Why Can't Everyone Pay the Same Tax Rate?

[FA_Q2]

That's the dodge I want posters to avoid.

If you cut taxes for the rich, you lose revenue. Therefore, whose taxes do you want to raise to make up that revenue? Your own?

It is not a dodge - it is EXACTLY what we need to do. I do not want anyone's taxes to raise. More to the point - this thread is about reforming the tax system to a flat rate, NOT about shifting the burden. I already stated my opinion about a flat tax and nowhere did I say we need to raise taxes for people. Revenue is not the problem with government shortages, it is the inability to control spending in ANY meaningful way that has created this mess we are in and THAT is where we need to concentrate for solving shortfalls.

On defense, which is the largest discretionary item on the budget?

That is one of the MANY places we need to begin cutting spending. I believe that we are FINALLY looking at that part now as they are gearing to close many of the bases that we have around the world that we really do not need. Unfortunately that is ONE piece of the grater problem and the cop out that all liberals seem to take as soon as you mention cutting spending. Sorry buddy, that will not work - we need to make cuts across the board and defense is certainly in that bucket.

 

[Charles_Main]

Why can't everyone pay the same tax rate?

Because the richest people in the country don't want to pay as high a tax rate as their secretaries.

What kind of crack are you on. The Rich pay the highest rate. The top 2% account for over half of all tax revenues.

Can you people ever stick to the facts?

 

[Charles_Main]

Ok, no dodge here, answer this.

If you think the rich are overtaxed, and we lower their taxes...

...whose taxes do you want to raise to make up the revenue shortfall?

Here's a thought - SPEND LESS!!!!!

That's the dodge I want posters to avoid.

If you cut taxes for the rich, you lose revenue. Therefore, whose taxes do you want to raise to make up that revenue? Your own?

What part of spend less do you not understand?

 

[boedicca]

Ok, no dodge here, answer this.

If you think the rich are overtaxed, and we lower their taxes...

...whose taxes do you want to raise to make up the revenue shortfall?

Here's a thought - SPEND LESS!!!!!

On defense, which is the largest discretionary item on the budget?

Here's where the outlays go, bub:

While we could save money on defense spending, it's not where most of the money is wasted.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Why can't everyone pay the same tax rate?

Because the richest people in the country don't want to pay as high a tax rate as their secretaries.

What kind of crack are you on. The Rich pay the highest rate. The top 2% account for over half of all tax revenues.

Can you people ever stick to the facts?

Whoops..

Richest 400 Earn More, Pay Lower Tax Rate - Forbes.com

I pay more than 17%. I bet you do too.

 

[boedicca]

Why can't everyone pay the same tax rate?

Because the richest people in the country don't want to pay as high a tax rate as their secretaries.

What kind of crack are you on. The Rich pay the highest rate. The top 2% account for over half of all tax revenues.

Can you people ever stick to the facts?

Whoops..

Richest 400 Earn More, Pay Lower Tax Rate - Forbes.com

I pay more than 17%. I bet you do too.

Big Whoop. There are over 7 million people in the top 5% who pay a ton of taxes.

Basing tax policy that affects millions of people due to Pea Green With Envy attitudes towards a fortunate few is lunacy.

The wealth those 400 hold is responsible for creating a lot of jobs.

 

[xotoxi]

Politicians make their careers by taking the golden eggs away from the more productive to pay off the less productive.

In order for someone to be "more productive", what do they need?

 

[theDoctorisIn]

What kind of crack are you on. The Rich pay the highest rate. The top 2% account for over half of all tax revenues.

Can you people ever stick to the facts?

Whoops..

Richest 400 Earn More, Pay Lower Tax Rate - Forbes.com

I pay more than 17%. I bet you do too.

Big Whoop. There are over 7 million people in the top 5% who pay a ton of taxes.

Basing tax policy that affects millions of people due to Pea Green With Envy attitudes towards a fortunate few is lunacy.

The wealth those 400 hold is responsible for creating a lot of jobs.

So that justifies them paying half the tax rate that their secretaries pay?

 

[boedicca]

Whoops..

Richest 400 Earn More, Pay Lower Tax Rate - Forbes.com

I pay more than 17%. I bet you do too.

Big Whoop. There are over 7 million people in the top 5% who pay a ton of taxes.

Basing tax policy that affects millions of people due to Pea Green With Envy attitudes towards a fortunate few is lunacy.

The wealth those 400 hold is responsible for creating a lot of jobs.

So that justifies them paying half the tax rate that their secretaries pay?

They each paid on average $45 million dollars of taxes. That's far more than their secretaries paid.

 

[FA_Q2]

So that justifies them paying half the tax rate that their secretaries pay?

No, and that is why we need A FLAT, TIERED TAX RATE. A simple system that requires each and every person to pay their fair share so that tax havens and 'working the system' can be eliminated and the rate set at the lowest possible point. Now the whole system is one MASSIVE convoluted mess.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Big Whoop. There are over 7 million people in the top 5% who pay a ton of taxes.

Basing tax policy that affects millions of people due to Pea Green With Envy attitudes towards a fortunate few is lunacy.

The wealth those 400 hold is responsible for creating a lot of jobs.

So that justifies them paying half the tax rate that their secretaries pay?

They paid on average $45 million dollars a piece in taxes. That's far more than their secretaries paid.

So I guess that means that you're all right with it.

