CDZ Why Not Use Payroll Tax Breaks to Lower Taxes AND Spur Job Growth?

[JimBowie1958]

It is no secret that lowering corporate taxes is resisted these days (or has very low enthusiasm) because people realize that more often than not those tax breaks are not in doing business overseas instead of here in the USA.

So why not use 30% of all salary costs of US citizen workers as an unlimited tax break, a direct deduction from corporate profits for tax calculations and erase all other corporate tax deductions?

The corporations would move Heaven and Earth to get those 0% taxes and the hiring of American citizens would explode.

Why not?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

It is no secret that lowering corporate taxes is resisted these days (or has very low enthusiasm) because people realize that more often than not those tax breaks are not in doing business overseas instead of here in the USA.

So why not use 30% of all salary costs of US citizen workers as an unlimited tax break, a direct deduction from corporate profits for tax calculations and erase all other corporate tax deductions?

The corporations would move Heaven and Earth to get those 0% taxes and the hiring of American citizens would explode.

Why not?

So why not use 30% of all salary costs of US citizen workers as an unlimited tax break, a direct deduction from corporate profits for tax calculations

Salary is 100% deductible already.

 

[Sonny Clark]

It is no secret that lowering corporate taxes is resisted these days (or has very low enthusiasm) because people realize that more often than not those tax breaks are not in doing business overseas instead of here in the USA.

So why not use 30% of all salary costs of US citizen workers as an unlimited tax break, a direct deduction from corporate profits for tax calculations and erase all other corporate tax deductions?

The corporations would move Heaven and Earth to get those 0% taxes and the hiring of American citizens would explode.

Why not?

Just curious, did you put a lot of thought behind that? .... FYI --- The corporate tax structure is NOT what's hurting our economy, job growth, hiring, or anything connected to incentives for corporations to act ethically, morally, nor with intent to stimulate economic growth and stability. Corporations OWN our government. They spend untold multi-$millions Lobbying Congress, influencing laws and policies, and in some sense, determine those that get elected to office. Corporations have, and have had, the upper-hand in the direction of this nation, and it's economy.

Look at defense contactors such as Halliburton. Look at the financials, pharmaceuticals, auto makers, Wall Street, big oil, and others. Basically, they all make their own rules. If this were not true, then why do they continue to spend untold multi-$Millions influencing Washington politics, legislation, policies, and elections? It's a game, nothing more. Corporations are NOT going to suddenly hire workers they don't need just to get around taxation. Believe me, if corporations needed more employees, they would hire more employees. If any business needed more employees, they would hire employees.

Regardless of what the tax structure is, employers are not going to hire people to sit in their break rooms all day. Employers hire in order to satisfy the needs of their customers, and for R&D, period. Businesses are not going to hire just to be hiring. Think about it.

 

[JimBowie1958]

It is no secret that lowering corporate taxes is resisted these days (or has very low enthusiasm) because people realize that more often than not those tax breaks are not in doing business overseas instead of here in the USA.

So why not use 30% of all salary costs of US citizen workers as an unlimited tax break, a direct deduction from corporate profits for tax calculations and erase all other corporate tax deductions?

The corporations would move Heaven and Earth to get those 0% taxes and the hiring of American citizens would explode.

Why not?

So why not use 30% of all salary costs of US citizen workers as an unlimited tax break, a direct deduction from corporate profits for tax calculations

Salary is 100% deductible already.

I am talking about the taxes on PROFITS, so yes, of course they are already defacto deductions from taxes. roflmao

The suggestion is for 30% of US citizen wage costs to be a direct tax deduction on corporate taxable profits, which is different.

To draw you a picture, suppose we have a $100 million corporate gross revenue, and $40 million in US wages, and $45 million in all other costs, for a profit of $15 million.

Allowing 30% deductions from this corporations taxable profits would put them at a $12 million tax reduction and paying taxes on only $3 million in profits.

That help? But the exact numbers are not what is the main point, but making USA labor a specific and the only tax deduction to spur the employment of US workers would end unemployment in record time as the corporations do what they do best; maximizing profits but in this case in a way that helps everyone in the USA.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Just curious, did you put a lot of thought behind that? ....

Did you put any thought into that silly question?

FYI --- The corporate tax structure is NOT what's hurting our economy, job growth, hiring, or anything connected to incentives for corporations to act ethically, morally, nor with intent to stimulate economic growth and stability.

Yes, it is. The 1984 Tax reform removed any tax incentives to hire American workers and made off shoring a profitable choice over expanding here in the US and hiring locally.

Corporations OWN our government. They spend untold multi-$millions Lobbying Congress, influencing laws and policies, and in some sense, determine those that get elected to office. Corporations have, and have had, the upper-hand in the direction of this nation, and it's economy.

So lets fix it then instead of taking a fatalistic whiney attitude that accomplishes nothing.

