenage pregnancy can often lead to poverty level conditions for a young family (more so if the mother remains single). The number one indicator of incarceration is economic setting, meaning that a not insignificant number of those kids may be put in jail at some point. That means you as a tax payer will pay for that.

This isn't a tough argument. It isn't tough to draw a straight line from the birthing room at the hospital to your bottom line. You do pay a cost in every child born, and this is before we get into hospitalization (If they can't pay you will through higher health care costs and increased insurance) and entitlements (Social Security, etc).

And people can't get birth control without government? Kids need vegetable, government should pay for that, parents might not want to spend their money on vegetables. We need to give them books too, parents may not buy them books. We want literate kids.

I know you're not a flaming liberal, Dr. But where does it stop? Why birth control? Why not everything that's good for us?

Because it is the cognitive dissonance of the right wing that causes them to complain about Both, the cost of an ounce of prevention And the cost of a pound of cure.

 

[kaz]

In my view, when a woman uses birth control she is not engaging in the same behavior that got her pregnant, she is altering it by taking responsibility. And that means using birth control.

In my view, birth control is nothing but a way for a woman to escape that responsibility.

As soon as the cell in that zygote begins to divide, that is human life. When a woman starts using birth control, she is ending that life. That is the ultimate abandonment of responsibility. And in my view, an act of murder.

That is a pretty darn strong statement and one that places it all at the feet of the woman.

The pill acts, primarily to prevent pregnancy and secondarily to prevent implantation by keeping the womb hostile through the use of natural hormones. We're not incubators for potential life. Most fertalized eggs never even make it that far. Add to that the fact that many married couples also use birth control for family planning - is she escaping responsibility because she doesn't want go through ten or twelve pregnancies? Should a married couple be expected to practice abstinance?

What the fuck? Places at the "feet of women?" Fuck your brains out, spread your legs, get VD, get pregnant, what ever the fuck you want. Just do it on your own dime. What is possibly unclear about that?

can we ask the right to stop practicing the abomination of hypocrisy, simply for the sake of the greater glory of our immortal souls?

Cucumbers are crispy

 

[kaz]

What the fuck? Places at the "feet of women?" Fuck your brains out, spread your legs, get VD, get pregnant, what ever the fuck you want. Just do it on your own dime. What is possibly unclear about that?

Generally speaking, I agree I don't want to pay for other people's choices. The problem here is that I'm going to pay either way, either in the minimal cost of birth control or in the schooling or incarceration of the kid. One is very much cheaper than the other, so I'm going with the cheap one.

That's pure economics here. The only way to 100% avoid paying for unwanted pregnancies as a citizen is to either completely stop funding education via tax money, as well as jails, or to pay for birth control. And dollar for dollar, the birth control is far cheaper.

WHY are you going to pay either way? Isn't that because leftists have decreed that we're going to be forced to take part in other people's private healthcare decisions whether we want to or not?

I love how leftists impose their worldview onto people, and then use that as an excuse why their worldview needs to be imposed even further.

Because in the USA, we have free public education and we have a taxpayer burden for incarceration. Every child born gets a free public education here in the USA, meaning each child born is another burden on property tax. As a society, we've decided (correctly) that the value of an educated populace is worth that cost.

On the flip side though, teenage pregnancy can often lead to poverty level conditions for a young family (more so if the mother remains single). The number one indicator of incarceration is economic setting, meaning that a not insignificant number of those kids may be put in jail at some point. That means you as a tax payer will pay for that.

This isn't a tough argument. It isn't tough to draw a straight line from the birthing room at the hospital to your bottom line. You do pay a cost in every child born, and this is before we get into hospitalization (If they can't pay you will through higher health care costs and increased insurance) and entitlements (Social Security, etc).

And people can't get birth control without government? Kids need vegetable, government should pay for that, parents might not want to spend their money on vegetables. We need to give them books too, parents may not buy them books. We want literate kids.

I know you're not a flaming liberal, Dr. But where does it stop? Why birth control? Why not everything that's good for us?

Because it is the cognitive dissonance of the right wing that causes them to complain about Both, the cost of an ounce of prevention And the cost of a pound of cure.

