Why are conservatives losing?!?!?

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Hey clueless hack!

Who has control of the House and Senate? Who has the most state governors?

How are you that stupid and still able to use technology to broadcast your stupidity?

Nice straw man, but you didn't refute a word I said. We are about to lose the SCOTUS for the next few decades. Without the Presidency there is very little good a GOP congress can do.

Yes we hold the senate and house for now, but look at the trend. We only see red states turning purple and blue. In the 80s CA was red, now it is solid blue. Not to long ago PA, NM, MI and BA were swing states now they are all pretty reliable blue states. I can't name one previous blue state that leans red now.

Blast me all you want but these 4 issues (not illegal immigration) is losing our movements ground.

And what is it about ‘losing’ the Supreme Court that you and others on the right find so repugnant – that you won’t be able to discriminate against gay and transgender Americas, that you won’t be able to compel women to give birth against their will through force of law, that you can’t place undue burdens on the voting rights of minorities…

This is why conservatives are losing, the consequence of the right’s fear of change, diversity, and expressions of individual liberty, conservative hostility toward the rights of citizens, and conservatives' desire to disadvantage various classes of persons for no other reason than who they are.

Americans will continue to reject the fear and reactionaryism of the right, Americans will continue to reject the right’s efforts to divide the American people, as the American people do not want to return to the past when women and minorities were subject to disadvantage and discrimination.

 

[my2¢]

It comes down to the numbers, employees outnumber employers. The working class is more likely to be concerned with fair labor practices, consumer rights, health care and Social Security.

Not many individuals have estates over $5 million. Good luck finding a GOP proposed tax plan that does not include eliminating the estate (inheritance) tax.

 

[PredFan]

They still have a strong base, but they can't compete in the long run.

It comes down to 4 issues that turn the middle on them:
(1) Healthcare: I get it single payer and government run health insurance we 'hear' is a disaster, yet European countries will not do away with it any time soon. However you never get a plan other than status quo. I hear the sell across state lines bullshit, but those insurers have to follow state law and I guarantee this added competition wouldn't change a thing, but it is a great talking point. Second you hear health savings accounts. Which are already hear and while good aren't even close to the answer. Obaminationcare is bad but it at least go rid of the insurer practice of pre-existing condition riders (meaning once your sick no one would insure you), drop you after you get sick and skyrocket rates after you get sick. Obaminationcare is bad, but status quo was horrible also. Conservatives lose many middle class voters on this issue, because they never present any real plan.

(2) Abortion: You used to be able to hold the stance, ban on later term abortions and no abortions after 1 trimester except for rape, incest or mother's life is in danger. Now during the primaries the only acceptable stance is "no abortion, no exceptions. Not for rape or incest victims, not if the fetus has birth defects, not for teenagers and some won't even allow if the mother's life is in danger. Sorry but this turns off many independents and women.

(3) Higher Education: Most jobs require a college degree. The few that don't are lower paying and in shrinking industries, such as manufacturing. The fact of the matter is higher education cost upwards of $120k. Young people start their lives in a boatload of debt. These are voters who hear one side at least talk about trying to forgive debt, help pay for it and lower rates.

Then you have the GOP who complain about what the colleges charge and basically stop there. They wouldn't pass the bill to lower interest rates. While there are good arguments why they did that. Voters with student loan debt only saw that republicans voted against saving students money.

As Republicans continue to lose on this issue, they continue to create New Democrats.

(4) Gun control: Every mass shooting you hear, don't blame guns blame the perpetrators. True on many cases, but in reality many in the middle want a balance between gun ownership and safety.

Until Republicans start finding a way to solve these issues for the masses they won't compete I the swing states and further red states will turn blue like VA, CO and NV. Right now the only way for Trump to win is if he turns 1 of 2 left leaning state (PA or MI) and wins FL or OH.

Blast me if you want, but these are the 4 issues that the GOP needs to get serious about if they don't want to go the way of the Whigs.

Surprisingly good thread coming from you.

Sent from my SM-N910T using Tapatalk

Thank you sir

You say that in order for the HOP to win they basically need to be democrats. Then you are surprised what a liberal hack agrees with you?

