Why Deities Are Not In The Constitution

[Si modo]

It's not necessary (for me).

I don't believe in Santa Claus or The Easter Bunny, either.​

And, few give a shit that you don't. So, why do YOU care so much about others' beliefs?

Because TOO-many of them feel they've got some Divine Right to legislate, based on their beliefs!! (...Or, so they say!!)

Look at how-often conservatives have been hustled by anti-Gay/pro-Family-types....who've ended-up being NEITHER!!! Typically....they're the same folks who're all-the-time talkin' about what God's told them...to tell everyone-else!!

I've got a little too-much self-respect to allow other people tellin' me what's best, for me. Ultimately, I'VE gotta live with the outcomes of my decisions. I don't need someone (else), to blame, 'cause my Life isn't goin' the way I'd planned.​

Ohhh! You're just afraid of what MIGHT happen.

Got it.

Now, when or if there is any legislation based on beliefs (other than carbon credits, that is), you can scream bloody murder and I will be right there beside you.

Right now, you're just being a pussy Chicken Little.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Even in Kentucky, there are some things you just don't discuss: Like "Rand Paul" at a Kentucky Republican "Unity" rally!

Kentucky Republicans Show 'Unity' Behind Rand Paul - Yahoo! News

There are some things that actually do not exist, and other things that you actually wish: Did not exist!

Finally, in the Bill of Rights, the original Deists finally conceded that there could be no government support of religion, and no government denial of religion.

Again: There are some things that actually do not exist, and other things that you actually wish: Did not exist. Even the Republicans are slowly coming around to this understanding of America, in our world.

"Crow, James Crow: Shaken, Not Stirred!"
(It has long been a tenet of wise campaigning, in The Colonies, to keep the actual candidates out of sight, and out of mind!(?) Then we are reminded that these people actually have The Bomb!)

The Constitution does mention our Lord, but only once.

 

[G.T.]

The Wager is wrong.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

The whole point of the first amendment was to protect the free expression of religion and not to destroy as so many liberals keep attempting to do.

"Religions are all alike - founded upon fables and mythologies." - Thomas Jefferson​

​

There are four references to ‘Devine’ in Declaration of Independence… 1)in first paragraph ‘Laws of Nature and of Nature’s God,’ 2) next paragraph ‘endowed by their Creator,” 3) Supreme Judge of the world, and 4) ‘divine’ Providence, last paragraph.
This is important because our historic documents memorialize a government based on individuals born with inalienable rights, by, in various references, by the Devine, or Nature’s God, or their Creator, or the Supreme Judge, or divine Providence.


Who was the author of the Declaration of Independence?


BTW, have you noted the inscription on Thomas Jefferson's tombstone?
"Here was buried Thomas Jefferson, author of the Declaration of American Independence, of the Statute of Virginia for Religious Freedom, and father of the University of Virginia."
Jefferson designed the tombstone, and he wrote the inscription. One can infer that these were his proudest achievements.

Every single state in these United States mentions God in their respective preambles.

 

[Si modo]

The Wager is wrong.

Logically, it is, as far as any argument to the existence of a deity is concerned. But logic and belief don't often get along.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

And, few give a shit that you don't. So, why do YOU care so much about others' beliefs?

Because TOO-many of them feel they've got some Divine Right to legislate, based on their beliefs!! (...Or, so they say!!)

Look at how-often conservatives have been hustled by anti-Gay/pro-Family-types....who've ended-up being NEITHER!!! Typically....they're the same folks who're all-the-time talkin' about what God's told them...to tell everyone-else!!

I've got a little too-much self-respect to allow other people tellin' me what's best, for me. Ultimately, I'VE gotta live with the outcomes of my decisions. I don't need someone (else), to blame, 'cause my Life isn't goin' the way I'd planned.​

Ohhh! You're just afraid of what MIGHT happen.

Nope!!

If things go well, for me, I take the credit.

If things go poorly, I'll learn from my mistake(s).

You wanna turn-your-Life-over to someone/something you can't see? Knock-yourself-out....and, keep your fingers crossed. After all....no matter what the outcome (at The End), you'll never have the opportunity to say "I TOLD you so!"....and, everyone-else will be too-busy living to care.​

 

[G.T.]

The Wager is wrong.

Logically, it is, as far as any argument to the existence of a deity is concerned. But logic and belief don't often get along.

That, and its premise that you've got "nothing to lose" is bunk also. It's akin to saying there's no commandments. Of course when you worship you've something to lose: experiences.

 

[mascale]

The more exclusively Catholic, Latin, A.D. is a specific reference to the Year Of Our Lord Jesus Christ.

