Why aren't the anti-choice people against birth control pills.

[DiamondDave]

The birth control pill can cause an abortion after conception.

The only abortion it can cause is IF you keep taking it after embryonic implantation and THEN it would act as an 'abortion pill'... before implantation, it is not an abortion by definition...

Does life not begin at conception? You're telling me its not a human being until implantation? Since when? As soon as conception occurs, the unique collection of DNA that will determine a human beings genetic identity has already been formed.

Do you even know the difference between aborting something and preventing something??

As if your inane lyrics did not paint you as enough of an idiot

 

[DiamondDave]

So, if you are religious, and Catholic....birth control is equal to abortion.

Well.. I am not catholic... but I at least respect them for choosing even more on the side of life... rather than going more towards the side of murder with supporting the abortions of developing kids that are growing within the mother....

 

[SpidermanTuba]

And you are misinformed. Eggs are not "produced." Women are born with every egg they are every going to have already in their bodies.

If I produce a rabbit from a hat do you assume I just created a rabbit?

The pill simply stops them from being fertilized.

You are extremely misinformed.

So are you.
Birth Control Pill Causes Abortions -- Pro-Life America, Celebs expose abortion! Celebrities, Speakers, TV, Radio, Videos and Literature to help save moms and babies from the pain and suffering of abortion. Save sex for marriage and choose life, not

 

[SpidermanTuba]

The only abortion it can cause is IF you keep taking it after embryonic implantation and THEN it would act as an 'abortion pill'... before implantation, it is not an abortion by definition...

Does life not begin at conception? You're telling me its not a human being until implantation? Since when? As soon as conception occurs, the unique collection of DNA that will determine a human beings genetic identity has already been formed.

Do you even know the difference between aborting something and preventing something??

As if your inane lyrics did not paint you as enough of an idiot

Uhh, you didn't really answer my question. Does the life of a human being begin at conception or not? A simple yes or no would suffice. Thanks.

 

[sweetie]

...yes i'm a 'conservative' 'pro-lifer'..i believe in 'small government'



(but not so small the government can't have it's nose into womans' wombs!..and not so small it can't execute and jail people for terminating a pregnancy!..)

 

[SpidermanTuba]

The answer is quite simple here.



Those who are educated and in the middle class or higher have better access to birth control and are more likely to use it properly. Therefore, the educated and higher class are less likely to ever be in a situation where they might consider an abortion. So its OK to kill a human life with a birth control pill, because if it wasn't, a bunch of successful conservative white women would have to either stop getting pounded by their Constitutional Party nut husband, or sit at home and have kids all the time.

Those who are ignorant and poor are more likely to need the abortion, therefore, its wrong to kill a human life by abortion.

 

[Care4all]

Same dilema with discarding/terminating ones frozen fertilized eggs or embryos....

 

[DiamondDave]

Does life not begin at conception? You're telling me its not a human being until implantation? Since when? As soon as conception occurs, the unique collection of DNA that will determine a human beings genetic identity has already been formed.

Do you even know the difference between aborting something and preventing something??

As if your inane lyrics did not paint you as enough of an idiot

Uhh, you didn't really answer my question. Does the life of a human being begin at conception or not? A simple yes or no would suffice. Thanks.

Again... the development of the life does not take place until implantation... fertilized and unfertilized eggs pass thru the system regularly without resulting in a pregnancy.... with or without a BC pill... and as it was explained to you just a few posts up, the BC pill prevents pregnancy by mainly stopping ovulation... you seem to readily confuse normal BC pills and the controversial 'abortion' pill

Perhaps you should actually understand a bit more about how pregnancy and birth control pills work... tps has already been trying to educate you

 

[Dr.Traveler]

In the rare chance an egg is produced while a woman is on birth control, the birth control pill will often cause a fertilized egg - in other words - a HUMAN BEING - to fail to attach to the uterine wall. This results in an abortion.

Why is it OK to kill an embryo right after conception with a birth control pill, but not anything else?

Some are. There are groups that would love to roll back birthcontrol. Some of those advoactes pop here now and again.