 

[PredFan]

Plain and simple.

The reason we are about to lose is that the stupid and lazy now outnumber the smart and productive, fact.

 

[Dr.Traveler]

GOP establishment trounces tea party in congressional primaries

This is an article about the phenomenon I was talking about earlier. More Conservative candidates are losing to the more "mainstream" GOP candidates, i.e., RINO's are winning. The Conservatives have lost leverage in the party. I think Trump is the ultimate indicator of this as he's mocked a lot of the Conservative talking points openly and yet is the GOP nominee.

 

[GHook93]

Plain and simple.

The reason we are about to lose is that the stupid and lazy now outnumber the smart and productive, fact.

No doubt there are many stupid and lazy people in the Democratic base. However, the vast majority are not lazy nor stupid. Many are highly successful.

It is facing the tough reality that these 4 issues are sinking us.

 

[Dr.Traveler]

Plain and simple.

The reason we are about to lose is that the stupid and lazy now outnumber the smart and productive, fact.

No doubt there are many stupid and lazy people in the Democratic base. However, the vast majority are not lazy nor stupid. Many are highly successful.

It is facing the tough reality that these 4 issues are sinking us.

It's easier to blame the public than admit why you lost. The Democratic Party as a whole faced it when they lost the 2004 election and the GOP faced it when the lost the 2006 midterms and 2008 election. For Conservatives, this is a tougher one. The GOP as a whole is doing fine on the state level and in the midterms, but got creamed in 2008 and 2012 in the general election. For Conservatives though these midterm results are a mixed bag too. It's becoming clear their agenda simply isn't moving forward despite the fact their chosen party is in control at the state level and has control of both legislative bodies at the Federal. It's also clear they were completely ignored as a demagogue hijacked the nominating process. I honestly don't know what comes next from Conservatives but they need to ask themselves some hard questions about why they can't convince folks to get behind them on the issues.

 

[LaDexter]

There was precisely NOTHING conservative about the George W Bush administration

 

[PredFan]

Plain and simple.

The reason we are about to lose is that the stupid and lazy now outnumber the smart and productive, fact.

No doubt there are many stupid and lazy people in the Democratic base. However, the vast majority are not lazy nor stupid. Many are highly successful.

It is facing the tough reality that these 4 issues are sinking us.

Success =\= intelligence. Bill Gates actually thinks common core is a good thing. The vast majority are stupid or lazy or both. Stupid, in that they actually believe the things they are told and that they ignore the constant lying and how their leaders have caused so many problems yet claim to be the solution. Lazy in that they want to try to get as much free stuff from the taxpayers as possible.

None of these people are going to change their minds, either because they can't or because they don't want the freebies to stop. And the democrat run school system churns out more and more of them each year.

That is why we will likely loose everything.

 

[buckeye45_73]

They still have a strong base, but they can't compete in the long run.

It comes down to 4 issues that turn the middle on them:
(1) Healthcare: I get it single payer and government run health insurance we 'hear' is a disaster, yet European countries will not do away with it any time soon. However you never get a plan other than status quo. I hear the sell across state lines bullshit, but those insurers have to follow state law and I guarantee this added competition wouldn't change a thing, but it is a great talking point. Second you hear health savings accounts. Which are already hear and while good aren't even close to the answer. Obaminationcare is bad but it at least go rid of the insurer practice of pre-existing condition riders (meaning once your sick no one would insure you), drop you after you get sick and skyrocket rates after you get sick. Obaminationcare is bad, but status quo was horrible also. Conservatives lose many middle class voters on this issue, because they never present any real plan.

They do have plans, the media doeant cover them. One was allowing pre existing conditions.to.be covered and then to allow competition among all carriers that meet laws in each of the states.

(2) Abortion: You used to be able to hold the stance, ban on later term abortions and no abortions after 1 trimester except for rape, incest or mother's life is in danger. Now during the primaries the only acceptable stance is "no abortion, no exceptions. Not for rape or incest victims, not if the fetus has birth defects, not for teenagers and some won't even allow if the mother's life is in danger. Sorry but this turns off many independents and women.

