Who Won the India/China Border Standoff?

[Vikrant]

India won the standoff. Here is why:

India's objective was to stop China from building the road in Bhutan. India accomplished that.

China's objective was to build the road in Bhutan. China failed to do so.

Not only that, during this 3-month long standoff China repeatedly said that India was intruding in "Chinese territory" and yet China was unable to do anything about it. Of course, the territory in question did not belong to China, it belonged to Bhutan but that is another issue. Another thing is that Chinese repeatedly threatened India with dire consequence. Yet, Indians remained in Bhutan till Chinese were kicked out of Bhutan.

My hat is off to India for defending its ally Bhutan. This should be a lesson to other countries that are dealing with Chinese bully. You can only defeat the bully by standing up to him not by running away from him.

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[fncceo]

India won the standoff.

How does one 'win' a standoff?

A standoff, by definition, has no winner.

 

[Vikrant]

India won the standoff.

How does one 'win' a standoff?

A standoff, by definition, has no winner.

Winner in a conflict or standoff is defined by the outcome of the set objective. China's objective was to intrude into Bhutan's territory and build a road. India's objective was to destroy that road and remove the Chinese soldiers from Bhutan. India succeeded in its objective. China did not. Therefore, India was a clear winner in this conflict.

During the 3-month long conflict, China was shown to be too impotent to do anything about India's actions in support of Bhutan. At the beginning of the conflict and during the course of the conflict, China was issuing all sorts of dramatic threats to India. Now, China is kissing India's ass - no more bombastic threats from China. Chinese have been put in their place by India.

All in all, a war mongering "superpower" was defeated by a peace loving country.

 

[Vikrant]

Just a week or so ago, China was threatening India that they will invade India and cause chaos. CCP is a joke Anyway, I am glad Chinese were able to see the wisdom in deescalation. War is never a good outcome for anybody.

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Nonetheless, the firmness of India's response and the disregard it showed for China's clear demands that it withdraw from Chinese sovereign territory was striking. It was expected that Modi would receive some cold shoulder this week even though China had been obliged to climb down to ensure his presence. Yet as we have seen this week, nothing could be further from the truth.

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China Tries To Make A Friend Of India At BRICS Meeting, But Is It Too Late?

 

[S.J.]

India didn't defeat China. Please...

 

[cnm]

How does one 'win' a standoff?

Hoho, two countries separated by a common language...

standoff
A standoff is a situation in which neither of two opposing groups or forces will make a move until the other one does something, so nothing can happen until one of them gives way.​

 

[Vikrant]

Hoho, two countries separated by a common language...https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/standoff

standoff
A standoff is a situation in which neither of two opposing groups or forces will make a move until the other one does something, so nothing can happen until one of them gives way.​

You are commenting on a issue you know very little about.

China intruded into Bhutan and built a road. India came in with bulldozers and destroyed the road and kicked Chinese soldiers out. The Chinese then regrouped at the border of Bhutan and demanded India withdraw from Bhuthan ("Chinese territory"). This is where standoff took place. Before the standoff, Chinese road was destroyed and Chinese were kicked out of Bhutan by India. The whole episode itself was not a standoff; you could call it a skirmish.

 

[cnm]

Ffs, you raving looney, you called it a 'standoff'.

 

[cnm]

Big Brother loves Bhutan...when it does what it's told.

As China and India tussle in South Asia, a pristine mountain kingdom is caught in the middle

http://www.latimes.com

Still, some Bhutanese have begun to chafe inside the tight embrace of big brother India. Bhutan joined the United Nations in 1971, and a decade ago the fourth king ceded executive power to a democratically elected parliament, fueling a desire among educated Bhutanese for a greater say in their country’s affairs.

To them, India’s decision to send soldiers into a China-Bhutan dispute smacks of neo-colonialism. It remains unclear whether Indian officials told Bhutan they were deploying troops to Dolam.

“When India says they did this to protect us, I feel insulted,” said Dawa Penjor, executive director of the Bhutan Media Foundation, a nonprofit organization working to develop a free press in the kingdom.

“India should realize Bhutan is a sovereign nation and can take care of itself. Because India lacked diplomacy, they couldn’t influence other countries in the region. But they can’t use Bhutan to start a conflict with China.”

