Who should pay for infastructure

[mnbasketball]

Who do you believe benefits the most from what this country provides?
Who should pay for the things that our country provides which I myself think that Business needs, in order to make profits. and then all the things that have to be looked after to make sure business is not doing us harm or selling us short.

From Schools to colleges to highways to airports and sea ports and all parts of our govt that has to oversea what happens. Who should pay for these things?

 

[American Horse]

Who do you believe benefits the most from what this country provides?
Who should pay for the things that our country provides which I myself think that Business needs, in order to make profits. and then all the things that have to be looked after to make sure business is not doing us harm or selling us short.

From Schools to colleges to highways to airports and sea ports and all parts of our govt that has to oversea what happens. Who should pay for these things?

We all do, directly or indirectly. Some of those like colleges or airports or seaports charge fees, and the others create costs we all bear so as to collectively enjoy the benefits. The regulation and oversight costs are paid by everyone except to the degree that they are charged fees to offset those costs. These systems were built up systemically over time, and elaborate compromises were made by everyone concerned.

The manufacturer enjoys the benefit of having interstate highways to transport his product, and the individual, whether or not he or she pays any taxes to support their maintenance or extension or further development benefits from the low cost to themselves, and convenience of having about any material product delivered to their homes.

Even a person who rides a bicycle and pays no gasoline taxes still benefits from the existence of roads and highways, even though that person does not contribute to their support.

Do you have any particular type or system of infrastructure in mind that you believe the cost is not adequately shared and/or not fully enjoyed by all?

 

[mnbasketball]

But the truth is that most of what we have is to provide the business community with a process to use to make money. Most of us might use some of the things built, but seldom compared to what business uses it for.
Just like schools, the bottom line is it's all about providing a workforce for industry and businesses. Yes we need schools to get people a general education like reading writing and math. But past that its main purpose is for business.

80% of our population uses what the govt provides to them to some extent, but nothing like those at the top who use it to make a profit. Even when using people who need what the govt provides, it's main purpose it's being used for is to provide work to a business that makes money off that person.


If you lived on a lake and 100 homes were built there. Along comes a business and builds a plant on the lake that gets a permit to take a ton of fish a week while you can only catch a few. Now they use these trucks so they must improve the roads and they say hey you guys will have to pay for your share of the road, 1/100 each. then you find out that the lake needs to be replenished so they once again charge you a 1/100 of the cost each.

Now the business is making big money but when you say something your told well everyone benefits somewhat so your just as responsible as the business, Hes one and each of you are one, you all should pay.

 

[American Horse]

But the truth is that most of what we have is to provide the business community with a process to use to make money. Most of us might use some of the things built, but seldom compared to what business uses it for.
Just like schools, the bottom line is it's all about providing a workforce for industry and businesses. Yes we need schools to get people a general education like reading writing and math. But past that its main purpose is for business.

80% of our population uses what the govt provides to them to some extent, but nothing like those at the top who use it to make a profit. Even when using people who need what the govt provides, it's main purpose it's being used for is to provide work to a business that makes money off that person.


If you lived on a lake and 100 homes were built there. Along comes a business and builds a plant on the lake that gets a permit to take a ton of fish a week while you can only catch a few. Now they use these trucks so they must improve the roads and they say hey you guys will have to pay for your share of the road, 1/100 each. then you find out that the lake needs to be replenished so they once again charge you a 1/100 of the cost each.

Now the business is making big money but when you say something your told well everyone benefits somewhat so your just as responsible as the business, Hes one and each of you are one, you all should pay.

Answer my questions; specifically which infrastructure do you believe is not already being paid for by business already to a greater degree than by individuals?

 

[The Rabbi]

The whole post rests on a premise that there is some kind of difference between "business" and individuals. Like businesses are made up of Martians or something.
The truth is that people need jobs, goods and services that businesses provide. Gov't is not acting out of some kind of largesse but rather gets its revenue from business activity. Yet, and here is the subtext, how much benefit is there to anyone from studies about the snail darter? Or any of the thousands of stupid, pointless wastes of money that government does? None, except for those vested interests that continue to get gov't money.

 

[Foxfyre]

What the rabbi said.

First your thesis suggests that there is business and then there is us. You really can't separate the two. Without business and commerce there would be no industry, no manufacturing, no products, no markets, no jobs, and no currency to exchange. Each of us would have to grow or hunt our own food, shear our own sheep or tan our own hides, hand sew our own clothes, build shelter from whatever we can scrounge up with our bare hands.

So to say that business benefits more from roads, sewers, street lights, power grid, bridges, etc. than we do is not looking at it from a whole picture perspective.