I know lots of women opposed.to abortion, but I want to get rid of birth control abortions, if it is a health issue, I'm ok with it. Repeat and incest would alot be OK to have an abortion, but you can't just claim it, you have to prove it.


(3) Higher Education: Most jobs require a college degree. The few that don't are lower paying and in shrinking industries, such as manufacturing. The fact of the matter is higher education cost upwards of $120k. Young people start their lives in a boatload of debt. These are voters who hear one side at least talk about trying to forgive debt, help pay for it and lower rates.

Then you have the GOP who complain about what the colleges charge and basically stop there. They wouldn't pass the bill to lower interest rates. While there are good arguments why they did that. Voters with student loan debt only saw that republicans voted against saving students money.

As Republicans continue to lose on this issue, they continue to create New Democrats.

The cost of education goes up a shit ton every year....so tuition and books need to be addressed, loans are loans, the cost is the problem.

(4) Gun control: Every mass shooting you hear, don't blame guns blame the perpetrators. True on many cases, but in reality many in the middle want a balance between gun ownership and safety.

Until Republicans start finding a way to solve these issues for the masses they won't compete I the swing states and further red states will turn blue like VA, CO and NV. Right now the only way for Trump to win is if he turns 1 of 2 left leaning state (PA or MI) and wins FL or OH.

Guns are a non starter....they are tools, and protected for a reason.......let's start saving jail space by emptying death row....the old fashioned way...

Blast me if you want, but these are the 4 issues that the GOP needs to get serious about if they don't want to go the way of the Whigs.

My points, love em or hate em

 

[Boss]

There was precisely NOTHING conservative about the George W Bush administration

There was nothing FISCALLY conservative about Bush (or his father) GWB was a SOCIAL conservative and the problem with soc-con ideologues is they tend to be big spenders on social programs... Huckabee has the same problem.

HW Bush was a NEO-conservative (neocon). They believe in strong military interventionism and global trade. These are all ideologies rooted in conservative philosophy and they all have their pros and cons. What the Conservative movement has been lacking is an intelligent and articulate messenger of Conservative PHILOSOPHY without the emphasis on ideology. That is why Reagan was so successful.

 

[Care4all]

(1) Healthcare: I get it single payer and government run health insurance we 'hear' is a disaster, yet European countries will not do away with it any time soon. However you never get a plan other than status quo. I hear the sell across state lines bullshit, but those insurers have to follow state law and I guarantee this added competition wouldn't change a thing, but it is a great talking point.

Auto insurance, life insurance, and home insurance are sold across state lines. So your argument is exploded by reality.

You should be buying your health insurance the exact same way you buy your auto, life, and home insurance.

Yeah, it was just that the gop was forced to use that truth to push policy that effectively cut the pay of those getting HC insurance as a benefit.

Employer-sponsored health insurance (ESHI) needs to go away. It bends the cost curve up, and it costs taxpayers tens of billions of dollars a year.

ESHI holds you hostage. It's a take-it-or-leave-it proposition. You have no real choice. You have ZERO leverage.

And yet when I want to buy auto insurance, I can call any auto insurance company in the country I wish. This gives me MAXIMUM bargaining leverage.

Is there something that is stopping Health Care Insurance companies from operating in all States now?

Is it individual State laws that these companies can't meet in certain States?

And on your car Insurance example, it is not true that you can buy insurance for your car from any insurance company. When I lived in Massachusetts, many major car insurance companies CHOSE not to operate in Massachusetts.... as Example, I could not buy insurance from GEICO when I lived there.... the State did not ban GEICO from operating there....however the State's own laws for what kind of coverage auto makers had to offer at a minimum or other rules of the State made GEICO choose to pass on Massachusetts.


So, I am presuming you are suggesting that for ''Healthcare Insurance should be offered across State lines'' would dissolve any and all healthcare rules and laws an individual state legislature enacted to protect their own citizens and the feds would dictate to the Insurance companies those type of rules and regs and remove the State's power to do such?