Strains in the relationship began to show in 2012, when then-Bhutanese Prime Minister Jigme Yozer Thinley held a meeting with his Chinese counterpart without notifying India beforehand. A year later, as Thinley was seeking re-election, India abruptly withdrew gas and kerosene subsidies to Bhutan, creating an economic panic that helped lead to his defeat.​

 

[Vikrant]

Ffs, you raving looney, you called it a 'standoff'.

So, are you going to debate a word when we are talking about a complex issue? You may have been partially correct if the standoff was still going on. But the standoff is not going on; it ended in favor of India. Thus India won. Is it too much for your skull?

Watch the video, read the link that I posted, educate yourself then we can have a discussion.

Also, before posting link to the meaning of standoff, you yourself need to understand the difference between skirmishes that lead to the standoff, the ensuing standoff itself and the terms at which the standoff ended.

 

[Vikrant]

Big Brother loves Bhutan...when it does what it's told.

As China and India tussle in South Asia, a pristine mountain kingdom is caught in the middle

http://www.latimes.com

Still, some Bhutanese have begun to chafe inside the tight embrace of big brother India. Bhutan joined the United Nations in 1971, and a decade ago the fourth king ceded executive power to a democratically elected parliament, fueling a desire among educated Bhutanese for a greater say in their country’s affairs.

To them, India’s decision to send soldiers into a China-Bhutan dispute smacks of neo-colonialism. It remains unclear whether Indian officials told Bhutan they were deploying troops to Dolam.

“When India says they did this to protect us, I feel insulted,” said Dawa Penjor, executive director of the Bhutan Media Foundation, a nonprofit organization working to develop a free press in the kingdom.

“India should realize Bhutan is a sovereign nation and can take care of itself. Because India lacked diplomacy, they couldn’t influence other countries in the region. But they can’t use Bhutan to start a conflict with China.”

Strains in the relationship began to show in 2012, when then-Bhutanese Prime Minister Jigme Yozer Thinley held a meeting with his Chinese counterpart without notifying India beforehand. A year later, as Thinley was seeking re-election, India abruptly withdrew gas and kerosene subsidies to Bhutan, creating an economic panic that helped lead to his defeat.​

That report from LA Times is garbage. Bhutan is an ally of Inida. That is why India risked war with China for Bhutan.

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Bhutan rejects Beijing's claim that Doklam belongs to China

NEW DELHI: The Government of Bhutan on Thursday refuted Chinese foreign ministry claims about Thimpu telling Beijing that the trilateral border stand-off area in Doklam in the Sikkim sector is not Bhutan's territory.

A top Chinese diplomat Wang Wenli had claimed that Bhutan had conveyed to Beijing through diplomatic channels that the area of the standoff is not its territory.

Wang, who is the deputy director general of the Department of Boundary and Ocean Affairs in China's foreign ministry, reportedly conveyed this information to a visiting Indian media delegation on Wednesday.

She, however, did not provide any evidence to back her claim, which has been strongly denied by Bhutan.

Official sources in the Bhutanese Government told ANI over phone, "Our position on the border issue of Doklam is very clear. Please refer to our statement which has been published on the web site of Bhutan's foreign ministry on June 29, 2017."

Reacting to the developments in Doklam, Bhutan had on June 29 issued a press release+ in which it clearly stated that the construction of the road inside Bhutanese territory is a direct violation of the agreements and affects the process of demarcating the boundary between the two countries.

In the press release, Bhutan said that the Chinese Army started constructing a motorable road from Dokola in the Doklam area towards the Bhutan Army camp at Zompelri on June 16, 2017.

It further said that the boundary talks between Bhutan and China were under way and the two countries had written agreements of 1988 and 1998 stating that they agree to maintain peace and tranquility in their border areas pending a final settlement on the boundary question. The two countries have also agreed to maintain status quo on the boundary as before March 1959 and refrain from taking unilateral action, or use of force, to change the status quo of the boundary.

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Bhutan rejects Beijing's claim that Doklam belongs to China - Times of India

 

[cnm]

Bhutan is an ally of Inida. That is why India risked war with China for Bhutan.

India risked war with China to conserve strategic ground it felt to be in its interest and to maintain a buffer state. Allies don't suddenly remove energy subsidies, patrons may do that to clients.