Anno Domini is not in the Constitution, but "Year Of Our Lord," common throughout all kinds of calendars, is in the Consititution: With the important part missing. Hare Krishna probably has a different concept of Lord Vishnu, for example, but probably can use the commoin calendar, now more recently evolving into the "Common Era," C. E. usage.

In the similar manner, the Protestants seem to have evolved the concept away from the original, Catholic Anno Domini.

Any Deist would have easily subscribed to "Common Era" type of usage and meaning of the concept--as opposed to the Catholic concept.

Hispancs, even, can probably understand this: Who are famously regarded for having delivered the poison blankets to the indigenous, California tribes, so very long ago. In that context, what Arizona calls "illegal aliens," would actually be said, Catholic, religious, Hispanics engaged in pennance: For their sins. There are lots of such traditions, in fact, in Mexico itself.

Actually, the Arizona immigration law does itself so-state, in fact, even as the famous border pilgrimage continues!

Deities are not in the Constitution, or even in the statute in Arizona!

Anyone can see that there is proof!

"Crow, James Crow: Shaken, Not Stirred!"
"Great Entrepreneurial Spirt of Reagan Tractory--of loads, and loads, and loads of federal largesse, however: Is in Great Half-Wit Father's democracy in Washington, D. C., even now!)

 

[Si modo]

The Wager is wrong.

Logically, it is, as far as any argument to the existence of a deity is concerned. But logic and belief don't often get along.

That, and its premise that you've got "nothing to lose" is bunk also. It's akin to saying there's no commandments. Of course when you worship you've something to lose: experiences.

Some possible experiences don't interest me. But, that's what makes horse races.

 

[rdean]

I think the Iraqi constitution is a good example of what would happen if the right wing were allowed to rewrite our constitution. Even though they say, "We can't tell the Iraqi's how to govern THEIR country", that's what they did when they invaded Iraq. Removed the government they didn't like and replaced it with what they thought was a "godly and religious" government. Only, it wasn't their god.

From the Iraqi Constitution, instead of:

Article 2:
First: Islam is the official religion of the State and it is a fundamental source of legislation:
A. No law that contradicts the established provisions of Islam may be established.

For us, it would read:

Article 2:
First: Christianity is the official religion of the State and the Bible, the word of God, is a fundamental source of legislation:
A. No law that contradicts the established provisions of God's Word, the Bible, may be established.

and instead of:

Second: This Constitution guarantees the Islamic identity of the majority of the Iraqi people

it would read:

Second: This Constitution guarantees the white, Christian identity of the majority of the American people

That would happen only if we let our guard down and they got the chance.

 

[G.T.]

Logically, it is, as far as any argument to the existence of a deity is concerned. But logic and belief don't often get along.

That, and its premise that you've got "nothing to lose" is bunk also. It's akin to saying there's no commandments. Of course when you worship you've something to lose: experiences.

Some possible experiences don't interest me. But, that's what makes horse races.

Different strokes. Some wouldn't call Heaven "Everything to gain."

 

[PoliticalChic]

Hey....c'mon....we are talkin'-'bout Politicians!!​

Ya' wanna get more-current??​

Mr. Shame, why do you insist that it's necessary that you be convinced of the existence of a deity?

It's not necessary (for me).

I don't believe in Santa Claus or The Easter Bunny, either.

I think it's got something-to-do with Maturity.​

Clearly not with intelligence.

Actually, after viewing your posts, and your style, the explanation seems simple enough: you have a surfeit of time on your hands.

 

[rightwinger]

There are four references to ‘Devine’ in Declaration of Independence… 1)in first paragraph ‘Laws of Nature and of Nature’s God,’ 2) next paragraph ‘endowed by their Creator,” 3) Supreme Judge of the world, and 4) ‘divine’ Providence, last paragraph.
This is important because our historic documents memorialize a government based on individuals born with inalienable rights, by, in various references, by the Devine, or Nature’s God, or their Creator, or the Supreme Judge, or divine Providence.


Who was the author of the Declaration of Independence?


BTW, have you noted the inscription on Thomas Jefferson's tombstone?
"Here was buried Thomas Jefferson, author of the Declaration of American Independence, of the Statute of Virginia for Religious Freedom, and father of the University of Virginia."
Jefferson designed the tombstone, and he wrote the inscription. One can infer that these were his proudest achievements.