 

[Si modo]

...SI dodo, you apparent glenn beck peckerhead..apparently you have a problem with some of my words/assertions..

...focus like a laser beam, dumbass, and critique my words/assertions..

(i suspect stoooooooopid fuck here will soon have a mitt romney lawn sign)

Really? I've never watched Glenn Beck. Tried to once, but couldn't sit through it. Wrong.

You are actually correct about my having problems with your words. They are moronic, thus garbage. There's your critique.

Now, I'm back to the actual topic again.

 

[Si modo]

But like I said THAT is RU486.

Now, I AGREE. That when the pill fails and they go to the RU486 to stop the pregnancy, THAT IS ABORTION.

But, for example, I'm pro-life and I would not use RU486.

The op is supplying a straw dog. Claiming those that are pro-life would use RU 486, when the truth is pro-lifers are against RU486 as am I.

There is a huge difference between preventing ovulation and killing a conceived embryo.

But he is trying to confuse the two things. I see no evidence from the op or anywhere in the thread that pro-lifers, like myself, are for or would use RU-486.

Birth control (in my own case) has failed twice. Their ages are now 20 and 12. Never regret having them either.

No TPS. Look at my link earlier. The Pill will prevent implantaion of the fertilized egg.

Yes, but as pointed out earlier it does so by the same mechanism that a woman already pregnant will not be able to get pregnant again if they have sex while pregnant.

It's the same hormones.

The only way to say this is hypocrisy is to say all women having sex during pregnancy are hypocrites.

I don't know what you're talking about, but look again: For those who missed my ealier link (from the package insert of Ortho-triclen (R)):

....
Combination oral contraceptives act by suppression of gonadotropins. Although the
primary mechanism of this action is inhibition of ovulation, other alterations include
changes in the cervical mucus (which increase the difficulty of sperm entry into the uterus)
and the endometrium (which reduce the likelihood of implantation).
....

[Emphasis added this time]

 

[Qball]

It's always funny when liberals figure out nuance in a conservative position. You'd think they would consider that maybe the nightmarish stereotype they once believed in never was true. But that never happens. Instead, they use it to call conservatives self-contradicting hypocrites for not having a one-track mind, ideologically speaking. Of course, that's the same mentality they once decried before they had their revelation, so really, conservatives can't win for losing.

 

[SpidermanTuba]

Do you even know the difference between aborting something and preventing something??

As if your inane lyrics did not paint you as enough of an idiot

Uhh, you didn't really answer my question. Does the life of a human being begin at conception or not? A simple yes or no would suffice. Thanks.

Again... the development of the life does not take place until implantation... fertilized and unfertilized eggs pass thru the system regularly without resulting in a pregnancy.... with or without a BC pill... and as it was explained to you just a few posts up, the BC pill prevents pregnancy by mainly stopping ovulation... you seem to readily confuse normal BC pills and the controversial 'abortion' pill

Perhaps you should actually understand a bit more about how pregnancy and birth control pills work... tps has already been trying to educate you

Uhh, you didn't really answer my question. Does the life of a human being begin at conception or not? A simple yes or no would suffice. Thanks.

 

[Si modo]

Do you even know the difference between aborting something and preventing something??

As if your inane lyrics did not paint you as enough of an idiot

Uhh, you didn't really answer my question. Does the life of a human being begin at conception or not? A simple yes or no would suffice. Thanks.

Again... the development of the life does not take place until implantation... fertilized and unfertilized eggs pass thru the system regularly without resulting in a pregnancy.... with or without a BC pill... and as it was explained to you just a few posts up, the BC pill prevents pregnancy by mainly stopping ovulation... you seem to readily confuse normal BC pills and the controversial 'abortion' pill

Perhaps you should actually understand a bit more about how pregnancy and birth control pills work... tps has already been trying to educate you

So, because the fertilized egg still needs to develop, it's OK to terminate its potential to develop?

 

[DiamondDave]

No TPS. Look at my link earlier. The Pill will prevent implantaion of the fertilized egg.