Corporations are NOT going to suddenly hire workers they don't need just to get around taxation. Believe me, if corporations needed more employees, they would hire more employees. If any business needed more employees, they would hire employees.
Regardless of what the tax structure is, employers are not going to hire people to sit in their break rooms all day.

That is not true. IF corporations could make more profit by hiring Americans instead of Chinese, Indians, Mexicans, etc, then they would. The cost of living in the US is much higher and so some balancing factors would be required.

And your implication that Americans would just sit in a break room all day is nothing less than the most disgusting bigotry.

Employers hire in order to satisfy the needs of their customers, and for R&D, period. Businesses are not going to hire just to be hiring. Think about it.

They hire those that they hire based on the PROFITABILITY of the hire, so giving them a tax break based on who they hire could re-energize our economy. Think about it.

 

[Sonny Clark]

Just curious, did you put a lot of thought behind that? ....

Did you put any thought into that silly question?

FYI --- The corporate tax structure is NOT what's hurting our economy, job growth, hiring, or anything connected to incentives for corporations to act ethically, morally, nor with intent to stimulate economic growth and stability.

Yes, it is. The 1984 Tax reform removed any tax incentives to hire American workers and made off shoring a profitable choice over expanding here in the US and hiring locally.

Corporations OWN our government. They spend untold multi-$millions Lobbying Congress, influencing laws and policies, and in some sense, determine those that get elected to office. Corporations have, and have had, the upper-hand in the direction of this nation, and it's economy.

So lets fix it then instead of taking a fatalistic whiney attitude that accomplishes nothing.

Corporations are NOT going to suddenly hire workers they don't need just to get around taxation. Believe me, if corporations needed more employees, they would hire more employees. If any business needed more employees, they would hire employees.
Regardless of what the tax structure is, employers are not going to hire people to sit in their break rooms all day.

That is not true. IF corporations could make more profit by hiring Americans instead of Chinese, Indians, Mexicans, etc, then they would. The cost of living in the US is much higher and so some balancing factors would be required.

And your implication that Americans would just sit in a break room all day is nothing less than the most disgusting bigotry.

Employers hire in order to satisfy the needs of their customers, and for R&D, period. Businesses are not going to hire just to be hiring. Think about it.

They hire those that they hire based on the PROFITABILITY of the hire, so giving them a tax break based on who they hire could re-energize our economy. Think about it.

Obviously we disagree. .. Oh, I've thought about it for many years now. Thanks.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Just curious, did you put a lot of thought behind that? ....

Did you put any thought into that silly question?

FYI --- The corporate tax structure is NOT what's hurting our economy, job growth, hiring, or anything connected to incentives for corporations to act ethically, morally, nor with intent to stimulate economic growth and stability.

Yes, it is. The 1984 Tax reform removed any tax incentives to hire American workers and made off shoring a profitable choice over expanding here in the US and hiring locally.

Corporations OWN our government. They spend untold multi-$millions Lobbying Congress, influencing laws and policies, and in some sense, determine those that get elected to office. Corporations have, and have had, the upper-hand in the direction of this nation, and it's economy.

So lets fix it then instead of taking a fatalistic whiney attitude that accomplishes nothing.

Corporations are NOT going to suddenly hire workers they don't need just to get around taxation. Believe me, if corporations needed more employees, they would hire more employees. If any business needed more employees, they would hire employees.
Regardless of what the tax structure is, employers are not going to hire people to sit in their break rooms all day.

That is not true. IF corporations could make more profit by hiring Americans instead of Chinese, Indians, Mexicans, etc, then they would. The cost of living in the US is much higher and so some balancing factors would be required.

And your implication that Americans would just sit in a break room all day is nothing less than the most disgusting bigotry.

Employers hire in order to satisfy the needs of their customers, and for R&D, period. Businesses are not going to hire just to be hiring. Think about it.

They hire those that they hire based on the PROFITABILITY of the hire, so giving them a tax break based on who they hire could re-energize our economy. Think about it.

Obviously we disagree. .. Oh, I've thought about it for many years now. Thanks.

So if we reduce the cost of American labor by 30% across the board, you don't think that will boost American employment?

roflmao

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Just curious, did you put a lot of thought behind that? ....

Did you put any thought into that silly question?

FYI --- The corporate tax structure is NOT what's hurting our economy, job growth, hiring, or anything connected to incentives for corporations to act ethically, morally, nor with intent to stimulate economic growth and stability.

Yes, it is. The 1984 Tax reform removed any tax incentives to hire American workers and made off shoring a profitable choice over expanding here in the US and hiring locally.

Corporations OWN our government. They spend untold multi-$millions Lobbying Congress, influencing laws and policies, and in some sense, determine those that get elected to office. Corporations have, and have had, the upper-hand in the direction of this nation, and it's economy.

So lets fix it then instead of taking a fatalistic whiney attitude that accomplishes nothing.