Maybe he was hedging his bets...just in case

Pascal's Wager (or Pascal's Gambit) is a suggestion posed by the French philosopher Blaise Pascal that even though the existence of God cannot be determined through reason, a person should wager as though God exists, because living life accordingly has everything to gain, and nothing to lose. It was set out in note 233 of his Pensées, a posthumously published collection of notes made by Pascal in his last years as he worked on a treatise on Christian apologetics.
Pascal's Wager - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Then again....some people live their lives that way simply because its the right thing to do

 

[G.T.]

Then again....some people live their lives that way simply because its the right thing to do

It's not all necessarily the right thing to do, if you don't believe to begin with.

Like, why would avoiding meat on "Fridays" in particular during lent or whatever be the "right thing to do" if Religion were fake? N'aw mean?

 

[Si modo]

That, and its premise that you've got "nothing to lose" is bunk also. It's akin to saying there's no commandments. Of course when you worship you've something to lose: experiences.

Some possible experiences don't interest me. But, that's what makes horse races.

Different strokes. Some wouldn't call Heaven "Everything to gain."

Right. The funny thing is, I really don't care who gets to Heaven and who doesn't. If there is one, I just care if I get to it.

I admit that the Religious Right annoys me. I DO keep an eye on them. As I said to Shaman, IF ever there is legislation based on some faith in some deity, I WILL scream bloody murder. Laws based on another's idea of what is good for me, piss me off. I value MY freedom.

That is exactly why the liberal Democrats piss me off. I, and ONLY I, am in the best position to decide what is best for me. Our Founders knew that, too.

Any sort of authoritarian bent in USA government is worthy of protest. Authoritarians exist on both the left and the right.

 

[Si modo]

Because TOO-many of them feel they've got some Divine Right to legislate, based on their beliefs!! (...Or, so they say!!)

Look at how-often conservatives have been hustled by anti-Gay/pro-Family-types....who've ended-up being NEITHER!!! Typically....they're the same folks who're all-the-time talkin' about what God's told them...to tell everyone-else!!

I've got a little too-much self-respect to allow other people tellin' me what's best, for me. Ultimately, I'VE gotta live with the outcomes of my decisions. I don't need someone (else), to blame, 'cause my Life isn't goin' the way I'd planned.​

Ohhh! You're just afraid of what MIGHT happen.

Nope!!

If things go well, for me, I take the credit.

If things go poorly, I'll learn from my mistake(s).

You wanna turn-your-Life-over to someone/something you can't see? Knock-yourself-out....and, keep your fingers crossed. After all....no matter what the outcome (at The End), you'll never have the opportunity to say "I TOLD you so!"....and, everyone-else will be too-busy living to care.​

Maybe something logical will actually collide with your brain cell after it ricochets enough within your cranium.

 

[G.T.]

Yea, I'm on the fence about a lot of things. I dunno.

Through lots of reading I'm finding that Human Civilization is a lot smarter than the naked eye sees, and so I just have this pet-theory that a secret body of leaders rules the world and in its current state ..... Wars in the Middle East aside,

looking at my life and how free I feel PERSONALLY, I think they're doing alright if they're there.

ETA: I don't actually believe this, of course, but it would be nice to fucking know either way.

 

[PoliticalChic]

It's not necessary (for me).

I don't believe in Santa Claus or The Easter Bunny, either.​

And, few give a shit that you don't. So, why do YOU care so much about others' beliefs?

Because TOO-many of them feel they've got some Divine Right to legislate, based on their beliefs!! (...Or, so they say!!)

Look at how-often conservatives have been hustled by anti-Gay/pro-Family-types....who've ended-up being NEITHER!!! Typically....they're the same folks who're all-the-time talkin' about what God's told them...to tell everyone-else!!

I've got a little too-much self-respect to allow other people tellin' me what's best, for me. Ultimately, I'VE gotta live with the outcomes of my decisions. I don't need someone (else), to blame, 'cause my Life isn't goin' the way I'd planned.​

It's so difficult to engage in this...what, argument? with one such as you, who reveals such invincible ignorance.

Shouldn't there be a time when one has the maturity that you claim, that scholarship and some sort of search for knowledge comes into play?

When one, such as yourself, knows less than nothing about the subject, then blithering idiocy seems to you to be...reasonable.

Case in point: "conservatives...who're all-the-time talkin' about what God's told them...to tell everyone-else!"

1. Conservatives, or, alternatively, classical liberals, believe that government should stay out of the god-business- and, in fact, most of people's business, period.

2. No conservative is forcing you to believe anything.

3. Folks like you who claim to be, what 'liberals'... don't know enough history to be aware of the fact that John Dewey co-opted the name liberal because the progressives/fascists had such a poor reputation.