I used to love cured ham, but now I'm a vegetarian. Well, except that I still eat fish and seafood

 

[Vastator]

What the fuck? Places at the "feet of women?" Fuck your brains out, spread your legs, get VD, get pregnant, what ever the fuck you want. Just do it on your own dime. What is possibly unclear about that?

Generally speaking, I agree I don't want to pay for other people's choices. The problem here is that I'm going to pay either way, either in the minimal cost of birth control or in the schooling or incarceration of the kid. One is very much cheaper than the other, so I'm going with the cheap one.

That's pure economics here. The only way to 100% avoid paying for unwanted pregnancies as a citizen is to either completely stop funding education via tax money, as well as jails, or to pay for birth control. And dollar for dollar, the birth control is far cheaper.

WHY are you going to pay either way? Isn't that because leftists have decreed that we're going to be forced to take part in other people's private healthcare decisions whether we want to or not?

I love how leftists impose their worldview onto people, and then use that as an excuse why their worldview needs to be imposed even further.

Because in the USA, we have free public education and we have a taxpayer burden for incarceration. Every child born gets a free public education here in the USA, meaning each child born is another burden on property tax. As a society, we've decided (correctly) that the value of an educated populace is worth that cost.

On the flip side though, teenage pregnancy can often lead to poverty level conditions for a young family (more so if the mother remains single). The number one indicator of incarceration is economic setting, meaning that a not insignificant number of those kids may be put in jail at some point. That means you as a tax payer will pay for that.

This isn't a tough argument. It isn't tough to draw a straight line from the birthing room at the hospital to your bottom line. You do pay a cost in every child born, and this is before we get into hospitalization (If they can't pay you will through higher health care costs and increased insurance) and entitlements (Social Security, etc).

And people can't get birth control without government? Kids need vegetable, government should pay for that, parents might not want to spend their money on vegetables. We need to give them books too, parents may not buy them books. We want literate kids.

I know you're not a flaming liberal, Dr. But where does it stop? Why birth control? Why not everything that's good for us?

Because it is the cognitive dissonance of the right wing that causes them to complain about Both, the cost of an ounce of prevention And the cost of a pound of cure.

Wrong! Prevention costs nothing.

 

[kaz]

Generally speaking, I agree I don't want to pay for other people's choices. The problem here is that I'm going to pay either way, either in the minimal cost of birth control or in the schooling or incarceration of the kid. One is very much cheaper than the other, so I'm going with the cheap one.

That's pure economics here. The only way to 100% avoid paying for unwanted pregnancies as a citizen is to either completely stop funding education via tax money, as well as jails, or to pay for birth control. And dollar for dollar, the birth control is far cheaper.

WHY are you going to pay either way? Isn't that because leftists have decreed that we're going to be forced to take part in other people's private healthcare decisions whether we want to or not?

I love how leftists impose their worldview onto people, and then use that as an excuse why their worldview needs to be imposed even further.

Because in the USA, we have free public education and we have a taxpayer burden for incarceration. Every child born gets a free public education here in the USA, meaning each child born is another burden on property tax. As a society, we've decided (correctly) that the value of an educated populace is worth that cost.

On the flip side though, teenage pregnancy can often lead to poverty level conditions for a young family (more so if the mother remains single). The number one indicator of incarceration is economic setting, meaning that a not insignificant number of those kids may be put in jail at some point. That means you as a tax payer will pay for that.

This isn't a tough argument. It isn't tough to draw a straight line from the birthing room at the hospital to your bottom line. You do pay a cost in every child born, and this is before we get into hospitalization (If they can't pay you will through higher health care costs and increased insurance) and entitlements (Social Security, etc).

And people can't get birth control without government? Kids need vegetable, government should pay for that, parents might not want to spend their money on vegetables. We need to give them books too, parents may not buy them books. We want literate kids.

I know you're not a flaming liberal, Dr. But where does it stop? Why birth control? Why not everything that's good for us?

Because it is the cognitive dissonance of the right wing that causes them to complain about Both, the cost of an ounce of prevention And the cost of a pound of cure.

Wrong! Prevention costs nothing.

He's just babbling, it's not even coherent