Who's Responsible

[LoneLaugher]

You borrow your brother's AR15 and leave it on your porch. The kid from next door comes over to ask if he can mow your lawn for 5 bucks and sees the gun. He sees a squirrel run across the lawn and tries to shoot it.....only he misses and blows a hole in your other neighbor's 4 y/o daughter's head.

This is fun!

 

[CrotchetyGeezer]

To use a real-life event which occurred in my life, I'll pose a hypothetical question.

About ten or fifteen years ago my brother loaned me his car because my car had broken down and I didn't have the money at that time to get it fixed immediately but, I needed transportation. I had a bad habit of leaving my keys in the car and one morning I got up to find the car had been stolen. Later that day, the police contacted my brother, who was the one who reported it stolen, to say they had found the car on the front lawn of a local elementary school abandoned and unharmed. Apparently someone had just taken it for a joy ride, finally got bored and just left it on the front lawn of the elementary school with the doors left wide open.

Now, lets says these people who stole the car got in an accident or intentionally ran it into the school building and killed and/or injured several children. Should my brother, or even I for that matter, have been held responsible had such a scenario transpired? And, more importantly, should all car owners, the automobile industry and special interest groups lobbying on behalf of the automobile industry, have been held responsible had such a scenario transpired?

Do you know what a false analogy is?

Here's an accurate analogy:

If your brother were mentally ill and you took steps to keep him inside and away from other people, but as he grew older, he got worse and dangerous. It became harder to control him and it was reasonable to believe he was capably of hurting others. However, you put off having him committed. You wanted him to be happy so you bought him guns and took him shooting. He continued to get worse and you continued to put off getting professional help.

Understand?

Yeah, I know what a false analogy is. You just gave one. You presume I wrote the OP exclusive to what transpired with the Sandy Hook incident and that the analogy was with respect to the Sandy Hook incident. Which, I didn't and, it wasn't. The events which unfolded with respect to the OP didn't involve some mentally ill child who lived with me stealing my brother's car because I left the keys in it and taking it for a joy ride.

Further, even if I had written the OP exclusive to the Sandy Hook incident and the analogy was with respect to the Sandy Hook incident? Still, how would all car owners, the automobile industry and special interest groups lobbying on behalf of the automobile industry been responsible because my mentally ill child who lived with me stole my brother's car because I left the keys in it and he went out and got in a car accident or ran the car into the elementary school, injuring and/or killing several school children?

Yes, if I had written the OP exclusive to the Sandy Hook incident and my analogy was exclusive to the Sandy Hook incident, where I had a mentally ill child living with me who stole my brother's car because I had left the keys in it and he got in a car accident or intentionally ran the car into an elementary school, injuring and/or killing several school children, then I would probably be in some way responsible. However, we must remember that in the Sandy Hook incident, this guy was 20-years-old. He was an adult. So, only by the matter of him still living with his mother did this make her somewhat responsible for him. I don't know what Connecticut's laws are but, at 20-years-old, would she even have been in a position to have him committed?

 

[CrotchetyGeezer]

You borrow your brother's AR15 and leave it on your porch. The kid from next door comes over to ask if he can mow your lawn for 5 bucks and sees the gun. He sees a squirrel run across the lawn and tries to shoot it.....only he misses and blows a hole in your other neighbor's 4 y/o daughter's head.

This is fun!

If the AR15 is legal, this is hard to say how such a case would play out in court. The one who borrowed the AR15 might face charges of negligence.

However, how could you possibly hold all gun owners, the gun industry and, the NRA, responsible? Or, for that matter, the brother of whom you borrowed the AR15 from?

 

[LoneLaugher]

Who said I would?

 

[MikeK]

Technically you could be held responsible because you enabled the crime by leaving the keys in the car. The legal theory is the same as DUI by consent. If you loan a car to a person who is arrested for DUI, you can also be charged with DUI by consent for enabling that person to drive your car. But legally the other entities could not be held responsible.

If I rent a car, go to a bar and get drunk, drive the car drunk and kill someone, does the rentor bear any responsibility?

 

[blackhawk]

Technically you could be held responsible because you enabled the crime by leaving the keys in the car. The legal theory is the same as DUI by consent. If you loan a car to a person who is arrested for DUI, you can also be charged with DUI by consent for enabling that person to drive your car. But legally the other entities could not be held responsible.

If I rent a car, go to a bar and get drunk, drive the car drunk and kill someone, does the rentor bear any responsibility?

No but the bar owner that let you leave and drive drunk might.

 

[Politico]

I don't know why you guy keep bringing Lanza into this. The scenario wasn't am I responsible if someone murders me and steals my car.

 

[Lakhota]

Who's Responsible

You are! So-called habits of the past are irrelevant.

 

[CrotchetyGeezer]

Who's Responsible

You are! So-called habits of the past are irrelevant.

Don't think so.