Yes, but as pointed out earlier it does so by the same mechanism that a woman already pregnant will not be able to get pregnant again if they have sex while pregnant.

It's the same hormones.

The only way to say this is hypocrisy is to say all women having sex during pregnancy are hypocrites.

I don't know what you're talking about, but look again: For those who missed my ealier link (from the package insert of Ortho-triclen (R)):

....
Combination oral contraceptives act by suppression of gonadotropins. Although the
primary mechanism of this action is inhibition of ovulation, other alterations include
changes in the cervical mucus (which increase the difficulty of sperm entry into the uterus)
and the endometrium (which reduce the likelihood of implantation).
....

[Emphasis added this time]

Go Ask Alice!: How do birth control pills work?

Again... you are focusing on a secondary 'safeguard' in the design of hormonal birth control... again... the main way a BC pill works if thru ovulation suppression

 

[SpidermanTuba]

Yes, but as pointed out earlier it does so by the same mechanism that a woman already pregnant will not be able to get pregnant again if they have sex while pregnant.

It's the same hormones.

The only way to say this is hypocrisy is to say all women having sex during pregnancy are hypocrites.

I don't know what you're talking about, but look again: For those who missed my ealier link (from the package insert of Ortho-triclen (R)):

....
Combination oral contraceptives act by suppression of gonadotropins. Although the
primary mechanism of this action is inhibition of ovulation, other alterations include
changes in the cervical mucus (which increase the difficulty of sperm entry into the uterus)
and the endometrium (which reduce the likelihood of implantation).
....

[Emphasis added this time]

Go Ask Alice!: How do birth control pills work?

Again... you are focusing on a secondary 'safeguard' in the design of hormonal birth control... again... the main way a BC pill works if thru ovulation suppression

So its OK to take a human life as long as its a last resort to getting what you want?

 

[DiamondDave]

Uhh, you didn't really answer my question. Does the life of a human being begin at conception or not? A simple yes or no would suffice. Thanks.

Again... the development of the life does not take place until implantation... fertilized and unfertilized eggs pass thru the system regularly without resulting in a pregnancy.... with or without a BC pill... and as it was explained to you just a few posts up, the BC pill prevents pregnancy by mainly stopping ovulation... you seem to readily confuse normal BC pills and the controversial 'abortion' pill

Perhaps you should actually understand a bit more about how pregnancy and birth control pills work... tps has already been trying to educate you

So, because the fertilized egg still needs to develop, it's OK to terminate its potential to develop?

Again... you act as if the BC pill is designed to let eggs fertilize and pass out of the system... when it has been shown to you all along that ovulation suppression is the main way a BC pill works

And again... development of a human embryo only happens with implantation... The medical definition of the start of pregnancy is at implantation

 

[teapartysamurai]

The birth control pill can cause an abortion after conception.

The only abortion it can cause is IF you keep taking it after embryonic implantation and THEN it would act as an 'abortion pill'... before implantation, it is not an abortion by definition...

Does life not begin at conception? You're telling me its not a human being until implantation? Since when? As soon as conception occurs, the unique collection of DNA that will determine a human beings genetic identity has already been formed.

Do you understand the difference between viable pregnancy and say eptopic pregnancy?

Not all fertilized eggs become properly implanted. Some of these will result in miscarriage. That's NATURAL.

Geesh! How can you tell when little boys are talking pregnancy? This dumbass stuff comes up.

 

[DiamondDave]

I don't know what you're talking about, but look again: For those who missed my ealier link (from the package insert of Ortho-triclen (R)):[Emphasis added this time]

Go Ask Alice!: How do birth control pills work?

Again... you are focusing on a secondary 'safeguard' in the design of hormonal birth control... again... the main way a BC pill works if thru ovulation suppression

So its OK to take a human life as long as its a last resort to getting what you want?

You are about as fucking obtuse as they come

Ovulation suppression... learn about it... pregnancy.. learn about it.... in your fervor to try and bash someone against the process of abortions, you have gone completely outside the realm of fact and common sense

 

[teapartysamurai]

So its OK to kill a human being so long as it has not attached to the uterine wall, is that what you are saying?