Infrastructure that does not fall under constitutionally mandated interstate commerce, post roads, national defense, etc. should be left to the states and local communities. It only makes sense for people to share certain services such as roads, sewers, power grids, etc. rather than each family providing these for themselves. But such infrastructure is available to all and paid for the same by all, rich and poor alike, with no consideration for anybody's socioeconomic standing or political leanings.

The lake example you used isn't infrastructure, however. That is regulatory policy and if it is detrimental to the community, then the community should petition to get it changed. All who used a shared lake should be subject to the same rules, regulations, and restrictions in its use.

 

[Avatar4321]

For the most part: The private sector.

For the rest, everyone should be paying an equal percentages of taxes so we all pay our part.

We shouldn't have some paying nothing and others paying half their income.

 

[JFK_USA]

The whole post rests on a premise that there is some kind of difference between "business" and individuals. Like businesses are made up of Martians or something.
The truth is that people need jobs, goods and services that businesses provide. Gov't is not acting out of some kind of largesse but rather gets its revenue from business activity. Yet, and here is the subtext, how much benefit is there to anyone from studies about the snail darter? Or any of the thousands of stupid, pointless wastes of money that government does? None, except for those vested interests that continue to get gov't money.

The point is that businesses exploit the very things that give them the ability to create profit and jobs yet don't pay their fair share in taxes.

All you republicans say "You can't tax the job creators" yet they wouldn't have jobs to create if government didn't provide the infrastructure to have it in.

Logistics wouldn't exist without the FEDERAL INTERSTATE SYSTEM. What business would survive without Logistics? Not a single one.

So its time to pay your fair share and no bitching about it.

 

[Foxfyre]

The whole post rests on a premise that there is some kind of difference between "business" and individuals. Like businesses are made up of Martians or something.
The truth is that people need jobs, goods and services that businesses provide. Gov't is not acting out of some kind of largesse but rather gets its revenue from business activity. Yet, and here is the subtext, how much benefit is there to anyone from studies about the snail darter? Or any of the thousands of stupid, pointless wastes of money that government does? None, except for those vested interests that continue to get gov't money.

The point is that businesses exploit the very things that give them the ability to create profit and jobs yet don't pay their fair share in taxes.

All you republicans say "You can't tax the job creators" yet they wouldn't have jobs to create if government didn't provide the infrastructure to have it in.

Logistics wouldn't exist without the FEDERAL INTERSTATE SYSTEM. What business would survive without Logistics? Not a single one.

So its time to pay your fair share and no bitching about it.

Ignoring the ignorant ad hominem, you've got it backwards. Business creates the need for infrastructure by doing business. Government doesn't create infrastructure to make it possible for there to be business.

 

[JFK_USA]

For the most part: The private sector.

For the rest, everyone should be paying an equal percentages of taxes so we all pay our part.

We shouldn't have some paying nothing and others paying half their income.

Now I know you have an IQ of 5 but lets get this through your head.

EVERYONE PAYS TAXES.

This "half" Bullshit is just smoke and mirrors. That would mean half of the population makes less than 12K a year.

If they QUALIFY for credits of 5000 but get only 3000, THEY PAY 2000 DOLLARS IN TAXES. So yes they pay taxes.

 

[American Horse]

The whole post rests on a premise that there is some kind of difference between "business" and individuals. Like businesses are made up of Martians or something.
The truth is that people need jobs, goods and services that businesses provide. Gov't is not acting out of some kind of largesse but rather gets its revenue from business activity. Yet, and here is the subtext, how much benefit is there to anyone from studies about the snail darter? Or any of the thousands of stupid, pointless wastes of money that government does? None, except for those vested interests that continue to get gov't money.

The point is that businesses exploit the very things that give them the ability to create profit and jobs yet don't pay their fair share in taxes.

All you republicans say "You can't tax the job creators" yet they wouldn't have jobs to create if government didn't provide the infrastructure to have it in.

Logistics wouldn't exist without the FEDERAL INTERSTATE SYSTEM. What business would survive without Logistics? Not a single one.

So its time to pay your fair share and no bitching about it.

Are you aware that income taxes do not pay for or support the interstate highway system?????

That is an example of what I consider a perfect tax because it is targeted at the users. The funding, all of it, comes from gasoline taxes, both state and federal. Those funds are distributed to the states by a per-mile (and by other contingencies) formula. The large semi tractor/trailer uses much more gasoline or diesel fuel per mile and pays a proportionally larger tax per mile driven than does an auto. And the individual who doesn't own a car and drive, or does use the highways by walking them or riding a bike pays nothing.

I have a feeling that you know none of that, but now that you do, it won't matter and you won't let it interfere with your biases.

 

[Two Thumbs]

Who do you believe benefits the most from what this country provides? Citizens.
Who should pay for the things that our country provides which I myself think that Business needs, in order to make profits. The country provides rights, they are not paid for except by Vets that didn't get to come home. and then all the things that have to be looked after to make sure business is not doing us harm or selling us short. Law suits keep biz from doing us harm.

