Why Land of the Free is so conflicted on health care..

[midcan5]

Healthcare opposition in America is simply part of a culture of independence that rationalizes selfishness as a positive value. It is so paradoxical among conservatives who pretend to be religious that it astounds commonsense. But it grew out the Calvinistic and protestant movements of the 16th century and became embedded in the American psyche with the Puritans. I have no idea how you change it as it is pattern of thought and not a reasonable response to life as it is. Healthcare is a right of citizenship as are roads and equal protection under the law. Like so much progress it will come hard and slow and soon be part of a background that fades into the way it is.

"In the fallen world in which we live, injury and sickness are a fact of life; physical death on this earth will never be overcome. But scripture paints a clear picture that health was God’s intent from the beginning and will be the goal once again in the end. This means that on a personal, national, and global level the physical well-being of all God’s children is close to God’s heart -- and should be close to ours as well."

Sojourners : Faith in Action

Truth-telling and Responsibility in Health Care - Jim Wallis - God's Politics Blog

 

[DiamondDave]

I honestly am not so opposed to the idea of universal coverage.

I am extremely opposed to the idea of our government managing health insurance in the manner that it has managed Medicare and Social Security not to mention our tax dollars in general. This government is inept and corrupt.

I will fight tooth and nail against giving Congress control of my health insurance dollars, because I can only foresee those dollars ending up in the general fund and piss poor health coverage not to mention medical personnel being untrained and unqualified to do the job.

Immie

You're not opposed to universal college??? I would ONLY agree if those attending were minors.. once you are an adult, your decisions are yours and your personal education and well being is your own... not society's, not the government's, not mine, and not Joe McFuckernut in Boise Idaho

What does college have to do with this?

I typed coverage.

No, I am not opposed to the idea of universal health care especially if most of us are paying for it on our own through our tax dollars. I've never been opposed to helping the poor out through welfare either so I don't find that inconsistant with my previous stance.

What I am concerned about is how it is done and who controls the purse string. Who hires, trains and pays medical professionals and who sets the fee schedules... among other things such as how much it costs.

Immie

LOL.. maybe I have to have another cup of coffee before early posting

LOL

My bad

 

[DiamondDave]

Healthcare opposition in America is simply part of a culture of independence that rationalizes selfishness as a positive value. It is so paradoxical among conservatives who pretend to be religious that it astounds commonsense. But it grew out the Calvinistic and protestant movements of the 16th century and became embedded in the American psyche with the Puritans. I have no idea how you change it as it is pattern of thought and not a reasonable response to life as it is. Healthcare is a right of citizenship as are roads and equal protection under the law. Like so much progress it will come hard and slow and soon be part of a background that fades into the way it is.

"In the fallen world in which we live, injury and sickness are a fact of life; physical death on this earth will never be overcome. But scripture paints a clear picture that health was God’s intent from the beginning and will be the goal once again in the end. This means that on a personal, national, and global level the physical well-being of all God’s children is close to God’s heart -- and should be close to ours as well."

Sojourners : Faith in Action

Truth-telling and Responsibility in Health Care - Jim Wallis - God's Politics Blog

Yeah... so promoting charity over forced redistribution and forced support is 'selfish'??

Laughable

 

[Navy1960]

Healthcare opposition in America is simply part of a culture of independence that rationalizes selfishness as a positive value. It is so paradoxical among conservatives who pretend to be religious that it astounds commonsense. But it grew out the Calvinistic and protestant movements of the 16th century and became embedded in the American psyche with the Puritans. I have no idea how you change it as it is pattern of thought and not a reasonable response to life as it is. Healthcare is a right of citizenship as are roads and equal protection under the law. Like so much progress it will come hard and slow and soon be part of a background that fades into the way it is.

"In the fallen world in which we live, injury and sickness are a fact of life; physical death on this earth will never be overcome. But scripture paints a clear picture that health was God’s intent from the beginning and will be the goal once again in the end. This means that on a personal, national, and global level the physical well-being of all God’s children is close to God’s heart -- and should be close to ours as well."

Sojourners : Faith in Action

Truth-telling and Responsibility in Health Care - Jim Wallis - God's Politics Blog

While of course most Americans do not desire to see anyone suffer needlessly, many feel that individual freedoms to make choices for themselves in matters of healthcare are much more important than universal conformity. What most on the other side do not seem to understand is that people can have compassion for those who do not have healthcare congerage or access to quailty healthcare and yet at the same time cherish the freedom to choose what is best for their own lives . I sumbit that if those that want to see healthcare as a right in this nation as many on the left want it to be then the road in which they are going down is not the correct one. Make it a right then, seek a constitutional Amendment making it a right in this nation and all the arguments as to it being a right then become mute. That is the system of Govt. in which we live under, and have for over 200 years, the problem is not one of being selfish or wishing ill upon those without healthcare. What many who oppose the current legislation see is an attempt to take away that 200 year history in an attempt to remake it into an image they feel fits best. Some Americans feel as I do, that our nation has the ability to actually reform healthcare within the system we have built this nation on without taking away the very freedoms we have held dear for years. Frankly I find it interesting to say the least that the party that has defended choice all these years and that has been identified as the defenders of civil rights and freedoms would be so willing to take them away from others in order to satisfy a vision that is not reflective if this nation. Again, I have no issue with healthcare as a right if it were made one, nor do I have an issue people being able to buy Govt. healthcare. What I have an issue with is a Govt. that tells Americans that they MUST purchase healthcare in order to conform. That is being selfish.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

This is why we are conflicted.

Health care is not a god given right guaranteed under the constitution.

The government is trying to give us the right to healthcare yet our very constitution says that God is who gives us our rights and not the government.'

The government is overstepping its role and authority and people who understand the founding principles of this country and its constitution are fighting the denegration of those principles and the constitution.

 

[Cecilie1200]

where do we rank in the world vs per captia spent, not at the top ,not even fucking close, unless you are independently wealthy, then you can buy what ever service you want

I will never understand why it's such an outrageous shock to leftists that being rich is easier and more luxurious than being poor, but they are forever announcing it as though it's a giant, scandalous newsflash.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Are we conflicted about healthcare? Or are we conflicted about this unconstitutional bill?

When you get right down to it, I think the fundamental conflict on just about every issue is whether or not it's our job to try to achieve cosmic justice and make the universe "fair".

 

[Cecilie1200]

We are 37th on the list for industrialized nations.. That is inferiior..

No why are you a moron??

read post 17 dildo.....i have no problems with my big bad private ins......now why are you a moron?....

And yet you missed the issue...

I am glad your happy.. We are still 37th on the list for industrailized nations.. That isn't good..

But thanks for equating your love for your insurance with the rest of the nation... Talk to me when you get cancer or something.. We will see how you like it then when you are dropped..

Would it shock you to know that many of us have no desire whatsoever to have our healthcare rank high on any list that YOU would approve of? Are you at all surprised to know that, in fact, YOUR priorities and standards of measurement mean less than nothing to us? Moreover, that they represent everything we DON'T want in our healthcare?

If you were not aware of this previously, please take some time now to contemplate the ludicrousness of repeatedly trumpeting "37th!" at us as though that's going to elicit any response from us other than "Well, thank God!"