4. The view to which you subscribe, stems from the French Revolution. ", the French Revolution turned politics into a religion, replacing Christianity with a secular faith in the Jacobin agenda. “The Jacobean atheism was integrated with rationalism, …and with the dismissal of Judeo-Christian scriptures.” Differences between Left & Right in their Psycho-Philosophic background

5. So, begin your search for knowledge with this kernel: rather than dismissing a belief in God, or "Santa Claus or The Easter Bunny," you have replaced it with a belief in the state.

Each of us will have to decide which is the more valid belief.

 

[mascale]

All Libertarian analysis and dialect(?) aside--if they're smart--the more light-skinned concept of the requirement, to cite the actual part of the Consititution that all legislation then comes from, is never going to be a date somewhere near the signature line of the document.

"Anno Domini" is not in the Constitution, number one, and even the Signatories, to the Constitution, are generally not cited as the Law of the Land, Lake, River, Ocean, Tunnel, Oil Spill, or anything else. There is no "Simon Says" clause, anywhere in the law books!

There is Kentucky, in the law books. There is no "Simon Says!"

There is, however: The "Tea Party" movement. which is so far not too concerned with the concept of judicial appointmets and nominees.

"Crow: James Crow: Shaken, Not Stirred!"
(What Sitting Bull said, is not the law! What Pocahontas said, is not the law! Be careful, even, about what Abraham Lincoln may have said! What part of the Constitutioin was he citiing, if any?!)

 

[rikules]

The whole point of the first amendment was to protect the free expression of religion and not to destroy as so many liberals keep attempting to do. Everytime someone professes some religious belief such as being christian they say "separation of church and state" and blah blah balh. The first sentence of that amendment says 'congress shall pass no law...' which means it is a limitation on the congress itself and not on individuals, politicians, or anyone else so the first amendment can't be used to silence by expression of my own religion or anyone elses.

Liberals haven't gotten that yet and seem to think they can just closet people who profess their belief in God.

"The whole point of the first amendment was to protect the free expression of religion and not to destroy as so many liberals keep attempting to do."


however
(i'm afraid I have bad news for you)

ALL citizens have a right to either believe in ANY god or NO GOD whatsoever

you can NOT force people to believe in YOUR religion
you can not DEMAND that they BOW to your religious beliefs

people who beleve in religion/god have every right to try and spread their beliefs

people who do NOT believe in religion have that VERY SAME RIGHT!

people who think religion is a "good thing" have the right to try and spread that message

people who believe that religion is not a good thing and that it is high time we stopped believing in primitive superstitious mumbo jumbo have the right to spread THAT message


YOU can defend religion all you want to (though I have no doubt that when it comes to all non-christian religions you are just as much an atheist as I am.......hmmmmm....makes me realize....
you....with your firm belief in ONLY the christian religion...are trying to DESTROY ALL NONchristian RELIGIONS!...
is ONLY the christian religion protected by the constitution?)

anyway
I digress

what was I saying...?

oh yes...

YOU can defend religion all you want to
and I can mock and ridicule it for the DANGEROUS nonsense that I truely believe it is.....





"Everytime someone professes some religious belief such as being christian they say "separation of church and state" and blah blah balh. "


Ya see...
this is where you and reality part company....

to say
"Everytime someone professes some religious belief such as being christian they say "separation of church and state" and blah blah balh."
is a lie....

MOST liberals are NOT atheists
MOST liberals profess a belief in god/religion/spirituality
and they do NOT try to DESTROY religion or stop anyone from expressing their religious beliefs

what they DO DO is work diligently to stop people like you from FORCING YOUR RELIGION BELIEFS on everyone else....

like schools... for example....

you want to teach creationism (and remove evolution), teach your religious perspective of deviants (homosexuals), teach the 10 commandments, teach the end times, teach the bible as the law of the land, teach YOUR primitive marriage and sexual beliefs....

so liberals
being much more sane and rational
merely work to stop YOU from using OUR SCHOOLS as christian evangelical indoctrination centers...

at which point
deranged people like you say
"Everytime someone professes some religious belief such as being christian they say "separation of church and state" and blah blah balh. "

you can express your lunacies all day long in the privacy of your home
on your own radio show
on your web blog
on your street corner

but you can NOT go into OUR SCHOOLS and try to brainwash OUR CHILDREN.






"The first sentence of that amendment says 'congress shall pass no law...' which means it is a limitation on the congress itself and not on individuals, politicians, or anyone else so the first amendment can't be used to silence by expression of my own religion or anyone elses. "


That's right
including the freedom of expression of NONbelievers!