From Schools to colleges to highways to airports and sea ports and all parts of our govt that has to oversea what happens. The Fed doesn't have to oversea any of it. State governments can if they want, but most of it is not needed. Who should pay for these things?

Slave minded people like you make me worry about the future of this country.

 

[Two Thumbs]

The whole post rests on a premise that there is some kind of difference between "business" and individuals. Like businesses are made up of Martians or something.
The truth is that people need jobs, goods and services that businesses provide. Gov't is not acting out of some kind of largesse but rather gets its revenue from business activity. Yet, and here is the subtext, how much benefit is there to anyone from studies about the snail darter? Or any of the thousands of stupid, pointless wastes of money that government does? None, except for those vested interests that continue to get gov't money.

The point is that businesses exploit the very things that give them the ability to create profit and jobs yet don't pay their fair share in taxes. That's a lie.

All you republicans say "You can't tax the job creators" yet they wouldn't have jobs to create if government didn't provide the infrastructure to have it in. 2nd lie

Logistics wouldn't exist without the FEDERAL INTERSTATE SYSTEM. 3rd lie What business would survive without Logistics? Not a single one.

So its time to pay your fair share and no bitching about it.

They pay the most. so that's 4 lies in one post.

Grats, the only truth you mentioned was "What business would survive without Logistics? Not a single one." But government didn't "give" it to them.

 

[Two Thumbs]

For the most part: The private sector.

For the rest, everyone should be paying an equal percentages of taxes so we all pay our part.

We shouldn't have some paying nothing and others paying half their income.

Now I know you have an IQ of 5 but lets get this through your head.

EVERYONE PAYS TAXES.

This "half" Bullshit is just smoke and mirrors. That would mean half of the population makes less than 12K a year.

If they QUALIFY for credits of 5000 but get only 3000, THEY PAY 2000 DOLLARS IN TAXES. So yes they pay taxes.

We made 52k last year and the year before. Not only did we not pay taxes we turned a profit by doing them ourselves.

In other words, you lied again.

 

[Toronado3800]

Ignoring the ignorant ad hominem, you've got it backwards. Business creates the need for infrastructure by doing business. Government doesn't create infrastructure to make it possible for there to be business.

*The electric generating system in the southwest before it was inhabitable for most humans.

*Earth City, MO and Park370 in St Peters, MO. Both are cases of big local government using tax dollars to make worthless flood prone land usable for businesses. There is no need for THAT land to be used. Plenty more land around here.

Only reason those two sections of land are important for development are:
-it enriches the land's owners
-it lets the mayor or council person feel like they accomplished something.

*Mid-America Airport - Lambert still isn't being used up to potential. Just some politician decided improperly we needed infrastructure.

More on point though, the government created them w/o a need. Eventually there will be a need I suppose when Lambert gets filled and IF we ever run out of land somehow.

I am a critic by heart. Certainly there are more good examples of infrastructure jumping ahead of business.

 

[JFK_USA]

Ignoring the ignorant ad hominem, you've got it backwards. Business creates the need for infrastructure by doing business. Government doesn't create infrastructure to make it possible for there to be business.

*The electric generating system in the southwest before it was inhabitable for most humans.

*Earth City, MO and Park370 in St Peters, MO. Both are cases of big local government using tax dollars to make worthless flood prone land usable for businesses. There is no need for THAT land to be used. Plenty more land around here.

Only reason those two sections of land are important for development are:
-it enriches the land's owners
-it lets the mayor or council person feel like they accomplished something.

*Mid-America Airport - Lambert still isn't being used up to potential. Just some politician decided improperly we needed infrastructure.

More on point though, the government created them w/o a need. Eventually there will be a need I suppose when Lambert gets filled and IF we ever run out of land somehow.

I am a critic by heart. Certainly there are more good examples of infrastructure jumping ahead of business.

I'm from St. Louis. Yeah Mid America airport was a waste. But Earth City and Riverport area help created business. In Columbia, they had infrastructure to intice IBM to bring 600 jobs to the area. You tell me that infrastructure doesn't create business opportunities, and I will laugh in your face.

 

[Cecilie1200]

But the truth is that most of what we have is to provide the business community with a process to use to make money. Most of us might use some of the things built, but seldom compared to what business uses it for.
Just like schools, the bottom line is it's all about providing a workforce for industry and businesses. Yes we need schools to get people a general education like reading writing and math. But past that its main purpose is for business.

80% of our population uses what the govt provides to them to some extent, but nothing like those at the top who use it to make a profit. Even when using people who need what the govt provides, it's main purpose it's being used for is to provide work to a business that makes money off that person.