Corporations are NOT going to suddenly hire workers they don't need just to get around taxation. Believe me, if corporations needed more employees, they would hire more employees. If any business needed more employees, they would hire employees.
Regardless of what the tax structure is, employers are not going to hire people to sit in their break rooms all day.

That is not true. IF corporations could make more profit by hiring Americans instead of Chinese, Indians, Mexicans, etc, then they would. The cost of living in the US is much higher and so some balancing factors would be required.

And your implication that Americans would just sit in a break room all day is nothing less than the most disgusting bigotry.

Employers hire in order to satisfy the needs of their customers, and for R&D, period. Businesses are not going to hire just to be hiring. Think about it.

They hire those that they hire based on the PROFITABILITY of the hire, so giving them a tax break based on who they hire could re-energize our economy. Think about it.

Obviously we disagree. .. Oh, I've thought about it for many years now. Thanks.

So if we reduce the cost of American labor by 30% across the board, you don't think that will boost American employment?

roflmao

But your plan doesn't reduce the cost of labor by 30%.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Just curious, did you put a lot of thought behind that? ....

Did you put any thought into that silly question?

FYI --- The corporate tax structure is NOT what's hurting our economy, job growth, hiring, or anything connected to incentives for corporations to act ethically, morally, nor with intent to stimulate economic growth and stability.

Yes, it is. The 1984 Tax reform removed any tax incentives to hire American workers and made off shoring a profitable choice over expanding here in the US and hiring locally.

Corporations OWN our government. They spend untold multi-$millions Lobbying Congress, influencing laws and policies, and in some sense, determine those that get elected to office. Corporations have, and have had, the upper-hand in the direction of this nation, and it's economy.

So lets fix it then instead of taking a fatalistic whiney attitude that accomplishes nothing.

Corporations are NOT going to suddenly hire workers they don't need just to get around taxation. Believe me, if corporations needed more employees, they would hire more employees. If any business needed more employees, they would hire employees.
Regardless of what the tax structure is, employers are not going to hire people to sit in their break rooms all day.

That is not true. IF corporations could make more profit by hiring Americans instead of Chinese, Indians, Mexicans, etc, then they would. The cost of living in the US is much higher and so some balancing factors would be required.

And your implication that Americans would just sit in a break room all day is nothing less than the most disgusting bigotry.

Employers hire in order to satisfy the needs of their customers, and for R&D, period. Businesses are not going to hire just to be hiring. Think about it.

They hire those that they hire based on the PROFITABILITY of the hire, so giving them a tax break based on who they hire could re-energize our economy. Think about it.

Obviously we disagree. .. Oh, I've thought about it for many years now. Thanks.

So if we reduce the cost of American labor by 30% across the board, you don't think that will boost American employment?

roflmao

But your plan doesn't reduce the cost of labor by 30%.

I wasn't referring to my plan I gave example numbers for, but to the simple idea that reducing the costs of American labor for corporations would cause them to hire more Americans. Sonny said that no deductions would work because corporations don't consider it, but if we could reduce the costs of American labor in this way by 30% obviously they would hire more Americans. The example I gave above would reduce labor costs by about 10%, which is a good step in the right direction, but allowing it as a deduction from taxes owed would give the 30% I spoke of.

The point is these things are in the range of possibility, that corporate tax breaks should be based on Americans employed, not overseas tax shelters and accounting maneuvers.

 

[JimBowie1958]

So why not couple corporate tax breaks to the hiring of more American workers instead of foreign workers?

Other than some ephemeral objections already answered, there doesn't seem to be any good reason to not do this, and thus harness corporate greed to pulling the nations work force into Prosperity along with them.

 

[jwoodie]

A tax credit for salaries would, over time, result in less incentive for businesses to become more efficient and raise productivity. That being said, the current system of front loading payroll taxes and benefit costs on new employees is a significant disincentive to increased hiring. Due to individual earnings caps on social security and unemployment taxes, along with fixed per capita premiums for health insurance, it is much less expensive to pay one employee $100,000 per year than it is to pay two employees $50,000 each. If these costs were based on a company's total payroll instead of its number of employees, there would be a greater willingness to hire additional people.

 

[JimBowie1958]

A tax credit for salaries would, over time, result in less incentive for businesses to become more efficient and raise productivity. That being said, the current system of front loading payroll taxes and benefit costs on new employees is a significant disincentive to increased hiring. Due to individual earnings caps on social security and unemployment taxes, along with fixed per capita premiums for health insurance, it is much less expensive to pay one employee $100,000 per year than it is to pay two employees $50,000 each. If these costs were based on a company's total payroll instead of its number of employees, there would be a greater willingness to hire additional people.

Good point, the credit would have to include ALL costs of hiring US citizens, from their matched Social Security to the insurance costs to their actual pay.

What do you think of letting them take as a credit their OSHA and EPA costs also?