Interesting. I though you guys were all about "fairness"

 

[boedicca]

No, capital gains should not be taxed at the same rate as income.

Long term investments fuel economic growth. The higher the tax rate, the less an investor is willing to take risks, which means less investment, less growth, and less job creation.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

So that justifies them paying half the tax rate that their secretaries pay?

No, and that is why we need A FLAT, TIERED TAX RATE. A simple system that requires each and every person to pay their fair share so that tax havens and 'working the system' can be eliminated and the rate set at the lowest possible point. Now the whole system is one MASSIVE convoluted mess.

I agree that the system should be revamped. I (as well as a majority of Economists) also believe in a progressive tax system, as opposed to the regressive system currently in place.

I also accept the fact that it's never going to change.

 

[The Federalist]

Anyone got a valid reason for this?

Because they can afford to pay more, as a successful capitalist they likely reduce their cost(see Cheap labor so they can sell goods or services using the cheapest labor they can find to increase their take. That reduces the income level of those they employ thus limiting the cash income for the necessities of life making paying the same tax rate as others an unfair burden.

 

[FA_Q2]

I also accept the fact that it's never going to change.

Never give up. Things are unlikely but not impossible (well, okay. They are impossible but I NEED that hope

No, capital gains should not be taxed at the same rate as income.

Long term investments fuel economic growth. The higher the tax rate, the less an investor is willing to take risks, which means less investment, less growth, and less job creation.

I disagree. Capital gains does drive the economic machine but investment is what is causing the imbalance of wealth in this nation and it is NOT healthy for 10 percent to have over 80 percent of the wealth. A flat tax rate REQUIRES that all items fall under it or you have the devastatingly complex and inefficient system that we have today. Investments will not cease or even slow if they were taxed as income. If there is money to be made in investing, taking a tax off the EARNINGS will not slow investment AT ALL. On the flipside, you should be able to take losses out of your income should you be making money in both endeavors. Fact is, ALL GAINS should be treated the same and ONLY at that point would you have a fair, simple and effective tax policy.

 

[Trajan]

Here you go.

And wealth is not income, bub.

In 2009, the top 5% reported 37% of the total AGI, and paid over 60% of the income taxes - that is hardly representative getting MORE from the government than they pay.

The Tax Foundation - Summary of Latest Federal Individual Income Tax Data

Ok, no dodge here, answer this.

If you think the rich are overtaxed, and we lower their taxes...

...whose taxes do you want to raise to make up the revenue shortfall?

frankly since its no secret that discretionary spending has risen over 25% in the last 2 years, we cut spending.

why should they be counting on anything? Its not their money no matter who they take it from. They keep raising the bar, spend more in deficit spending then bitch they don't take in enough to satisfy the new spending and money it takes to float the interest on debt. etc. .Right? I wish it were that easy, its not but thats part and parcel of the problem.


the expiration in jan. of the current tax brackets and dividends, cap gains, the gov. is telling us hey we are going to have a hole in the budget if we don't get it, well so what? If they are spending ahead of pop. growth and information etc. thats the problem, not transferring more money form the public to the gov. to spend. Where does it end?




IF the tax cuts don't expire they are no further back then they are now, it should be in stasis, they can freeze spending where it is right this minute. We continuing paying what we are paying presently, they are no losing a dime.

If you think the gov. can spend the money more efficiently than you or me or anyone else can hey, history is against you, we would not be having this discussion if it were so.....bubbles etc. not withstanding.

Let me ask you a question; what do they need that money for? the 700 billion whatever, can they justify an increase? What is it for, exactly? let them make their case.

 

[Trajan]

Ok, no dodge here, answer this.

If you think the rich are overtaxed, and we lower their taxes...

...whose taxes do you want to raise to make up the revenue shortfall?

Here's a thought - SPEND LESS!!!!!

On defense, which is the largest discretionary item on the budget?

for the forth time in as many weeks they have cut defense, a lot. Or is that all there is to cut or that you agree to cutting? ?

 

[Trajan]

and as a general question one which I have asked here in this forum 3 times and have not yet received an answer that i can find- define 'rich'.


200k? 250K a million, 5, 10? what?(oops, In fairness I think someone said half a mil)l....if I recall correctly, so what say you?

next q-

what % of that do you think is fair for them to have to pay as measured against the populace at large?

Who thinks its fair that 10 % of the populace pays over 80% of all taxes collected? Remember that close to 40% of the populace don't pay net taxes.

is that to low? to high, just right?

 

[boedicca]

and as a general question one which I have asked here in this forum 3 times and have not yet received an answer that i can find- define 'rich'.


200k? 250K a million, 5, 10? what?(oops, In fairness I think someone said half a mil)l....if I recall correctly, so what say you?

next q-

what % of that do you think is fair for them to have to pay as measured against the populace at large?

Who thinks its fair that 10 % of the populace pays over 80% of all taxes collected? Remember that close to 40% of the populace don't pay net taxes.

is that to low? to high, just right?

The income level at which the top 10% begins was $113K in 2009; for the top 25%, it was $66K. Do we really think that a family making around $100K is RICH?

 

[Dick Tuck]

Here's a thought - SPEND LESS!!!!!

On defense, which is the largest discretionary item on the budget?

Here's where the outlays go, bub:

While we could save money on defense spending, it's not where most of the money is wasted.

It's the largest discretionary item. That's what I stated.