Follow along with the video below to see how to install our site as a web app on your home screen.
Note: This feature currently requires accessing the site using the built-in Safari browser.
That was perfect .. and if the automakers are allowed to fail, those words will become a mantra throughout this country.
thanks
This whole depression scenario is nothing more that a scare tactic. What happens if GM dont survive AFTER we loan them this money and they cant pay it back?
Once I built a railroad, I made it run,
made it race against time.
Once I built a railroad; now it's done.
Brother, can you spare a dime?
Once I built a tower, up to the sun,
brick, and rivet, and lime;
Once I built a tower, now it's done.
Brother, can you spare a dime?
A right-winger .. "stop using fear tactics"
Damn this board is funny.
You mean millions of American workers suddenly out of work facing an environment where there is little work to be had .. that's "fear tactics?"
OK
Sharing this with Willow is a waste of time so I thought I'd share it with you. See, GOP is evil!!!!
Congress Bails Out Those Who Shower before Work, but Not Those Who Shower after Work
Right-wing Republicans and conservative pundits have made it clear they want Federal aid denied to the Big Three so that the firms go bankrupt. Then the companies can renege on pensions they guaranteed to retirees and can break salary and benefit promises to workers in current contracts.
They want the unions broken. They want retirees benefits slashed and union workers wages and benefits cut, which, of course, will enable the foreign auto makers whose U.S. plants are non-union to reduce their wages. Itll be an all-American race to the bottom, rather than the preferable opposite, where workers and retirees are treated with dignity and respect for their hard labor.
None of those conservatives, however, is calling for Citigroups Charles O. Prince III, who took down Citigroup at a cost of untold billions to taxpayers, to return his $1.7 million pension, office and car and driver.
Sen. Richard Shelby, the ranking Republican on the Senate Banking Committee, said, for example, I do not support the use of U.S. taxpayer dollars to reward the mismanagement of Detroit-based auto manufacturers.
Shelby, of course, has a lot to lose if Michigan does well. His home state of Alabama gave HUGE tax breaks to foreign car companies Mercedes-Benz, Honda and Hyundai to locate factories there hardly a free market approach.
When the representatives of blue collars went to Congress hat in hand, lawmakers insisted that to get loans automakers would have to present viable business plans. Congress didnt impose similar conditions, however, when Bernanke and Paulson went to Congress seeking grants for reckless white collar firms.
For the whole thing go to:
The Hill Blog» Blog Archive » Congress Bails Out Those Who Shower before Work, but Not Those Who Shower after Work
Now THAT is an excellent question, in my never humble opinion.
And it is an excellent question because the likelihood that simply saving GM and Chrysler is going to dramtically change the economic climate is rather remote.
Thos companies are going down because the economic climate is killing them.
Yes, they have their own problems, but they were not going broke until the economy collapsed.
So fixing them, but not fixing the root source of the economic collapse probably won't help much.
Of course if they went down, then the economy would get much much worse much more quickly, but saving them doesn't do jackshit about the REAL problems that are plaguing this nation.
Brother, Can You Spare a Dime," lyrics by Yip Harburg, music by Jay Gorney (1931)
OK is right,, it dosen't matter how much money you throw at this fucked up problem,, the unions have priced your asses right outta work,, that's not the taxpayers problem it's your's if you've been stupid enough to pay union dues all these years..
...
Thos companies are going down because the economic climate is killing them.
...
I'll answer that for ya... most of America's work force is doing exactly what you guys are doing.. frittering away your work time on a message board and charging your employee's for work not done.. cry me a river. and you want dignity..
Some of us get to do both things at the same time .. and the empolyers don't care .. in fact, they encourage it.
.. sue me
Some of us get to do both things at the same time .. and the empolyers don't care .. in fact, they encourage it.
.. sue me
Irrespective of your flawed comment .. a depression WILL be the taxpayers problem.
IMO, the country isnt going to go into a depression if GM goes into chapter 11, although thats what many a DC insider would like us to believe. The fact of the matter is, chapter 11 was designed specifically for the purpose of corporate reorganization.
Ive not heard one valid argument as to why DC wants to abandon current laws and procedures. Could it be that a lot of politicians are indebted to the company or even the UAW? Ya think?
Loaning money to save jobs is the most ridiculous thing Ive even heard of and to date, Ive not heard one valid argument as to why GM cant take the Chapter 11 route, which was designed for this purpose. I heard a good one on the news yesterday; some senator (dont recall who) reasoned that other countries are doing it. Simply outrageous.
Loaning money to GM in order for them to become solvent any time soon is akin to believing in clean coal technology, IMO.
This whole depression scenario is nothing more that a scare tactic. What happens if GM dont survive AFTER we loan them this money and they cant pay it back? The way I see it, he risk of lending it to them by far exceeds the risk of NOT lending it to them.
If Michigan does well??? Why the hell hasn't Michigan done well? doyathink???
There's a lot more to it than that.
"In the year 2007, GM sold 9.3 million automobiles and lost $38 Billion dollars. In 2007 Toyota sold 9.3 million automobiles and made a profit of $17 Billion dollars. Seems to me that throwing more money at the situation or creating a "Car Czar" isn't the answer. Only Chapter 11 re-organization will save GM. Everyone from the top to the bottom is going to have to re-group, would you rather have 70% of something or 100% of nothing, pretty tough choices need to be made, by everyone."
Sen. Tom Coburn of Oklahoma
I would rather have one depression now that establish a pattern of government bailing out wasteful and bloated companies who need to be left to die.
A bailout now just ensures that this problem will endure and grow.
Letting them die now means we will go through a rough patch and afterward, we will have a level playing field for competitive and decent companies to rise.
Ford had huge profits in 1999. What happened in 2000? Bush stole the White House.
And 43 other states are hurting badly. Why?
Bushanomics. You know that.
Here's a Libertarian perspective if anyone is interested:
Say No to the Auto Bailout
General Motors, Ford, Chrysler and the United Auto Workers union are pouring millions of dollars into a lobbying campaign for a taxpayer bailout.
The money devoted to influence peddling in Washington would be better spent on improving quality and finding ways to reduce a bloated cost structure, but both management and UAW have decided that fleecing taxpayers is a better option.
A taxpayer bailout would be a terrible mistake. It would subsidize the shoddy management practices of the corporate bureaucrats at General Motors, Ford and Chrysler, and it would reward the intransigent union bosses who have made the UAW synonymous with inflexible and anti-competitive work rules.
Perhaps most important, though, is that a bailout would be bad for the long-term health of the American auto industry. It would discriminate against the 113,000 Americans who have highly-coveted jobs building cars for Nissan, BMW and other auto companies that happen to be headquartered in other nations.
...
A bailout will hurt the overall economy by misallocating resources
A bailout will encourage other industries to seek taxpayer handouts
A bailout is a perverse transfer from poor taxpayers to rich taxpayers
More Here
Why is it ok to give Toyota 6 Billion dollars in federal tax dollars to come to Alabama and set up shop to compete with the American car companies?
The only reason we don't boot Toyota and Honda out of the country is that they employ thousands of people.
The same reason we won't let the Big 3 fail. They employ even more Americans.
You have heard valid arguments. YOu just don't believe them.
I don't beleive we needed to bail out the banks either. But we did. $750 billion. So now you want to get tight with the purse strings? They only want $25 million. And the Big 3 definately can take down the economy. Your tiny little brain just can't understand it.