Or is a fertilized egg not a human being?

There is zero chance for development without uterine implantation... it is not being aborted from something unless it is attached to something... to terminate it has to be in the process of something... there is no process til the process starts, and the process starts with implantation into the womb... otherwise it is simply the passing of a fertilized egg out of the system, as happens pretty frequently in nature

Well, I suppose your thoughts on this are your thoughts on this....

This is what the Catholic church teaches on Birth control and it being abortion in some cases and morally wrong in all others....

I. CATHOLIC TEACHING ABOUT MARRIAGE AND THE REGULATION OF BIRTHS

WHAT DOES THE CATHOLIC CHURCH TEACH ABOUT THE RELATIONSHIP OF MARRIAGE?

Marriage is a permanent relationship created by God and entered into by
the free consent of man and woman. It is a relationship of love and
service, and it is a Christian sacrament.

"The intimate partnership of married life and love has been established by
the Creator and qualified by His laws. It is rooted in the conjugal
covenant of irrevocable personal consent.. .

"By that human act whereby spouses mutually bestow and accept each other,
a relationship arises which by divine will and in the eyes of society too
is a lasting one . . . A man and a woman, who by the marriage convenant of
conjugal love 'are no longer two, but one flesh' (Mt 19:6), render mutual
help and service to each other through an intimate union of their persons
and of their actions ... Christian spouses have a special sacrament by
which they are fortified and receive a kind of consecration in the duties
AND DIGNITY OF THEIR STATE" (GAUDIUM ET SPES, 48).[1]

WHAT DOES THE CHURCH SAY ABOUT METHODS OF BIRTH CONTROL?

"When there is a question of harmonizing conjugal love with the
responsible transmission of life, the moral aspect of any procedure does
not depend solely on sincere intentions or on an evaluation of motives. It
must be determined by objective standards. These, based on the nature of
the human person and his acts, preserve the full sense of mutual
self-giving and human procreation in the context of true love. Such a goal
cannot be achieved unless the virtue of conjugal chastity is sincerely
practiced. Relying on these principles, sons of the Church may not
undertake methods of regulating procreation which are found blameworthy by
the teaching authority of the Church in its unfolding of the divine law"
(Gaudium et Spes, 51).

Does the Church teach that the unnatural or artificial means of birth
control are immoral and blameworthy? Yes. In Humanae Vitae, the
first-named form of illicit or unnatural method of birth control is
abortion (n. 14).[3]

Then, "equally to be excluded, as the teaching authority of the Church has
frequently declared, is direct sterilization, whether perpetual or
temporary whether of the man or woman" (Humanae Vitae, 14). This condemns
tubal ligations, vasectomies, and the Pill.

"Similarly excluded is every action which, either in anticipation of the
conjugal act, or in its accomplishment, or in the development of its
natural consequences, proposes, whether as an end or as a means, to render
procreation impossible" (Humanae Vitae, 14). Such unnatural forms include
the Pill, the intrauterine device, foams, diaphragms, condoms, withdrawal,
mutual or solitary masturbation and sodomistic practices.

Are some forms of unnatural birth control worse than others? Yes. Those
forms that act after conception has occurred to prevent the continuation
of the pregnancy participate in the additional evil of abortion. "From the
moment of its conception life must be guarded with greatest care, while
abortion and infanticide are unspeakable crimes" (Gaudium et Spes, 51).

Surgical abortion is the most obvious but not the only form. The
intrauterine device (IUD) acts primarily as an early abortion agent by
preventing implantation of the week-old human life.

The birth control Pill makes the inner lining of the uterus very hostile
to implantation. It is not known how often the Pill acts in this way, but
it cannot be denied that the Pill may be acting as an early abortion agent
in any given cycle in any given woman.[4]
http://www.ewtn.com/library/MARRIAGE/CCLBC.TXT

So, if you are religious, and Catholic....birth control is equal to abortion.

That's the position of the Catholic Church.

Not all pro-lifers, however, are Catholic.