Perhaps you could post the declaration where the ally sovereign state client Bhutan asked for Indian troops to assist in its territorial claims, I couldn't find it in your linked article.

 

[Vikrant]

Bhutan is an ally of Inida. That is why India risked war with China for Bhutan.

India risked war with China to conserve strategic ground it felt to be in its interest and to maintain a buffer state. Allies don't suddenly remove energy subsidies, patrons may do that to clients.

Perhaps you could post the declaration where the ally sovereign state client Bhutan asked for Indian troops to assist in its territorial claims, I couldn't find it in your linked article.

Your post was a collection of misinformation.

Bhutan is very tightly integrated into India. There are no visa restrictions between India and Bhutan. There is no border control between India and Bhutan. There are no taxes on Bhutanese goods and services in India and vice versa. India had been responsible for the security of Bhutan for decades now. This is nothing new. In addition to all of that, Bhutan receives aid from Indian Federal Government.

Below is another article which clearly reports that Bhutan's stand on Doklam is exactly the same as India's.

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Bhutan vents out first major disclaimer against Chinese, sides with India over disputed Dong Lang territory

Bhutan, for the first time has taken a major stand against China's incursions and said the area where the Chinese were building a road is a disputed one and progressing towards Zom Pelri, a camp of the Royal Bhutan Army.

"We have asked them (China) to stop and refrain from changing the status quo,” Major General Vetsop Namgyel told The Hindu on Wednesday, adding that the road that the People’s Liberation Army (PLA) is constructing not in line with agreements between China and Bhutan. The Bhutan-China border talks are based on the guiding principles agreed to in 1998 by the two countries and the agreement on the maintenance of peace and tranquility in the Bhutan-China areas.

Border talks has strategic implications for India’s security and Delhi’s own negotiations with China probably needed to be ‘synchronized' with Thimphu.

While authorities and media in Bhutan shun from speaking about the escalations between the two countries in recent years, Indian Army chief General Bipin Rawat took off to Gangtok to take stock of operational matters and interact with top commanders in the formation headquarters.

However, a senior Bhutanese journalist under anonymity told Firstpost that Bhutan should be on the forefront and be proactive in discussing the border issue. "Doklum is a disputed area between Bhutan and China. The Chinese have violated the peace agreement many times in the past as well," he said.

China has a history of incursions

Bhutanese secretary for international boundaries, late Dasho Pema Wangchuk, had told the Bhutanese parliament that Chinese soldiers had intruded into Bhutanese territory as many as seventeen times in 2009 alone.

China started road construction work from the Lang Marpo stream (falls in the disputed area) towards Zuri ridge in 2004, but later stopped it after the Bhutanese government protested five times and asked China to stop construction on the basis of the 1998 agreement on the maintenance of peace and tranquility in the Bhutan-China border.

Wangchuk had often said that Bhutan has not been able to successfully demarcate the northern border with China because of the differences of views and positions of the boundary between Bhutan and China.

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Bhutan vents out first major disclaimer against Chinese, sides with India over disputed Dong Lang territory

 

[Vikrant]

India's way of handling China has just solved the biggest policy puzzle for world powers

How to deal with China? This is easily the biggest foreign policy question for most governments in today’s global power order. And that’s precisely why the resolution to the Doklam stand-off will necessitate continuous relooking. Because the outcome in itself is an exception to what was becoming a new normal.

While China’s larger interest on the success of the Brics Summit in Xiamen did help expedite an end to the two-month stand-off, the fact that India could manage to successfully stave off a strong and shrill Chinese challenge has reverberated across world capitals.

The understanding was arrived at after some 13 rounds of negotiations done through established diplomatic channels. No back channel, no false assurances. This is quite an out-of the-ordinary experience for all countries with a Beijing problem, specifically those that share land and maritime boundaries with China.

Read more at:
India's way of handling China has just solved the biggest policy puzzle for world powers

 

[cnm]

Still no indication Bhutan asked for help from the army of neo-colonial India. Seems India is making its buffer state Bhutan's decisions for it.

 

[cnm]

Read more at:
India's way of handling China has just solved the biggest policy puzzle for world powers

Self aggrandising bullshit from an insecure neo-colonial power.

 

[cnm]

But as a matter of curiosity, do you have an innocent explanation for the removal by India of energy subsidies from Bhutan at the time of the last election?