If you lived on a lake and 100 homes were built there. Along comes a business and builds a plant on the lake that gets a permit to take a ton of fish a week while you can only catch a few. Now they use these trucks so they must improve the roads and they say hey you guys will have to pay for your share of the road, 1/100 each. then you find out that the lake needs to be replenished so they once again charge you a 1/100 of the cost each.

Now the business is making big money but when you say something your told well everyone benefits somewhat so your just as responsible as the business, Hes one and each of you are one, you all should pay.

Edited:No Family.

It's not 80% of our population who use our infrastructure, you pinhead. I suppose somewhere in America, there might be a hermit living in a cave on a fucking mountaintop and not participating in the economy one tiny bit, but I doubt it. And even if such people exist, there'd be so few of them as to be statistically non-existent, so it's 100% of the population who use the infrastructure, dimwit.

This is not an "us or them" scenario. We're a SOCIETY, imbecile. Interconnected, interacting, interdependent. Businesses don't exist and don't succeed and don't make money just for the hell of it, separate and unrelated from consumers, and the infrastructure doesn't benefit businesses just for the hell of it, or just for the sake of campaign bribes and cronyism. Businesses use the shipping docks and airports and highways to bring in goods because consumers want and need them. Anytime you want to return to the standard of living of the 1890s, buddy boy, you can consider yourself to be exempted from using the infrastructure. Until then, shut the hell up with the anti-business ranting.

 

[JFK_USA]

For the most part: The private sector.

For the rest, everyone should be paying an equal percentages of taxes so we all pay our part.

We shouldn't have some paying nothing and others paying half their income.

Now I know you have an IQ of 5 but lets get this through your head.

EVERYONE PAYS TAXES.

This "half" Bullshit is just smoke and mirrors. That would mean half of the population makes less than 12K a year.

If they QUALIFY for credits of 5000 but get only 3000, THEY PAY 2000 DOLLARS IN TAXES. So yes they pay taxes.

We made 52k last year and the year before. Not only did we not pay taxes we turned a profit by doing them ourselves.

In other words, you lied again.

Umm no I did not. You just said profit. Meaning you had a cost, meaning you paid taxes.

And how the hell you get a tax credit and I don't is beyond me. But hey whatever.

 

[shintao]

But the truth is that most of what we have is to provide the business community with a process to use to make money. Most of us might use some of the things built, but seldom compared to what business uses it for.
Just like schools, the bottom line is it's all about providing a workforce for industry and businesses. Yes we need schools to get people a general education like reading writing and math. But past that its main purpose is for business.

80% of our population uses what the govt provides to them to some extent, but nothing like those at the top who use it to make a profit. Even when using people who need what the govt provides, it's main purpose it's being used for is to provide work to a business that makes money off that person.


If you lived on a lake and 100 homes were built there. Along comes a business and builds a plant on the lake that gets a permit to take a ton of fish a week while you can only catch a few. Now they use these trucks so they must improve the roads and they say hey you guys will have to pay for your share of the road, 1/100 each. then you find out that the lake needs to be replenished so they once again charge you a 1/100 of the cost each.

Now the business is making big money but when you say something your told well everyone benefits somewhat so your just as responsible as the business, Hes one and each of you are one, you all should pay.

Answer my questions; specifically which infrastructure do you believe is not already being paid for by business already to a greater degree than by individuals?

Consumers pay business taxes in higher priced merchandise, so the answer is, no part of infrastructure is paid by business.

 

[The Rabbi]

But the truth is that most of what we have is to provide the business community with a process to use to make money. Most of us might use some of the things built, but seldom compared to what business uses it for.
Just like schools, the bottom line is it's all about providing a workforce for industry and businesses. Yes we need schools to get people a general education like reading writing and math. But past that its main purpose is for business.

80% of our population uses what the govt provides to them to some extent, but nothing like those at the top who use it to make a profit. Even when using people who need what the govt provides, it's main purpose it's being used for is to provide work to a business that makes money off that person.


If you lived on a lake and 100 homes were built there. Along comes a business and builds a plant on the lake that gets a permit to take a ton of fish a week while you can only catch a few. Now they use these trucks so they must improve the roads and they say hey you guys will have to pay for your share of the road, 1/100 each. then you find out that the lake needs to be replenished so they once again charge you a 1/100 of the cost each.

Now the business is making big money but when you say something your told well everyone benefits somewhat so your just as responsible as the business, Hes one and each of you are one, you all should pay.

Answer my questions; specifically which infrastructure do you believe is not already being paid for by business already to a greater degree than by individuals?

Consumers pay business taxes in higher priced merchandise, so the answer is, no part of infrastructure is paid by business.

Did you just make the argument for reducing or eliminating business taxes?
See how easy that was!